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Kuva Bramma Changes: Explanation and Timeline.


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Justo ahora, Voltage dijo:

I stopped reading here. Kuva Bramma was the equivalent of Cernos Prime firing rounds from an old Tonkor without any drawbacks. Bramma definitely needed a nerf, but it should not have released in this state in the first place.

I understand you, but I think there is a misunderstanding. I'll gladly explain it again: Bramma didn't need a nerf, assuming only a minority of high MR players could use it. In this way, the weapon would continue to be the nuclear weapon that it is, but much less seen and used.

one.

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Just now, Awazx said:

I understand you, but I think there is a misunderstanding. I'll gladly explain it again: Bramma didn't need a nerf, assuming only a minority of high MR players could use it. In this way, the weapon would continue to be the nuclear weapon that it is, but much less seen and used.

You could restrict it to MR 29 Founders exclusively and it would still be an unhealthy weapon. No matter how you slice it, the weapon was released broken when it shouldn't have, and DE is cleaning up their mess (better late than never). Fortunately it's not taking years to address and Bramma will fall in line with other weapons.

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3 minutes ago, WhiteMarker said:

This would only work if reaching high mastery ranks took some sort of skill or something...

And if the MR restriction actually worked. Unfortunately, the current acquisition system for Lich weapons bypasses it.

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hace 1 minuto, Voltage dijo:

You could restrict it to MR 29 Founders exclusively and it would still be an unhealthy weapon. 

I do not agree with this statement. I think it is healthy for the player to receive rewards for time spent, even if that makes him a little OP. After all, this is PvE, not PvP.

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hace 6 minutos, Caliboom dijo:

Bramma was overpowered, there was a reason why almost everyone used it.

The fact that "everyone can use it" is the fault of DE, not the weapon.

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2 minutes ago, Awazx said:

I do not agree with this statement. I think it is healthy for the player to receive rewards for time spent, even if that makes him a little OP. After all, this is PvE, not PvP.

It completely trivialized a majority of gameplay. Would you argue Nuke Trinity was healthy for Warframe or 200% range Scoliac Riven Mods as long as it was gated appropriately? If you want to strive for game balance, you need to address these issues. If you left Bramma in the state it was in, 100% of Primaries in the future would be either complete fodder or insane power creep.

Time spent is rewarded with an easier experience for people behind you. That is how DE operates.

Edited by Voltage
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1 minute ago, Awazx said:

I do not agree with this statement. I think it is healthy for the player to receive rewards for time spent, even if that makes him a little OP. After all, this is PvE, not PvP.

"A little OP" is a problem in a game where everyone is extremely OP to the point the game is extremely easy. We don't need to be even more OP

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Justo ahora, Voltage dijo:

It completely trivialized a majority of gameplay. 

The fact that the game modes are trivial is the fault of poor game design, not the weapon.

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14 minutes ago, Awazx said:

About Bramma and bad decisions by DE

Introducing Bramma in its initial form was indeed a bad decision.

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Sometimes they try to release a fun weapon. Sometimes it's just too OP. Adjustments were made.  

It will happen again. Temper your expectations and enjoy it while it last.

Edited by Hypernaut1
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2 minutes ago, Awazx said:

I do not agree with this statement. I think it is healthy for the player to receive rewards for time spent, even if that makes him a little OP. After all, this is PvE, not PvP.

In that case replace the 1000 daily milestone with this insanely broken weapons and then maybe you can justify its power. 

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The only bad decision was DE introducing the Kuva Bramma to begin with. It deserves to be nerfed and even more than their proposed changes they showed us.

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4 minutes ago, Awazx said:

I do not agree with this statement. I think it is healthy for the player to receive rewards for time spent, even if that makes him a little OP. After all, this is PvE, not PvP.

What time spent?
Reaching high MR? No time at all with ESO...
Getting Bramma from a Lich? No time either...

So what time are you talking about?

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18 minutes ago, Awazx said:

With Bramma's recent nerf a pattern repeats itself that is starting to be as dangerous as it is boring: throw a new weapon -> the weapon is popular -> nerf the weapon to the ground -> throw a new weapon.

DE, Bramma didn't need a nerf. What was necessary from the beginning are two things:

1. Test weapons (actually test anything) before launch so you don't have to make "tough decisions" in the future.

2. It was enough to raise Bramma's MR requirement, and turn it into a "reward" weapon for high level players. Your DE mistake was allowing everyone to access a powerful weapon from the start.

The problem is not in Bramma, the problem is your poor planning and poor design of game dynamics that currently affects all areas.

What you have achieved with this unnecessary nerf is to generate even more mistrust in many of your players, who will no longer be sure to invest 6 ways and tens of hours to upload their favorite weapon at the risk of another imminent nerf.

You are doing things wrong.

Technically the Bramma was a none issue until they removed the self damage which was the control to the Bramma's power. This is just DE catching up with themselves as I doubt they foresaw this happening when they pulled self damage. The weapon was literally designed and created when the rules were different. To expect things to not change to meet the new laws is paradoxical. 

Edited by Magus_Tahir
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Justo ahora, (XB1)ShonFr0st dijo:

And just like that you invalidated your whole post

On the contrary, the phrase is perfect in context. You just need to keep reading and of course understand what you read.

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6 minutes ago, Awazx said:

I do not agree with this statement. I think it is healthy for the player to receive rewards for time spent, even if that makes him a little OP. After all, this is PvE, not PvP.

Within the current framework of the game, you were op before the Bramma even existed. 

The weapon is unique, yes, but if you still love the weapon you'll use it regardless, unless you were just looking for an gimmick to hop on.....

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4 minutes ago, Awazx said:

On the contrary, the phrase is perfect in context. You just need to keep reading and of course understand what you read.

Somehow you think exclusivity justifies unbounded power that trivializes content and makes other weapon choices worthless, that's just not how it works.

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hace 16 minutos, (XB1)ShonFr0st dijo:

Somehow you think exclusivity justifies unbounded power that trivializes content and makes other weapon choices worthless, that's just not how it works.

Exactly so. All Warframe is based on trivializing content and having unlimited power.

Is that how it works.

Edited by Awazx
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Seriously?

We get a grineer bow (which everyone wanted in FOREVER), then DE goes and nerfs it since "everyone is using it"? ...

WE WANTED A DAMN GRINEER BOW! THAT'S WHY EVERYONE IS USING IT!

Either DE forgets all of the feedback, doesn't think of the "big picture", or both.

 

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On 2020-06-09 at 12:06 AM, (PS4)WretchedMoon said:

And the cycle continues, until nothing is fun. Thank you the fun police in the community. I don't even use it, but now you've made sure that I won't. And I rarely saw that weapon in game. And you know what? If I entered a PUBLIC match, and someone was using something I don't like, I have the ability to back out of the match. I don't go and complain about it online, to take someone's fun away.

So, if we want to talk about overpowered, when are we gonna get the hate train going on the Sheev? Since the melee changes, LITERALLY EVERY MELEE WEAPON is more than viable. The Machete? Come on everyone, there are people having fun out there in game, and you know we can't have that!

 

The weapon is still fun, but more balanced opposed to being over tuned. And during my 4h + playtime per day I always had a team member who had bramma.

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Stop playing the videogame in a lazy, boring way. There're hundreds of weapons in the game that are powerful with the right builds, Bramma was just too powerful and not fun to play.. 

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3 hours ago, crashapple12 said:

i don't really agree with the method of nerfing
changing the max ammo from 15 to 5 is easily offset by ammo mutation, it more makes the weapon annoying to use than actually nerfing the problem (just imagine if DE actually made a slot specifically designed for said mod type sure would be a shame if they were to have done that)
the change to the cluster bombs is... a change, albeit a nice change due to excessive particles blinding people 



the major issue i have with bramma, is it has both higher base damage than kuva ogris (without even considering the cluster bombs or the fact that ogris is not intended to be a crit weapon),better critical stats than kuva tonkor (expecially when you consider that tonkor has low base damage to account for its high critical stats and bramma does not), faster fire rate than lenz and larger radius than all of them

it being so much stronger than lenz makes a degree of sense due to MR tier gap, but the gap between bramma, tonkor and ogris is kinda nuts given their MR tier is so close, let alone comparing it to any single target focused weapon like kuva chakkurr, snipers, shotguns or the plethora of other weapon types *but that is a whole other issue not exclusive to bramma*

from a purely statistical standpoint its better in every regard to other explosive weapons EVEN with these nerfs, hell its quite likely going to retain the spot of the strongest weapon in the game for the reasons mentioned above, while also completely outclassing every other explosive weapon by miles outside of the one flaw of it now being slightly more annoying to maintain the ammunition

basically halving its base damage, increasing its accuracy, alongside the cluster bomb change, would be a far more adequate nerf+QoL change
rather than simply making it more annoying to use

to the people complaining that bramma is being nerfed, we all saw it coming, we knew this was going to happen
nerfing the bramma is practically the same as buffing up every single other weapon simply on the basis that now bramma is no longer dwarfing them in power
buffing up every other weapon in the game is a huge waste of time when its just a few weapons dwarfing other types in power
balance is always important, be it PVP or PVE, the point is to increase variance and viability of as many options as possible which is a large selling point to why warframe remains fun for so many

one cannot create challenge if said challenge can be instant killed from half a mile away, through walls, while also killing everything nearby instantly
people may say melee is overpowered, but at least with melee it generally has to be more powerful due to potentially putting you in more danger *exceptions do apply*

I couldn't agree more !

Edited by Zeus0
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