Kuva Bramma Changes: Explanation and Timeline.

[(PSN)CommanderC2121]

7 minutes ago, SebyShine said:

but do you realize what the hell you're talking about?

I do. Self damage was not a enjoyable thing in the game. You either killed ourself because of weapon, or you used the tonkor until its nerf. Meanwhile, the current stagger mechanic has more player choice around it besides use weapon and die or dont, and it also provides a overall way to deal with knockdowns by timing a jump correctly, something we didnt have until then. 

[SebyShine]

Stop nerfing! reintroduce self-damage, put BRAMMA back as it was before and put valid content where badass weapons can be used. Or something smarter, you choose whether to activate self-damage or not. it's difficult?

[Rin-senpai]

another topic? lol?

[SebyShine]

2 minutes ago, Rin-senpai said:

another topic? lol?

yeah, cause the last were in wrong section... 

[Gabbynaru]

8 minutes ago, SebyShine said:

reintroduce self-damage

No. Go away!

8 minutes ago, SebyShine said:

put BRAMMA back as it was before

See above.

[Grey_Star_Rival_Defender]

6 hours ago, SebyShine said:

Stop nerfing! reintroduce self-damage, put BRAMMA back as it was before and put valid content where badass weapons can be used. Or something smarter, you choose whether to activate self-damage or not. it's difficult?

Seems pretty difficult to make an entire weapon system change on a toggle.

[Hikarin]

Quick solution:
Delete Kuva Bramma from the game, Refund players potato, lens and forma via a script.
And would you look at this? this entire post dosen't need to exist, or make people angry about Kuva bramma nerfs! Everyone is happy, except for that one Tonkor and one Zarr main who is still angry that splash damage is weaker than it use to. 

[ChaoticEdge]

On 2020-06-08 at 4:01 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

- It has a smaller reserve ammo (15 to 5), and gains fewer arrows from ammo pickups - This is to encourage players to aim the bow deliberately at crowds of enemies and not fire it wildly everywhere

what I just realized...

Hey, got infinite ammo?

loops.

[ysegrim]

i know the reason i do not like multishot ... its a stat that should not be in warframe. weapons like the bramma play nice without multishot. the ammo mutation limitation must be a joke - it must be ... cause i refuse to believe somebody finds it a good solution to have a weapon with only 5 shots that doesnt kill anything serious in the game in one shot and is unsustainable in such a mission.

[NecroPed]

1 minute ago, ysegrim said:

i know the reason i do not like multishot ... its a stat that should not be in warframe. weapons like the bramma play nice without multishot. the ammo mutation limitation must be a joke - it must be ... cause i refuse to believe somebody finds it a good solution to have a weapon with only 5 shots that doesnt kill anything serious in the game in one shot and is unsustainable in such a mission.

I'm pretty sure I've only used bramma post changes so take note. But I personally love the bramma. Sure it struggles to take out single high lvl targets, but should it? I wipe waves with it and often by doing so kill the high enemies as a result too. The only problem I really have with it is inconsistencies with punch through.

[ysegrim]

25 minutes ago, NecroPed said:

I'm pretty sure I've only used bramma post changes so take note. But I personally love the bramma. Sure it struggles to take out single high lvl targets, but should it? I wipe waves with it and often by doing so kill the high enemies as a result too. The only problem I really have with it is inconsistencies with punch through.

how do you get your ammo back if enemies take 2-3 shots? just curious

[NecroPed]

16 minutes ago, ysegrim said:

how do you get your ammo back if enemies take 2-3 shots? just curious

They generally don't for me. I tend to wipe a wave of enemies with a single shot. And if any loot frames are present there's excess ammo lying around.

[johnno23]

Bramma is fine...the "nerfing" DE did was really needed as too many people went gaga with massive explosions all over the dammed place. No aiming at an enemy just blasting all over the tileset in Hydron defense for an example as the AOE would just melt the low level fodder.

What DE have forced upon such players is simply that now they have to think first and aim properly....in my mind a good thing but it created a wave of resentment that could be heard in the next star system.

ysegrim

As for the getting ammo back you have so many options.......

Be active and pick up the drops do not just stand in one spot shooting wildly. Choose the target take them down and any low level enemy fodder around them in one hit.

Use mods as Vigilante Supplies that convert the unwanted ammo drops you pick up to the primary weapon

Use mods that increase base ammo and the best one is ammo Drum on the exilus as it gives 90% extra without sacrificing a mod slot on the weapon itself.

There are probably more options but if you still run out of ammo then you're not utilizing the Bramma properly. 

 

[NecroPed]

6 hours ago, johnno23 said:

There are probably more options but if you still run out of ammo then you're not utilizing the Bramma properly. 

 

This. If I run out of ammo it's usually because I've been wasteful or made some bad shots. Or in other words: failed to effectively use the bramma.

[johnno23]

I think so. I never have ammo issues with the Bramma. I have Ammo drum on the exilus slot which gives me 90% extra ammo so the negative effect of 15 to 5 which many complain about is for the largest part negated.

I also use the secondary firearm for the single targets and Bramma for groups. 

I aim at the feet of the enemies if there is a group and AOE is over 44,972 spread over 8.3 meters. 9 out of 10 times it just takes them all down. It has an 87.5% Critical chance with a 4.6x multiplier so not many regular star chart enemies really give too much trouble.

I also mop up stragglers with melee so the ammo drops are basically being picked up on the fly either as I run over them or my companion picks them up.  I have used the bramma on 1 hour arbitrations without running into issues with ammo but I use the bramma specifically for the ability to take out a group. 

I do however take advantage of multishot. With multishot that assists in taking down a group. My favourite place to use the bramma outside of an arbitration is the void as very often it is the perfect weapon for the passages - doorways and staircase etc where one shot and the enemies are dead and I can move on.

I personally think the Bramma is an excellent weapon and do like to use it but I am careful about what missions. For example I like to use it on a survival if I know I can get up high loose 3 or 4 shots the hoard is thinned out jump down melee the remainder and jump up high again. Thats just a playstyle I enjoy and never really had a situation where I have zero ammo. The only time in my mind that can happen is if one were to stand in one small area and fire off the arrows without ever collecting the drops. if that is a playstyle another likes to use then they could consider using the gear wheel to have a supply of ammo just as they do health and energy.

EDIT: I forgot to mention my Bramma has 4 Madurai polarities and one naramon. and is level 38 so I can with ease swap out 1 and on occasion 2 mods to make a viral build magenetic build blast radiation or corrosive. So I always adjust my bramma to meet the needs of the mission. But that is simply good sense for any weapon.

[Chloraa]

Why are people raising torches, screaming, and crying about the damage the Kuva Bramma deals? lol...

This bow is seriously GARBAGE against high level enemies with ANY level of armor. Corrosive builds are useless (for me, if it doesnt one shot or two shot an enemy as a bow, it's garbage), the only thing that can bypass how WEAK it is towards these enemies, is a Hunter Munitions build, and even then, the status percentage is absolute bs low (Crit builds on this weapon for high levels is BAD, so I dont know why people are complaining about it and asking for a 5% nerf on the crit chance LOL). For someone like me who has terrible luck, with 3 mods in the build raising status chance for viral and slash procs, specially now with less cluster bombs, it still seriously sucks xD. I have to grind for another 3 weapons to raise toxin damage, and get a Primed Cryo mod to even make it "good". Overpowered? Maybe so against enemies who have literally NO armor like most infested units. Wanna know overpowered? Take a look at a well-built Excalibur exalted sword, now that, is busted and a half. But I mean, what can you say, the hate's always gotta be there right? Just like I read on someone else's comment... fun police all over the place trying to ruin other people's fun.

 

[fr4gb4ll]

On 2020-10-29 at 9:12 PM, Chloraa said:

Why are people raising torches, screaming, and crying about the damage the Kuva Bramma deals? lol...

This bow is seriously GARBAGE against high level enemies with ANY level of armor. Corrosive builds are useless (for me, if it doesnt one shot or two shot an enemy as a bow, it's garbage), the only thing that can bypass how WEAK it is towards these enemies, is a Hunter Munitions build, and even then, the status percentage is absolute bs low (Crit builds on this weapon for high levels is BAD, so I dont know why people are complaining about it and asking for a 5% nerf on the crit chance LOL). For someone like me who has terrible luck, with 3 mods in the build raising status chance for viral and slash procs, specially now with less cluster bombs, it still seriously sucks xD. I have to grind for another 3 weapons to raise toxin damage, and get a Primed Cryo mod to even make it "good". Overpowered? Maybe so against enemies who have literally NO armor like most infested units. Wanna know overpowered? Take a look at a well-built Excalibur exalted sword, now that, is busted and a half. But I mean, what can you say, the hate's always gotta be there right? Just like I read on someone else's comment... fun police all over the place trying to ruin other people's fun.

 

while the bow isn't 'garbage' like you say, it certainly isn't nor was to begin with so overpowered as many here claimed - only in the normal gameplay it was but as you said, against high levels it's less than optimal... this goes to about all guns, primary or secondary too though (and especially all aoe-weapons, regardless of build).

i fully agree with the statement of 'if it can't kill in one or maybe at least two hits, it's useless' and since we can have melee weapon build that DO can kill an enemy in one or two hits, that is the way doing things in high level for most players. kinda sad that DE does not think about this though - especially BEFORE releasing any new weapons like the bramma which ofc looks like an overkill if one is only using it against enimies in the below-100 range... that aside, the fx of the bow where indeed a bit annoying first, but one could just prevent this easily enough too by not using those damn color schemes out of the 80's...

maybe if weapons would also 'scale' up with the enemy level, all those 'nerf-cryer' and 'fun-killer' discussions could be prevented too in the future... but i doubt we will ever see any kind of functional scaling in warframe since there is already too much 'tradition' in everything around, weapons, builds and gameplay like which all would be affected by it - and likely would be hated by so many people regardless of it being a better way or not.

[BahamutKaiser]

So is Vigilante Supply equally effective as Arrow Mutation?

[(PSN)Claudija]

52 minutes ago, BahamutKaiser said:

So is Vigilante Supply equally effective as Arrow Mutation?

i find it better especially as Vigilante Armaments boosts a Multishot effect if both are equipped with other Vigilante mods. Arrow Mutation is exactly the same mod I found.

Bramma still gains just 1 arrow per pickup last I used her but the Vigilante bonuses make them better than Arrow Mutation

[RioLeXuS]

14 minutes ago, (PSN)Claudija said:

i find it better especially as Vigilante Armaments boosts a Multishot effect if both are equipped with other Vigilante mods. Arrow Mutation is exactly the same mod I found.

Bramma still gains just 1 arrow per pickup last I used her but the Vigilante bonuses make them better than Arrow Mutation

I`m pretty sure vigilante set bonus is not multishot effect, but adds a chance to increase critical hit tier, therefore multishot from vigilante armaments isn`t boosted by any means

[(PSN)Claudija]

10 hours ago, RioLeXuS said:

I`m pretty sure vigilante set bonus is not multishot effect, but adds a chance to increase critical hit tier, therefore multishot from vigilante armaments isn`t boosted by any means

Vigilante Armaments adds a +41 Multishot or something and as Set mods can boost each other.. Then you have actual rare mods plus Rivens  also adding to Multishot; this is why I suggested Vigilante Supplies in place of Arrow Mutation

[RioLeXuS]

6 hours ago, (PSN)Claudija said:

Vigilante Armaments adds a +41 Multishot or something and as Set mods can boost each other.. Then you have actual rare mods plus Rivens  also adding to Multishot; this is why I suggested Vigilante Supplies in place of Arrow Mutation

Set mods do not boost each other, the only exceptions are sacrificial and umbral mod sets. Set mods have a unique effect that is boosted by how many set mods are equiped and for vigilante mod set that unique effect is a chance to increase critical tier.

[DroopingPuppy]

That's right. Boosting the other set mods is the set effect of the Sacrificial and Umbra mode sets.

That said, the bow is still very powerful. It requires either Carrier or Vigilante Supplies to be functional, but you can put Supplies on the exilus slot and you have not much an issue. It is annoying a bit sometimes when its ammo stock is depleted but in the most times you can keep shooting it for the dropped ammunition is converted to the arrow. I don't think that why it is even a nerf - I can keep shooting just below of me often and I have not much a problem for this.

[(PSN)f_r_e_e_b_i_e_bg]

I recently got it. Initial impressions were rather meh. The slap in the face with the magazine was wtf moment. I didn't look what was nerfed but it just felt meh (vs lvl 20-30 ish the aoe area seems very small). Later I put catalyst and opened exilus slot - as I found out arrow mutation or vigilante supplies were pretty much a must if you want to use a very popular and still considered one of the best primaries weapons in the game.

I am still unimpressed and on the fence if I want to forma (don't have that much). In general I am left with the feeling it was great on theory and visuals, but on practice it feels, meh (so far). A bit wider AoE area wouldn't hurt and at least 10 magazines man :D.

[DroopingPuppy]

18 hours ago, (PSN)f_r_e_e_b_i_e_bg said:

I recently got it. Initial impressions were rather meh. The slap in the face with the magazine was wtf moment. I didn't look what was nerfed but it just felt meh (vs lvl 20-30 ish the aoe area seems very small). Later I put catalyst and opened exilus slot - as I found out arrow mutation or vigilante supplies were pretty much a must if you want to use a very popular and still considered one of the best primaries weapons in the game.

I am still unimpressed and on the fence if I want to forma (don't have that much). In general I am left with the feeling it was great on theory and visuals, but on practice it feels, meh (so far). A bit wider AoE area wouldn't hurt and at least 10 magazines man :D.

If I remember correctly, the 'nerf' include the INCREASED area of effect of the weapon. So it actually attacks wider area for now.

 

Quote

- It has a smaller reserve ammo (15 to 5), and gains fewer arrows from ammo pickups - This is to encourage players to aim the bow deliberately at crowds of enemies and not fire it wildly everywhere
- Fewer cluster bombs are produced on impact (from 7 to 3) - Reduces the overwhelming AOE potential somewhat but also makes the Bramma less visually busy. Players have said that the many many explosions produced by Bramma are hard to see through.
- Increased cluster projectile radial attack size from 2.7m to 3.5m
- Reduced cluster projectile fall off from 100% to 50% - Fewer explosive fragments, but they cover more area and generally do more damage