Remove Jackal deathbeam

[ShadowStarx1]

Damm things are undodgeable 1 hit will that repeatedly down to wipe most of the party.

 

only way even possible to try to dodge is with Operator Void.

 

and yet this is the FIRST boss players encounter.

 

.. no even if this was a boss near the end of the map it  wouldn't be ok.

 

remove the deathbeams.

 

This message will self-destruct.

[SpicyDinosaur]

Even at level 102 this fight is trivial. Learn some parkour. 1, for part of the fight there are columns to hide behind. 2, for all of the fight you can jump up the columns to get to a tiny ledge above the laser, 3, you can roll into and through each laser to limit stagger and damage. 

 

It's a very easy fight. You didn't even propose an alternate, just "make the new fight you designed trivial for even the lowest geared player."

[--F--NerevarCM]

8 minutes ago, ShadowStarx1 said:

Damm things are undodgeable 1 hit will that repeatedly down to wipe most of the party.

Do you know Parkour? Do you know you can literaly jump in the fcking wall and evade all lasers?

[(PSN)Hikuro-93]

Let alone the usual cheese tactics, I look forward to facing this new Jackal with new mechanics that make me move more than pressing "Jump" every few seconds.

Or so I hope. *Activates Nyx's Absorb*

Edited June 17, 2020 by (PS4)Hikuro-93

[Traumtulpe]

16 minutes ago, ShadowStarx1 said:

Damm things are undodgeable 1 hit will that repeatedly down to wipe most of the party.

Bruh. I just killed the Jackal without mods on my Warframe and without operator. I didn't even get downed once. Save to say, the problem lies with you.

[Sevek7]

25 minutes ago, ShadowStarx1 said:

Damm things are undodgeable 1 hit will that repeatedly down to wipe most of the party.

 

only way even possible to try to dodge is with Operator Void.

 

and yet this is the FIRST boss players encounter.

 

.. no even if this was a boss near the end of the map it  wouldn't be ok.

 

remove the deathbeams.

 

This message will self-destruct.

Deathbeams? You mean the big glowing orange wall that moves at walking pace? 

You can walk away from it, you don't have to stand still and take the damage. 

[Rhyandra]

I swear to god no matter how easy the game would become, some casuals would just whine about everything.

[ixidron92]

You know you can jump up and avoid them, right?

[Loza03]

Try jumping over them, jump-rope style. Staying at the edge of the arena helps since you have a larger area

Alternatively, get close, and the beams will be travelling relatively slower, making it trivial to avoid them.

Also consider latching on to the walls.

 

There are problems with death beams, but dodging is not one of them.

[AnatharsWrath]

only issue ive seen with the laser walls is if you are on a laggy host connection. it can hit you due to where the disparity between where it actually is comapred to where you see it.

beyond that its super easy to avoid
 

also it really sucks for non sentinel pets...they go down constantly cause they dont avoid damage.

[Tsukinoki]

2 hours ago, ShadowStarx1 said:

Damm things are undodgeable 1 hit will that repeatedly down to wipe most of the party.

You mean so undodgeable that if you get closer to the Jackal you can walk at the same pace as the walls and never get hit as long as you pay attention to what direction the walls are moving in?
So undodgeable that you just need to pay some attention to the game.  And not even a ton of attention.  Just what direction is the wall moving in and thats that.

I have never had to go into kid mode to avoid the death walls, and I've done every sortie with the Jackal in it so far.

26 minutes ago, AnatharsWrath said:

also it really sucks for non sentinel pets...they go down constantly cause they dont avoid damage.

Yeah, they should just make pets immune to the death walls like they are immune to most of the void traps...pets just aren't smart enough to avoid it and it just makes it too impractical to bring a pet into that fight because its not a "if it goes down" but a "When jackal does his first light wall they will go down".

[rodzzila]

You don't even have to jumping over them, just run with the laser and you're good! They even turn off when they change direction, so you don't have to worry about that.... In other words:  GIT GUD!

[Thrymm]

Geez guys, have a little class.  We can help with stuff like this instead of jumping on like a pack of, well, Jackals.

Operator Void mode is definitely not the only way, in fact, I don't really even know how to do it that way because I use the operator only for energy and wouldn't do that if Zenurik went away

As mentioned, you can move along with the beams, staying between them.  That's a good way to avoid it.

You can jump over the beams as mentioned, it'll take a little timing but it works.

The Rolling Dodge mod will let you survive them.  I recommend it for many builds, it's worth it.

The way I do it is to jump up the wall, usually on a corner of one of the support beam looking things.  If I'm feeling fancy, I'll wall latch up there.  If I'm not, I'll just jump repeatedly, mashing my head against the ceiling until the phase is done, then jump down and parazon him.

I'm sure there are other ways, but these will cover it

[Nichivo]

12 hours ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

It's a very easy fight. You didn't even propose an alternate, just "make the new fight you designed trivial for even the lowest geared player."

So it begins.. *Marks date on calendar to know when the 3-6 month, make everything trivial fix will go live.*

I think it's safe to say, no matter how easy content is, someone will complain it's hard.

[kevoisvevo]

Geez if you can't even dodge a very telegraphed Lazer with parkour wall latch or just moving with the beams then you wouldn't even stand 10 secs with the first boss fights in dark souls, sekiro and bloodborne. Then it is gaming journalism difficulty at that moment then 😂

[Steel_Rook]

10 hours ago, Tsukinoki said:

You mean so undodgeable that if you get closer to the Jackal you can walk at the same pace as the walls and never get hit as long as you pay attention to what direction the walls are moving in?

Snark aside, walking with the red walls as you say is actually a superior tactic to trying to jump on the ceiling. It's easiest to avoid them when you stand close to the Jackal, which puts you in immediate Parazon range the moment it drops (provided you jump over his landing shockwave). Trying to hang off the ceiling does work, but it puts you far from the Jackal and requires a bit of movement to get back to it.

Also, a bit of an observation. The Jackal will rotate its red wall a predictable number of times, depending on how many health bars it has. At four health bars, it'll rotate once. At three health bars, it'll rotate twice. At two and one health bars, it'll rotate three times. This is useful, because the Jackal will slam down at the end of the final rotation quite quickly. If you know which rotation is "the last rotation," you can jump (and double jump) when you think it's going to end and immediately execute it. I've found this to be easier and faster than any other approach, myself.

[nslay]

Try wall climbing/wall latching on the walls at the edges of the arenas (ignore the pillars that get destroyed).

[Richeatue]

On 2020-06-16 at 8:31 PM, ShadowStarx1 said:

Damm things are undodgeable 1 hit will that repeatedly down to wipe most of the party.

 

only way even possible to try to dodge is with Operator Void.

 

and yet this is the FIRST boss players encounter.

 

.. no even if this was a boss near the end of the map it  wouldn't be ok.

 

remove the deathbeams.

 

This message will self-destruct.

There are so many ways to cheese this damn thing, if I'm playing with noobs I just play max duration harrow and nobody can take damage, even if they want to. This is a very trivial problem, and the game makes it very clear how to dodge these. However, if for some reason you don't want to actually dodge the lasers, here is a list of a few ways to cheese it:

Harrow

Operator mode

Wukong

Rhino

inaros

the list goes on.

In other words, unless you're a glue eater this boss should be relatively easy. I've played this with multiple noobs, and the only guy who died constantly on this fight was complaining about 2fps. Also, this is NOT the first boss players fight, captian vor is, and if you think this boss is "hard" for new players, you haven't met lech krill yet.

Edited June 19, 2020 by Richeatue

[supernils]

Omg dude, forget Operator or "parcour". Do you know evolving doors? Are you afraid of those? Just WALK with the beam. All it takes it just that. Or go play the Sims.

 

[BlackCat500]

I'm all for improving newbie experience, but I think jackal is a very easy, very good first step towards achieving this. Right now, newbies get spoonfed with the ability to basically delete each enemy in 1-3 shots. If you raise the bar from the start and make people think even a little bit about a fight, they will be more alert for what's to come and further reworks of other bosses can bring up the difficulty and enjoyment of the game as a whole.

 

I for one don't want the sergeant to be swapped with the jackal just because he's an easy boss - I want him to get reworked to be much harder and more significant than the jackal. The jackal is a combat proxy, but the sergeant is actually someone of rank and importance in the corpus army (even if we take away the fact that he is technically supposed to be nef anyo, he's not just some random killer robot).

 

This is an opportunity to turn things around an add difficulty to the game, while hard mode and ultra hard mode potentially offer the possibility of adding more challenging mechanics on top.

[phoenix1992]

Undodgeable ?

As multiple people mentioned, walk with the bloody beam. Even more, when they are blue it is safe to go trough.

[T-Shark69]

On 2020-06-17 at 2:31 AM, ShadowStarx1 said:

only way even possible to try to dodge is with Operator Void.

You learn this stuff in elementary school but, walking alongside θ requires less walking speed than walking alongside L for the same beam speed :



If you stay close to the intersection you can literally just walk faster than the beam can get to you.
Now go git gud.

[supernils]

Just now, T-Shark69 said:

You learn this stuff in elementary school but, walking alongside θ requires less walking speed than walking alongside L for the same beam speed :



If you stay close to the intersection you can literally just walk faster than the beam can get to you.
Now go git gud.

big brain stuff!

[HoustonDragon]

On 2020-06-16 at 8:31 PM, ShadowStarx1 said:

Damm things are undodgeable 1 hit will that repeatedly down to wipe most of the party.

If your party stands there and takes it on the chin, yes, you're going to die horribly.

 

Use your Operator Void form to pass between the beams. Jump up the walls and avoid it. Or just watch the pattern and run/bullet jump to dodge it. The beams are static in there are only 3 rounds and they alternate direction each time. The blue ones are the warning, the red ones are deadly.

 

There's the odd occasional death due to lag or something, but it's a manageable encounter. Also, DON'T try reviving anyone while the lasers are still freaking running. I've watched too many heroes killing themselves that way.

[Koga.]

On 2020-06-16 at 5:31 PM, ShadowStarx1 said:

Damm things are undodgeable 1 hit will that repeatedly down to wipe most of the party.

 

only way even possible to try to dodge is with Operator Void.

 

and yet this is the FIRST boss players encounter.

 

.. no even if this was a boss near the end of the map it  wouldn't be ok.

 

remove the deathbeams.

 

This message will self-destruct.

hol up so you're telling me that a boss ability that can be completely avoided just by moving should  is too hard for you  ? u tripping bro just close this discussion no need to make a fool out of your self  ''jackal boss is so hard Bouhuuu'' never before said S#&$ ever

 

Edited June 19, 2020 by Koga.