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Upcoming Protea Changes!


[DE]Megan
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Dunno why people are still complaining about blaze artillery. Even the current version in game with a high duration build with moderate power strength does very good damage to a crowd of enemies, so doubling its scaling and improving base duration should be great. Also, to people complaining about it not getting volt shield synergy; you realize blaze artillery can't crit (even with avenger) so all that would do is change its damage type to radiation so you miss out on the infinite heat proc stacking, right?

I still have a few big QoL gripes with Protea that aren't reflected here however: First off, her shield grenade buff icon should really have a timer under it. The ability icon timer isn't enough because it just gets overridden by shrapnel grenades. This is especially important because you can't refresh the shield grenade buff until it runs out, so you've really gotta be able to plan around exactly when it's gonna fall off. Additionally, as other people have suggested in the thread, it would go a long way to just have one of the shield grenades auto-apply to protea when you throw them (that might be a good way to let the buff refresh as well, as the game won't have to be comparing durations on shield grenades when deciding if they one should replace the currently active one). Having to chase them down each time can make her survivability feel pretty inconsistent compared to other shield-gate reliant frames, which is only made worse by the clunky cast animation.

As far as Temporal Anchor goes, I think my biggest issue right now with it is that you have to basically avoid energy orbs (or more precisely spots that could spawn energy orbs) like the plague while you have it up. I'm fine with energy you gain prior to rewinding being lost, that's the trade off of the ability. However, I've noticed that energy orbs you get while rewinding just get overridden by an older energy value. I don't know if this is by design or a result of how energy is snapshotted by the ability (I'm assuming that your literal energy value is what's recorded and rolled back through, and not changes to it), but it kind of gives her temporal anchor and dispensary a lot of anti-synergy, especially on a low efficiency build that relies on arcane energize (which is kind of the only way to justify dispensary as a good ability imo). I've been able to play around it, but it's just very counter intuitive to have to do so.

I'd assume the intention here would be to let you do something like activate temporal anchor, throw down a dispensary to later refund its cost, spend a bunch of energy, then rewind to the dispensary that has produced an energy orb to refund your temporal anchor cast (if you get lucky with an energize proc). In practice, what I have to do is throw down a dispensary first, then start temporal anchor well outside of vacuum range of the dispensary and make sure I stay out of that range for the duration.

Other than that, I think the implosion component of temporal anchor should either ignore LoS and just go through walls like Equinox (otherwise range means very little on it), and/or you should be able to stack the damage until you consume it by deactivating temporal anchor without rewinding. then at least you can save up for a while until you have a perfect opportunity with a lot of enemies in LoS/can do enough damage to at least kill high level armored enemies.

All that being said, Protea's a fun frame and I like her a lot, I just think she has some QoL issues that should be addressed (on top of the changes that are already in the works).

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Blaze Artillery

  • Increased Duration of Blaze Artillery by 1 second, and doubled the Damage multiplier to compete against higher level enemies. Duration will now show in Arsenal stats instead of the maximum number of shots.
  • Protea’s Blaze Artillery will now shoot through Volt’s Shield, but won't benefit from its buffs.
  • Fixed Protea’s Blaze Artillery not targeting ragdolled enemies. 

Our goal here is to keep the spirit of the rapid fire Artillery alive, with just a bit more punch. We will monitor for feedback after this change as well. 

 

May i suggest about this Blaze Artillery. Since it's very fast lauch of bullet and low bullet stock (just not more than 15 with planty of Str). So this ability was limit by bullet itself.

So in this case, why not just increase it's duration to like 30-40 sec to make it stay as long as it not use all bullet then vanish after bullet is dry out or time out. So we can place it like a trap instead of just use it like option fire. 3-4 sec make it no option to use it unless you want to fire it suddenly. In that case "Gun" is more relaiable. I can't imagine much situation for this ability to shine with just option fire. (Since you can't shoot your gun during use ability so you need to pick one Shoot gun or use this ability, which give almost same result just this ability give you auto aim and lower damage)  But i can imagine that it's will be useful if it work same as trap that we can place it around wait for enemy to encounter it. You can use it as back up fire take care on your back while you shoot the front enemy or place it on the enemy trials to trap them. 

Edited by LumilSilvermoon
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Changes are welcome. Had always the feeling, that her Blaze Artillery was a mere placeholder than an actual skill. I would be happier if the duration would last around 20 secs, since you can deploy multiple turrets. What bugs me more is the throwing range of her grenades. If her grenades had an Vauban-like arc It would be better for my taste. Feels like I throw them somewhere into the void than It's actual destination.

Edited by PyroMail.Com
Typo
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vor 3 Stunden schrieb Rusty_Shackleford_Prime:

Dunno why people are still complaining about blaze artillery. Even the current version in game with a high duration build with moderate power strength does very good damage to a crowd of enemies, so doubling its scaling and improving base duration should be great. Also, to people complaining about it not getting volt shield synergy; you realize blaze artillery can't crit (even with avenger) so all that would do is change its damage type to radiation so you miss out on the infinite heat proc stacking, right?

Although I don't really care about Volt shield and never suggested it, Volt shield damage does not combine exsiting damage types to create secondary elements. Also the electric damage addition is the part that stacks with multiple shields, so before making a clever argument here, I'd probably check my facts before making false conclusions. I do not agree with the blaze artillery damage being fine with these changes. At least not for level 30+ content. If I spawn in simulacrum - for the ultimate test - 20 heavy gunners at lvl 175 and use a fully forma'd Protea having 250% strength and 12 ammo, the artillery just shoots randomly at them. Fire never stacks higher than 25 (because the guns just shoot different targets even if they're not moving) and most importantly I don't even see the HP moving after several minutes. LOL. It's completely useless. I could clear these with a decent weapon in 15 seconds or less. Now if this would be additional damage, I wouldn't really care or complain but I'm required to constantly put turrets down to get most damage out of them. In other words, I would be A LOT more effective just using my weapons and not using the ability at all. The suggested buffs will not change this.

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Il y a 19 heures, Mr.Holyroller a dit :

Yeah id love if it was just duration based and capped at like 10x or something

Well, it would be normal to have that
Having it duration based AND ammunition based makes it clunky to use, you can't really place the turret somewhere to cover a point, you have to cast it every 4-5 seconds (depending on your mods)
Even removing the duration and keeping the Ammo while capping it at 2-3 deployed at the same time, with a lvl scalin AND a multiplier cap would be a lot better
Plus it costs a lot for something that needs to be spammed (64.5 in my actual build, every 4 seconds, that's just insane, don't really know if they tested it before putting her live)
And her turret is S#&$ against higher lvl ennemies 120+, considering the new difficulty set that is coming, I don't think she'll be picked up that much often.
Why deploying an ability that don't even kill things past a certain level when you have an overpowered melee, AOE guns, and even better frames with less energy hungry powers to do that ?
Placing the turret is more time consuming than blindly firing with an acceltra in a pack of mobs (And that's actually what I'm doing, I usually forgot to place the turret)

But anyway, everyone is hoping for things to change, but remember Revenant when everyone was saying that things needed tweaks or even big changes (that happened to some other frames too)
We're just suggesting things, but in the end, they do whatever they want, and they'll surely not tweak the turret as suggested by the players that are actually playing her.

Please, show me that I'm wrong here

Edited by Maryph
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24 minutes ago, Vajet said:

Although I don't really care about Volt shield and never suggested it, Volt shield damage does not combine exsiting damage types to create secondary elements. Also the electric damage addition is the part that stacks with multiple shields, so before making a clever argument here, I'd probably check my facts before making false conclusions. I do not agree with the blaze artillery damage being fine with these changes. At least not for level 30+ content. If I spawn in simulacrum - for the ultimate test - 20 heavy gunners at lvl 175 and use a fully forma'd Protea having 250% strength and 12 ammo, the artillery just shoots randomly at them. Fire never stacks higher than 25 (because the guns just shoot different targets even if they're not moving) and most importantly I don't even see the HP moving after several minutes. LOL. It's completely useless. I could clear these with a decent weapon in 15 seconds or less. Now if this would be additional damage, I wouldn't really care or complain but I'm required to constantly put turrets down to get most damage out of them. In other words, I would be A LOT more effective just using my weapons and not using the ability at all. The suggested buffs will not change this.

what you're saying is true for hitscan weapons, but for projectiles it does. Or at least it gets folded into secondary elements containing electricity, so if it's not the case that a heat projectile would combine with electric to make radiation then that's my bad. And yeah you're right that the flat damage each shield adds would add up, but still doesn't seem like the best synergy since I just think of crits with volt shield. Either way, I guess it's no reason to have even less inter-warframe synergy so I was probably too quick to shoot down those complaints.

As for damage being bad, I've got I think 169 strength and enough duration for 15 shots on my build and 3 turrets kills groups of level 145 chg's and bombards in a few seconds. One thing I've found that makes a big difference is bunching up enemies enough for the punchthrough to do its thing and stack up the multiplier in fewer shots, so I've been using the ferrox for that. Then factor in stacking viral with a kuva nukor and you have a pretty well scaling crowd clearer. I can understand if that seems like too much work to make an ability work really well, but I've been enjoying my playstyle with it and I kinda think a lot of people are writing it off sooner than they should.

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il y a 21 minutes, Rusty_Shackleford_Prime a dit :

As for damage being bad, I've got I think 169 strength and enough duration for 15 shots on my build and 3 turrets kills groups of level 145 chg's and bombards in a few seconds. One thing I've found that makes a big difference is bunching up enemies enough for the punchthrough to do its thing and stack up the multiplier in fewer shots, so I've been using the ferrox for that. Then factor in stacking viral with a kuva nukor and you have a pretty well scaling crowd clearer. I can understand if that seems like too much work to make an ability work really well, but I've been enjoying my playstyle with it and I kinda think a lot of people are writing it off sooner than they should.
 

253 strgh, 203 duration, 3 turrets don't even scratch the paint of 145 chg, DoT is ending before even killing one, are you sure about what you're saying ?
Having to use 2 things plus the ability to make it work correctly against Higher lvl ennemies means it's not really working well

If she had a 3rd tether coil grenade to quickly pack the mobs, it would be fine like that

 

Edited by Maryph
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vor 8 Minuten schrieb Rusty_Shackleford_Prime:

what you're saying is true for hitscan weapons, but for projectiles it does. Or at least it gets folded into secondary elements containing electricity, so if it's not the case that a heat projectile would combine with electric to make radiation then that's my bad. 

It behaves same for projectiles and hitscan. At least for weapons like bow (including Ivaras's exalted) or catchmoon. I'm not sure what other projectiles you are refering to.

 

vor 8 Minuten schrieb Rusty_Shackleford_Prime:

As for damage being bad, I've got I think 169 strength and enough duration for 15 shots on my build and 3 turrets kills groups of level 145 chg's and bombards in a few seconds. One thing I've found that makes a big difference is bunching up enemies enough for the punchthrough to do its thing and stack up the multiplier in fewer shots, so I've been using the ferrox for that. Then factor in stacking viral with a kuva nukor and you have a pretty well scaling crowd clearer. I can understand if that seems like too much work to make an ability work really well, but I've been enjoying my playstyle with it and I kinda think a lot of people are writing it off sooner than they should.

You might just kill them with the nukor if you're using it to stack viral to make a difference. Basically what you are saying is when all stars align and I use other mechanics to buff damage the turrets do alright. Keep in mind we have warframes that can clear entire rooms with a single button and weapons that deal large amounts of aoe and a lot more damage. Like I said, if the turrets would last significantly longer, I wouldn't compare them against such things because their damage would be additional to whatever else I'm doing. But in it's current state (and one second extra won't really change that), it's an ability you need to use frequently which means you do it instead of just using weapons.

I can understand you enjoy the current playstyle and I do too because it requires to use her abilities a lot and more attention than most warframes. But regardless it underperforms terribly in my opinion and one part of the solution to that is either make blaze artillery a more passive ability (by increasing the duration significantly) or make it more powerful (by increasing damage significantly). I think DE put in a lot of effort into this frame, it truly has a lot of unique and fun abilities. I think it'd be sad if in the end it becomes another mastery fodder frame because of it's overall performance.

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31 minutes ago, Maryph said:

253 strgh, 203 duration, 3 turrets don't even scratch the paint of 145 chg, DoT is ending before even killing one, are you sure about what you're saying ?
Having to use 2 things plus the ability to make it work correctly against Higher lvl ennemies means it's not really working well

If she had a 3rd tether coil grenade to quickly pack the mobs, it would be fine like that

 

Just tested again and I think the discrepancy is all about bunching enemies up with the ferrox. When I use the Ferrox (but no nukor) on 4 chg and 4 bombards only 2 chgs survived with almost no health. Without grouping them, yeah the results are pathetic. I 100% agree she should have something in her kit to bunch up enemies (besides the implosion which behaves erratically). I've seen other suggestions about making her shrapnel grenades also have a pull effect to them, I think that'd be pretty perfect.

 

20 minutes ago, Vajet said:

It behaves same for projectiles and hitscan. At least for weapons like bow (including Ivaras's exalted) or catchmoon. I'm not sure what other projectiles you are refering to.

 

You might just kill them with the nukor if you're using it to stack viral to make a difference. Basically what you are saying is when all stars align and I use other mechanics to buff damage the turrets do alright. Keep in mind we have warframes that can clear entire rooms with a single button and weapons that deal large amounts of aoe and a lot more damage. Like I said, if the turrets would last significantly longer, I wouldn't compare them against such things because their damage would be additional to whatever else I'm doing. But in it's current state (and one second extra won't really change that), it's an ability you need to use frequently which means you do it instead of just using weapons.

I can understand you enjoy the current playstyle and I do too because it requires to use her abilities a lot and more attention than most warframes. But regardless it underperforms terribly in my opinion and one part of the solution to that is either make blaze artillery a more passive ability (by increasing the duration significantly) or make it more powerful (by increasing damage significantly). I think DE put in a lot of effort into this frame, it truly has a lot of unique and fun abilities. I think it'd be sad if in the end it becomes another mastery fodder frame because of it's overall performance.

Nope, I just tested since I was already in the simulacrum. Lanka modded with pure radiation only procs radiation shooting through shields, whereas redeemer prime modded with corrosive got some electric procs. Also tested with ember's fireball as that would be the closest to protea's turret and that actually was able to proc heat and electric separately despite being a projectile, so I guess protea's turret wouldn't lose the heat proc with that synergy. Just tested with a projectile gun only modded for heat and it got both heat and electric, so yeah. Projectile and hitscan only behave differently as to whether or not the electric gets combined into secondary elements or not, it never gets combined with a primary element, so I was wrong about that.

You're probably right though that I'm trying to make it work in its current state too hard; it's not like I'm opposed to buffing it, I guess I just felt the need to defend it a bit because people generally make the turret sound worse than it is without failing to account for a lot of factors that influence its damage.

Edited by Rusty_Shackleford_Prime
elaborated on volt shield element procs
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Hi, thanks for really listen to us.

Her 1th and 2th will need new tests to know how this changes will be good for her, those changes sounds good. Blaze Artillery getting cautious buffs is understandable, I'll hold off on judgement till it's available in game. Hope u guys consider the interaction between her 2th and volt's shield, i think that synergy between different warframe abilities should be encouraged instead of avoided.

However, her 3th and 4th need no test to know that this will not fix them, her 3th (while the marker of course will help) need somehow be more mobile, for other mission, idk, i like the ability, but i always have to be in the same spot to take the full effect of the ability or recast it, losing energy... to gain less energy?... 

Her 4th doesnt need to place an anchor, remove that please, make that she is always recording (doenst need to be a giant amount of secoonds), this will make her gameplay much more dynamic, If not, at least make the ability cheaper and refund the cost if it is canceled. At the moment, that is no reason to use the ability.

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17 minutes ago, Mendonza said:

Her 4th doesnt need to place an anchor, remove that please, make that she is always recording (doenst need to be a giant amount of secoonds), this will make her gameplay much more dynamic, If not, at least make the ability cheaper and refund the cost if it is canceled. At the moment, that is no reason to use the ability.

Thing is, if you cast this ability and put down Dispensary you get back energy you spend during the ability and also once the ability rewinds back you get the energy from Dispensary.

Tho you kinda have to have some efficiency. Point is, energy isn't the biggest problem with this ability. It's the usage that can be really situational.

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I love the new changes. People who don't know how powerful she is just aren't playing her right.

First thing is you want to have 185% strength, because beyond that the strength of her abilities don't scale as fast.

2, If you want to get the most out of her abilities, you need to get your energy to the max, 225, and with the efficiency of a single Streamline, you can cast Time Warp for 70 energy. If you've already used her shield drones to increase your shields, then after you cast Temporal Anchor, you only need to summon 1 turret to activate her passive.

3, Once you trigger her passive, you need to cast her Dispensary with the bonus 100% strength. That gives you an increased chance for it to spawn an additional health/energy orb and more ammo drops.

4, After that you need to just spam the hell out of her Turret. Because once Temporal Anchor rewinds you, you get back all of the energy you spent on abilities.

And if you use Energy Siphon and the Dethcube Precept mod Energy Generator, you will never run out of energy, even without using Energizing Dash.

Also, with her shield drones, it's not about how long they last, it's about the instant surge of shields you get when you use it. Right now, my drones give me an immediate boost of 900 shields. 

The only thing I would change about her shield drones is if they made it prioritize Warframes over companions. I couldn't count how many times I have had to use my shield drones 3-4 times because, A the 2 other people and their kavats who ran in to help the guy take the shield drones when they are already at max shields. Also, if I'm not mistaken, when Protea was first released, you couldn't grab a shield drone if you already had one. But now you can refresh the duration of you pick up another one. Please have the drones prioritize Warframes and Warframes that don't have overshields over companions and Frames that already have overshields.

Giving her Grenade Fan/Shield Drones a fourth one is good, but not if it prioritizes companions and Warframes equally.

Edited by Primalmaximus
Thought of something else to add to my post
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On 2020-06-18 at 10:11 PM, Magus_Tahir said:

The amount of processing/memory power needed to be recording constantly to make this work whenever is kinda the reason this wont happen. At least not in the way one would expect.  Have a few ideas Id have to watch Doctor Who for a bit again to get it all down.

Hours of gameplay might be too much but the last few minutes would be ok. I mean, when you play Sanctuary Onslought you are fighting with many enemies, each of them, their bullets and other "their" things doing collision detection (they are doing some "interesting" stuffs to make it smoother but it still a lot of work).

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                                                                                                       translate to english

It really surprises me that none of the players here care about the 4 (and if there are some who give it ideas for their 4, but they are practically vague ideas and I have only seen ideas such as, increasing the duration, or that of others or more benefits, which would practically make the skill the same, that is, a limiting skill) that in itself the 4 is the sense of protea, but they not only give ideas of the other skills that are more or less good but not of their core that It is the 4 that practically does not work or does not make much sense or simply other warframes do it better and do not waste their time going back, because that is another warframe it is a mobility game and if you use the 4 protea you are practically breaking with the mobility because it gives you back, that makes the 4 protea a limitation and can only be used for defense missions that you will always keep in one place, that is, it is only used for camping, all without touching the issue that it seems that I did not have Of course, how to make this warframe because their skill kit does not have synergy with each other, and that's a shame because they could be inspired by the skills of the protagonist of quantum break, but not always like they think things halfway and I don't like that , thinking or leaving game modes behind does not convince me, I really do not understand why people care so much about their other abilities, that if I know that they need a few touches but ok, they just need a few touches that practically improved it with the last one hotfix, and still I see people giving paragraphs to improve their drone -.-, I mean paragraphs to improve their drone and a resource dispenser instead of worrying about their 4 that in itself should be the core of protea not a dispenser or a drone that almost already have other warframes and are better than in protea, ok now I will give an idea for your 4:

Mmm I say the time anchor should be like this: giving a single click to 4 activates the ability obviously and then rewinds, and double clicking 4 activates the ability and not only that, but we are not going to rewind in the place where we activate the ability, if not we will stay in the place where the ability ends (yes I know that by holding down the 4 the ability is canceled, but why do I want the ability to be canceled if its benefits also do it ? I mean that it makes sense to cancel this, that is the problem of 4, which limits us) and we will obtain the benefits it offers such as the explosion and regenerations of the shield and life, but with the important difference that we will have the capacity to choose if we want to return or we want to stay in the place where the ability ends.

 

                                                                                                              traduccion al español (original)

De verdad me sorprende que ninguno de los jugadores aquí se preocupan por el 4 ( y si hay algunos que lo dan ideas para su 4, pero son prácticamente ideas vagas y solo e visto ideas como, aumentar la duración, o que te de otros o mas beneficios, que prácticamente harían que la habilidad fuera lo mismo, osea una habilidad limitante) que en si el 4 es el sentido de protea, pero no solo dan ideas de las otras habilidades que están mas o menos bien pero no de su núcleo que es el 4 que no sirve prácticamente o no tiene mucho sentido o simplemente otros warframe lo hacen mejor y no pierden su tiempo volviendo hacia atrás, porque esa es otra warframe es un juego de movilidad y si usas el 4 de protea prácticamente estas rompiendo con la movilidad porque te devuelve, eso hace que el 4 de protea sea un limitante y solo se puede utilizar para misiones de defensa que siempre te mantendras en un solo sitio, osea solo se utiliza para campear, todo esto sin tocas el tema de que pareciera que no tenían claro como hacer este warframe porque su kit de habilidades no tiene sinergia con la otra, y eso es una lastima porque podían inspirarse en las habilidades del protagonista de quantum break, pero no siempre como que piensan las cosas a medias y eso no me gusta, el pensar o dejar modos de juegos atrás no me convence, de verdad no entiendo porque la gente se preocupa tanto por sus otras habilidades, que si yo se que necesitan unos retoques pero ok, solo necesitan unos retoques que prácticamente lo mejoraron con el ultimo hotfix, y aun así veo gente dando párrafos para mejorar su dron -.-, osea párrafos para mejorar su dron y un dispensador de recursos en vez de preocuparse por su 4 que en si debería de ser el núcleo de protea no un dispensador o un dron que ya prácticamente los tienen otros warframe y son mejores que en protea, ok ahora daré una idea para su 4:

Mmm digo que el ancla de tiempo debería ser así: al dar un solo clic al 4 activamos la habilidad obviamente y luego rebobinamos, y al hacer doble clic en 4 activamos la habilidad y no solo eso, si no que no vamos a rebobinar en el sitio donde activamos la habilidad, si no que nos quedaremos en el sitio donde se termine la habilidad ( si ya se que al mantener pulsado el 4 la habilidad se cancela, pero para que quiero yo que se cancele la habilidad si sus beneficios también lo hacen?, osea que sentido tiene cancelar esta, ese es el problema del 4, que nos limitan) y obtendremos los beneficios que esta ofrece como la explosión y las regeneraciones del escudo y de la vida, pero con la importante diferencia que nosotros tendremos la capacidad de elegir si queremos devolvernos o queremos mantenernos en el lugar en que finaliza la habilidad.

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Le 19/06/2020 à 13:07, ReaverKane a dit :

Aquí pensé que ibas a hacer que el "Warframe de manipulación del tiempo" tuviera más de 1 habilidad relacionada con el tiempo ...

                                                                                                translate to english

That is called wasted potential, protea could be a super fun and interesting warfame, a great warframe that all his skill kit had synergy and that all his skills were to control time (something like the protagonist of quantum break), but not, As long as they half-think things and don't work hard on things to implement, the warframe had potential, and even has potential, but I doubt that DE will synergize their abilities, because really adding a dispenser to a controlling warframe time was the best idea you had? And not only that but they come and put a drone, and not only that but they also put grenades, that makes sense with a warframe that has in its 4 rewind time ?, and not only that if not that We go again to the same and is that there are other warframes that do that and more and even leaving them afk they do it more efficiently and in less time.

                                                                                            traduccion al español ( original)

Eso se llama potencial desperdiciado, protea podrían ser un warfame super divertido e interesante, un gran warframe que todo su kit de habilidades tuviera sinergia y que todas sus habilidades fueran de controlar el tiempo ( algo asi como el protagonista de quantum break), pero no, siempre como que piensan las cosas a medias y no trabajan mucho en las cosas a implementar, el warframe tenia potencial, e incluso tiene potencial, pero dudo que DE haga que sus habilidades tengan sinergia, porque de verdad agregar un dispensador a un warframe que controla el tiempo era la mejor idea que tenían? y no solo eso si no que vienen y ponen un dron, y no solo eso si no que tambien le ponen granadas, osea  que sentido tiene eso con un warframe que tiene en su 4 rebobinar el tiempo?, y no solo eso si no que vamos otra ves a lo mismo y es que hay otros warframes que hacen eso y mas y hasta dejandolos afk lo hacen mas eficientemente y en menos tiempo.

Edited by DestroyerF5
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I've seen plenty of feedback here, and a lot of people claiming that other people just don't know how to use Protea.  Fine, my feedback is that after initial impressions the frame just doesn't have any consistency to the theme and application of skills.  That lack of consistency means using the skills as they are now is a bad joke, and requires very specific conditions.

 

As an example, power 1 is either crowd control or a regenerative ability.  Why?  How does this relate to the time theme.  It's pretty much taking Vauban's power, and instead of active attackers making Protea either a buffer or a point control frame.  Power 2 reinforces that point control, but the non-turret turrets barely last long enough to shoot without specific builds.  That's a strike against time manipulation, one for point control, and a strike against build diversity possibilities.  Power 3 is a dispenser.  Why?  It's literally stealing the Team Fortress 2 logic, and effectively is miserable if it provides energy and you use her ultimate.  Those energy orbs are erased if you pick them up before the rewind.  Finally, the time rewind...  I can think of nothing to say here.  It's effectively operator mode, without the huge investment into arcanes. 

 

So, what's the feedback?  Protea is Vauban if there was less thematic cohesion.  It's a frame that wants an area to control, but if you use the ultimate ability it can erase the benefits of the third ability.  

Make the turrets from ability two spawn, and exist until the ammo is depleted, or until the maximum limit is reached based upon power duration.  Have them do percentage damage to enemies, with a splash damage of that percentage so that they function as level scaling crowd control that can be counted upon.  To balance this, give them them one health and 1 shield.  This means they could take one hit with shield scaling, but must have some sort of CC to be effective.  This makes them a turret that is limited by ammo, instances, and durability.  That would balance them being a set-and-forget, which has been a problem you say is being focused on.

 

The dispensers are a joke.  In practice they are trumped by consumables, the operator mode, and other features.  Instead of this make them "temporal shears."  A crowd control element that has immense aggro draw, and absorbs the fire it draws in.  Instead of being a Nyx lite, the shear will explode after a time rewarding ammo, energy, and health based upon the damage it absorbed.  This could synergize with the ultimate ability, to provide resources after time is rewound.

 

The ultimate getting an invincibility period is pretty backwards when for all other frames you've basically said casting times require natural talent to influence.  Limbo is especially galling, when you consider cataclysm makes a squishy frame a target.  It's a fine ability, but the issue is that you're going to apply a bandage to fix dying in long animation times.  Why not just choose a much shorter animation?

 

 

I don't like Protea, I don't think she's bad.  Protea is a thoroughly middle of the road build, with powers that seem intentionally nerfed and inconsistent to the frame.  Hopefully in two years there'll be a rework making her less of a mess.

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5 hours ago, Primalmaximus said:

People who don't know how powerful she is just aren't playing her right.

Here We Go Reaction GIF by moodman

5 hours ago, Primalmaximus said:

4, After that you need to just spam the hell out of her Turret.

spider man lol GIF

 

dont play yourself dj khaled GIF

 

MOST people, dont even complain about her powerlevel, its about her playstyle, and this "ability spamming" is exactly the problem. its terrible.

Edited by SmokinDice
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Hace 33 minutos, master_of_destiny dijo:

He visto muchos comentarios aquí, y muchas personas afirman que otras personas simplemente no saben cómo usar Protea. Bien, mi comentario es que después de las impresiones iniciales, el marco simplemente no tiene ninguna coherencia con el tema y la aplicación de habilidades. Esa falta de coherencia significa que usar las habilidades como están ahora es una broma de mal gusto y requiere condiciones muy específicas.

 

Como ejemplo, el poder 1 es control de masas o una habilidad regenerativa. ¿Por qué? ¿Cómo se relaciona esto con el tema del tiempo? Se trata básicamente de tomar el poder de Vauban y, en lugar de atacantes activos, hacen de Protea un marco de control de puntos o de amortiguación. Power 2 refuerza ese control de puntos, pero las torretas sin torreta apenas duran lo suficiente como para disparar sin construcciones específicas. Eso es un golpe contra la manipulación del tiempo, uno para el control de puntos y un ataque contra las posibilidades de construir diversidad. Power 3 es un dispensador. ¿Por qué? Literalmente está robando la lógica de Team Fortress 2, y efectivamente es miserable si proporciona energía y usas su habilidad definitiva. Esos orbes de energía se borran si los recoges antes del rebobinado. Finalmente, el tiempo retrocede ... No se me ocurre nada que decir aquí. Es efectivamente el modo operador, 

 

Entonces, ¿cuál es el comentario? Protea es Vauban si hubiera menos cohesión temática. Es un marco que quiere controlar un área, pero si usas la habilidad máxima, puede borrar los beneficios de la tercera habilidad.  

Haz que las torretas de la habilidad dos engendren, y existe hasta que la munición se agote, o hasta que se alcance el límite máximo en función de la duración de la energía. Pídales que hagan un porcentaje de daño a los enemigos, con un daño por salpicadura de ese porcentaje para que funcionen como control de masas de escala de nivel con el que se puede contar. Para equilibrar esto, dales una salud y 1 escudo. Esto significa que podrían recibir un golpe con la escala del escudo, pero deben tener algún tipo de CC para ser efectivos. Esto los convierte en una torreta limitada por munición, instancias y durabilidad. Eso los equilibraría al ser un conjunto y olvidar, que ha sido un problema en el que usted dice que se está enfocando.

 

Los dispensadores son una broma. En la práctica, los consumibles, el modo de operador y otras características los superan. En lugar de esto, conviértalos en "cizallas temporales". Un elemento de control de multitudes que tiene un inmenso dibujo de aggro y absorbe el fuego que atrae. En lugar de ser un Nyx lite, la cizalla explotará después de un tiempo recompensando munición, energía y salud en función del daño que absorbió. Esto podría sinergizar con la capacidad máxima, para proporcionar recursos después de que el tiempo se rebobina.

 

Lo último en conseguir un período de invencibilidad es bastante al revés cuando para todos los otros cuadros básicamente has dicho que los tiempos de lanzamiento requieren talento natural para influir. El limbo es especialmente irritante, cuando consideras que el cataclismo hace que un marco blando sea un objetivo. Es una buena habilidad, pero el problema es que vas a aplicar un vendaje para arreglar la muerte en largos tiempos de animación. ¿Por qué no simplemente elegir una animación mucho más corta?

 

 

No me gusta Protea, no creo que sea mala. Protea es una construcción completamente intermedia, con poderes que parecen intencionalmente nerfeados e inconsistentes con el marco. Con suerte, en dos años habrá una revisión que la hará menos desordenada.

                                                                                                                      translate to english

Exactly, I agree with you, although I would add or change the best ones you said, but I agree that protea is not bad, but and a big but, and that is that other warframe do what she does but faster and more efficient, and without counting that its abilities have no synergy and it seems that they did not know or were not clear on how to make the warframe, because it was supposed to be a time control warframe but their other abilities other than 4 have nothing to do with its core or its theme which is temporary control.

 

                                                                                                                       traducción en español ( original)

Exacto, concuerdo contigo, si bien añadiría o cambiaría esas mejores que dijiste, pero concuerdo con que protea no es mala, pero y un gran pero y es que otros warframe hacen lo que ella hace pero mas rápido y mas eficiente, y sin contar que sus habilidades no tienen sinergia y que pareciera que no supieron o no tenían claro el como hacer el warframe, porque se suponía que seria un warframe de control de tiempo pero sus otras habilidades que no sean el 4 no tienen nada que ver con su núcleo o su temática que es el control temporal.

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Le 18/06/2020 à 14:51, [DE]Megan a dit :

As we pass our 7 day mark since the launch of The Deadlock Protocol on PC, our hands are busy at work making changes based on great player feedback! We hope to provide Protea with both visual improvements as well as touching on some Ability mechanic improvements. We’re aiming to slip this in before Console Cert as well so our Console Tenno can enjoy an improved version of Protea!


Grenade Fan

  • Increased Duration of both grenades by 3 seconds.
  • Increased Range of both grenades at max rank from 4 to 5 meters.
    • For Shield Satellite, this applies to the grenade pickup Range.
  • Increased Shield Satellite grenade count from 3 to 4 to accommodate max Squad sizes.
  • Increased visibility FX on available Shield Satellite grenades to aid in differentiating between the two grenades.
  • Doubled the Damage of the Shrapnel Vortex grenade.
  • Fixed Protea's Grenade Fan/ Shield Satellites appearing giant while using Archwing.

Our goal here is to improve efficacy, usability, and logic of Grenade Fan! 

SHIELD SATELLITES

  • Please... ADD it more CASTING SPEED. It is so needed. it has a really long casting animation.
  • Duration of 13 seconds isn´t enough. Why can´t you make it 18 or 20 seconds FOR THE SHIELD SATELLITES at least. It wouldn´t make it overpowered in any shape or form.
  • PROTEA SURVIVABILITY for enemies lvl 100+ is so DEPENDENT OF ARCANE AEGIS and it requires a lot spam just to proc this arcane and it´s even worse considering its actual casting speed. Shield satellites are still not giving enogh SURVIVABILITY.
  • PROTEA SURVIVABILITY for enemies lvl 100- is fine (considering a build with 254% power strenght ofc.) that´s a lot of power strenght and it is not enough against enemies lvl 100+.
    • POSSIBLE SOLUTIONS FOR LACK OF SURVIVABILITY lvl 100+ (please consider one the following)
      • Buff its shield/sec.
      • Give it damage reduction only applied to shields.
      • Allow us to carry more than just 1 satellite (3 or 4 for example) [THIS WOULD BE AMAZING]

 

Edited by xXMadneXDXx
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Can't we just apply these?

Blaze Artillery: Only 1 can be placed at a time, base duration of around 25 seconds, scales with enemy lvl, has unlimited shots/bullets (Maybe decrease the range)
Dispensary: Only 1 can be placed at a time, will stay up until you decide to re-cast it (kinda like Wisp's Reservoirs).
Grenade Fan: Throws 1 grenade at a time, Shrapnel scales with enemies and has a bigger AOE, Shield stays kinda the same.

 

Edited by NobuNoo
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