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ANother "Hard Mode Is Doing It Wrong" Thread :(

Lutesque

By Lutesque,
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Lutesque

Lutesque

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Yes... another one of these things...

Okay I just watched Brozime's Summary of his Expeience with Hard Mode.... aaaaaaaand.... The way that they have it set up feels like its just for players who want more Reources... not for people who actually want a Challenge.

The Incentive to do Hard mode I feel like is going to go the way of Arbitrations. Veteran Players arent going to do it for the Challenge, but Intermediate players are going to do it just because they need more Endo, or because they want Condition Overload to drop...

And naturally that means you can expect all the Bad stuff from other modes like Eidolon Hunts and Arbitrations, like The Toxicity and Elitism to come to Hard Mode in full force, which is then going to lead into more complains to make Hard Mode Easier. 

I never asked for Hard Mode... what I wanted was a Source for Affinity and Endo Farming.... however it seems like Il be doing Hard Mode just to get that because this problem is still not Fixed in the Regular Star Chart.I cant wait to ruin everyones Experience hard mode in game with my Noobishness :)

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Midas

Midas

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1 minute ago, Lutesque said:

Yes... another one of these things...

Okay I just watched Brozime's Summary of his Expeience with Hard Mode.... aaaaaaaand.... The way that they have it set up feels like its just for players who want more Reources... not for people who actually want a Challenge.

The Incentive to do Hard mode I feel like is going to go the way of Arbitrations. Veteran Players arent going to do it for the Challenge, but Intermediate players are going to do it just because they need more Endo, or because they want Condition Overload to drop...

And naturally that means you can expect all the Bad stuff from other modes like Eidolon Hunts and Arbitrations, like The Toxicity and Elitism to come to Hard Mode in full force, which is then going to lead into more complains to make Hard Mode Easier. 

I never asked for Hard Mode... what I wanted was a Source for Affinity and Endo Farming.... however it seems like Il be doing Hard Mode just to get that because this problem is still not Fixed in the Regular Star Chart.I cant wait to ruin everyones Experience hard mode in game with my Noobishness 🙂

This was always expected my dude.

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Lutesque

Lutesque

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1 minute ago, Midas said:

This was always expected my dude.

Yeah I expected it too Because DE never learns.... but was still dissapointed.... Seems like I havent been Properly Conditioned to get used to it just yet...

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Lutesque

Lutesque

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2 minutes ago, 844448 said:

And we have Tenno that say we should get more drops for the increased difficulty so who to blame?

Those Tenno have thier Priorites confused... If you want more Drops then ask for more Drops...

Hard mode SHOULD NOT OFFER THINGS THAT ARE NEEDED BY NEWER PLAYERS.... I mean its that simple... 

The good news is Hard mode gives you access to exclusive Emotes, Decorations and even Accolades that appear in your Profile... DE should be doubling down on that... But if Hard mode continues to follow the path of Arbitrations then well... its going to become what became of Arbitrations. I mean... Iven seen MR8 Players Bum Rushing the Star Chart just so they could access a Node that actually drops a decent amount of Endo. This is not good.... this has to stop.

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dwqrf

dwqrf

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il y a 3 minutes, Lutesque a dit :

Those Tenno have thier Priorites confused... If you want more Drops then ask for more Drops...

Hard mode SHOULD NOT OFFER THINGS THAT ARE NEEDED BY NEWER PLAYERS.... I mean its that simple... 

The good news is Hard mode gives you access to exclusive Emotes, Decorations and even Accolades that appear in your Profile... DE should be doubling down on that... But if Hard mode continues to follow the path of Arbitrations then well... its going to become what became of Arbitrations. I mean... Iven seen MR8 Players Bum Rushing the Star Chart just so they could access a Node that actually drops a decent amount of Endo. This is not good.... this has to stop.

Yup. Hard mode is gonna be the new baseline of the game if the rewards are interesting ; meaning it will strongly depopulate normal mode. I'm still advoctating that cloning the start chart is not a good thing for the game (dividing the community) ; but ho well.

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vanaukas

vanaukas

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57 minutes ago, Lutesque said:

I cant wait to ruin everyones Experience hard mode in game with my Noobishness 🙂

I mean, you were carried to arbitrations? You are being carried on arbitrations? Because carrying people on arbitration it's a pain because they die and the mode punishes anyone but the one that failed. So I can't see the problem if a new reach that point, also I'm not doing things like spy on public and most of veterans don't do it unless it's a premade team. You can't be that hard to carry unless you put effort on being annoying.

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vanaukas

vanaukas

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1 minute ago, Lutesque said:

Abit Presumptuous are we ?

I solo Arbitrations with Gara, sooo yeah... I guess I am being Carried 😛

I mean, you were the one who said:

1 hour ago, Lutesque said:

I never asked for Hard Mode... what I wanted was a Source for Affinity and Endo Farming.... however it seems like Il be doing Hard Mode just to get that because this problem is still not Fixed in the Regular Star Chart.I cant wait to ruin everyones Experience hard mode in game with my Noobishness 🙂

So, why was that then? I think you are the one being "Abit Presumptuous".

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Magus_Tahir

Magus_Tahir

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1 hour ago, Lutesque said:

I never asked for Hard Mode... what I wanted was a Source for Affinity and Endo Farming.... however it seems like Il be doing Hard Mode just to get that because this problem is still not Fixed in the Regular Star Chart.I cant wait to ruin everyones Experience hard mode in game with my Noobishness 🙂

Well it wasn't made for you as it is given the nature of it. And its only the test build we don't know what is coming after.

Lastly only going off of Brozime comments is hilarious. You honestly think Vauban is useless on the regular star chart? Then we may not have to wait for The Steel Path for you to let's say ruin peoples experiences. 😛

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vanaukas

vanaukas

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Just now, Lutesque said:

I dont see see the word "carried" anywhere in my post... soo nope... try again Captain Presumptuous...

Dude, you was the one sying you were a "noob" (literally), if it was a "pun" it's just on your mind, because we can't translate your intentions or read your mind to comprehend your special "sarcasm". I can't see the problem with "noobs" on Steel Path, I can't see the problem with better chance of resources and mods.

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Lutesque

Lutesque

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1 minute ago, vanaukas said:

Dude, you was the one sying you were a "noob" (literally), if it was a "pun" it's just on your mind, because we can't translate your intentions or read your mind to comprehend your special "sarcasm". 

And yet despite your inability to translate or Interpret what I said... you decided to spit out a false accusation anyway... That, my fried, is what makes you Presumptuous.  I mean... what were you expecting ? how wuould react if someone claimed you were "Carried" ? Maybe you thought you were compleimenting me..

3 minutes ago, vanaukas said:

I can't see the problem with "noobs" on Steel Path, I can't see the problem with better chance of resources and mods.

That fine... Some Engineers couldnt see the Problem with Filling a Ballon with Hydrogen as a form of Air Travel...

shooting-down-a-zeppelin-during-the-firs

Sometimes people miss things, I was hoping we could catch these issues before Hard Mode ships out to the rest of the players but, if it doesnt... oh well... I tried.

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Jarriaga

Jarriaga

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1 hour ago, Lutesque said:

Those Tenno have thier Priorites confused... If you want more Drops then ask for more Drops...

I feel the normal drop rate is good for normal. 

That's not the same for hard mode. They simply should not have the same rates for resources such as Kuva.

Those things are not mutually exclusive.

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vanaukas

vanaukas

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Lutesque said:

And yet despite your inability to translate or Interpret what I said... you decided to spit out a false accusation anyway... That, my fried, is what makes you Presumptuous.  I mean... what were you expecting ? how wuould react if someone claimed you were "Carried" ? Maybe you thought you were compleimenting me..

Yeah, because I thought you were a noob, as you said literally. If you don't need to be carried on arbis, you aren't a noob. Simple.

2 minutes ago, Lutesque said:

That fine... Some Engineers couldnt see the Problem with Filling a Ballon with Hydrogen as a form of Air Travel...

shooting-down-a-zeppelin-during-the-firs

Sometimes people miss things, I was hoping we could catch these issues before Hard Mode ships out to the rest of the players but, if it doesnt... oh well... I tried.

They indeed saw the problems of using hydrogen, but they coudln't use helium, dennied by the USA: https://www.airships.net/hindenburg/hindenburg-design-technology/, so your example it's very, very off place.

As I said, it can't be that hard carry "noobs" on Steel Path if we can right now carry noobs on Arbitrations, when they are a liability just because they die and you have to revive them or stockpilling a lot of revive tokens, dimishing our health pool.

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(XBOX)ECCHO SIERRA

(XBOX)ECCHO SIERRA

Posted
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1 hour ago, Lutesque said:

Those Tenno have thier Priorites confused... If you want more Drops then ask for more Drops...

Hard mode SHOULD NOT OFFER THINGS THAT ARE NEEDED BY NEWER PLAYERS.... I mean its that simple... 

The good news is Hard mode gives you access to exclusive Emotes, Decorations and even Accolades that appear in your Profile... DE should be doubling down on that... But if Hard mode continues to follow the path of Arbitrations then well... its going to become what became of Arbitrations. I mean... Iven seen MR8 Players Bum Rushing the Star Chart just so they could access a Node that actually drops a decent amount of Endo. This is not good.... this has to stop.

Yeah no. 

 

If anything hard mode needs *more* incentives. Otherwise whats the point? 

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Amazerath

Amazerath

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Posted (edited)

I was thinking about this and I went back to Rebecca's post on what Hard Mode is supposed and not supposed to be (https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1203260-the-steel-path-upcoming-hard-mode). And I think I noticed some important details which I'll share here. Post is a bit big, so I put it in a spoiler.

Spoiler

 

According to Rebecca's post, Hard Mode/The Steel Path:

 

 

It is suppposed to be a "Higher Difficulty Series of content that rewards exclusive cosmetic decorations, emotes, and mastery."

I think everyone (including me) read this one as "more challenge". But that's not exactly what's written is it? "Higher difficulty series" refers to the start chart missions being at +100 level. It doesn't necessarily mean DE wants this thing to be a challenge, and this becomes a lot more evident further ahead.

 

It is suppposed to be "An extra layer of opportunity for players to use their powerful gear to take on threats at a higher level without having to wait in missions for long periods of time."

This one also has nothing to do with challenge. They're just saying they want a place for people to fight high level enemies without having to wait for hours. Let's keep going.

 

It is suppposed to be "A way to engage with some better scaling Affinity and Mod Rewards."

Pretty clear. You get more affinity and more mods. No mention of resources or anything else aside from what was pointed out in the first bullet point (cosmetic decorations, emotes and mastery). Moving on...

 

It is NOT supposed "to be associated with the nebulous ‘end game’ topic."

Wait a minute... This thing is NOT SUPPOSED TO BE END GAME. Which kind means it is not designed to be challenging, right? At least not challenging in a way that most of us are looking for. And I completely missed this the first time I read the thread. So this begs the question, why the heck is DE calling this "hard mode"? It's making people expect something that's probably not what DE wants to offer with Steel Path to begin with. But let's keep going.

 

It is NOT supposed to be "overly complicated in its goal to simply provide higher level content and some exclusive rewards."

This seems to be saying "this is just supposed to be a simple way to give you higher level content and some rewards, please don't take it too seriously". And taking it seriously is kind of what we are doing, isn't it? Of course we are! Because this thing is being called "hard mode" which must mean it's |END_GAME_CONTENT| !!! Except... they already said that it is not... It's kinda confusing. Moving on to the last bullet point...

 

It is NOT supposed to be "tiered. We are providing one 100+ level pass to be cognizant of matchmaking for our first iteration."

So they probably want to add tiers but will not do that just yet. They want to get things working first. Sounds good. Then again, if it's not |END_GAME_CONTENT| then why bother adding tiers? Isn't that kind of a contradiction? It's seem strange to me.

 

So my conclusion is that DE either didn't do a great job at communicating with us (which happens a lot), or even they are not entirely sure of what they want this game mode to be (which also happens a lot). So I guess in the end we'll have to wait and see. I believe there's a chance that DE will end up pushing this closer to end game content then they were originally planning to. But it's also possible that that they'll keep it as it is and stay away from end game for now.

Either way, if they don't want this to be super challenging then they should probably make that clear. Six sentences to describe a game mode is not exactly great.

Edited by Amazerath
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nslay

nslay

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Lutesque said:

I never asked for Hard Mode... what I wanted was a Source for Affinity and Endo Farming.... however it seems like Il be doing Hard Mode just to get that because this problem is still not Fixed in the Regular Star Chart.I cant wait to ruin everyones Experience hard mode in game with my Noobishness 🙂

ESO is good for affinity farming and slightly for Endo farming. Though I think Archwing Interception (Caelus, Uranus, the only node) and Derelict Survival has given me the most Endo... outside of Scarlet Spear.

EDIT: Yeah, just verified that I'm not imagining things... Archwing Interception drops a tonne of Endo

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Interception#Archwing

And, so does Derelict Survival (but so do T3 normal Survival and T3-T4 dark sector Survival apparently)

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Survival#Derelict

NOTE: Remember that Rotation A repeats twice (AABC) per 4 rounds. You will get up to 800 Endo in 4 rounds or 1600 in 6 rounds.

Edited by nslay
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844448

844448

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21 minutes ago, (XB1)ECCHO SIERRA said:

Yeah no. 

 

If anything hard mode needs *more* incentives. Otherwise whats the point? 

A place to do field testing if the build you made or copy from a streamer/min-maxer is viable/strong or just cookie cutter build that doesn't work when it's claimed to be "the best build" instead of using simulacrum with its controlled environment

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Eluminary

Eluminary

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I wasn't on the test cluster but I've seen a few reviews of it and it seems fine and about what I expected from it.  This just extra stuff in the game that is no way required if you don't want to do it you're in no way required to.  I'll be doing it, for something to do, when I'm board, and I'll keep doing it until I get sick of it and stop...  I mean I play video games as a diversion and to have fun with, this will be something new to play with for a while until I don't like doing it anymore and I'll stop,  people making things more complicated than they have to be,  if you don't like it don't do it it's not even like you're missing out on anything important.

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TARINunit9

TARINunit9

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6 hours ago, Lutesque said:

not for people who actually want a Challenge.

This is correct, because Steel Path is part of Warframe, and not a time machine to go back to 2012 and change how Warframe was designed

Playing Warframe at this stage for the challenge is like playing Dark Souls for the car racing mechanics -- you're in the wrong genre entirely, to the point where saying that isn't an insult

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Prexades

Prexades

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DE made a mistake even touching this. The crowd on the nostalgia trip who want their 2h+ void key survival mode runs back are never going to be satisfied. All their talk about challenge is just nostalgia. No matter what DE would have made it can't compete with the glorious past in the minds of these players.

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SpicyDinosaur

SpicyDinosaur

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6 hours ago, Lutesque said:

Hard mode SHOULD NOT OFFER THINGS THAT ARE NEEDED BY NEWER PLAYERS.... I mean its that simple... 

Hard Mode hasn't even begun yet and newbies have had the same needs since the beginning. Nothing is being offered that they can't get. That argument makes no sense. How can people need something from it when it doesn't exist yet?

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