Xoris Interactions With Warframe Abilities & Exalted Weapons

[MescalineChef]

How did you not know this was going to be a problem with stat stick frames? Yet another weapon that I wasted TIME and FORMA on that will be tossed away because yall cant see how new weapons effect the meta lol Seems like yall forgot warframes have stat-ticks, noticed you put a meta changing weapon in and then just Nerfd its one gimmick lol

[Sickle_Slayer]

Why does it have to reset the combo count Completely?

I like using the Xoris... just as a weapon. My favorite/most played warframe is also Khora.

Yes, I like the interaction they had, but I don't see why you have to actively make the Xoris an Anti-Synergy for warframes that use the combo counter.

The change to make it reset the combo will make it so it's completely undesirable to even use the weapon with any of those frames. And I just want to be able to use the Xoris like a regular Glaive, while still running with Khora.

Just... is there a way to make it switch to a regular combo count, maybe having that trigger IF one of the mentioned Warframe abilities have been used, switching from infinite to a regular combo? Then it will have a regular combo cooldown until the combo count resets. Once it does, it regains its infinite combo until the abilitie(s) are used again.

Please... anything so I don't have to choose between a weapon or my waframe

[GREF_TM]

11 minutes ago, Cerikus said:

We can be glad, that DE nerf and prevent it

Yeah, glad that underperforming exalted abilities (EB, IS, Hysteria) xoris indirectly buffed will remain underperforming forever. Woo, such joy.

[(XBOX)FavoredCargo305]

I feel this nerf would be too harsh for the Warframe abilities. If you want it spend combo, just don't make it spend all it(like 10 or 15). Also this nerf is harsh to the waepon that is not even a top tier stat stick, it was just a convenient stat stick. This weapon sacrificed damage potential and riven potential for convenience and that is why people used it. Making it less convenient will lead to no one using this weapon in general game play.

[Lepren]

... so, I just need to go back to Venka (14 not 12x mul) w/riven then, and occasionally toggle out of Baruuk's 4 (meaning I won't be playing him moving forward).

Why are you nerfing the Xoris (gives players 1 more mod option) when people were already doing this build just with rivens... do you just want more money, or...? 

I was all for average players being able to access these fun builds... I don't know why you're making things less fun, and doing so right on the cusp of Steel Path.

[Koga.]

12 minutes ago, _Mr.Robot said:

i should have known better when i invested forma and time leveling this weapon. i have absolutely no use for it now because i dont like glaives just as probably 90% of the rest of warframe players. 

but you should have made clear from day 1 when this was discovered, that it was not going to stay that way so we wouldnt have wasted our time and resources.

give me back my formas and catalyst. and while you are at it, maybe give me back my fun playing and enjoying this game, or maybe an update that i dont finish in 4 hours grinding out everything new implemented

My hat tipped to ya

[Koga.]

Just now, Lepren said:

... so, I just need to go back to Venka (14 not 12x mul) w/riven then, and occasionally toggle out of Baruuk's 4 (meaning I won't be playing him moving forward).

Why are you nerfing the Xoris (gives players 1 more mod option) when people were already doing this build just with rivens... do you just want more money, or...? 

I was all for average players being able to access these fun builds... I don't know why you're making things less fun, and doing so right on the cusp of Steel Path.

nah they just don't know their game and also the ''nerf everything fun and unique'' always been their Number 1 policy Unless if it was octavia. DE simp for that S#&$ glad i'm crafting her, gonna finally have an op frame that never was nerfed and never will be 

[Snakehound762]

what a joke

[Voltage]

Good. Mind addressing Riven Mods and other weapon augments/passives applying to Warframe abilities? It is unhealthy to require Riven Mods and augments for specific weapons just to min-max an unrelated Warframe ability. Same goes for Deth Cube's Vaporize. Stat sticks are bad for the game, and separate modding for the abilities in question should be explored.

[Aryo_Griever]

Ah great, so I suppose I'm getting all my forma back? Like everytime you guys do a big enough change to a weapon? oh right never happens...

[phoenix1992]

I apologize, but i see neither of the issues as "issues", due to the requirements needed to fulfill this.

Even more it was fixing an old bug.

[Orakan]

4 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

As stated above, we are doing this because restricting your choice to a single weapon for indisputable best performance invalidates all others and such an interaction does not warrant changes to base Warframes as a whole. 

In conclusion, Warframe Abilities / Exalted Warframe weapons affected by this are:

• Ash Bladestorm
• Atlas Landslide
• Baruuk Serene Storm
• Excalibur Exalted Blade
• Khora Whipclaw
• Valkyr Talons
• Wukong Iron Staff

 

Special note: Gara’s Shattered Lash will now scale with Melee Combo Counter, to be consistent with Khora Whipclaw and Atlas Landslide. The same Xoris restriction will still apply.

TLDR: Certain Warframe Abilities and Exalted weapons will reset the Melee Combo Counter only if the Xoris is being used.

We’ll be continuing to observe how the Xoris interacts with the above when The Steel Path Update arrives in your hands, and our apologies again for the wait. 

Thank you!

In conclusion , I am sadly saying that but either Digital Extremes doesn't have quality assurance engineers or valid testers with enough knowledge of the game , because missing out a mechanic like that and don't understand what can be done with this kind of mechanic is totally a management problem.

[Gendalph]

@[DE]Megan can I get my 4 Forma back, please?

I can do this with a number of Riven mods we have available. Hell, I'll do even more damage using a statstick with a Riven!
Here: https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Riven_Mods/Weapon_Dispos/Melee - everything that has at least 1.2 attenuation is a great candidate for a statstick, that will make what Xoris did pale in comparison.

If anything, exalted weapons need a buff: Wukong's Iron Staff got power-creeped with Melee 3.0 updates. I haven't seen a reason to use Valkyr, because her Talons are just not good enough. Atlas? Nope, not punchy enough as it is (but also, with my Amphis it's just dumb). Most of these abilities need to be made better.

With spawn density we've seen on Steel Path, Khora and others will accumulate combo on normal statsticks. Are you ready for some actually dumb damage numbers? This change achieves very little.

[(NSW)Matt-S]

Out of curiosity, would it not be possible to just have the Xoris combo work normally outside of the Void, then become infinite in the Void?

Having Xoris in your loadout already triggers some flags in the Granum Void it appears, so this could be extended to the combo perhaps, making the weapon work exactly the same as others outside of the Granum Void, instead of it having a unique negative interaction with abilities.

[Koga.]

Just now, Gendalph said:

@[DE]Megan can I get my 4 Forma back, please?

I can do this with a number of Riven mods we have available. Hell, I'll do even more damage using a statstick with a Riven!
Here: https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Riven_Mods/Weapon_Dispos/Melee - everything that has at least 1.2 attenuation is a great candidate for a statstick, that will make what Xoris did pale in comparison.

If anything, exalted weapons need a buff: Wukong's Iron Staff got power-creeped with Melee 3.0 updates. I haven't seen a reason to use Valkyr, because her Talons are just not good enough. Atlas? Nope, not punchy enough as it is (but also, with my Amphis it's just dumb). Most of these abilities need to be made better.

With spawn density we've seen on Steel Path, Khora and others will accumulate combo on normal statsticks. Are you ready for some actually dumb damage numbers? This change achieves very little.

Same here give us our forma back will ya

[Cerikus]

2 minutes ago, Orakan said:

In conclusion , I am sadly saying that but either Digital Extremes doesn't have quality assurance engineers or valid testers with enough knowledge of the game , because missing out a mechanic like that and don't understand what can be done with this kind of mechanic is totally a management problem.

As I said numerous times. Majority of players DID NOT realize this. People know about it because: a) they watch content creator that talked about it, b) friend who watches a content creator that talked about it told them about it.

You knowing what statsticks is, for what warframes it can be used and how to use it means that you are extremely rare person. Yes, DE should know it, but they don't only do balance, do they? Deadlock protocol was amazing and clean update. Being angry about them missing this niche mechanic is forgivable. 

[Cerikus]

6 minutes ago, Gendalph said:

I can do this with a number of Riven mods we have available. Hell, I'll do even more damage using a statstick with a Riven!
Here: https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Riven_Mods/Weapon_Dispos/Melee - everything that has at least 1.2 attenuation is a great candidate for a statstick, that will make what Xoris did pale in comparison.

You CANNOT balance the game based on rivens. Not everyone has riven. Almost nobody will get a good riven, or even god riven. Many people don't use rivens to begin with or just flat out refuse to do that.

Using rivens as an argument is absolutely erroneous.

[Cerikus]

3 minutes ago, (NSW)Matt-S said:

Out of curiosity, would it not be possible to just have the Xoris combo work normally outside of the Void, then become infinite in the Void?

Having Xoris in your loadout already triggers some flags in the Granum Void it appears, so this could be extended to the combo perhaps, making the weapon work exactly the same as others outside of the Granum Void, instead of it having a unique negative interaction with abilities.

WOW... Actually. That is a great idea.

Yes, I want that DE!

[GoodOldLeon]

4 hours ago, CrimsonPenguino said:

You want to know an even easier solution? Make it so that these abilities are separately mod-able, like exalted weapons are. I have mostly heard of people using this as a stat stick for khora, atlas, etc. so an easier fix would be to make it so that you could mod those abilities so you don't have to worry about this. I don't know why that isn't a thing as it is. 

+1000

[OmegaVitae]

here's the issue, the Xoris wasn't actually that big a deal, it was pure QoL. it allowed for your buildup to stay built up, and for you to have more fun due to less micromanaging as a result; it didn't actually increase damage. in fact, using Xoris resulted in lesser damage, due to unusable riven dispo and having no augments. all Xoris did was increase reliability in exchange for decreasing damage, and truth be told that sounds like a balanced buildcraft tradeoff to me...

[Drex83]

36 minutes ago, Sickle_Slayer said:

Why does it have to reset the combo count Completely?

I like using the Xoris... just as a weapon. My favorite/most played warframe is also Khora.

Yes, I like the interaction they had, but I don't see why you have to actively make the Xoris an Anti-Synergy for warframes that use the combo counter.

The change to make it reset the combo will make it so it's completely undesirable to even use the weapon with any of those frames. And I just want to be able to use the Xoris like a regular Glaive, while still running with Khora.

Just... is there a way to make it switch to a regular combo count, maybe having that trigger IF one of the mentioned Warframe abilities have been used, switching from infinite to a regular combo? Then it will have a regular combo cooldown until the combo count resets. Once it does, it regains its infinite combo until the abilitie(s) are used again.

Please... anything so I don't have to choose between a weapon or my waframe

I completely agree with this post. I understand a need for balance, but first off this change spits in the face of anyone that already put forma/catalyst into this, catalyst less of an issue had it came with one out of the box like many story weapons do, but it didn't. But more importantly, as Sickle said above, this isn't just a 'fix' it's an anti-synergy. Khora for example builds +1 combo on everything hit with the whip, it's part of her gimmick for building power up on the whip. If that's effectively removed Xoris will go from being completely OP, to being 100% undesirable all together, and I don't think that's a good solution either.

 

4 hours ago, CrimsonPenguino said:

You want to know an even easier solution? Make it so that these abilities are separately mod-able, like exalted weapons are. I have mostly heard of people using this as a stat stick for khora, atlas, etc. so an easier fix would be to make it so that you could mod those abilities so you don't have to worry about this. I don't know why that isn't a thing as it is. 

As much as I'd like to agree with this myself, there is a reason they have not done this sooner. It's because there's certain things people come to expect with how these frames work with their "stat sticks" and they're often in ways incompatible with how exalted weapons currently work. Such as certain mods not being allowed in exalted weapons

[alseltas]

With the Deadlock Protocol launch Ash was revived from long nightmare.

 

And now Ash is dead again.

 

 

[(PSN)Laughing_Beta]

1 hour ago, [DE]Megan said:

The idea of an infinite combo duration weapon opens the door for some cool builds, but we don't want the Xoris to be the only way to play.

well you gotta think about in a few ways, It has a passive that can be used in a limited of ways. Granum Void is its perfered usage for charges, lasting comb count for its own damage, and a combo stat stick. this was was basically doomed to get nerfed, i could tell it was going to get nerfed from seeing its popularity. This weapon really had one use outside of granum void and it was a stat stick. My issue is how could such a simple oversight even happen to begin with. Simple thoughts and testing would reveal its interactions with abilities. People realized its interations within a day, how you guys had been working on this for a long time how did this just slide under the rug. You guys should know more about the interactions better than us, we sometimes have to data-mine to understand things. But lets say you knew its interactions how did you guys not think about the large number of frames that would massively get buffed from this one weapon. Why are you surprised that players would use the weapon as a statstick as well? Infinite combo duration only affects really a few things, and the most useful thing is buffing combo frames like ash. which leads me to another thing. I just cant see how this oversight was missed unless you didn't test the weapon really much or you guys forgot about some of your own stuff.

 

Why are you surprised that it was used for almost one thing rather than granum, obviouldy players wouldnt only do granum. lots of Frames and weapons have pretty much one use. look at zakti, mire, telos boltace, secura penta, limbo, rhino, frost, gara, sayrn, chroma, and espcially nekros. they all have other uses, like nekros has three ways of using CC, his 1 2  and 4 are means of cc. But even then players almost only use him for farming missions. Zakti can open enemies to finishers but ar almost only used for CD combos. Limbo can deal high dmg if used right but will just be used for defense 9 out of 10 times. Why use them when others can d the same, its because they are just convienet to use and get.   

 

and my last point, the weapon doesnt make already OP abilities more op, it just makes them more convenient. The weapon wont just make Khora's 1 just nuke the map, all it does it just revert players to using naramon. yes you could add gladiator mods to it but lets not forget we have things like mire that just says "F You!" to enemies. I still will be able to just press one button and do amazing damage in ESO, all this is doing is makeing it fickle to deal with.

 

all this nerf is going to accomplish is a migration from using xoris to just using naramon, this will not break khora 1mil+ dmg builds, this is just making a weapon have less uses as if you really want it just used for granum which wouldn't  encourage different loadouts like you guys always want with players (correct me if im wrong, many weapons have been nerf for that very reasons.)

[MustBeAStandUser]

the xoris was just ok if you don't want to invest in rivens and/or the jaw/skana/cleaver/mire/whatever mods....
i will never understand why you need to change stuff no one asked for ._.
this isn't the first time you do stuff like that
do you really think this is a healthy way to handle your game?

[Monomea]

This "fix" doesnt change anything. You didnt nerf anything except accesibility, which is way worse then nerfing power.