Xoris Interactions With Warframe Abilities & Exalted Weapons

[Kefka]

On 2020-07-01 at 12:01 PM, --Raid-Master-Qued said:

They are nerfing an OP interaction. Why people hate nerfs?

Because "OP" and "convenient" are not the same thing, the Xoris is used because it is convenient, not because it is OP. This witch hunt is just stupid and I do not advocate this change as it only makes players go back to using w/e other melee they used before that they had an OP riven for, literally the same thing just slap on naramon focus and the only thing that changes is the damage numbers sore higher for the loss of convenience...

[Kefka]

14 minutes ago, Electric.Sheep said:

you know, i'm glad i'm experiencing this. in the future when i talk to someone who played warframe, THIS and things like it are going to be at the forefront of the conversation.

it's not going to be about the aspects of the game we liked, it going to be about how DE ruined their game by completely ignoring its players and were laughably transparent about their desire to promote platinum purchases through nonsensical balance patches. 

it's honestly unprecedented as far as i can tell. i feel like i'm a part of history! 

Put the pitchfork down please, we don't need to treat them like the American Government just yet my dude, just give constructive feedback because they do still care, they just make bad decisions now and then.

[Deepak_M]

Seems DE has no idea what they are talking about. whoever is incharge of this nerf nonsense. play your game for a while. this post was completely filled with mis-information that xoris is being powerful. it does not even come close to glaive prime or for the matter the the another quest weapons we had were skiajati and paracesis. Xoris is worse than skiajati in terms of everything except xoris has better 1% crit chance and 0.3x extra crit multi. that alone will not makes it over powered with synnergy because far better scalable weapons exist. so look into the feedback and try to retract your statement of nerf for xoris.There is no point in overcomplicating an interaction and making few more lines of code or a class just for this weapon, players use this weapon only to not use the naramon passive as they can rely on zenurik for energy which is far more essential, there are some times where i pick some other arcane instead of energize just that i am using zenurik so i can focus more on survivability or tankyness, Xoris at the stage DE gives to player so early that anyone can atleast use with a synnergy based warframe like baruuk, ash, valkyr, because lets say players will get valkyr way before they know what a xoris is. and to them it is just a warframe that takes up a slot so they can use it later and lets face it these early player will have no idea what gladiator mods are or what is zenurik or naramon is. there are a lot of angle we as a player could look into and this is not the way you as a Developer look into the matter. this kind of forum post makes your impression as a Developer so bad that we seriously say the statement of DE NEVER PLAY THEIR OWN GAME. and i see no reason to believe that Developers at DE had no idea regarding the system they Developed. 

[(XBOX)Quik8201]

4 hours ago, lesstalkmorerokk said:

You guys aren't gonna listen, just like how you didn't listen to the Vazarin nerf feedback.

And guess who uses Vazarin today? Absolutely no one.

[Krelian05]

What, seriously!? As a new player that doesn't have much in a way of high end gear and mods or access to the schools, the xoris was  good addition. Now that's being taken away, after all the forma I put into that thing and the time and resources which are limited. I don't have millions of raw materials like people that's been playing for years.  Dude really? I believe there are other bugs in game that actually hinder gameplay that has not been fixed and yet you go after poor Xoris, that seems to be one of the saving graces especially for rookies. 

So pls reconsider and fix the bugs that are more game breaking.

[Xaero]

14 hours ago, TheOneFromAnotherPlace said:

Nerfing the Xoris interaction does not address the "overwhelming damage output" by the pseudo-exalted abilities, the explicitly stated reason for the nerf.

Why do you only quote the first part of the statement? To make proving your point more convenient? Let's be fair here.

On 2020-07-01 at 7:55 PM, [DE]Megan said:

However, the overwhelming Damage output of certain Warframe Abilities was not our intention with an infinite Melee Combo weapon

See? They are fine with overwhelming damage output in case of exalted/semi-exalted weapons, they just don't want an infinite combo counter.

I don't support their decision though. The whole stat-stick stuff is stupid and should be removed entirely. Exalted abilities should be rebalanced accordingly, semi-exalted abilities should have separate modding.

[Electric.Sheep]

2 hours ago, Kefka said:

Put the pitchfork down please, we don't need to treat them like the American Government just yet my dude, just give constructive feedback because they do still care, they just make bad decisions now and then.

you know, ima Kafka and by extension ff6 antagonist fan, so i'll tell you what, i'll keep the farming instrument in my hands, but i'll put off setting the fire for the time being.

see? isn't compromise a wonderful thing?

[phantomGrey]

I seriously "couldn't" exited for any new weapons that come out if thing like this keep happens really! i'm sorry, really sorry but the reason it limited choice is DUMP! you can go watch Brozime video that he explain clearly why here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SlKS9RtIJk

Then this is what will happen: no one using this weapon anymore except for one game mode it use in! and ok... so exited

[Ghoulish_Emma]

yeah no, could you maybe not? As many people have pointed out, the Xoris wasnt used for some overpowered interaction as a stat stick, in fact many other weapons with strong riven dispositions are way more powerful as Rivens apparently effect warframe abilities, the Xoris was used because it was convenient to not have to refresh your combo multiplier and jump out of your exalted weapon every 15 seconds

If the Xoris was considered too strong for a convenience at least then be consistent and also remove the interaction between melee rivens and warframe abilities 

[(PSN)Impulse2988]

I knew this was coming but this is the most single extreme nerf of a single mechanic I've ever seen it's like no thought went into the Xoris at all it's laughable.

[(XBOX)Voltren Xytech]

cool.... so what about the ramifications on the protea boss fight? if your using any of the frames in that list 1 involuntary movement will set you back a good ways because your locked into using that weapon, and know your innate abilities will reset you charges, maybe just make two combo systems, a weapon combo system and an ability combo system so you patch your "OVER POWERED GOD WEAPON" [seriously massively disappointing this is your top priority... i have a list of things that could be of higher priority] and not make the boss ungodly annoying because you cant stop involuntary reactions with out massive amounts of conditioning

i mean heck [seriously, your filters pick up every slight curse word and scramble it, ive had 12 y/o call me and my teams the n word, but yeah your filters will totally protect the innocent minded] ive know about the infinite glitch when i got my hands on the glaive, but i dont use it at all after that quest because i have objectively far better weapons and builds already, thought the point of this game was so players could play how ever they want, but thats a flawed statement when you find a build that goes against your play teams styles you Nerf it to dust, like poor mag, she got nerfed so hard at one point she was literally unplayable, and you only fixed it when everyone lost interest, made getting a ton of mag prime sets pretty easy, but i decided to grind them up, because not only did the community decide she was hot trash, so did DE, so now i like to gather as many of her parts up and then hoard them, some times i scrap them, but sometimes i give them to lower level players to have a mag prime, but only the ones who choose mag, thats not even scraping the surface, you guys do alot of "ghost updates' and they can be spiteful sometimes, better hope Sony doesn't end up buying y'all up, they have a tendency to make game go exclusive, that will be half your player base gone in one stroke of a pen that you get no say in, plus we will lose all are stuff and i am NOT buying another PlayStation product after the vita incident ive had with them

[(NSW)Freyalise]

So just a quick thought to maybe ameliorate this nerf a little,  perhaps instead of auto-clearing the combo counter entirely whenever a pseudoexalted skill is used, it could use the same logic as a heavy attack? That way non-Naramon-school players, particularly Zenurik, can still build Xoris as a low-maintenance stat stick that lets you expend the combo when and where you need it, but still leaves Xoris decidedly inferior to classic dedicated Naramon stat stick builds for endurance play, so it doesn't become overcentralizing.

Thoughts? Yes no maybe?

[Berzerkules]

Exalted weapons are trash again. No reason to not run any other melee. thx.

[BZRANC]

Oh wow this is garbage, thanks.

[Amethyst_Blitz]

Just gonna put a drop in the bucket of "Not even overpowered, just slightly weaker but more convenient"

The Xoris is nowhere near as powerful as all of the other stat-sticks used for pseudo-exalted weapons before it's release. Before the Xoris, People would use weapons with strong Riven Dispositions to pump out massive damage because they got lucky or purchased one for an exorbitant amount of plat. Now it's just back to Naramon and the Rivens, because Rivens interacting with Warframe abilities is so healthy compared to the accessibility and convenience of not having to worry about combo without being forced into 1 focus school.

But on a proactive note:
Why not make a small exalted weapon rework? When are pseudo-exalted abilities going to become actual exalted weapons so we can mod them and do sick combos instead of spamming 1 over and over? Also, while you're there, why not make it so Exalted weapons have access to all the mods normal melee weapons have? It'd solve the stat-stick "problem" and exalted weapons can be as strong as normal weapons, if not slightly stronger seeing as they're tied to the Warframes themselves and not Rivens. 


TLDR;
-Xoris is nowhere near as strong as other stat-sticks, infinite combo just made it easy to play with and have fun not having to build combo all over again when enemies decide not to spawn or allies kill them too fast. 
-Also just make mod-able exalted melee weapons for stat-stick frames a thing and give exalted melee weapons access to the same mods all melees have so they don't hit like wet noodles in comparison to actual melee weapons.
 

[Domaik]

Understandable on this issue, but for other things....please DE you can't nerf every single way that we have of dealing with high level content.

[Leqesai]

The hilarious thing here is that the issue isnt even rivens or stat sticks at all. 

The issue is that khora is able to reach ludicrous damage levels and de doesnt like it. 

You dont even need a rive. To reach crazy damage levels with khora.

The issue with her whipclaw is the 20% crit chance. It scales way too well with blood rush and gladiator mods.

I love khora but people are up in arms because she is able to output incredible damage numbers.

Atlas can do some amazing damage but compared to khora he will never compete because she has a whole extra layer of damage potential with crit that atlas just cant reach. Gara will get combo synergy soon and she doesnt have crit chance on her ability at all so she also wont scale like khora.

 

I anticipate de overnerfing xoris, then overnerfing stat sticks in general because they dont listen to the majority of well intentioned people in this topic who have explained the issues over and over again.

[Noel_Woodsoul]

As someone who has played around a bit with Xoris interactions, this post is written from the perspective of someone who ended up using the weapon exclusively for Khora. I may have missed some insane interaction, but Khoras whipclaw seemed like the best fit for the weapon - and with the assumption that this is what was considered too much I am very disappointed by this change.

The issue I have with this nerf is that even if the Xoris is as good as DE seems to think, it's still not enough to push the Warframes that would use it as a stat-stick to the top.
The convenience of building stacks on the Xoris and not having to worry about losing them is good and made Khora fun to play for me again, but it's not like Khora or any other Warframe using the stat-stick were pushing everything else into unplayability like Saryn and Mesa do. Despite this, we have not seen any real Saryn-nerfs

The argument that it limits player choice just doesn't hold water, since what the Xhoris did was push unpopular Warframes into playability by making them less finnicky to use. As for melee-weapons, us who were using Xoris will just be going back to whatever stat-stick melee-weapon with a Riven we had before and keep getting annoyed by the massive loss in power for the Warframe whenever no enemies spawn near us.

 

It is tempting when reading this thread to believe that this nerf comes for the sake of pushing Rivens, out of some greedy business scheme, since that would at least give some sort of explanation for why this nerf was decided upon... But when you consider as stated earlier in my post that the best Warframes overshadow the rest of the field with abilities not based on Rivens, you stop to think wonder why they haven't been hit.

This is not a Catchmoon-situation. I love playing Khora, and I love using the Catchmoon.
When the Catchmoon was hit, I was happy to see it, because I felt cheap using such a powerful weapon. I still use it, and feel better about doing so.
Now that's Xoris is getting hit, I'm disappointed and annoyed to see a Warframe I love using once again put back on the shelf, since I find it  too annoying to restart a combo after no enemies have decided to spawn.

[--Fart_In_The_Wind--]

Ah yes, take our fun away, thanks as always.

 

Don't forget about deleting rivens as they are op...

[TheNineBreaker]

Good job yet again not understanding your own game. You've just taken a decent stat stick weapon that was convenient and made it worthless. 

 

This wouldn't happen if you had just given our exalted weapons blood rush, weeping wounds, etc. You claim you want us not to all play the same thing but you are forcing us to find something that gives us what we want. then nerf it and restrict our freedom to play the game the way we want to by taking options away.

 

do you even listen to the players?

[(PSN)XxDrakenguardxX]

So basically I should throw the weapon out and not even bother with it after the quest?

Yeah seems about right sense it's literally just a worse glaive prime at that point.

I understand nerfing the gladiator set effecting exalted weapons part as that doesn't really make much sense. But the rest of this was total BS and pretty much everyone can see it.

The weapon dose NOT in fact cause a psudo exalted weapons to output massive damage. It just enables you to maintain your combo(which then boosts blood rush which gives the ability more crit rate) for the ability without naramon/combo duration mods(which can give 18 seconds with both mods). I could just as easily mod any other weapon with a stat stick build and get the same if not BETTER results.

This nerf has nothing to do with balancing or over usage. It's just you guys nerfing convenience just because. Seriously, why the hell did you guys even put this thing in the game in the first place?

[(PSN)ChernHucare]

Is nerf really necessary? Just because she is "overpowered" with xoris doesnt mean a nerf is needed. There are lots of "overpowered" warframes too like octavia. Also all melee weapons are strong not because the weapon itself but the mods like Condition Overload, Blood Rush, Weeping Wounds, etc. 

[HikariBlue]

Regarding the diversity thing, this was simply another option in that pool. It sacrifices a small amount of power for the utility of not needing to micromanage your combo count. I guess the only diversity that matters is one where you have to go thru the riven slot machine or, an even more cynical view, one where you have to pay DE for platinum to buy rivens from people who went thru that slot machine for you.

[Adi1908PL]

22 minutes ago, (PS4)XxDrakenguardxX said:

So basically I should throw the weapon out and not even bother with it after the quest?

Yep. I believe that's what they want to acomplish. Being a bit sarcastic: because of the "great" series of updates through last year and this "superb" decision,  people may throw out the weapon together with the whole game. Problem solved, WELL DONE DE !!!

[Xaero]

32 minutes ago, (PS4)XxDrakenguardxX said:

The weapon dose NOT in fact cause a psudo exalted weapons to output massive damage.

Semi-exalted melee abilities in fact do scale in damage with combo counter.