Would Djinn be a good option compared to Carrier, if i have Ammo Mutation on my weapon?

[Torllay]

Hi, 

So, i noticed that even with Primed Regen, in high level content Carrier Prime has a good chance of dying, so i was wondering if Djinn with Ammo Mutation on the weapon is still a good source for ammo, since i usually do Survivals/Arbitrations with my Rhino and the Kuva Bramma. Obviously since the last changes i need ammo mutation more than ever to use Bramma, and i was thinking that Djinn being able to come back to life every 90s with Vacuum would be a great solution compared to Carrier, what i wonder is: would ammo mutation on the weapon only be enough?

 

[WhiteMarker]

If you stop mindlessly spamming Kuva Bramma you don't even need Ammo Mutation.
That being said, why aren't you running Vigilante Supplies in your Weaponn Exilus already?

[Torllay]

Just now, WhiteMarker said:

If you stop mindlessly spamming Kuva Bramma you don't even need Ammo Mutation.
That being said, why aren't you running Vigilante Supplies in your Weaponn Exilus already?

I do have Vigilante Supplied, and i don't spam, my question is, suppose that i do have to spam not to be overwhelmed by enemies or whatever, would Djinn with Ammo Mutation on the weapon be enough compared to carrier?

 

[McCIoud]

Carriers only perk is the ammo mutation, if you use vigilante supplies carrier is useless. So using Djinn who can't die forever is just an upgrade

[Captain_Rocket505]

37 minutes ago, McCIoud said:

Carriers only perk is the ammo mutation, if you use vigilante supplies carrier is useless. So using Djinn who can't die forever is just an upgrade

It also gives you more ammo for your weapons, which can be useful imo. Granted its only like 1 ammo for bramma but it still helps. 

[Lutesque]

Hmmmm... Difficult to say....

I would suggest using none of those things....

No Djinn, No Carrier, No Ammo Mutation.... 

Instead i would suggest using Ammo Restores.... infact i would suggest having a dedicate shortcut that would allow you to drop Ammo Restores in demand.... and then for your Companion i would go with Dethcube Prime for its Energy Generator Precept.... assuming you can get it (it costs 100K rep at Simaris)....

The reason why i say this is Because the Kuva Bramma's nerf was kinda dumb.... DE Not only lowered the maximum Ammo but they also capped all Ammo Restoration effects to 1 per Pick Up.... this means if you run Ammo Case, Sniper Ammo Mutation, Vigilante Supplies and Arrow Mutation all at the same time you would still only get a single Arrow from each pick up.... the only source of Ammo that bypasses this Limitation is Ammo Restores.... this will give you all 5 of your Arrows back with Each Pulse....

And this is why i think the Kuva Bramma's Nerf was kinda dumb.... because with Ammo Restores you can go back to that Degenerate Play Style that i think is unhealthy. 

If you are using a Warframe other than Rhino i would suggest using the Wyrm Sentinal with the Negate and Crowd Dispersion Precepts.... this will knock away any enemies that get too close to you and prevent one status effect from affecting you once every 5 seconds.... this includes Knockdowns and Staggers....

Obviously for the best results you are going to need the Prime Version of Wyrm.... and that is most definitely not cheap.... i think it comes from one of those Loki Prime Relics that are in such high demand people are willing to play 10 Platinum for just one of them.

9 minutes ago, Captain_Rocket505 said:

It also gives you more ammo for your weapons, which can be useful imo. Granted its only like 1 ammo for bramma but it still helps. 

I dont know if people know this but theres this strange Side Effect that happens when you put Ammo Case on Carrier.... it delays all Ammo Mutation effects.... usually when you pick up Ammo the conversion happens immediately.... but if you use Carrier it can be delayed for as long as 3 whole seconds (this happens when constantly picking up ammo one by one rather than scooping it all up in one big chunk.)

 

[(PSN)Viveeeh]

I'm not using the Bramma, but I ran out of ammo with the Boar Prime constantly, and an ammo mutation mod indeed solves the issue. It's also nice to pack up on ammo pizzas, just to be sure.

Btw if you like facetanking with that Rhino, try a pet instead. In Arbitration, if they die, they die permanently, but they are much more tanky than sentinels. How much time do you spend in Arbitration missions?

[mkah_mvet]

imo, djinn just doesn't have the utility.  Even though it reawakens, it takes too long... in the kinds of missions where it dies, it will still die, and after it finally revives it'll just die again before it can do anything useful.  Sure, it can reawaken, but to do what exactly?  There isn't much worthwhile it can do during those brief moments when it's not dead.  I stopped using it when I realized it spends 90% of its time dead even fully forma'd.  If you're running rhino, you need a tank companion, which sounds like a pet is probably the way to go, be sure to pair it with a good melee weapon.  I usually run high mobility/high DPS builds where pets are less desirable and I lean into sentinels a lot more.

[Lutesque]

2 hours ago, mkah_mvet said:

imo, djinn just doesn't have the utility.  Even though it reawakens, it takes too long... in the kinds of missions where it dies, it will still die, and after it finally revives it'll just die again before it can do anything useful.  Sure, it can reawaken, but to do what exactly?  There isn't much worthwhile it can do during those brief moments when it's not dead.  I stopped using it when I realized it spends 90% of its time dead even fully forma'd.  If you're running rhino, you need a tank companion, which sounds like a pet is probably the way to go, be sure to pair it with a good melee weapon.  I usually run high mobility/high DPS builds where pets are less desirable and I lean into sentinels a lot more.

This has always been Djinns Weakness.... relative to the other options (except for Taxon, Prisma Shade and Diriga) Djinns Stats are really really bad...low Armor, Low Shields and Low Health. Its not hard to kill Djinn.... so naturally theres a threshold where Djin spends more time Reawakening rather than actually being awake.

But Hope is not lost... one thing you can do to Keep Djinn alive longer is to just use Vitality Motes from Wisp's Specter, this will increase Djinn's max health and Heal it for 30HP/s  i think it adds like 200HP to its health total (and to yours)

Theres also some warframe abilities yoy can use on your sentinal that will help but thats very dependent on which warframe... Wisp Specters are the one size fits all solution for companion survivability. 

[Butterfly85]

I stopped using Djinn.  Yes, it'll revive after 90 seconds, but it'll usually die 5 seconds later. that thing has paper thin defences,even with all the survival  mods.

I run Carrier Prime a lot,  more durable, has the ammo mutation perk and I also use it's looter mod.  It's unreal the amount of stars that thing has found for me. I also don't run any attacking mods on it, so it's way less likely to pull aggro and get walloped.

[Torllay]

11 hours ago, Butterfly85 said:

I stopped using Djinn.  Yes, it'll revive after 90 seconds, but it'll usually die 5 seconds later. that thing has paper thin defences,even with all the survival  mods.

I run Carrier Prime a lot,  more durable, has the ammo mutation perk and I also use it's looter mod.  It's unreal the amount of stars that thing has found for me. I also don't run any attacking mods on it, so it's way less likely to pull aggro and get walloped.

Oh yeah, i agree, i was asking more on the perspective of: i'm going to do an endurance, is Djinn a valuable option since eventually Carrier will die?

Carrier + Looter is just crazy good.

 

[Torllay]

20 hours ago, McCIoud said:

Carriers only perk is the ammo mutation, if you use vigilante supplies carrier is useless. So using Djinn who can't die forever is just an upgrade

I agree, for Endurance runs, but for normal gameplay i think Carrier with Looter is just too good, even 1000h in is nice to get Orokin Cells while bullet jumping around.

[Torllay]

19 hours ago, Lutesque said:

Hmmmm... Difficult to say....

I would suggest using none of those things....

No Djinn, No Carrier, No Ammo Mutation.... 

Instead i would suggest using Ammo Restores.... infact i would suggest having a dedicate shortcut that would allow you to drop Ammo Restores in demand.... and then for your Companion i would go with Dethcube Prime for its Energy Generator Precept.... assuming you can get it (it costs 100K rep at Simaris)....

The reason why i say this is Because the Kuva Bramma's nerf was kinda dumb.... DE Not only lowered the maximum Ammo but they also capped all Ammo Restoration effects to 1 per Pick Up.... this means if you run Ammo Case, Sniper Ammo Mutation, Vigilante Supplies and Arrow Mutation all at the same time you would still only get a single Arrow from each pick up.... the only source of Ammo that bypasses this Limitation is Ammo Restores.... this will give you all 5 of your Arrows back with Each Pulse....

And this is why i think the Kuva Bramma's Nerf was kinda dumb.... because with Ammo Restores you can go back to that Degenerate Play Style that i think is unhealthy. 

If you are using a Warframe other than Rhino i would suggest using the Wyrm Sentinal with the Negate and Crowd Dispersion Precepts.... this will knock away any enemies that get too close to you and prevent one status effect from affecting you once every 5 seconds.... this includes Knockdowns and Staggers....

Obviously for the best results you are going to need the Prime Version of Wyrm.... and that is most definitely not cheap.... i think it comes from one of those Loki Prime Relics that are in such high demand people are willing to play 10 Platinum for just one of them.

I dont know if people know this but theres this strange Side Effect that happens when you put Ammo Case on Carrier.... it delays all Ammo Mutation effects.... usually when you pick up Ammo the conversion happens immediately.... but if you use Carrier it can be delayed for as long as 3 whole seconds (this happens when constantly picking up ammo one by one rather than scooping it all up in one big chunk.)

 

Thanks for your advice, i never used Wyrm so i might give it a try!

Anyway, i decided to go for Djinn as well, but not as my primary but for endurance runs, mostly cause of Looter. 🙂

[(PSN)Hikuro-93]

• Djinn all the way for long missions. It's my go-to for Arbitrations and Eidolons.
• Carrier more for the box shattering AoE and Ammo economy extreme cases
• Helios for scans and Gladiator mods
• Wyrm for squishier frames in order to avoid certain procs such as toxin ones, that ignore shields and could potentially kill me
• Deth Cube for added energy regen

---

And now, with beast companions being a regular thing again:

• Vasca Kavat for some added survivability and revives
• Adarza for a steady crit boost
• Sunika for capture targets
• Raksa for shield-based frames
• Huras for a more reliable invisibility than Shade

 

[Lutesque]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Hikuro-93 said:

Huras for a more reliable invisibility than Shade

Im confused as to why Huras works better than Shade ?

The Precepts are suppose to do the exact same thing. Were they coded differently?

[(PSN)Hikuro-93]

9 hours ago, Lutesque said:

Im confused as to why Huras works better than Shade ?

The Precepts are suppose to do the exact same thing. Were they coded differently?

It would seem so. But now DE even chose to capitalize on Shade's clunkiness with the release of its augment. So no hope for a good shade, I'm afraid. 😞