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Tencent on the hunt to buy Warframe? (Deal not confirmed/final)


NerdyJew-bij
Message added by Letter13

Please remember to keep discussion civil. No, this isn't the end of Warframe. The same sort of over-sensationalized prophesying happened 4+ years ago when Leyou (formerly Sumpo) bought shares in DE; people said it'd turn into 'all-lootboxes' and 'pay-to-win' and that DE 'would have zero control' and guess what? All bupkis.

Speculation is fine, as long as you're cognizant of the difference between opinions and facts, and as long as you're not spreading misinformation (intentionally or not). If you feel so strongly about this that want to leave the game, that's your prerogative (and loss) and is also fine.

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5 minutes ago, Felsagger said:

Ervin, that comment was edited by me. Please delete it. That's a conversation I don't want to have for obvious reasons. 

No need to have a conversation about it. The info should still be there in context since otherwise someone else will spread the same misinformation. I'm just confused why people have those ideas when the world has already shown several times how they plan on treating Chinese tech in the future due to these very concerns.

edit: There a so many precedents regarding this out there to read about. From hardware to software and what laws china needs to follow regarding privacy in the rest of the world or be utterly shut down. There are western game ports that got shut down the same year the new "privacy" law went live in the west.

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On 2020-07-10 at 8:49 AM, WhiteMarker said:

People feared Leyou aswell, and what happened? Nothing.

To be fair it's always hard to know what's going on internally with a studio after a corporate takeover. Also Leylou was a chicken company, don't think the had any pretense knowing how to run a gaming studio.For all we know all the rushed updates and Uber grindy new stuff added in the last couple of years could have been dictated by leylou, and Tencent has a reputation of grabbing free to play game with decent cash models and turning them into paying 20 bucks for skins with p2win aspects , so I worry. I mean nowadays I feel you need to pay for everything in WF already (slots, reactors, catalysts, good lenses, riven slots, exiluses, gazillion formas to fit all these mods, it does feel like a plat to win game). And that's not even talking about the cosmetic stuff...

 

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1 hour ago, Aadi880 said:

Game developers are still the same tho, not under Chinese game devs. Tencent bought Warframe China edition from DE to develop the Chinese version of warframe, which is separate to the global build. Currently, ChinaFrame is stuck at fortuna part 1.

This is a change on the investor effectively. Previously, it was Leyou since 2016 (I think?), who is also Chinese, mate.

And you really think they wont attempt to get any influence? They are not trustworthy any bit and a game being bought up by a big chinese corp isnt a good sign

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1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

The info should still be there in context since otherwise someone else will spread the same misinformation.

 

It's not misinformation at all. It's a natural concern. These are two different things. 

Misinformation happens when the information is false. There is no guarantee, certainty or evidence about such plausible events. 

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

I'm just confused why people have those ideas when the world has already shown several times how they plan on treating Chinese tech in the future due to these very concerns.

We can't be idle or ignorant about such possibilities. Many users are saying the same thing. This concern will permeates since there are security scrutiny concerns with Tencent. 

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

 

edit: There a so many precedents regarding this out there to read about. From hardware to software and what laws china needs to follow regarding privacy in the rest of the world or be utterly shut down. There are western game ports that got shut down the same year the new "privacy" law went live in the west.

And you think that China will behave?  

rofl...

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On 2020-07-10 at 8:51 AM, Angwah said:

League of Legends and Fortnite also operate without interference from Tencent. They are known to be hands-off. 

Also, the deal is not done. Exclusivity agreement means they are negotiating in earnest and no one else is allowed to talk to Leyou, but it can still be called off.

And I think this will be the case with Warframe. As Digital Extremes has been a big part of Leyous earnings, even when Leyou as a whole posted losses: Warframe didnt. 

I think Warframe wont be effected if Tencent takes over, we might not even notice anything. Could also be wishful thinking but I think Tencent knows if they make any drastic changes to the economy of Warframe, it could have drastic impacts on the financial success of the game. 

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11 minutes ago, Felsagger said:

It's not misinformation at all. It's a natural concern. These are two different things. 

Misinformation happens when the information is false. There is no guarantee, certainty or evidence about such plausible events. 

We can't be idle or ignorant about such possibilities. Many users are saying the same thing. This concern will permeates since there are security scrutiny concerns with Tencent. 

And you think that China will behave?  

rofl...

So it is not misinformation yet you keep on going? And there is guarantee, it is called national laws. It simply cannot happen since DE would be commiting a crime if they were to inject such things in their game. It is against western law, the game is developed in a western country and so on.

Many users are misinformed or not very into what the laws say, not to mention that DE has creative rights so the final say in what gets done to their game. It would take outside sources for such a thing to happen, which is as probable now.

And it isnt about china behaving or not, it is about what they can and cannot due given the situation. If WF was made in china or some other shady country, then yeah there would be reason for concern, but WF is made in Canada, that have laws regarding these tech things since they've followed (or were ahead) of the EU when it started with the whole Huawei "crisis". So of course china will behave when they simply put get cockblocked. Or do you imagine a whole troop of stealthy engineers crossing borders, building MacGuyver cell towers, infiltrating game studios etc?

Realize that these concerns should be there not based on if a company is owned by a chinese one or not, but because the chinese (and all other countries) have "cyber" divisions that do this job covertly. 

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8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

So it is not misinformation yet you keep on going?

I'm not the only one who "keeps on going"? This concern will remain this way for the next seven years if we are lucky. 

8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

 

And there is guarantee, it is called national laws. It simply cannot happen since DE would be commiting a crime if they were to inject such things in their game. It is against western law, the game is developed in a western country and so on.

Yes, Laws are there for a reason but do people obeys them always? That's the problem. 

8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Many users are misinformed or not very into what the laws say, not to mention that DE has creative rights so the final say in what gets done to their game. It would take outside sources for such a thing to happen, which is as probable now.

That's not the issue. 

Reading and quoting some URL here or reading what the lay says suffice. We are speaking about the implications and the tendencies. These are genuine legit concerns that will continue spiraling all the way. You can't change people's opinions. There are facts, events and situations that makes people think in a certain way. 

 

8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

And it isnt about china behaving or not

Say again?

It's all about that and how their corporations behave. 

8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

, it is about what they can and cannot due given the situation.

There are laws that restrict and punish crime but crime continues happening. 

8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

If WF was made in china or some other shady country, then yeah there would be reason for concern, but WF is made in Canada, that have laws regarding these tech things since they've followed (or were ahead) of the EU when it started with the whole Huawei "crisis".

That's not the issue. 

8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

So of course china will behave when they simply put get cockblocked.

If the situation arrives at that point then all forms of negotiations will end. Do you know what will happen next? 

8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Or do you imagine a whole troop of stealthy engineers crossing borders, building MacGuyver cell towers, infiltrating game studios etc?

They don't need that. Internet suffice. We are giving them a bridge in a silver platter every time we get connected to the game. 

8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Realize that these concerns should be there not based on if a company is owned by a chinese one or not, but because the chinese (and all other countries) have "cyber" divisions that do this job covertly. 

And you still think that Tencent is a saint of its devotion. 

 

 

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25 minutes ago, (XB1)Cram Duahcim said:

 

I think Warframe wont be effected if Tencent takes over, we might not even notice anything. Could also be wishful thinking but I think Tencent knows if they make any drastic changes to the economy of Warframe, it could have drastic impacts on the financial success of the game. 

This makes more sense. 

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1 hour ago, Felsagger said:

It's not misinformation at all. It's a natural concern. These are two different things. 

Misinformation happens when the information is false. There is no guarantee, certainty or evidence about such plausible events. 

Can you cite an instance where Tencent was alleged, accused, and found guilty of stealing private information from western users through their games or as part of the EULA licensing agreements?

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25 minutes ago, Felsagger said:

I'm not the only one who "keeps on going"? This concern will remain this way for the next seven years if we are lucky. 

Yes, Laws are there for a reason but do people obeys them always? That's the problem. 

That's not the issue. 

Reading and quoting some URL here or reading what the lay says suffice. We are speaking about the implications and the tendencies. These are genuine legit concerns that will continue spiraling all the way. You can't change people's opinions. There are facts, events and situations that makes people think in a certain way. 

 

Say again?

It's all about that and how their corporations behave. 

There are laws that restrict and punish crime but crime continues happening. 

That's not the issue. 

If the situation arrives at that point then all forms of negotiations will end. Do you know what will happen next? 

They don't need that. Internet suffice. We are giving them a bridge in a silver platter every time we get connected to the game. 

And you still think that Tencent is a saint of its devotion. 

 

 

Do you really think DE would risk severe punishments and bow their head to some foreign nation by letting them inject spyware into their IP? You are more or less at the point where you say DE have criminal intent since this will all fall on DE and no one else in the end. I mean we've had tinfoil theories around here before, but this one is about to take the price.

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9 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

Can you cite an instance where Tencent was alleged, accused, and found guilty of stealing private information from western users through their games or as part of the EULA licensing agreements?

I think that is what he fails to realize, that this is a western game, so whatever may be connected to Tencent within China has jack and squat effect or possiblity to happen here. Next he'll go and say that Epic are all secret police undercover as devs and business runners.

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5 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Do you really think DE would risk severe punishments and bow their head to some foreign nation by letting them inject spyware into their IP? You are more or less at the point where you say DE have criminal intent since this will all fall on DE and no one else in the end. I mean we've had tinfoil theories around here before, but this one is about to take the price.

So you think that such danger doesn't exist. 

Ok, fine. 

 

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3 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

I think that is what he fails to realize, that this is a western game, so whatever may be connected to Tencent within China has jack and squat effect or possiblity to happen here. Next he'll go and say that Epic are all secret police undercover as devs and business runners.

Eh, it's been alleged, and proof of same has been found here in the west in both software and hardware over the last number of years so I am not discounting the possibility even if it amounts to corporate suicide for business interests in the West.

...I am moreso curious if Tencent has been alleged to be involved in any of it given that it's a publicly traded company

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4 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

I think that is what he fails to realize, that this is a western game, so whatever may be connected to Tencent within China has jack and squat effect or possiblity to happen here. Next he'll go and say that Epic are all secret police undercover as devs and business runners.

This was already answered here. The answer was witty.  

"Tencent knows if they make any drastic changes to the economy of Warframe, it could have drastic impacts on the financial success of the game. "

The concern exists. The doubt exist. People get worried. Tencent IS NOT a saint of its devotion. That is the problem. 

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7 minutes ago, Felsagger said:

This was already answered here. The answer was witty.  

"Tencent knows if they make any drastic changes to the economy of Warframe, it could have drastic impacts on the financial success of the game. "

The concern exists. The doubt exist. People get worried. Tencent IS NOT a saint of its devotion. That is the problem. 

That doesn't answer my question... Common sense is enough to dictate that a company isn't going to spend roughly a billion dollars just to have nothing to show for it in the process.

This was my actual question:

27 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

Can you cite an instance where Tencent was alleged, accused, and found guilty of stealing private information from western users through their games or as part of the EULA licensing agreements?

Either you can cite such an instance or you can not.

If you can... It's a valid concern to hold.

If you can't... It's not and fear mongering is mis-placed.

FWIW, I couldn't find one.

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5 minutes ago, Felsagger said:

So you think that such danger doesn't exist. 

Ok, fine. 

It exsists but not for the reasons you think. The danger is just as real now incase a government wanted to target games for spying since the same method would be required in both cases. DE will never let it happen by adding it to the game on deman by their "overlords". Outside sources will be the factor and those are already present dangers.

3 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

Eh, it's been alleged, and proof of same has been found here in the west in both software and hardware over the last number of years so I am not discounting the possibility even if it amounts to corporate suicide for business interests in the West.

...I am moreso curious if Tencent has been alleged to be involved in any of it given that it's a publicly traded company

Those were mostly problems rooted in western ports of eastern or russian games. Some of them closed down when the privacy law went live. Cant remember if it was Ragnarok that shut down along with a bunch of mobile games since they couldnt spy and sell info anymore about the players, their behaviors and RL names etc.

Yes, Tencent has been involved, but that has been within China through some of their "social" apps that have been connected to facial recognizion etc, this is why Huawei was stopped from expanding in europe using their own hardware, software and workers for the masts, since they are tied to Tencent and the chinese government. I mean this isnt something new though since swedish Telia and I think Sony/Ericsson were involved with something similar in some eastern euro country some years ago that let the government spy on disidents.

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11 minutes ago, Felsagger said:

This was already answered here. The answer was witty.  

"Tencent knows if they make any drastic changes to the economy of Warframe, it could have drastic impacts on the financial success of the game. "

The concern exists. The doubt exist. People get worried. Tencent IS NOT a saint of its devotion. That is the problem. 

They cant make drastic changes to begin with since creative rights are fully in DE's hands. Go read up on what that means.

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2 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

They cant make drastic changes to begin with since creative rights are fully in DE's hands. Go read up on what that means.

If you think tencent would splurge in excess of a BILLION dollars to buy Leyou, who's most profitable part is DE, and then not put pressure on DE to increase revenue/profit then you are seriously kidding yourself.

No one knows what the actual legal terms of these "creative rights" are, but I'll guarantee you that's being looked at by Tencent right now.

Tencent will want a return on their investment, that's business.  And I doubt that they'll wait years to get it.

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8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Yes, Tencent has been involved, but that has been within China through some of their "social" apps that have been connected to facial recognizion etc, this is why Huawei was stopped from expanding in europe using their own hardware, software and workers for the masts, since they are tied to Tencent and the chinese government.

That was the gist of the most I could find as well which, invariably, gets stuffed by the privacy laws in place in other countries.

Which is where my curiosity comes into place regarding if it's been done in the West by Tencent.

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