Can We Unanimously Agree That

[CaveCricket48]

Autoroll needs to removed?

[Ned_Wiki]

The player needs to battle the controls every step of the way. You need to master the controls and even then...the god damn auto-roll pops up with no warning or consistent way of predicting its arrival.

[Lunaticked]

I don't think you'll get anyone arguing that.

 

Unless they argue for the sake of arguing, using long strings of "quote" posts.

[Justin_Case001]

Autoroll?  What autoroll?  What means you by this?  Is this some console controller thing?  It sounds like it would be annoying though, so I'll give this idea the ol' +1.

[Kolos1001]

Use jump melee attack to fall straight. Use sprint jump slide to do everything else. The only time you will auto roll will be when you try to jump and shoot at the same time which is ridiculous. 

 

 

It's a bad mechanic and should be removed because it makes a game prided on high mobility very clunky. Forcing players to find a way around something that makes you feel like you're in entry level gymnastics is just...lame. 

[Liminal]

I don't think you'll get anyone arguing that.

I've seen a few people saying that we should get used to it so...

There are always those opposed to anything another player suggests.

Edited October 17, 2013 by The_Doc

[DavidSPD]

Geoff posted in a popular thread a while back stating they were in the process of testing a more robust parkour system in-house (he's gefu on the forums) based on player suggestion. I'm not sure if that means we'll be seeing it eventually or not... there's other mobility features they talked about (and showed us) that were kind of shelved for now so....

 

 

There are always those opposed to anything another player suggests.

 

 

Seen some of those people and they are infuriating. Thankfully the forums has a "ignore poster" feature. Forums got a lot quieter after I discovered that feature.

Edited October 17, 2013 by DavidSPD

[shut]

I disagree. I've always liked the Autoroll for what it was, even if it made combat much more difficult than if you were given the same amount of control of your own movement as, say, anything from the Source engine.

Losing the autoroll causes the game to lose its realism. (And for the people who are about to be all like "this game is space ninjas; realism hardly has a place in it", I say that at realism should at least be applied to basic character movements, such as absorbing impact when falling, which a ninja with parkour abilities should very well be able to do.) If autoroll is lost, I propose that fall damage is put in its place. I don't see anything besides the current impact-absorbing skills that the Tenno have that would prevent damage from heights, and the air resistance / maximum falling speed that allows the rolling tactic to work from any height.

 

But I think that the vast majority of us can agree that it needs to be slackened at the absolute least. Falling into a roll after sprinting off a three-foot drop is not something that a space ninja in a powersuit should have to do, ever. Nor is falling into a roll after doing a regular jump while sprinting, which tends to occur every now and then.

Edited October 17, 2013 by SortaRandom

[DrugsForChildren]

I think that removing it is unnecessary, BUT it should have some kind of logic to invoke it, at the moment it's just a useless frustrating mechanic you have to work around, should be along the lines of:

If landing while holding shift: roll

Land without holding shift: no roll

easy.

[DavidSPD]

I disagree. I've always liked the Autoroll for what it was, even if it made combat much more difficult than if you were given the same amount of control of your own movement as, say, anything from the Source engine.

 

Sounds like you're somewhat of a masochist. 

 

Also realism within predefined game logic makes sense. Realism applied in a real-world sense with contradicting game logic breaks immersion. Was that enough of a wordplay to work for ya?

 

Ever see people argue about what a "true" zombie is? 28 days later (if that's right) or Romero zombies? How many of these people use the word "realism" in their argument? See my point?

Edited October 17, 2013 by DavidSPD

[Loswaith]

You know if you stop holding the forward movement key, allot of the time the roll doesnt actually happen (abet not always, depending on momentum).  The forward roll after a backflip glitch is annoying as hell though, so can see how it could annoy some people.

[DavidSPD]

You know if you stop holding the forward movement key, allot of the time the roll doesnt actually happen

 

I wouldn't be surprised if that was actually a bug. A lot of the time when I'm sprinting, then come to a stop, confirm that I've stopped, then try to crouch and move sideways I'll slide even though I obviously wasn't sprinting.

 

Guess that's what I get for not being a rusher....lol?

[shut]

Sounds like you're somewhat of a masochist. 

I merely prefer games that are more realistic in nature, such as Mirror's Edge. I don't see how wanting this to apply to a modern physics- and Parkour-oriented shooter is detrimental in any way.

 

Also realism within predefined game logic makes sense. Realism applied in a real-world sense with contradicting game logic breaks immersion. Was that enough of a wordplay to work for ya?

 

There is no game logic that contradicts the real-world realism in regards to the rolling, save for the issues of "Why do I have to do a somersault to recover from a thirteen-inch drop?" and other unrealistic issues of the like. When you're leaping off a platform onto the floor around fifteen feet below, that's when rolling would make much more sense (unless your powersuit is built to handle such shock, like Master Chief's, which, as far as we're aware, ours are not), and, in this game's case, does.

And at your "wordplay" comment, I'm failing to see any meaning in it besides a display your condescending attitude.

 

 

Ever see people argue about what a "true" zombie is? 28 days later (if that's right) or Romero zombies? How many of these people use the word "realism" in their argument? See my point?

 

True. There's a limit, though, when the impossibilities depicted in the media start to conflict with its general theme and concept in the first place. Whereas most shooters get away with such physical impossibilities as landing on your feet from impossible heights and climbing up ladders no-handedly without moving your feet, those are seen as insignificant, since they don't have anything to do with what the gameplay revolves around in the first place.

Warframe, however, revolves largely around its parkour-resembling movement system, and the maneuverability that a stereotypical ninja warrior has. To take away as fundamental a parkour concept as rolling to absorb heavy falls would be incredibly silly in this game. You'd might as well give unrealistic speed, jump, and fall damage boosts to Mirror's Edge gameplay. It simply wouldn't fit with what the game tries to be. (One could argue here that if the game is so intertwined with its parkour system, then it should at least have a basic momentum system. I would agree with that argument.)

 

 

But yeah, all in all, I think the rolling system should stay because it fits with the game's original theme. It's certainly not perfect (no more so than the wallrun system, really), but the only complaints that I see about rolling in general (save for the "you shouldn't roll after falling off a two-foot drop" things, which I agree with completely) are in regards to how it increases difficulty in battle rather than anything realism-related. All it needs are tweaks; to remove it entirely would do more harm than good.

 

 

EDIT:

Holy jeebus christ, that is way too damn stiff-sounding for my own good.

Time to bed.

Edited October 17, 2013 by SortaRandom

[Nenesse]

When I first started playing Warframe, I thought the roll was awesome. It makes you look agile.

 

It keeps you moving forward, keeps your momentum up, while still visually showing that you're absorbing the shock of falling. Much better than having to stop when you land, or having no landing animation. It looks good and it serves a purpose.

We definitely still need some kind of landing animation--I don't know how to make it so that you have a landing animation that doesn't make you momentarily stop, but doesn't force you to roll in one direction. Maybe if it does force you to stop, but it's much shorter and less restrictive--your character lands on his feet and lowers into a squat, still holding their weapons in the same ready position.

[Taranis49]

There is no game logic that contradicts the real-world realism in regards to the rolling, save for the issues of "Why do I have to do a somersault to recover from a thirteen-inch drop?" and other unrealistic issues of the like. When you're leaping off a platform onto the floor around fifteen feet below, that's when rolling would make much more sense (unless your powersuit is built to handle such shock, like Master Chief's, which, as far as we're aware, ours are not), and, in this game's case, does.

And at your "wordplay" comment, I'm failing to see any meaning in it besides a display your condescending attitude.

 

Actually, that's not really true, we're dropped from much higher heights and don't need to roll (e.g. when Lephantis takes out the floor beneath us and we fall all the way to the bottom), hell, we're dropped from moving spacecraft on outpost maps and don't need to tuck and roll for that. :-P

[JerryMouse13]

Can someone explain to me why the auto roll is such a pressing concern? 

 

In my experience it's never hindered me in any meaningful way, and it's useful for maintaining momentum.

[Thrain856]

I'm another person who never seems to run into any issues with auto-roll.. Is it an issue you run into when rushing? 

[shut]

Actually, that's not really true, we're dropped from much higher heights and don't need to roll (e.g. when Lephantis takes out the floor beneath us and we fall all the way to the bottom), hell, we're dropped from moving spacecraft on outpost maps and don't need to tuck and roll for that. :-P

We do the crouching thing that we do if we fall straight down, since rolling isn't the easiest feat if you're not already moving forward. Given that we have a somewhat slow maximum falling speed, I guess it kinda makes sense that we're able to do this, but I see your point. I've always been a bit annoyed that we have such a slow maximum falling speed in the first place.

The spaceship doesn't seem like too far of a drop, though. That one can stay. XD

[CY13ERPUNK]

+1 OP

there is one spot, where you wallrun up a wall to backflip off of it to land on top of a stack of crates... AND EVERY @(*()$ TIME YOU LAND, YOU ROLL OFF THE CRATES...

/sadface

-9999 autoroll =[

[Drasiel]

Can someone explain to me why the auto roll is such a pressing concern? 

 

In my experience it's never hindered me in any meaningful way, and it's useful for maintaining momentum.

 

Because sometimes it will trigger from things like stepping off of a 2ft ledge, running over too bumpy of a surface, jumping onto a bumpy surface, or when you respawn onto a ledge or platform after falling in a hole and initiating the endless drop issue until you manage to wiggle to one side.

 

The auto roll has issues that seem to be both environmental and detection related. I don't really want to see it removed but I do want to see it tweaked. Maybe just having it need a certain (much larger than current) fall distance before it toggles and removing it's ability to trigger on a respawn from a pit fall.

 

+1 OP

there is one spot, where you wallrun up a wall to backflip off of it to land on top of a stack of crates... AND EVERY @(*()$ TIME YOU LAND, YOU ROLL OFF THE CRATES...

/sadface

-9999 autoroll =[

 

There's actually about 3 different spots that this shows up intermittently, but I am convinced that it's a separate bug from the normal auto roll issues.

[litlit]

Gracefully falling,

the inevitable fate

of autorolling

[Leuca]

 

Losing the autoroll causes the game to lose its realism. (And for the people who are about to be all like "this game is space ninjas; realism hardly has a place in it", I say that at realism should at least be applied to basic character movements, such as absorbing impact when falling, which a ninja with parkour abilities should very well be able to do.) If autoroll is lost, I propose that fall damage is put in its place. I don't see anything besides the current impact-absorbing skills that the Tenno have that would prevent damage from heights, and the air resistance / maximum falling speed that allows the rolling tactic to work from any height.

What's to say the different frames don't have advanced shock absorption technology? If you're going to put fall damage from a forward jump, you have to put it on everything from the same height that triggers it.

[OblivionNecroninja]

Yes. Maybe it can come back someday, in some form, but removing autoroll would be a nice band-aid for the movement system that could be implemented right now.

 

Personally, I think it might be covering up a lack of animations to transition from a jump to a run...

[shut]

What's to say the different frames don't have advanced shock absorption technology? If you're going to put fall damage from a forward jump, you have to put it on everything from the same height that triggers it.

I didn't mean that everything that triggers a roll now should cause fall damage. I meant that to be mostly for higher falls.

[Leuca]

I didn't mean that everything that triggers a roll now should cause fall damage. I meant that to be mostly for higher falls.

Which means that the distance is going to be completely arbitrary, and that players will now have to target the ground below them before deciding whether they want to leap down or not. It's not benefiting anybody.