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So uh, what happened to focusing on the "war" in 2020?


Goldenrice

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1 minute ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

What where the oldest?, I can't recall when they where even released, given that they are used for a Quest and Boss farming right? 

Well, the oldest one I recall was Vauban, which added gear polarisation and clans to the game way back in 2013, and there were a few before that that I wasn't around for.

First update I saw that added a boss fight was Nova's in the same year, which added the Raptor, and the first quests were added with Mirage back in... 2014 IIRC. The Plains of Eidolon weren't added until 2017.

This is fairly simple to check, since the Wiki still lists patch notes from the early days.

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3 hours ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

What where the oldest?, I can't recall when they where even released, given that they are used for a Quest and Boss farming right? 

How little do you actually play the game if you cant remember things released from the end of 2017 and forward? And no, they are used for a hell of alot more than a quest and boss farming.

Sometimes it just feels like the biggest complainers are extremely out of touch with the game releases as a whole.

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5 hours ago, (PS4)SolarPhantom82 said:

I do think the player base is starting to wake-up to this.  I predict this year's Tennocon numbers won't be good and the hype won't be high. ...  I also predict that what is shown will not be released at tennocoin like steve said.  And when released will be received by another community backlash. .. I want to believe but I got into this game after watching tennocon 2018. .  And half that's stuff hasn't been released. ....

Oooh soooo edgy! Do you also predict that day will follow night, and the tides will follow the moon? 

I predict this year's Tennocon numbers won't be good and the hype won't be high.: Say it with me, "Glo-bal pan-dem-ic", most people have other stuff on their minds. Like not dying. Like recouping severe financial losses sustained over several months. Like recouping those losses,

while not dying. 

What is shown won't be released at TennoCon: didn't they actually say "Soon"? 

And when released will be recieved by another community backlash: with the usual list of malcontents and wannabe edgelords we have all content gets tanked even before it gets released, hell you already started it with that statement, but you going to act all surprised when it happens? 

 

I want to believe but I got into this game after watching tennocon 2018. . And half that's stuff hasn't been released: You didn't understand that what you were seeing was a showcase of the things that they were working on, or how long stuff like that takes to get completed, and blame the Devs for your lack of understanding. 

 

Seriously, you wanna make "predictions"? Go with "I see a trip in your future, you will meet someone significant, it may be someone from your past, or someone you immediately feel a strong connection to". 

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29 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

How little do you actually play the game if you cant remember things released from the end of 2017 and forward? And no, they are used for a hell of alot more than a quest and boss farming.

Sometimes it just feels like the biggest complainers are extremely out of touch with the game releases as a whole.

Tell me about it. 

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37 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

How little do you actually play the game if you cant remember things released from the end of 2017 and forward? And no, they are used for a hell of alot more than a quest and boss farming.

Sometimes it just feels like the biggest complainers are extremely out of touch with the game releases as a whole.

Ah here we go..

I've played the game long enough to kown how forgettable the content is, does that help your qeastion?, or do you want me to lick someones boot?

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2 minutes ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

Ah here we go..

I've played the game long enough to kown how forgettable the content is, does that help your qeastion?, or do you want me to lick someones boot?

It just seems extremely odd to miss when those releases have happened in time, especially to the point of refering to them as the oldest, missing 4+ years of releases prior to that. It is kinda like the people setting the "standard" for DE releases based on Liches and Railjack, out of a total of 7 years+ of content releases since the game went into alpha.

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On thing I don't understand about their motives is the lack of Mocap. Why not adapt and switch to manual keyframe animation until they get back access to the studio? 

It's not like we got NaughtyDog level of cinematics before either, they didn't have much movement to start with. The quality will vary, and it will take longer than usual, but at the very least it will be servicable and will allow them to keep their promises. 

Looks how awesome these dudes manually animated the models from Dragon Age Inquisition.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYFrBg1yb6g

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51 minutes ago, aligatorno said:

On thing I don't understand about their motives is the lack of Mocap. Why not adapt and switch to manual keyframe animation until they get back access to the studio? 

It's not like we got NaughtyDog level of cinematics before either, they didn't have much movement to start with. The quality will vary, and it will take longer than usual, but at the very least it will be servicable and will allow them to keep their promises. 

Looks how awesome these dudes manually animated the models from Dragon Age Inquisition.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYFrBg1yb6g

Hey great idea.... Except what happens when the government of Ontario says that it's okay to go to the office again. They'd be part of the way through doing the gazillion animations, and then probably just have to scrap all of it because someone put on a body suit and pranced around for a bit? 

I don't think that most people really expected the shutdown to be as long lasting as it has been. It's affected most spheres of our lives in unexpected ways. 

Given that they seem to have shifted gears and worked on other things in the mean time, I figure that we can try to be a wee bit more understanding of the situation. 

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23 hours ago, Goldenrice said:

Did I remember this wrong?

Nope... The things they have said effectively point in both directions.

They said quite some time ago that the New War was so big that the intention was for it to come out in phases as wars are made of "many separate battles".

That said, they've also said there would be a New War story quest that releases this year...

I am thinking the intent is that they'll be doing both but it seems like The New War should have already launched, if that is the case, to avoid confusion. 

Hopefully Tennocon commentary clears it all up. 

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10 hours ago, OniDax said:

I'm not cutting them slack because Covid-19 isn't what has made them shift focus so often.

The current pandemic situation doesn't absolve them of criticism on past work, sure. I'm not addressing that, though, because that's not what this thread is about. You seem to be glossing over my focus on this one particular very short period in time here (spring/summer 2020 if that wasn't clear).

I am talking about Covid delaying 2020's original development plans, and that's it. I have no stake (or interest tbh) in your discussion about other updates.

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1 hour ago, aligatorno said:

On thing I don't understand about their motives is the lack of Mocap. Why not adapt and switch to manual keyframe animation until they get back access to the studio? 

It's not like we got NaughtyDog level of cinematics before either, they didn't have much movement to start with. The quality will vary, and it will take longer than usual, but at the very least it will be servicable and will allow them to keep their promises. 

Looks how awesome these dudes manually animated the models from Dragon Age Inquisition.

 

Quote

Why not adapt and switch to manual keyframe animation until they get back access to the studio?

My guess: lack of skill, or experience, or time, or all three. Warframe has never had animations of the quality seen in that video. IMO, animations are the area most lacking in the game when it comes to quality. DE probably doesn't want to put time into manual keyframe animations that won't be up-to-par with their mocap, particularly for their cinematic cutscenes.

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1 hour ago, aligatorno said:

On thing I don't understand about their motives is the lack of Mocap. Why not adapt and switch to manual keyframe animation until they get back access to the studio? 

It's not like we got NaughtyDog level of cinematics before either, they didn't have much movement to start with. The quality will vary, and it will take longer than usual

I think you answered your own question there.

1 hour ago, aligatorno said:

but at the very least it will be servicable and will allow them to keep their promises. 

1. Big unforeseen circumstances.

2. I don't need the New War so badly that I can accept being annoyed at janky, "servicable" animations forever. I can wait for mocap. Idk what others' opinions are on it, but that's me.

3. Even if they told us what their goals were, internal goals are not the same as external promises. Nobody at DE has sat down and said, "we will get this to you by this specific date", there are no pre-orders or contracts for the content they are making, no money-back guarantee.

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1 hour ago, aligatorno said:

On thing I don't understand about their motives is the lack of Mocap. Why not adapt and switch to manual keyframe animation until they get back access to the studio? 

It's not like we got NaughtyDog level of cinematics before either, they didn't have much movement to start with. The quality will vary, and it will take longer than usual, but at the very least it will be servicable and will allow them to keep their promises. 

Looks how awesome these dudes manually animated the models from Dragon Age Inquisition.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYFrBg1yb6g

There is a big chance that while this may work, they are still tied to contracts with whoever it is that does the mocap "acting". So they are likely in a tough spot, kinda like how it was in the US when some companies used their own staff for voice acting, which turned into a massive mess due to the voice actors union or whatever it was called.

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20 hours ago, OniDax said:

So, Covid-19 upended the world last year too, right? I'm sure Covid-19 is to blame for how Old Blood and Railjack turned out. It's also to blame for 2018 and its content drought issues as well. It's also the reason why the lore is contradictory, why a lot of content is buggy, why they took three years to release Umbra, etc. DE is a perfect development studio, the best in the world, and Covid-19 is the reason for all its problems.

You are the one saying all that.

Its amusing, really.

 

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20 hours ago, OniDax said:

So, Covid-19 upended the world last year too, right? I'm sure Covid-19 is to blame for how Old Blood and Railjack turned out. It's also to blame for 2018 and its content drought issues as well. It's also the reason why the lore is contradictory, why a lot of content is buggy, why they took three years to release Umbra, etc. DE is a perfect development studio, the best in the world, and Covid-19 is the reason for all its problems.

Don't put words in my mouth, Ok?

Long Story Short, don't count heart of deimos as a non-TNW update just yet. Empyrean was a Grineer-focused update, yet that saw the start of the whole shebang. And, as I said, not only does Heart of Deimos potentially have Ballas, and thus TNW connections, it's also putting every single other faction in one place, right above a location well-known for being a battleground. Doesn't exactly take a huge leap in logic to suggest that it'll turn into a battleground once again.

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45 minutes ago, OniDax said:

My guess: lack of skill, or experience, or time, or all three. Warframe has never had animations of the quality seen in that video. IMO, animations are the area most lacking in the game when it comes to quality. DE probably doesn't want to put time into manual keyframe animations that won't be up-to-par with their mocap, particularly for their cinematic cutscenes.

I think it’s partly time/money and maybe that they want to make sure they don’t segregate those in the community with older systems that would have trouble running more high-end animations.

I can’t speak to talent at the Studio being a factor.

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21 minutes ago, Loza03 said:

Don't put words in my mouth, Ok?

Long Story Short, don't count heart of deimos as a non-TNW update just yet. Empyrean was a Grineer-focused update, yet that saw the start of the whole shebang. And, as I said, not only does Heart of Deimos potentially have Ballas, and thus TNW connections, it's also putting every single other faction in one place, right above a location well-known for being a battleground. Doesn't exactly take a huge leap in logic to suggest that it'll turn into a battleground once again.

It would be the perfect opportunity to open up for more factions and mission types in RJ aswell, possibly with some squad link missions and/or a revamped invasion system.

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27 minutes ago, (PS4)Silverback73 said:

I think it’s partly time/money and maybe that they want to make sure they don’t segregate those in the community with older systems that would have trouble running more high-end animations.

I can’t speak to talent at the Studio being a factor.

Animations aren't like graphics. Why would older systems have trouble running high-end animations?

30 minutes ago, Loza03 said:

Don't put words in my mouth, Ok?

Long Story Short, don't count heart of deimos as a non-TNW update just yet. Empyrean was a Grineer-focused update, yet that saw the start of the whole shebang. And, as I said, not only does Heart of Deimos potentially have Ballas, and thus TNW connections, it's also putting every single other faction in one place, right above a location well-known for being a battleground. Doesn't exactly take a huge leap in logic to suggest that it'll turn into a battleground once again.

Empyrean starts as a Grineer-focused update, but it still quickly leads to the Sentients. And the context of getting the Railjack is all about the Sentients. I wouldn't be surprised one bit if Heart of Deimos is Railjack content. And if so, then yeah, it'd be TNW-related. Can't say that has me excited, but it probably is connected. I just hope it has some story with it and isn't just randomly thrown in the game like Old Blood (where there's no story introduction that places it within the timeline of Warframe's story.

33 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

You are the one saying all that.

Its amusing, really.

 

I'm not the one who has been using Covid-19 as a shield to protect DE from criticism of how they manage their game. It's amusing that all of a sudden people want to pretend that DE hasn't had problems staying focused in the past. Whether Heart of Deimos is an example of that or not (as in, whether it's actually related to The New War or is unrelated), people shouldn't be surprised at the possibility that DE isn't staying focused. It's not something new that just happened with Covid-19.

My first comment was "DE has never been able to focus on anything for long, in response to a thread that's all about DE not focusing on the thing they were working on." Whether or not that applies to Deimos, DE's management of the game over the past 7 years has demonstrated that they don't stay focused on any story or content for long. In response to that simple statement, SenorClipClop said this:

22 hours ago, SenorClipClop said:

Right? It's totally DE's thing. I wouldn't even be surprised if nobody has been doing any motion capture work at the studio. I bet DE's studios are basically empty and everyone's just at home -- oh wait.

Maybe this "loss of focus" in 2020 has some basis in an outside factor....

My interpretation of his comment was that he was saying it's not DE's "thing" to shift focus from one thing they're working on to something else before finishing the thing they were working on. As I responded to him/her, Covid-19 may be exacerbating their "focus" problem, but it isn't the cause of it. Let me remind you that DE originally suggested the New Player Experience, based on the cinematic trailer they paid for, would be added early 2020. Did they ever start work on that, or did they treat that like they did Umbra, where they put it off for three years? Yes, Covid-19 has upended the world this year, but let's not pretend that DE has handled things perfectly before this. Covid-19 hurt a studio that already had a problem getting content out. DE even acknowledged this when talking about Tennocon 2020, saying that they didn't want to announce content and then have it release 6 months later. That's why they aren't just working on Heart of Deimos, but are working to get it out soon after Tennocon 2020.

And SeniorClipClop clarified his comment to say that he was specifically talking about Heart of Deimos and not previous content. I was speaking much more broadly with my original comment about DE's lack of focus.

Again, I'm not saying Heart of Deimos is a clear shift away from The New War. I'm not upset with DE for doing Heart of Deimos instead of a New War quest or Duviri (DE has already made clear they don't have the means to do that without their studio). I'm not too excited about the eventual New War quest anyway (because I don't like the Sentients). I'm just saying that DE has always had a problem staying focused. That didn't just start with Covid-19, and it won't end with Covid-19 either.

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On 2020-07-20 at 12:50 PM, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Pretty sure that we got the whole Scarlet Spear thing in 2020. And that Deimos thing or whatever may take a while to be released. So..... 

What was the question again? 

DE wants to launch an update on Aug 1st. Deimos is likely what they are "shipping what they show"

 

And they did do Scarlet Spear, but I think the pandemic has changed the plans....kinda like everyone elses right now.

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4 minutes ago, (XB1)Cram Duahcim said:

DE wants to launch an update on Aug 1st. Deimos is likely what they are "shipping what they show"

 

And they did do Scarlet Spear, but I think the pandemic has changed the plans....kinda like everyone elses right now.

Really? I think that the Tennocon reveal is on the first. Everything else is a matter of "soon" afaik. But I haven't been able to check the streams. Do you have a source? 

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4 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Really? I think that the Tennocon reveal is on the first. Everything else is a matter of "soon" afaik. But I haven't been able to check the streams. Do you have a source? 

They made a video announcement regarding the date being changed to Aug 1st because they want to ship an update on the same day of the reveal. 

Search "Tennocon 2020 annoncement" on YouTube 

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