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Not a fan of these changes, especially the syndicate and MR stuff. The nerfs to infused abilities, I'll wait to see the values. Just remember you could always pick better abilities from other frames, or buff the ones chosen rather than nerf these ones, and I don't think they were so amazing that was necessary. 

The mastery rank change just feels like yet another case of DE promising they'll do something for vets, and immediately capitulating to the cries of inexperienced players who want this to put another tank ability on their inaros which doesn't need it anyways, especially not on the 5 waves of hydron they bring him to. If you're gonna make noob-friendly content, fine. Set out to do it that way, and follow through. Revamped new player experience is an example of how to do that. But if you say you're gonna make a veteran-focused system/mode, do it. Don't claim you will then immediately scale back the difficulty and requirements to engage with it, and don't pull a steel path and make the enemies so tanky it's almost a chore in most game modes (though some do have their benefits from say, increased spawn rates), rather than a quick way to make the levels more meaningful.

Also the syndicate thing is annoying, I'd prefer to just have it unlock at the end of the quest, and don't let us interact until we hit the MR requirement.

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27 minutes ago, (XB1)C11H22O11 said:

They warned that there might be changes before launch, better to make the changes now instead of changing them later and piss some people off. 

Bold of you to assume they won't do any nerfs after it launches.

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MR8 is not endgame, hell it isn't even mid level. Now you're just making this new player content, causing them to burn out quicker and make it less special for the veterans. 

 

And nerfing subsume abilities is even more stupid. Those abilities are not broken, they are unable to break every frame like certain people claim. You have to consider if they synergize with other frames' abilities to maximize the benefit.

Like of course we can put Warcry on every frame and make their melee hit faster, but why would we do that? If I want to focus on melee when don't I just use Valkyr? 

Of course we can put Roar on every frame, but Ember's, Banshee's, Mag's, Zephyr abilities still do S#&$ty damage. 

Of course we can put dispenser on every frame, but when we can just use pads, why would we waist the slot on this ability?

 

There is no reason to nerf the abilities, THEY WILL NOT BREAK THE GAME. If you nerf them to S#&$, no one's gonna use them, then why don't you just choose another ability? 

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On 2020-08-12 at 1:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

THE HELMINTH: DEV WORKSHOP.

Looking at this its plain to see that unless there's some super secret closed beta no player's influenced this at all

Right now everyone wants buffed bad abilities and you want to nerf the really good ones, this sounds like a system you already have in place hmmmm. 

I can't believe nobody thought of using a system similar to riven disposition on these subsumed abilities which would give LITERALLY EVERYONE what they want.

Also at Mr 8 I had 3 frames, and your saying that I have to option to get rid of a third of my frames on a bad judgement.

If you were just going to lower the mastery rank why did you not discuss this internally before announcement, going back on favoured  decisions doesn't really give the idea of a stable company.

P.s. First post here and on mobile so I probably messed some formatting up, my bad 

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Endgame content, veteran content.. 🤣😂

and i havn't seen the content in their "new open world".. probably more bounties & reputation i guess.. just like fortuna.. ? 😮

and now this..

Oh, btw.. can u fix kuva ayanga ? still doing self dmg.. i just put it there, its probably a very hard thing to fix considering it still there a few months later 🙂

Peace. 🤣

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On 2020-08-12 at 1:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

THE HELMINTH: DEV WORKSHOP.

Serious question. What happened to this being geared towards “experienced players”? And also if you’re going to nerf abilities, why hide the system behind a grind? We all know there’s going to be a grind. Asking for a friend. 

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If DE reveals things in advance to be given a once-over by the playerbase, but don't listen to feedback, and release it overpowered, they get criticised for doing so.

If DE does listen to feedback, and tone it back in response to that feedback, they get criticised for doing so.

If DE doesn't publicise their releases and goes radio silent in order to manage expectations by never setting any, they get criticised for doing so.

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32 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

"heavy nerf"?

Independent of whether it's possible to nerf something that does not yet exist, you say "heavy" three times, while nothing from DE has given any indication of what numbers to expect. 

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5 minutes ago, Voltage said:

You can't just turn down Roar and expect other abilities to suddenly compete. It's a multiplicative damage multiplier. It's like a Faction mod for all factions across your entire arsenal. Understand that fundamentally this skill is good and impossible to balance if given to any Warframe to use.

Agreed. It won't matter if you tune it to base strength only. It's still 50% = 1.5x multiplier including abilities. It's still going to be better than 90% of the whole Workshop unless they change it.

Charge fits perfectly in the system. I don't understand why they are beating their head play testing and changing values trying to keep Roar "in line with other abilities".

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5 minutes ago, Liv.Somik said:

MR8 is not endgame, hell it isn't even mid level. Now you're just making this new player content, causing them to burn out quicker and make it less special for the veterans. 

 

And nerfing subsume abilities is even more stupid. Those abilities are not broken, they are unable to break every frame like certain people claim. You have to consider if they synergize with other frames' abilities to maximize the benefit.

Like of course we can put Warcry on every frame and make their melee hit faster, but why would we do that? If I want to focus on melee when don't I just use Valkyr? 

Of course we can put Roar on every frame, but Ember's, Banshee's, Mag's, Zephyr abilities still do S#&$ty damage. 

Of course we can put dispenser on every frame, but when we can just use pads, why would we waist the slot on this ability?

 

There is no reason to nerf the abilities, THEY WILL NOT BREAK THE GAME. If you nerf them to S#&$, no one's gonna use them, then why don't you just choose another ability? 

Why should I ever play Valkyr if Inaros can just have her only good ability and be much tankier? Or Wisp, who actually has a completely better kit, health regen, and will get even more attack speed than Valkyr. What is Warframe identity when I can just create a synergy that just becomes disgusting in the use I have it for and outshines any standard Warframe kit for that use? Why should I ever use Chroma in Eidolons if my Volt Prime can cast Shock Trooper, Roar, and then fire through shields for more Critical Damage? Why play Mirage in Profit Taker if my Volt can use Eclipse? 

This system does create massive issues when it comes to certain abilities, and these abilities need to be changed up.

Nerfing abilities is stupid because it highlights that DE does not see the fundamental problem with some abilities they listed for subsuming.

Edited by Voltage
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It's good that you're making these changes beforehand.

But we really will need the numbers for How these abilities are going to be changed/capped.

Otherwise you're having players spend time prepping and farming for hours on something that might not even be worth it because we don't know enough about it.

Mastery Rank (sidenote):

Kinda sad to see that it was lowered so low.... MR 8 takes no time at all to get to. I was looking forward to something that really felt like it was a reward meant for the players who have put time into the game

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40 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

Do you think DE is making a wise chose or terrible chose?

A wise one, because people would react even more violently if they did it post launch.

People also would have pitched a fit if things like Roar weren't an option in the first place and DE launched it with just the most basic utility type moves people would be demanding that things like Roar be added instead.

People would be angry no matter what they do, and honestly if this causes said angry people to quit the game then frankly I don't give a damn.

Some people will never be satisfied, even if you give them what they want they will demand more, the very essence of greed.

Edited by Aldain
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1 minute ago, (PS4)AtomicEyekon said:

Helminth system who is this for? not for new players right? Mr15 right?!

DE: Nope Mr8 players

I would argue Mastery Rank 15 is still new player territory. We have over 2 million Mastery in the game now and DE is gating this system behind a measly 160,000. If DE really wants this geared towards experienced players, it should have a heavy resource cost across every single gamemode simultaneously and be gated to atleast the halfway mark of MR 20.

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il y a 4 minutes, Sickle_Slayer a dit :

It's good that you're making these changes beforehand.

But we really will need the numbers for How these abilities are going to be changed/capped.

Otherwise you're having players spend time prepping and farming for hours on something that might not even be worth it because we don't know enough about it.

Mastery Rank (sidenote):

Kinda sad to see that it was lowered so low.... MR 8 takes no time at all to get to. I was looking forward to something that really felt like it was a reward meant for the players who have put time into the game

After all this time.. don't u get that DE don't care about veterans they just want to add stuff for "everybody", meaning low content easy to do even for a MR2 that just started so that they won't get frustrated for god know what reason..

and here i am.. wondering why all my old time mate & friends in warframe are all leaving the game..

Edited by 1st-1
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So MR8 is now considered a 'veteren'? 

And if you're going with the argument that MR is not a reflection of player status/capability, then why have a limit in the first place? 

This is such a joke. 

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Just now, --Q--Trekk said:

So MR8 is now considered a 'veteren'? 

And if you're going with the argument that MR is not a reflection of player status/capability, then why have a limit in the first place? 

This is such a joke. 

They needed to give the Scarlet Spear MR0 veterans a reason to rank up. /s

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1 minute ago, Voltage said:

I would argue Mastery Rank 15 is still new player territory. We have over 2 million Mastery in the game now and DE is gating this system behind a measly 160,000. If DE really wants this geared towards experienced players, it should have a heavy resource cost across every single gamemode simultaneously and be gated to atleast the halfway mark of MR 20.

30/2 = 20???? 15 is fine, at 16 I have 1000 hours.

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I do not post on the forums often, but I am not enjoying the direction Warframe has been going. Weapon specific mods and unique weapons variations have been mostly ignored since the addition of riven mods. Kuva Litches were over-hyped, under-delivered, and a huge grind. I killed/converted over a hundred of them and the only litch cosmetic I have was given to my by a friend. Railjack is three planets filled with a single mission. It requires hundreds of runs to level intrinsics, even with quad affinity boost. Steel Path isn't challenging, just another drawn out grind. Now experienced means less than two weeks of casual play, and preemptive nerfs are done based on speculation? The only reason I was excited for it was because even the most mediocre Warframes would have a chance to shine.

Events like The Gradivus Dilemma, Cicero Crisis, Operation: Gate Crash, and even Specters of Liberty were awesome. Updates like Shadows Of The Dead, The Grustrag Three, and Valkyr Unleashed were great. I want to see more things like that, not rushed grind-fests.

I have spent thousands of hours playing Warframe, many of which I enjoyed. I want reasons to play, but I am seeing fewer with each update.

Edited by jss2a98aj
Elaborated a bit more
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Making some abilities weaker versions while others are the same ones just because the others are terrible is dumb. At the end of the day it doesn't matter because the reason people are willing to pick the ones you nerfed is because some frames don't even have 1 skill to use. 

 

You guys just derailed the hype for the system with these changes. 

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7 hours ago, Voltage said:

Lol. Make it 20 or something. 15 was too low. What happened to this system being for the more progressed players?

Mastery Rank 8 is only ~7.39% of the current game's Mastery. That's a joke.

+1

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