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3 hours ago, Salt_KuHa said:

mastery rank requirement being lowered to 8 from 15. That's most likely the reason this blew up

3 hours ago, (NSW)Lorkhan said:

Oh, DE nerfed all the good powers that can be given to Helminth. The lowered the from MR 15 to MR8.

Oh..I see.

Well, to be fair the Nerd is not that bad it was to be expected, due to the Powers where indeed happen to be a bit OP in certain builds, so bravo for that.

As for the MR rank thingy?, Ouch. is all I can say. They should've kept it for MR 15, cuz this will only dig a hole worse then it already is. Allowing "New Lights" to destroy a Warframe by mistake or cuz they think it's cool do to so. (Or spend all their resources on it and be stuck). But it is nice that they allow more players to join in on the fun.

So kinda a duel edged sword   

 

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DE, what exactly is a fresh out the sacrifice quest MR 8 with barely any knowledge of the game going to do in the Helminth for the Heart of Deimos update? They’ll barely have their own Cetus syndicate maxed out, much less put any actual work into the game. This is complete and utter bull crap that you lowered the MR requirement because a bunch of whiny peasants that don’t farm for anything want a free pass. Having it at MR 15 was perfectly fine and didn’t need to be lowered. You didn’t lowered the requirement needed for Steel Path so why is this an issue? You should’ve left it alone for the veterans that actually play the game. Not give a bunch of free handouts to players that are just orbiter sitters. Round of applause to dumbest decision you’ve made.

 

Edited by (PS4)Slyagra69
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1 minute ago, Rage_Inducer said:

Ok, I went over the recent changes and it all makes sense BUT can we please get numbers on these things?
Can we also get more clarification on the subject of damage buffing abilities such as shock and smite with their respective augments and how they interact with other damage buffing powers (if at all)

DE will NEVER give out this information until its released, so they avoid players steering away from the content, before it's already out.

(that never ends well anyway, but oof) 

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1 minute ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

As for the MR rank thingy?, Ouch. is all I can say. They should've kept it for MR 15, cuz this will only dig a hole worse then it already is. Allowing "New Lights" to destroy a Warframe by mistake or cuz they think it's cool do to so. (Or spend all their recouses on it and be stuck).  

Yeah I mean MR8 is way too low even if I was against the MR15 lock. Maybe somewhere between MR10 and MR15 would have been a better option but I dunno

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A neutral response requesting moderation? 

The nerv on some people. 

I bet you make arguments with logic instead of insults too! 

 

As to the changes itself. 

The MR 8 part is disappointing for me cause they changed it only after they had already said its for experienced (kinda) players. 

And MR 8 players (the fresh ones not the "I don't gain MR on principle" ones) will likely not be able to use it until they grind for more than twice that time gathering resources to feed helminth so it doesn't really do much other than cause MR 8 players to wonder why they have this if they can't use it. 

Again this is on assumption of how the helminth will be made available, and it still needs standing which is its own issue for MR 8 players. 

 

The ability nerfs I expected so no real comments. Only feel they should have thought of it before making the very first dev workshop. 

 

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1 minute ago, Salt_KuHa said:

Yeah I mean MR8 is way too low even if I was against the MR15 lock. Maybe somewhere between MR10 and MR15 would have been a better option but I dunno

Yeah...but DE do care more about numbers/money then anything else, so. Oh well, I guess.

I do feel bad for the new players tho, they'll have no clue what to do with this and you always have them players who do things cuz "oooo shiny"

Not a insult to anyone here, hell even I like shiny things, but it's legit bait and hook move.

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13 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Why do these Infused Warframe Abilities have these rules?
It was apparent in player feedback and play testing that these Infused Warframe Abilities had the potential to be the overwhelming choice; which is not ideal. Instead of changing the Ability outright due to those concerns, we decided to give them slight rules when Infused.

Seems reasonable.
 

13 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Without spoiling too much, the Helminth Segment is currently obtained in Rank 3 of the Entrati Syndicate

ty for the info.

Edited by Chroia
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1 minute ago, Salt_KuHa said:

Yeah I mean MR8 is way too low even if I was against the MR15 lock. Maybe somewhere between MR10 and MR15 would have been a better option but I dunno

correct me if i'm wrong, but isnt MR8 can be assume already complete the starchart? i know its still count as fresh player but still atleast they should already know to certain extent. and yeah prob around MR 10-15 is a better option compare to MR8 or just straight MR15

 

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2 minutes ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

Yeah...but DE do care more about numbers/money then anything else, so. Oh well, I guess.

well DE need to pay the bill

2 minutes ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

I do feel bad for the new players tho, they'll have no clue what to do with this and you always have them players who do things cuz "oooo shiny"

yeah... shiny bait for newplayer that prob leaver after couple months

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The problem with the MR 8 change isn't that it's no longer MR 15, it's the fact that we've been told that this is a system for experienced players.
We've seen graphs and most people that stick around warframe tend to linger in the MR 10 to 13 range.
With that in mind, sure, MR 15 stands out as a more experienced player that likely has many more warframes.
You can easily hit MR10 and only ever get 3 warframes in total so I find it hard to buy the whole idea of it still being for experienced players any more.

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1 minute ago, D_terra said:

correct me if i'm wrong, but isnt MR8 can be assume already complete the starchart? i know its still count as fresh player but still atleast they should already know to certain extent. and yeah prob around MR 10-15 is a better option compare to MR8 or just straight MR15

 

An MR 8 wont have the star chart completed unless they were carried. And even if that did happen, most of their builds wouldn’t even tickle a level 50 enemy. MR 15 was perfectly fine. It would’ve given an incentive for players to grind for something.

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1 minute ago, D_terra said:

correct me if i'm wrong, but isnt MR8 can be assume already complete the starchart? i know its still count as fresh player but still atleast they should already know to certain extent. and yeah prob around MR 10-15 is a better option compare to MR8 or just straight MR15

 

I know people that are mr 16 - 20 that havent completed starchart

there's 562 gear items in the game, getting MR 15 is easy, getting MR 8 is even easier, players won't know what to do , since there's also things like Railjack, Open Worlds, Eidolons, Orbs, Liches, that aren't locked to higher MR's that will overwhelm them ebcause they have acces to them all at once

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On 2020-08-12 at 7:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

PART 1 - Changes to select Infused Warframe Abilities

Please keep in mind we’re still testing/playing around with the values for each, hence why the values are not present below:

The following only apply to Infused Warframe Abilities:

Rhino - Roar
Diminished Damage increase

Mirage - Eclipse
Diminished Damage increase and cap Damage Reduction 

Valkyr - Warcry
Attack speed increase reduced

Protea - Dispenser
Duration reduced

Nidus - Larva
Radius reduced

Wukong - Defy
Armor capped


Why do these Infused Warframe Abilities have these rules?
It was apparent in player feedback and play testing that these Infused Warframe Abilities had the potential to be the overwhelming choice; which is not ideal. Instead of changing the Ability outright due to those concerns, we decided to give them slight rules when Infused.

Can we get more info about these changes? I'd like to know how much these abilities were nerfed. Are they capped at what precents?

On 2020-08-12 at 7:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

EDIT: We have also changed the Mastery Rank Prerequisite of the Helminth Segment to 8 (was 15).

Please raise this to 10-12. I don't think mr 8 players are ready for this system. I'm saying this because 90%of the times players under mr 10 are usually not as skillful as the higher mr players.

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20 minutes ago, Sahansral said:

Do you have any statistics that could back that up? Perhaps Warframe changed from COOP multiplayer to Solo experience and I didn't get the message, maybe?
If not, I consider Warframe still mainly a coop game, that needs to offer fun for every player in a team.
I have no problem with other players making more damage. I have a problem, when I enjoy playing with others and anyone can decide how much fun everyone will have by choosing loadouts with certain broken combinations.  Looting becomes irrelevant in the long run, when the core game loop becomes damaged.

Your points:

1- I don't give a S#&$ about solo players, because me,myself and I like coop.

2- I have no problems with players making more damage, unless it doesn't fit my exquisitely narrow minded take on how people sould play and interact when in team with me.

On the side note: why don't you just premade with friends if you are bothered by how randoms play the game? Oh, well, I might know the answer...

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Okay so, it's seems obvious some abilities were chosen over others because some abilities are just too good. But if we're now nerfing some abilities to balance them within the helminth system, it seems like the list may need to be revised. For example, I assume Nyx is giving Mind Control because Psychic Bolts stripping the defenses of 6 enemies is considered too good, and you just wouldn't give Chaos or Absorb. However, if we're adjusting abilities within the helminth then I think it would be much better to give Psychic Bolts, but it only shoots 2 or 3 bolts. Of course, then you would want to change from Ash giving his Shuriken to giving his Teleport because augmented Shuriken is too similar to Psychic Bolts. Then you look at Pull - not looking that great, but if you were to apply the chance to drop energy to enemies that have been pulled recently (not just died from Pull itself) that would be super appealing and not a broken buff to Mag. Not trying to give DE lots of extra work with 5 days before the update, but I do think the ability selections might need another pass - or if not, maybe some of the selections need to be buffed.

Edited by Neightrix
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23 minutes ago, (PS4)IrOrphanCrippler said:

so I take it that you don't understand what " very experienced warframe players " means but lets say you do. Have you reached 15 yet? Or by lowering from 15-8 are you now able to participate?

MR24 actually. Would be higher, but I havent had any real need to max out the last of the armory.

As for experience, I have just under 3600 hours in game. Granted, a good majority of that is Fashionframe and experimenting with loadouts. I'm very much a "very experienced Warframe player", I just dont understand the feeling that DE needs to pander to me because of it.

Edited by Dragmod
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11 minutes ago, Aguzo said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

So DE makes a new system, to let y'all mess around and make interesting builds.

One side didn't want certain abilities in the mix, because they basically make the original frames irrelevant. I'll play whatever frame I want, because I want to, regardless if they are "S" or "F" tier. However, they were making a fairly reasonable argument. You give rhino's buff away, why use rhino? So it was decided that certain subsumed abilities would be slightly lowered.

Instead of removing some of the subsumable abilities, they lowered some values, so that the originals owners would still be at the top. This is called compromise.

 

 

Dammit, why can't I remove a Hidden Content on a quote?

Anyway onto topic: I understand how some people will care a lot about the whole "S" or "F" tier. (More then they should, if I'm going to be honest with certain you tuber too). But I hope you reliaze Aguzo, that people who DO care about this stuff will quickly and very easily call the "choices" made here "Trash/Dumb" (and other much more bad words) and never use them or flock to the power that avoided the "Nerf" in the first place?.

For example: If I delete Mesa's 4th power (please de) all the Meta-Players will flock to the next powerful Warframe, such as Chroma. et. How do you solve this issue?.

 

Think Which One GIF

 

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Don't change the mastery requirement, 15 was fine and if you're going to change it maybe it should be 12 or 13, it was going to give getting to that mastery rank an actual value besides like 3 weapons. The dream of later game content once again slipped through your fingers.

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>Requirements lowered to MR8

CONGRATULATIONS. You have now created a new ENFORCED META of "You either do these builds or you are doing it wrong". You know, like you guys INVENTED that the Xoris was doing. Except its always you guys doing it. Every time. 

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13 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Please keep in mind we’re still testing/playing around with the values for each, hence why the values are not present below:

The following only apply to Infused Warframe Abilities:

Rhino - Roar
Diminished Damage increase

Mirage - Eclipse
Diminished Damage increase and cap Damage Reduction 

Valkyr - Warcry
Attack speed increase reduced

Protea - Dispenser
Duration reduced

Nidus - Larva
Radius reduced

Wukong - Defy
Armor capped


Why do these Infused Warframe Abilities have these rules?
It was apparent in player feedback and play testing that these Infused Warframe Abilities had the potential to be the overwhelming choice; which is not ideal. Instead of changing the Ability outright due to those concerns, we decided to give them slight rules when Infused.

Please just replace Roar with Charge.

Doesn't matter if you fiddle with the values, Roar is too good of an ability for the system and if you are truly play testing it you will find out no amount of nerfing will stop Roar from being the overwhelming top choice.

Edited by (XB1)MetalxPhoenix
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5 minutes ago, (PS4)Slyagra69 said:

An MR 8 wont have the star chart completed unless they were carried. And even if that did happen, most of their builds wouldn’t even tickle a level 50 enemy. MR 15 was perfectly fine. It would’ve given an incentive for players to grind for something.

To be fair I don't see the reason for it to be MR15 when it could be MR14,13,12,11 or 10. Do those 5 extra Mastery Ranks really make a player more skilled in the game? Does levelling mastery fodder weapons and frames they might never play again really make a player more experienced? I understand having it locked behind MR but 15 is maybe a bit too much.

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On 2020-08-13 at 12:27 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Who is this for?
We consider this a customization system for very experienced Warframe players (Mastery Rank 15 8 Prerequisite). We do not intend to let newer players unlock this system. We intentionally placed the Segment deep into progression to ensure only experienced players could access the Segment and begin their journey with Helminth.

I don't want to jump into the bandwagon before i see the exact number of this nerf. But this one... damn, MR8 = Very experienced Warframe players. Bwahahaha l laughed hard at this.

Back then, i need around 1 - 2 months of casual playing to reach MR8. So you're tryin to say that you can be a Very experienced Warframe player within a month?? What a joke.

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