The Helminth: Dev Workshop

[SnakeBadger]

Subsumed"spectre could function infested for 24 hours duration can be bothersome without any rewarding features for combat, going further the pets and ship are absurd rightnow so a low MR should be great to get players interested in new content until rework pushes out new bounties and planet updates, the OP room is large i hope we can have some new decorations and spreading plants and life across the other rooms without investing in platinum i can just say gardening and getting some scientific servants would put ordis to good use, excavations, and other NPC items like grukdul to use in the ship, icefloors, environments atmospheres to unlock will make each helmith and orbiter more unique to feature something like the grocery stores have in the vegetable areas misting water and flickery lightbulbs, occasional rumble of a meteorshower, and music change would be good for players to earn affinity in different ways like MMO-rpg since most players go fashion frame after they get to MR7

[Croeseus]

So.

A feature intended for Veterans and Somewhat invested players (Mr 15 or above). Has for some bizarre panic reason been N E R F E D, Like come on DE, It's not even funny anymore

Now you nerf something that isn't even out yet? Honestly i don't see what you thought was bad about some of the abilities, like you said Rhino's roar could only be replaced on Warframes that already Have a Damage boost ability and not used at the same time with others at all "Special case", so what gives with the nerf here? And then you lower the Helminth Consuming room to Mr8? I'm a clan leader, and believe me, I have plenty experience that most people at mr8 barely know a lot of the game content, hardly eidolons, most don't have millions of varied resources, a lot are unsure what weapons are strong, Usually only have 1/2 Riven Mods, just starting to test the water with Sorties.                                                                                                                                                                  So why are you making the new Helminth chair update New player "friendly" reducing it to Mr8, again, why always new player friendly? So many people in my clan have gone from Excitement to "Meh" not largely because of the nerf, but moreso the reduced Mr 15 change to Mr 8, that Exclusivity for playing the game more and being rewarded for it is gone again before it even existed. Well done DE 😞 

[FluterTree]

"De SaId It WaS eNd GaMe CoNtEnT"  i have seen them call it late game content in terms of maxing it out but I have never seen them say its for end game content only

[SpentCasings]

On 2020-08-12 at 12:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

 

AUGUST 19TH UPDATE:

Greetings, Tenno!

The launch of Heart of Deimos grows near, and we have some Helminth updates since we last posted! Below are 2 parts of updated/clarifying information that touches both Infused Warframe Abilities and the Helminth Segment acquisition.  

PART 1 - Changes to select Infused Warframe Abilities

Please keep in mind we’re still testing/playing around with the values for each, hence why the values are not present below:

The following only apply to Infused Warframe Abilities:

Rhino - Roar
Diminished Damage increase

Mirage - Eclipse
Diminished Damage increase and cap Damage Reduction 

Valkyr - Warcry
Attack speed increase reduced

Protea - Dispenser
Duration reduced

Nidus - Larva
Radius reduced

Wukong - Defy
Armor capped

Why do these Infused Warframe Abilities have these rules?
It was apparent in player feedback and play testing that these Infused Warframe Abilities had the potential to be the overwhelming choice; which is not ideal. Instead of changing the Ability outright due to those concerns, we decided to give them slight rules when Infused.

 

And just like that you guys just completely destroyed your update. I have No longer any desire to take part in the farm fest just for gimped abilities after I farmed SEVERAL of the HARDEST WARFRAME FARMS IN THE GAME specifically to take advantage of this system. All the other abilities you listed where trash. You know it. we know it, and you just gimped the only abilities worth a crap. 

 

Do you guys hate us? Do you hate fun??! Do you actively hate your own game? I'm actually being somewhat serious now because design choices like this are just completely counterproductive to enticing players to play this update. If it goes live with those nerfs im NOT BOTHERING. Why do you continually make choices that just RIPS the wind out of our sails?

[jesusdh]

On your edit you forgot to erase the "customization system for very experienced Warframe players", because MR 8?! Really?! I'm glad i always have low expectations to not be disappointed, but congratulations, you've done it.

[Shidonia]

"You can only replace 1 ability"

Does this mean we won't be able to add multiple abilities to a warframe and completely change it? 

[selig_fay]

14 minutes ago, Sahansral said:

How could a buff to Ice Wave look like so that anyone would consider taking it over roar?

reduces enemy resistance by 150%. You know how resist works. negative resistance is a damage bonus.

[Swagernator22663]

MR8 players will be like "i have 5 frames, which should i kill first hmmm"

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

1 minute ago, Shidonia said:

"You can only replace 1 ability"

Does this mean we won't be able to add multiple abilities to a warframe and completely change it? 

It's always been just one ability since it was announced.

[Klokwerkaos]

On 2020-08-12 at 12:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

It was apparent in player feedback and play testing that these Infused Warframe Abilities had the potential to be the overwhelming choice; which is not ideal. Instead of changing the Ability outright due to those concerns, we decided to give them slight rules when Infused.

 

On 2020-08-12 at 12:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

(Mastery Rank 15 8 Prerequisite)

You know... I was genuinely excited. 

There goes all my excitement For this system.  

Just like primary kitguns, what we think we are going to get and the watered down trash we get is very different.

Quick question... 

Why does everything have to be For new players?  They can unlock Steel Path At MR 8.  They can unlock Helminth at MR 8.  MR 8 takes 8 days or maybe two weeks iF you're casual.

Why do we keep catering to the lowest common denominator?

One oF the chieF problems the game has is because players check out once they have no more content... there is nothing specific to work towards or look Forward too...

This is yet another example oF BAD direction.  I gotta say, I'm glad I'm remained skeptical.  I was dangerously close to Saying you guys were starting to earn back some oF the good will you burned last year in the never ending content drought and what updates did launch were terrible at release.

You were so close DE...

Now this is just another time synch, not any sort of meaningful progression. 

PRO TIP: PLAYERS CHECK OUT BECAUSE THEY HAVE NOTHING TO LOOK FORWARD TO AND WORK TOWARDS.

Put me down as being staunchly against all of this and I'll be very surprised if this isn't another meaningless grind on arrival.

Seriously, NEW PLAYERS HAVE 3000 hours of content... when is there content For advanced players DE?  Steel path wasn't it.  MR 8 is all you need and steel path is a joke in regards to "hard mode" challenge.

New players are constantly complaining about being overwhelmed because they have too much to do and no direction and you rely on us to Fix that For you and train them up and keep them invested in the game and never give us content For advanced players... WHEN DE?  WHEN?!?!?!

Pretty sure the answer is never iF we're being honest.

I am so incredibly disappointed personally with the devs at these choices.  That's not an attack, that's a substantial grievance as Feedback. 2019 seems to have taught them NOTHING.  This makes me Feel disgusted.

[Cody]

On 2020-08-12 at 1:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

THE HELMINTH: DEV WORKSHOP.

Who is this for?
We consider this a customization system for very experienced Warframe players (Mastery Rank 15 8 Prerequisite). We do not intend to let newer players unlock this system. We intentionally placed the Segment deep into progression to ensure only experienced players could access the Segment and begin their journey with Helminth.

I'm sorry... but you had the perfect opportunity to get more playtime out of your player base and not only did you bury the disgrace of what it means to be a high MR deeper than what it is, you also called MR 8 "Very Experienced". Are You scared to lock anything higher than MR 16? (current cap for rivens there's still no reason to go above mr 16.) completely missed opportunity.

Sure this makes newer players miss out, but do you know whats healthy for a game? Grind, Dedication. Wanting to Achieve and earn. Other than flexing rights theres no reason to push 20+ MR why not make things higher MR requirement?

Speaking of MR requirement. it takes 8 days to hit MR 8 if you really want to, isn't hard (cus I know there will be crybaby white knights out there arguing otherwise) unless you're someone who really Doesn't care. which in my eyes, means you shouldn't have access to helmith then, why should lazy people get catered to?

Also, I'm curious to see what gets nerfed in the future. I have bags of popcorn sitting in my cabinet ready to bake for when things pop off and you swipe peoples hard earned progress from underneath their feet.

P.S- I hate to sound so negative, because I do play the game alot. but it really doesn't look good moving forward in terms of game lifespan. Where are our raids? where are enemies with actual mechanics? (jakal was a good start) so many missed opportunities. 😞

[selig_fay]

13 minutes ago, Sahansral said:

Well, not easy to rework 35 abilitites to make them competitive with the best 6 with the deadline coming nearer and nearer and having all available ressources bount to new content...

Nobody asks to make weak abilities strong now. The developers will have an infinite amount of time after the helminth is implemented.

[SnakeBadger]

2 minutes ago, Pzykdruhgs said:

From an experienced player:

This is barely going to change endgame if it were implemented in it's original proposal. If the players want to, they can do broken stuff with or without this new system. All nerfing them does is give us slightly less dps... which is futile at this point. 👍

Will the Broken staff ever get a upgrade or repair? I am thinking the "broken war" and those story items should have "kuva" versions and upgrade specific mods, branching as well as well into something that the kit-gun/Zaw players can turn into unique rewards, infested versions too could have a clean skin unlocked passive or feature additional attacks or stances with growth in the ranks and system if the helminth allows for weapons to also gain upgrades, added capabilities and upgrade cores should be found in cities, and planets 

[Geronimo_r]

On 2020-08-12 at 7:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

EDIT: We have also changed the Mastery Rank Prerequisite of the Helminth Segment to 8 (was 15).

I very highly believe, this should be higher than MR8.

[NinjaZeku]

1 minute ago, Croeseus said:

nerf

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

A new feature was made more accessible. That's all that happened (unless I missed something). No nerf in sight.

3 minutes ago, Croeseus said:

So many people in my clan have gone from Excitement to "Meh" not largely because of the nerf, but moreso the reduced Mr 15 change to Mr 8, that Exclusivity for playing the game more

Ah, elitism. Now I get it.

4 minutes ago, Croeseus said:

Now you nerf something that isn't even out yet?

Trying to balance something / make it work better before releasing it, that's now also a bad thing?

ok

[IGN_Maverick]

15 minutes ago, Sahansral said:

Well, not easy to rework 35 abilitites to make them competitive with the best 6 with the deadline coming nearer and nearer and having all available ressources bount to new content...

You're so dishonest dude, holy cow. LMAO

[Sahansral]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb DeusTurbo:

What do you think hotfixes are for? Release the system as is, study the numbers on which abilities get used most, and then buff the abilities that get used the least so that there is more competition and choice for players. Don't just nerf stuff before it is even released. 

Yeah, tell me how you want to bring abilitites like ripline or decoy on par with the top choices.
DE kind of proved that they have a hard time making these abilitites worthwhile (else some of  those wouldn't be in the current miserable state for so long).
So given that, it really makes more sense to tone down the the top six abilitites to have at least 20+ viable choices at the introduction of the system.

Btw, you act like the effect of these 6 abilitites can't be foreseen. You can calculate/simulate with the known numbers.
Pablo explained pretty recently why sometimes it's better to nerf something than to try to buff everything else.

1) Some things just can't be buffed to a competitive state.

2) The sheer amount of work to buff all (including enemies) would bind resources and developement of new things would come to a stop.  

[SpentCasings]

3 minutes ago, selig_fay said:

reduces enemy resistance by 150%. You know how resist works. negative resistance is a damage bonus.

since when did ice wave do that?

[jesusdh]

Because is for very experienced Warframe players.

[selig_fay]

Just now, SpentCasings said:

since when did ice wave do that?

This is a suggestion on how to make the wave a topical choice against roar. Even if it only lowers the resistance against ice damage, it will have its fans.

[Keyhound]

2 minutes ago, selig_fay said:

reduces enemy resistance by 150%. You know how resist works. negative resistance is a damage bonus.

they could also make it so enemies hit get stuck in the ice(they can still attack, but no longer move).

[Sahansral]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb selig_fay:

Nobody asks to make weak abilities strong now. The developers will have an infinite amount of time after the helminth is implemented.

Well, everyone who expects the system to offer real choice, instead only 6 out of 45?

[SnakeBadger]

11 minutes ago, -Edrick- said:

Mastery Rank Prerequisite of the Helminth Segment

I just want to say, maybe the player's MR can affect the types of rewards and abilities that players can use on weapons and pets too

[RivaAurelius]

1 minute ago, Sahansral said:

Yeah, tell me how you want to bring abilitites like ripline or decoy on par with the top choices.
DE kind of proved that they have a hard time making these abilitites worthwhile (else some of  those wouldn't be in the current miserable state for so long).
So given that, it really makes more sense to tone down the the top six abilitites to have at least 20+ viable choices at the introduction of the system.

Btw, you act like the effect of these 6 abilitites can't be foreseen. You can calculate/simulate with the known numbers.
Pablo explained pretty recently why sometimes it's better to nerf something than to try to buff everything else.

1) Some things just can't be buffed to a competitive state.

2) The sheer amount of work to buff all (including enemies) would bind resources and developement of new things would come to a stop.  

Oh wow, it's almost like ripline isn't even in the ability pool... Decoy however, could be improved. And I act like the effect can't be forseen because IT CAN'T. Like I already said before, I would choose Frost's Ice Wave over all the other choices for some warframes. I would also choose stuff like Chroma's Elemental Ward over all the other options for some warframes. This system was supposed to be powerful and for the upper echalons of players. Every ability in the pool can be buffed to be a competetive option. To act like this isn't true demonstrates laziness and a lack of imagination. 

[Shidonia]

4 minutes ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

It's always been just one ability since it was announced.

Oh my Gosh yes I know that. However they never said we could ONLY replace ONE ability either. They just talked about loadout B or C. 

 

4 minutes ago, --Aegis--Cody said:

I'm sorry... but you had the perfect opportunity to get more playtime out of your player base and not only did you bury the disgrace of what it means to be a high MR deeper than what it is, you also called MR 8 "Very Experienced". Are You scared to lock anything higher than MR 16? (current cap for rivens there's still no reason to go above mr 16. completely missed opportunity.
 😞

I agree 👍🏼 this and every update has always been a market for new players so they want to guarantee a new player a week of play and game will grant you what you want. However it should be the story and dedicatiom which keeps player in.