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3 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

We consider this a customization system for very experienced Warframe players (Mastery Rank 15 Prerequisite). We do not intend to let newer players unlock this system. We intentionally placed the Segment deep into progression to ensure only experienced players could access the Segment and begin their journey with Helminth

This is good news, I was worried they nerf this system to match casual play, I would consider this a great move from DE

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4 minutes ago, Trippytrev said:

This is so awesome I can't wait. but PLEASE consider Valkyr's subsume ability being Rip Line instead, I was totally fantasizing about being able to use it with a couple certain warframes.

Just use Larva. It's better.

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3 minutes ago, (PS4)Tomplexthis said:

dont you need wisps to breach surge. 

your little things that wisp spawns only serve to increase the abilities range when looking at them and serving as a teleport. so no, you dont need it for breach surge to function on a base level however you will not get the added synergy that wisp has with her other abilities

Edited by RakShar_ThePaladinGod
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2 hours ago, --Q--Candy said:

This is incorrect. You have stuff like Volt - Shock there. With the Augment this is a crazy Ability to increase dmg. Can we get a limitation there too?

Shuriken + Seekign Shuriken = Remove Armor from all enemies... Now even grineer are a joke like all other factions.
Rest & Rage = Now you can bee your own Sleep Equinox to power level / fokus farm.
Nourish = Extremly strong toxin buff. The quote from above applies here.
Smite + Smite Infusion = Same thing as the Quote applies here and it even has scaling dmg...
Dispensary = Endless Energy for all Warframes.... This doesnt seem broken at all...

This system needs Heavy Nerfs and active maintenance.This has the potential to kill the balance in this game forever. If it will be relased like this and wont get balanced very often you can say goodbye to all sorts of Balance in this game.
I hope that you will do something about this, else we can say goodbye to ever have any challenge in this game.

 

(Shutout to the comment from --Q--FSK41 a few posts down. This System will kill everything)

Literally the only thing you're correct about is being consistent with the buff abilities. If Roar and Eclipse are going to be limited, DE should be consistent about it. Therefore, in this tear-down I'll ignore those.

Now:
1. Armor removal is already present in about a half-dozen+ different ways, at least half of which aren't restricted to one of the Warframes that can do it (Nyx, Gauss, Vauban, Ember, +1-4 more) so having just one more armor removal method doesn't trivialize anything more than it already was.

2. Stealth leveling Warframes is already possible, albeit with more difficulty, via a combination of Arcane Trickery, the Skiajati, and silenced weapons. This just makes it a bit easier. Also stealth focus farming can already just be done with Equinox, and you can easily do Sanctuary Onslaught focus farming if you don't have/don't feel like using Equinox.

3. Oh, endless energy? Like Zenurik, Energy Pads (sort of), and Hunter Adrenaline/Rage? The health loss necessary for HA/Rage is negated by allies giving healing, Medi-Ray, Life Strike, and Arcane Grace. Face it, this point is dumb and you shouldn't have made it. If there is to be any complaint made here, it's that this allows any Warframe to bring infinite ammo for any weapon, including Archguns (I'm not actually complaining about this, just pointing out that this would've been a better avenue of attack). 

4. Balance hasn't been present in Warframe for long time, possibly its entire lifespan. Besides in a PvE game it's largely irrelevant anyway. Just so long as nothing is so completely outmoded by another that it is the only thing used. None of the abilities here do that.

 

(This system will have an overall positive impact on the game, allowing people to further personalize their Warframes, and allowing for fun and interesting combinations. The antithesis of 'killing everything')

 

Now that I've finished countering/mocking this comment, I'll say that I won't be responding to any replies, since I don't check notifications here anyway, and that most of the replies will be from this dude or other Quasars, infamous for their stubbornness. This comment is more for the benefit of anyone else who read the quoted one and believes it.

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14 minutes ago, Gurpgork said:

Frames like Saryn have a way of inflicting their playstyle on the entire party, because they can pretty easily turn the whole mission into a walking simulator for the whole party. 

I don't have a problem with someone playing their way. I do have a problem with it if their playstyle comes at the expense of mine. 

These comments are hard for me to wrap my mind around. Are you seriously implying that this is a big deal? I've encountered a lot of Bramma users and typically employ a strategy that I call "go the other way and kill enemies somewhere else". If that doesn't work, the mission is over in 5 minutes and I get to start fresh with xp, focus, and items that that dirty nuke using player HELPED ME acquire.  

And before you try to regale me with stories about how its the same in every session, I have been playing this game for years and know that you're 100% exaggerating.

The majority of us, myself included, stumble upon overpowered builds every now and then. Its actually the whole appeal of this game, its all about those numbers. We enjoy those OP builds for a while and maybe even have the audacity to ruin other player's experiences by using them in pubs. But, they get boring and we try to find a more interesting combo of weapons and gear. So who cares? It changes all the time. This is just the latest in a long line of changes. 

Whatever build you're so worried about will get old in a week. But yes, people will use them, and inflict their disgusting playstyle upon you. 

If you hate it so much, do a solo, invite only, or friend only match.

You don't get to decide how strangers play.  

Edited by (NSW)StoneGhost
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Hey, now that mag's pull is getting some "attention".. could we see it getting potentially buffed? Not the CC, but it's energy drop mechanic

Right now, pull only works on targets that DIE for the ability, and, considering that it deals magnetic damage, the damage is even worse. From level 30 and up, this ability is not able to kill nearly anything on it's own, and you waste more energy trying to kill something than you get from a orb (without modifiers)

I Propose that, Mag's pull will now debuff enemies for a set amount of time (not affected by duration) and if that enemy dies, they have a extra chance of droping a orb. Doing so will make mag's caster status a bit more consistent, as she needs to use a lot of her powers consistently. And to make is more balanced, lower the base chance of droping to 10% or 12%, still scaling with power strength.

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11 minutes ago, (PS4)The-AngryMan said:

For the most part this seems good or balanced with the exception of a couple issues.

1. The choice of Eclipse doesn't seem like a good move. Swapping Eclipse with other damage buff abilities like Roar is a false equivalency that doesn't even come close to balancing this.

- Damage buff abilities are not just flat amount buffs like Roar or Eclipse. Damage buffing comes in different ways like armor reduction (Seeking Shuriken), scaling damage (Smite), or Mesa's Peace Maker and other exalted weapons that are effectively damage buffs because it offers incredibly high dps over standard weapons, and Peace Maker is an aim bot.

- Eclipse is not just a damage buff ability. It's the most powerful damage buff ability in the game. Any Rhino would gladly ditch Roar for Eclipse. Ivara can sit inside an invisible bubble in a light area with Eclipse damage buff, or a Mesa aim botting everything with 500% extra damage.

- Eclipse can provide 95% damage reduction also.

Eclipse is Mirage's most powerful ability. It's the frame's greatest contribution to a team. Giving away Eclipse severely reduces Mirage's appeal or usefulness.

If you keep Eclipse in the Helminth system you can pretty much call this update the "Everyone gets Eclipse update (besides a few poorly selected victims because logic)"

Proposed solution: Give her 2 instead or heavily nerf Eclipse (thus nerfing Mirage in the process and unnecessarily reducing the farme's appeal). I would go with the former.

2. Second issue is Ivara's invisibility quiver. A Mesa or Titania sitting inside an invisibility bubble seems to encourage inactive play styles and discourage teamwork play. This may also cause some balance issues.

Other than these two, I think this is going to bring a lot of creative ideas. I always wanted to use Hildryn and Protea with an electric Elemental Ward. I can finally test this.

I prefer roar honestly. I’d have preferred mirages one. 4 rhinos with roar and iron skins. Seems nice and probably broken. 4 chromas defiently a show stopper. With roar I don’t have to run into the light or dark I get it everywhere and so does my party. 

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vor einer Stunde schrieb (PS4)IceRuneKnight:

How about stop crying about things that seem "broken"... There are players out there that play sometimes 6h of survival so don't judge when you yourself dont play such long runs. This whole crap about "nerf this and nerf that" is the reason why many veterans stop playing. For them such long runs are thrilling. Testing out how long you can go with frames solo or in a good team.

So stop ruining the fun for these people with your nerfing crap before it even starts. You should just test it first before you should criticize it. 

This threat is about feedback to their ideas,so in fact I am supposed to criticize/give feedback now,also I am ONE of those players unknown.pngunknown.png

 

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3 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

"REBUILD SHIELDS"

"Instantly restore shields."

Why choose this, when I can subsume Harrow's Condemn or Hildryn's Pillage? The only time this ability would appear to win out is if there are no enemies around...but if there are no enemies around, why wouldn't I just wait for the shields to recharge? 

Is there something more to this ability that this little "blurb" failed to mention, or is it really that one-dimensional?

 

 

3 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

"PERSPICACITY"

"Your next hack will be automatic."

I just don't see the value in ever picking this ability up. Ciphers perform this action everywhere except for Sorties and Arbitrations for a relatively negligible upfront cost. And there isn't any content that requires console hacking at a high enough rate to justify sacrificing an entire ability slot to do so quickly.

 

 

Honestly, all the Helminth-born abilities look incredibly lackluster to me. I hope I am wrong when it comes to their actual application...but if I'm not, keep this in mind: They are competing internally with subsumed abilities, and externally with all Warframe abilities. If you cannot find a way for them to effectively compete, they might not be worth keeping around as Warframe abilities.

Edited by MasterBurik
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3 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

"REBUILD SHIELDS"

"Instantly restore shields."

....Oh.....Ohhh noooooo........

Depending on the cost.....this could seriously go places.......op places......

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vor 1 Stunde schrieb VGS038:

 

 

Oh game's too easy for you huh? Well then, get an MK-1 stuff and go for Steel Path, please Tenshin a bit

Aside maybe from the Boss fights its not even that hard to do Steelpath with MK-1 Stuff to be quite honest with you.

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3 hours ago, --Q--Candy said:

This is incorrect. You have stuff like Volt - Shock there. With the Augment this is a crazy Ability to increase dmg. Can we get a limitation there too?

Shuriken + Seekign Shuriken = Remove Armor from all enemies... Now even grineer are a joke like all other factions.
Rest & Rage = Now you can bee your own Sleep Equinox to power level / fokus farm.
Nourish = Extremly strong toxin buff. The quote from above applies here.
Smite + Smite Infusion = Same thing as the Quote applies here and it even has scaling dmg...
Dispensary = Endless Energy for all Warframes.... This doesnt seem broken at all...

This system needs Heavy Nerfs and active maintenance.This has the potential to kill the balance in this game forever. If it will be relased like this and wont get balanced very often you can say goodbye to all sorts of Balance in this game.
I hope that you will do something about this, else we can say goodbye to ever have any challenge in this game.

 

(Shutout to the comment from --Q--FSK41 a few posts down. This System will kill everything)

Okay so let me unpack this. 

All this update/workshop is, is DE confirming that Warframe is ment to be a power fantasy more than anything else. 

This was also their solution to, alternatively giving us kit-frame, which would have led to there only being the 1 god frame and every one else below it. 

Additionally the balance of the game at MR 18+ is drastically different than balance below it. So different that it honestly doesn't matter what a player uses, because a slightly diversified loadout will always out perform the available content. This makes balance a moot point.

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1 minute ago, (NSW)StoneGhost said:

These comment are hard for me to wrap my mind around. Are you seriously implying that this is a big deal? I've encountered a lot of Bramma users and typically employ a strategy that I call "go the other way and kill enemies somewhere else". If that doesn't work, the mission is over in 5 minutes and I get to start fresh with xp, focus, and items that that dirty nuke using player HELPED ME acquire.  

And before you try to regale me with stories about how its the same in every session, I have been playing this game for year and know that you're exaggerating.

The majority of us, myself included, stumble upon overpowered builds. We enjoy them for a while and maybe even have the audacity to ruin other player's experiences by using them in pubs. But, they get boring and we try to find a more interesting combo of weapons and gear. So who cares? It changes all the time. 

If you hate it so much, do a solo, invite only, or friend only match.

You don't get to decide how strangers play.  

I assume you also defended people slide-attacking in a corner with atterax through walls?

Because they used literally the exact same justifications to argue against that being nerfed.

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3 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

"COMPANION HEAL"

"Heal your companion and call it to your side."

Does this mean we'll eventually have some way of giving orders to our pets? Say yes, say yes, pretty please with a cherry on top?

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Lol you can really tell who just instantly skipped over everything and went straight for the List of abilities that are being subsumbed. because they are commenting on the borkenness of having 2 damage buff abilities even tho is states in the post you can only have 1 damage buff per frame.

This is why you read through everything folks. 

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vor 1 Stunde schrieb -A-N-T-:

 

Imagine crying and begging the devs for nerfs for a system that hasn't even dropped yet in a PVE GAME.

Imagine being an inaros main coz u die all the time to the *PVE* enemies if you use something else

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7 minutes ago, cpl_loki said:

To further cut down on "being locked out of MR locked content", maybe, just maybe, build up to it? (not sure where this general feedback should go)

the second dream, you had to be mr3. 
the war within you had to be mr5. 
the sacrifice quest had no mr attached to it, just that you finished the chains of harrow and apostasy.
you couldn't spawn kuva liches without having the war within done, which still leaves you at mr5. 
the New War - Railjack had mr requirement of mr10 because of needing paracesis to use on the red crystal in veil proxima 
but they removed it when the scarlet spear event dropped which brings you back to mr5 being the lowest needed. 
steel path is not mr locked except for tier 6 bounty for earth and venus that required you to be mr10 but if you were taxied into the bounty, you got around needing that, that leaves you still mr5 as the lowest mr requirement. 

so essentially the story content (is HoD story? or sidequest?) jumped from 5 to 15, instead of just 10 to 15. 

so the argument comes from, why should it be mr15 locked when mr10, or some below, can do steel path and others without being carried (and i know mr15's that were carried by lower and higher mr to get through their steel path)? what actually constitutes as experience? there was no build up for the giant leap from 5 to 15. does that make sense? 

agreed. we shouldn't shut new players out of new content by mr locking it  so high. mr 10 would be reasonable because you CAN undo any ability changes.

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