The Helminth: Dev Workshop

[(PSN)Prooomz]

Just now, selig_fay said:

Well, this is already a gameplay moment. Maybe I want something aesthetic. Like slow Lentz or Ogris.

Err use ensnare I guess

[selig_fay]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Prooomz said:

Err use ensnare I guess

I just remembered that Torid exists. Oh, this is going to be fun. 

[(XBOX)MetalxPhoenix]

9 minutes ago, selig_fay said:

I don't think it's a lot to spend on this slot ability. As I said, the larva is a higher priority for me, because the ability to deal damage to 10 enemies at once is much better than +100% damage to 1 enemy.

Roar also buffs abilities though not just weapons though. You and your abilities deal more damage so not necessary dealing damage to just 1 enemy only, everything you do will deal x2 damage at 100% Roar and some abilities can become nuke.

I stomp nuke Hydron to wave 15 without issue thanks to Roar. But to each their own. Is there really any frame in the game that would choose some okay-but-not-astounding CC or utility over the ability to just flat-out deal more damage and presumably directly contribute to clearing a mission faster?

Larva can be an exception since I know thats an amazing CC in the first place.

[(PSN)Prooomz]

Just now, selig_fay said:

I just remembered that Torid exists. Oh, this is going to be fun. 

Ensnare does seem really fun bunches up enemies and they take 2x damage and are immobilized ooft

[(PSN)DeFuerza]

29 minutes ago, (PS4)psykenmo said:

Man, the warframe community is so messed up. DE adds a truly amazing custumization option on top of an already amazing mod system, and there's still people throwing a fit because our WARframes are going to be broken and too powerful. Get over yourselves already. How can the game actually grow if people want limitations on everything? Does anyone play skyrim and stop using certain spells because your destruction magic is too powerful??? No, the whole point of a game like this is for every player to customize as much as possible giving every player more FREEDOM to play their own style. You can get all pissy about seeing this option, but nobody says you have to partake in any of it. One thing you are forgetting is that some of us (like myself) do virtually everything solo and this will be a game changer to not have to squad up to get other's buffs/ usefulness. I know we all complain about things in this or any game really, but this will be able to push players to go even further and push their limitations. The best you can do is adapt. Not gonna lie I've been pissed at warframe several times over the years, but its never stopped me from playing. Hated the cursor change (sucked it up and adapted) hated the xoris change (started using naramon more) hated ember's rework (still slightly salty) but overall other games don't even compare to this one. I think we all as player's should appreciate the hard work DE does for us and if you just want to complain about every little change before you even get to test it out, than this probally isn't the game for you. 

In general, I agree with your statement here, I feel more or less the same. I would not attribute this to the overall community, though, just the vocal minority.

[Cpl_Facehugger]

14 minutes ago, Hardenum said:

On 2020-08-12 at 1:27 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

 

Excuse me, is this Mastery discrimination necessary? Mastery Rank is a weak measure of experience. I've been playing warframe since 2016 and I am proud of the fact that I have a low Mastery(MR10), I just don't support mindlessly grinding mastery fodders for some stupid points. Now I can't enjoy this awesome content? Is that what you're telling me?

So... Wait. You want to participate in a system that revolves around melting down warframes (which give mastery) to give their powers to other warframes without levelling your mastery rank? The best way to benefit from this system is having a broad stable of warframes, which would naturally lead to having MR15 or greater. This seems like a really silly complaint, akin to asking why ammo mutation mods don't do anything for swords.

[(PSN)Shaun-T-Wilson]

17 minutes ago, Hardenum said:

Excuse me, is this Mastery discrimination necessary? Mastery Rank is a weak measure of experience. I've been playing warframe since 2016 and I am proud of the fact that I have a low Mastery(MR10), I just don't support mindlessly grinding mastery fodders for some stupid points. Now I can't enjoy this awesome content? Is that what you're telling me?

Most rpg games use a leveling or progresson system to lock content or abilities. The reason is offend to motivate player to improve or prgress in the game. Warframe uses tests to see proven ability and rewards those who pass. For most of the content/quests DE has low MR requirements so new players can if there prepared enough to enjoy. Helmith system is for the experienced(Proven) players to use and is not noob friendly. For your case it will take min of 5 days to reach mr15, assuming you have the skill to pass the tests.

[TypeZeroEmiya]

Like the new system? Use it and try as many combinations as you want to.

Don’t like the new system? Don’t use it.

Thinking people using the new system will ruin your fun? Play solo or uninstall the game.

Choice is simple. Don’t complain here. I don’t care about your complaints, and neither do many people.

[selig_fay]

9 minutes ago, (PS4)Prooomz said:

Ensnare does seem really fun bunches up enemies and they take 2x damage and are immobilized ooft

If I'm not mistaken, this is because the synergy with Khora 1. The weapon does not take additional damage from this.

9 minutes ago, (XB1)MetalxPhoenix said:

I stomp nuke Hydron to wave 15 without issue thanks to Roar. But to each their own. Is there really any frame in the game that would choose some okay-but-not-astounding CC or utility over the ability to just flat-out deal more damage and presumably directly contribute to clearing a mission faster?

It's just that people choose the way they play.

Some people focus on killing with abilities, but you know, I don't think Garuda with Roar will be much more effective than without Roar. This also has its own aspects.

On the other hand, I focus on weapons. People think that the damage buff is the only way out for weapons, but I think otherwise, because here you need to look at the situation. If a weapon does AOE damage, then it is logical that it will benefit from a large group of enemies more than the usual damage boost. If the weapon is an ammo eater, I want to see how the ammo efficiency ability will work, because it's showing up very well on Titania right now. Well, the dispenser is also a better choice for an ammo eater, because your damage boost is useless if you don't have ammo, you know? On the other hand, I'm very interested in the AOE things that Helmith offers, because a powerful sniper rifle shot that will trigger an AOE is not bad, you know. Again, I think it might be better than a normal damage boost in most situations. But here again, we need to see how it works.

I'm not saying that damage boost is bad. I say that there are really so many good alternatives that I would rather not put it on than use it on all frames.

[Shinzann]

On 2020-08-12 at 11:27 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Warframes that are Subsumed join the Helminth in an eternal bond. They will live on in a Lotus flower that matches the colours of the Subsumed Warframe, as a permanent honor. See below for an example of the Helminth garden after 5 Subsumes:

 

  Hide contents

 

Has it been established which colours from the subsumed Warframes are going to be be used for the flowers? My apologies if this has already asked and asnwered.

[(XBOX)MetalxPhoenix]

5 minutes ago, selig_fay said:

If I'm not mistaken, this is because the synergy with Khora 1. The weapon does not take additional damage from this.

It's just that people choose the way they play.

Some people focus on killing abilities, but you know, I don't think Garuda with Roar will be much more effective than without Roar. This also has its own aspects.

On the other hand, I focus on weapons. People think that the damage buff is the only way out for weapons, but I think otherwise, because here you need to look at the situation. If a weapon does AOE damage, then it is logical that it will benefit from a large group of enemies more than the usual damage boost. If the weapon is an ammo eater, I want to see how the ammo efficiency ability will work, because it's showing up very well on Titania right now. Well, the dispenser is also a better choice for an ammo eater, because your damage boost is useless if you don't have ammo, you know? On the other hand, I'm very interested in the AOE things that Helmith offers, because a powerful sniper rifle shot that will trigger an AOE is not bad, you know. Again, I think it might be better than a normal damage boost in most situations. But here again, we need to see how it works.

I'm not saying that damage boost is bad. I say that there are really so many good alternatives that I would rather not put it on than use it on all frames.

I understand I'm jumping into conclusions about everyone using Roar. However, let people experiment for like the first month and eventually everyone will just turn to the same 5 or so universally good abilities like Roar, Warcry, Larva, Dispenser everything else is going to left behind except for the niche use. It's pretty obvious those are prime outliers and most will pick the best from the system.

[selig_fay]

14 minutes ago, (XB1)MetalxPhoenix said:

I understand I'm jumping into conclusions about everyone using Roar. However, let people experiment for like the first month and eventually everyone will just turn to the same 5 or so universally good abilities like Roar, Warcry, Larva, Dispenser everything else is going to left behind except for the niche use. It's pretty obvious those are prime outliers and most will pick the best from the system.

This is already a problem of how DE will balance abilities relative to each other. I'd rather they buff the weak things began to change than nerf the ability because the current list is fine with me. But there are some problems, I'm not arguing. Molt is much more resilient than Decoy for example.

[Ixlix_C]

Hmm. In the provided list I see at least one ability with (Hydron-)nuking capabilities.

Now let's put it on any frame which can easy recharge energy for itself (Trinity, Harrow, Garuda).

I think it could be devastating... for the eyes and morality of my occasional teammates.

 

[(XBOX)Bosskiller44834]

On 2020-08-13 at 3:27 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

THE HELMINTH: DEV WORKSHOP.

Tenno the time has come for our comprehensive Dev Workshop on The Helminth System (formerly known as ‘Helminth Chrysalis System, we reduced the name length for ‘Mouth’feel)! This Dev Workshop is subject to change, but here is everything you need to know about THE HELMINTH!

We debuted this system at TennoCon 2020 - rewatch here:

https://youtu.be/KoKO1nAk0MQ?t=1693

The Helminth System is an expansion of the Helminth room on your Orbiter - you may only know this room as an infested space that allows you to remove the Helminth Cyst. With the ‘Heart of Deimos’ Update, that’s all changing. The Helminth system enables you to customize your Warframes by infusing new Abilities in place of existing Abilities.

How does it work?
To participate in the Helminth, you must obtain the ‘Helminth Segment’. This is acquired in the Heart of Deimos in the Entrati Syndicate and is then installed on your Orbiter in the Helminth Room to begin your Helminth journey!

Once ready, there are 2 key things this System offers:

- You can replace 1 Ability per Warframe.
- Every Warframe can be Subsumed to permanently provide 1 specific Ability to Helminth.


Who is this for?
We consider this a customization system for very experienced Warframe players (Mastery Rank 15 Prerequisite). We do not intend to let newer players unlock this system. We intentionally placed the Segment deep into progression to ensure only experienced players could access the Segment and begin their journey with Helminth.


What are Resources / Secretions?
Virtually every Resource you’ve ever earned can be fed to Helminth - your stockpiles have a new home! This Feeding creates SECRETIONS, which allow you to utilize the Helminth for Ability customization.
Helminth has a diverse appetite - make sure you feed Helminth Resources they want to eat to get the best Secretion results! Your choices on what you’ve fed Helminth will determine its willingness to reward secretions - change it up for best results!
 

Permanent?
Infused Abilities are removable with the click of a button - they will stay within a given Warframe as long as you decide you want it!

Subsuming a Warframe is permanent  - only Subsume Warframes you are sure you do not want to play with. You can always re-earn or re-buy a subsumed Warframe.

 

Do Configurations matter?
You can deeply customize by only replacing Abilities on certain Configurations, as seen in the Demo! But we would like to expand this further to demonstrate just how deep you can go.

You can have 1 different Ability infused PER config!

So if you have Excalibur in the chair - you could put Shock on Configuration A, Molt on Configuration B, and Firewalker on Configuration C!

For example, if you wanted Shock applied to Excalibur on Configuration A but wanted Configuration B and Configuration C to stay default with Slash Dash, you can do so!

 

What does Ranking Helminth do?
As you feed and use the Helminth system, you will rank up! Each Rank unlocks something different - from a new power, to more Subsume Slots (max Rank Helminth = unlimited Subsume Slots), make sure you progress through the Ranks by regularly Feeding Helminth, Subsuming, and Infusing your Warframes! 

What are the Helminth Abilities?
Helminth Provides unique abilities of their own - these are subject to change before launch, but here is the current list:
 

"EMPOWER"

"Increase the power strength of your next ability."
 

“ENERGY MUNITIONS"

"Imbue your weapons with ammo efficiency."
 

"INFESTED MOBILITY"

"Increase your sprint and parkour speed."
 

"MARKED FOR DEATH"

“Stun an enemy, next damage you deal to it, will be dealt to all enemies around it."
 

"REBUILD SHIELDS"

"Instantly restore shields."
 

"PERSPICACITY"

"Your next hack will be automatic."
 

"COMPANION HEAL"

"Heal your companion and call it to your side."
 

"EXPEDITE SUFFERING"

"Hit enemies in a cone, affected enemies will have their Bleed and Toxin status removed and their remaining damage dealt in a burst."


What is Infusion?
Infusion is the process of injecting a Warframe with an Ability - whether it be one of Helminth’s own, or another Warframes. Every Warframe can receive 1 Infused ability at a time in any Ability slot (i.e you could place Shock on any of the 4 Ability slots). 

 

What is Subsuming? 
In addition to Helminth’s own Abilities, you can Subsume a Warframe to obtain 1 specific Ability permanently in Helminth’s memory (list below). We do not allow the Subsuming of any Prime Warframes, but you can Infuse Abilities on Prime Warframes! 

Subsuming is the act of permanently providing a base Warframe into the Helminth’s biology. 1 Warframe can be subsumed every 23 hours. The Warframe can be any Rank. 

What Abilities are earned on Subsuming a Warframe?

The following table outlines the current Ability a given Warframe will provide on the Subsume action. This is subject to change before launch. 

WARFRAME	ABILITY	AUGMENT	DEV NOTES
Ash	Shuriken	Seeking Shuriken
Atlas	Petrify	Ore Gaze	We will not create Rubble.
Banshee	Silence	Savage Silence
Baruuk	Lull	Endless Lullaby
Chroma	Elemental Ward	Everlasting Ward
Ember	Fire Blast	Healing Flame
Equinox	Rest & Rage	Calm & Frenzy	We will use Rest or Rage depending on your Energy Colour.
Excalibur	Radial Blind	Radiant Finish
Frost	Ice Wave	Ice Wave Impede
Gara	Spectrorage	Spectrosiphon
Garuda	Blood Altar	n/a
Gauss	Thermal Sunder	n/a
Grendel	Nourish	n/a	Keeps the heal and give Nourish Strike only.
Harrow	Condemn	Tribunal
Hildryn	Pillage	Blazing Pillage	Drains 50 Energy instead of 50 Shield.
Hydroid	Tempest Barrage	Corroding Barrage
Inaros	Desiccation	Desiccation’s Curse
Ivara	Quiver	Empowered Quiver	Tap Cloak, Hold Noise. Augment only affects Cloak and Dashwire.
Khora	Ensnare	n/a
Limbo	Banish	Rift Haven	Base Ability Change: Add ‘Cancel ability on Hold’ to let enemies out of Rift.
Loki	Decoy	Savior Decoy
Mag	Pull	Greedy Pull
Mesa	Shooting Gallery	Muzzle Flash
Mirage	Eclipse	Total Eclipse
Nekros	Terrify	Creeping Terrify
Nezha	Fire Walker	Pyroclastic Flow
Nidus	Larva	Larva Burst
Nova	Null Star	Neutron Star
Nyx	Mind Control	Mind Freak
Oberon	Smite	Smite Infusion
Octavia	Resonator	Conductor
Protea	Dispensary	n/a
Revenant	Reave	Blinding Reave
Rhino	Roar	Piercing Roar
Saryn	Molt	Regen Molt
Titania	Spellbind	Spellbound Harvest
Trinity	Well Of Life	Pool of Life	Base Ability Buffed - Now does small amount of heal over time over a large range. If you hit the enemy, a % of the damage dealt gets converted into AoE heal.
Valkyr	Warcry	Eternal War
Vauban	Tesla Nervos	Tesla Bank
Volt	Shock	Shock Trooper
Wisp	Breach Surge	n/a
Wukong	Defy	n/a
Xaku	Xata’s Whisper	n/a
Zephyr	Airburst	n/a	Base Ability Buffed - now has a HOLD or TAP functionality. HOLD to receive original functionality. TAP to suck enemies in a wind Vortex.

What are my safeguards?

Since you can remove an Ability at any time with the click of a button, you’ll be able to safely experiment with many creative combinations.

For example, if you replace Grendel’s ‘1’, your kit doesn’t really work! If you change around or re-assign Abilities already assigned to Railjack Tactical use, you simply may not have one, or have a new one in its place! If you put Hildryn’s PIllage on Inaros, you don’t get Shields, but you do get diminished Armor/Shields on enemies on cast.

It’s all up to you - have fun experimenting, Tenno!

What about Damage buffing Abilities?

As you can see, we have two Abilities that increase damage: Mirage’s Eclipse, and Rhino’s Roar. We are creating a special case for these Abilities when infused on Warframes with similar Abilities (i.e Chroma, Mirage, Rhino, Octavia). When you infuse these, you will receive a prompt that you can only have 1 Damage Buffing ability at a time, and thus you are limited to replacing said ability type. Which is to say - Damage Buffing abilities can only be swapped with Damage Buffing Abilities on Warframes that already have them. However, that limitation does not apply to the other 30+ Warframes. 

 

What exactly is going on here with the Warframe Subsuming?

Warframes that are Subsumed join the Helminth in an eternal bond. They will live on in a Lotus flower that matches the colours of the Subsumed Warframe, as a permanent honor. See below for an example of the Helminth garden after 5 Subsumes:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Is ‘Helminth’ a permanent name?

Don’t like it? You can rename your Helminth at any time!

Is Helminth a Cat or Dog ‘Person’?

Well, you’ll find out… 

 

Thank you very much for reading our Dev Workshop on the upcoming Helminth Feature - see you in game on August 25 on all platforms!  

What happens if i want to change the ability i put on a frame with a different one

For example if put rhino's roar on umbra but i want to swap roar out for protea's dispensary

 

[selig_fay]

Just now, (XB1)Bosskiller44834 said:

What happens if i want to change the ability i put on a frame with a different one

For example if put rhino's roar on umbra but i want to swap roar out for protea's dispensary

You put as you like. There are no restrictions here.

[(XBOX)Bosskiller44834]

Just now, selig_fay said:

You put as you like. There are no restrictions here.

So i change it as many times as i want 

 

[Sahansral]

vor 35 Minuten schrieb TypeZeroEmiya:

Like the new system? Use it and try as many combinations as you want to.

Don’t like the new system? Don’t use it.

Thinking people using the new system will ruin your fun? Play solo or uninstall the game.

Choice is simple. Don’t complain here. I don’t care about your complaints, and neither do many people.

Yeah, that „argument“ 🤨

Following that school of thought, Warframe would have already lost its playerbase due to old Bladestorm, Blessing, Inferno, Magnetize, Molecular Prime, Miasma, Miraculor, Sound Wave, Rivens without disposition system and Naramon endless invisibility.

In each and every of this cases people expressed concerns about the impact of these things on the gaming experience. And in hindsight those people were right. What you call „complaints“, helped to keep this game alive. 

The majority of people like the system and are excited. There are a handful of abilities that will cause much trouble though and DE should really think twice about giving out these 5-6 abilities.

[selig_fay]

1 minute ago, Sahansral said:

Yeah, that „argument“ 🤨

Following that school of thought, Warframe would have already lost its playerbase due to old Bladestorm, Blessing, Inferno, Magnetize, Molecular Prime, Miasma, Miraculor, Rivens without disposition system and Naramon endless invisibility.

In each and every of this cases people expressed concerns about the impact of these things on the gaming experience. And in hindsight those people were right. What you call „complaints“, helped to keep this game alive.

The majority of people like the system and are excited. There are a handful of abilities that will cause much trouble though and DE should really think twice about giving out these 5-6 abilities.

People point their fingers at the sky and say it's bad. The fact that naramon was strong is no secret to anyone. But it was strong because it gave you invisibility. And invisibility frames are still strong in this regard. In fact, this nerf didn't solve anything. Instead, invisibility was supposed to get a nerf, but people kept quiet about it. No, nerf only got naramon while invisibility remained a problem. And you worry about that? I'm not.

On the other hand, a lot of negative things have been said about healing objects. DE nerf it, but it literally didn't solve anything. Also remember that the dangerous weapon was removed from the game and replaced with a soft CC. This made the weapon more powerful and so some people started to resent it. And I am very glad that DE did not listen to these people. Like I said, people are just pointing fingers at the sky. 

[Claric]

7 hours ago, kusanagikyo said:

Hmm i bet that i gonna see alot of players using roar and it gonna get a nerf really soon. Lot of frame have strong ability by it own and now ppl will using roar to buff it more.

Roar doesn't stack with other instances of roar. So 3/4 people in a group full of subsumed roars are gonna be -1 useful ability. How does this warrant a nerf?

[kgabor]

6 minutes ago, Claric said:

Roar doesn't stack with other instances of roar. So 3/4 people in a group full of subsumed roars are gonna be -1 useful ability. How does this warrant a nerf?

Inb4 people with subsumed Roars will not stack the buff not because of this, but because they still press 2 to use Iron Skin instead.

This needs to be a meme.

[Mingtzu]

This reminds me of Marvel Heroes and Rogues power steal ability. On paper it sounded SO awesome but then you find out you don't get the cooler, more wanted, skills and then it just seems O.K.. That is exactly what this is for me. They gave most of the skills I don't use and so won't really ever use this feature. I will eventually unlock this feature but will only use it on frames that I don't use all their skills like Octavia or Loki.

I give it a 10 for hype but 5 for what it actually does. It does seem some players are really excited for this so I'll give it a 10 just for them. I know balancing would be even more of a nightmare with access to ALL the available skills but it would have been insanely fun imo if that happened. I always say that fun > balance. All skills available would have been fun.

To each their own.

 

EDIT: Skills I would've liked to see instead, for funs sake, would've been Wukong's Celestial Twin, Inaros's Devour, Vauban's Minelayer or Photon Strike, Octavia's Mallet, Nekros's Shadows of the Dead, or Mirage's Slight of Hand or Prism. Would love to have a twin run around with ANY of my frames or shadow copies of fallen enemies. While skills I can throw down a hallway to cover my back is just as good. 

[sirz_benjie]

On 2020-08-12 at 3:04 PM, 0_The_F00l said:

Noticed there are combnations of DR (kinda ?) abilities as well as Damage boost abilities

You have highlighted limitation on stacking damage boost , but no limitation on stacking DR ?

- also sneaky sneaky many abilities can be considered damage boost with the right context , will there be a list of what will be conisdered damage boost ? i assume nyx absorb , mesa gallery, equinox metamorphosis are included though players dont really use it for teh damage buff? 

That Roar is gonna be causing all sorts of balancing problems i reckon, but then again , it will let me replace many of the dumb abilities on some frames.

 

 

Stacking damage reduction doesn't seem to matter when there are abilities that make frames invulnerable (like completely invulnerable).

[Hardenum]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Shaun-T-Wilson said:

Most rpg games use a leveling or progresson system to lock content or abilities. The reason is offend to motivate player to improve or prgress in the game. Warframe uses tests to see proven ability and rewards those who pass. For most of the content/quests DE has low MR requirements so new players can if there prepared enough to enjoy. Helmith system is for the experienced(Proven) players to use and is not noob friendly. For your case it will take min of 5 days to reach mr15, assuming you have the skill to pass the tests.

  I don't support mindless grinding. 

1 hour ago, Cpl_Facehugger said:

So... Wait. You want to participate in a system that revolves around melting down warframes (which give mastery) to give their powers to other warframes without levelling your mastery rank? The best way to benefit from this system is having a broad stable of warframes, which would naturally lead to having MR15 or greater. This seems like a really silly complaint, akin to asking why ammo mutation mods don't do anything for swords.

What if I'm only interested in 2-3 abilities? Ever thought of that? Or I'm only allowed to play the game the way 90% of the people play it?

[(PSN)Shaun-T-Wilson]

31 minutes ago, (XB1)Bosskiller44834 said:

So i change it as many times as i want 

 

Theres a resource cost of each infusion, but yes.

[selig_fay]

4 minutes ago, Hardenum said:

I don't support mindless grinding.

Then what are you doing in a warframe?