Locked out of content - "AGAIN?"

[Berserkerkitten]

I reckon this whole thing would go down better if MR wasn't DE's way to gauge player "experience" and "knowledge". Things like overall kills, time spent in missions, mod ranks, used forma, lots of things which require players to spend time using game mechanics that go beyond raising gear to rank 30, don't factor into MR at all. I think that's unfortunate. While I don't believe it's particularly difficult to get to MR15, there are clearly players, who spend massive amounts of time playing the game, yet never raising MR at all. Again, easy enough to raise one's MR a bit for the sake of accessing content, but it's unfortunate MR is solely tied to ranking up a bunch of stuff and nothing else.

[Tsukinoki]

10 hours ago, Krankbert said:

Honestly, there is only one actual solution for people who think their time spent on this game isn't worth it, and that's for them to go away and stop playing a game they don't like to play.

Hey if they did that then who would they have to complain to that the game is so horrible and a terrible grind that no one should find fun and that everyone else is wrong for not being angry about the same things they are?

6 hours ago, Sahansral said:

The entitlement is real.

"I demand both the right to ignore 80% of the game without any negative consequences and also easy access to all the stuff I choose without any requirement that would discomfort me."

For players like the OP, I want cool, non-cosmetic stuff locked behind things like progression in codex scans or kurias.  

I would love for there to be more reasons to raise MR to high levels.
I mean so many of the people complaining about these MR locks go "But there is no reason to have high MR!   How dare DE add in some reasons to have a higher MR!"

5 hours ago, zanzibar9 said:

DE never gave us incentive to attain high MR

And so because DE never gave an incentive before they aren't allowed to add incentives now?

I mean seriously what is that logic?
"They didn't do this before so they can't ever do it in the future!  It's just not fair!"

On 2020-08-14 at 10:08 AM, (PS4)goonie4good said:

No it won't, and since this thread is a little heated, let me preface this with I'm not here to start an argument with you. But have you considered just collecting those things and playing the game normally? Not everyone uses Hydron to fast level "garbage". Part of the fun for me was starting my own clan, gathering all the resources, building everything, leveling everything, even the stuff that sort of sucked through normal gameplay while going through the mountain of content we have available. To me that's how you learn the game, not going for the meta equipment and calling it a day. Seems to me like you're trying to sprint in a marathon. 

This actually mirrors some of my experiences in this game.
I've only ever played Hydron for one reason: To clear the node!

It's probably a huge shocker to players like the OP but there are people who actually like playing the game and trying new weapons!

I've rarely even used ESO for power-leveling gear....I actually like playing the game with my weapons and leveling them by using them instead of just AFK farming.  And hek, I've found a decent number of weapons that I've enjoyed playing with that I would never have thought I would like if I hadn't spent the time just using it for a little bit.
And its not like leveling a weapon takes longer than 20-30 minutes, even if you have a full loadout equipped.

[Nezha_Rose]

This thread is something else. I also like that OP seems to target easily refutable points but ignores the rest of the post with valid points here. 

All of these problems can be outright ignored by having a high mr already. Or if youre a gimmick player (purposely keeping lower MR) you can get an alt account. And you *can* get an alt account. 

Question is: will be even worth to get an alt account for the "content".

[zanzibar9]

3 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Sorry but everything you just said was wrong. You can level a frame in minutes if you want to, or do it passively in just one or two runs by just walking in a circle collecting resources, while someone else does the killing. That's not a barrier to anyone. 

Having limited time to play is a thing, but really, at some point we have to step back and ask 'is me having limited time something that is their fault?' And the obvious answer is, no it's not. 

Rivens, higher standing caps for your syndicates, higher void reactant cap, greater daily rewards, higher starting mod capacity on rank zero items... 

🤔

So uh... No incentive, you say? None at all? 

1. Everything i said was wrong? The whole post was wrong? Really? So is it wrong that there are other ways to determine whether a player is "experience player" or not? Can you only determine it through MR? There is no other way? Oh god, lol. Tell that to veteran players who have 5-8 years account, see if most agree with you.

(btw, it's easy to nick picked a point while ignoring the whole argument. Such a cheap debate trick.)

2. Where in my post that i said that it is their fault? I only point out that there are other ways to make this system only for experience player, which if you still don't understand that i only disagreeing with DE on their "experience player" definition, which apparently is MR 15+ players. Because we all now, that MR 15 is the only thing that determined that whether a player is an experience one or not.

3. You can call that an incentives, i called that pittance. Is there no Rivens at lower MR? because i found many at MR 8-11. Higher starting mod on rank zero items? is that what you call a rewards? an incentives? Even though it matter not after you max rank it? Right.

1 hour ago, (PS4)Wil_Shatner_face said:

This is nonsense. I work 50 hour weeks, have a family, and mostly only play on the weekends and I’ve hit MR17 in about 7 months. You’re just not trying.

It is you, not me. I too have a wife and kids, i too have a business to run, but i don't spend my weekends to bored myself with boring grind. Especially, because there was no incentive before, beside the small pool of "end game" weapons. I played games to relieve myself from weekdays stress not to add S#&$ to it, mind you.

And of course i wasn't trying, have you not read my whole post? I was already said that my account was 3-4 years old and on that time, i only reach MR 11. So why no progression you would asked? because there was no incentive for me to reach higher ranks. no incentive = no rewards beside small pool of "end game" weapons, if you can even call it rewards. You can then make a conclusion that i, most of the time, play with the same frame, with the same weapon all those times. So is it wrong for me to ask for DE to lower the MR requirement so that it can make more sense progression wise? Rail Jack is locked behind what? MR 10? 11? so why the suddenly MR 15? If the whole reason for DE to do it is only for catering to more experience player. Why not make it more forgivable for us casual players? So that we can still enjoy the game while rank up our MR?

Hell, i even up, if let say DE lower it to MR 13, but it is locked progression wise. Say that at MR 13 you can only have the helminth original skills to add to your warframes. Say that at MR 14, you only can sacrifice (insert your number of choice here) of warframes, at MR 15, you can then enjoy the whole system. So, why not that?

The thing is, there are plenty other easily coded ways to cater it just for the experience players while not locking everything at MR 15.

One more things, the other reason why many are suddenly at arms with the MR 15 requirement is, because there are those who things that the only highlights about the whole Deimos expansion is this very systems, and a lot of people aren't happy that it was lock behind High MR, just because DE decided that MR 15 is the "experienced player" MR number.

[zanzibar9]

24 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

And so because DE never gave an incentive before they aren't allowed to add incentives now?

I mean seriously what is that logic?
"They didn't do this before so they can't ever do it in the future!  It's just not fair!"

And who said that DE can't EVER add incentives now? Where in my post that I said that? Care to point that to me? Where is your LOGIC when you spout that nonsense "They didn't do this before so they can't ever do it in the future!  It's just not fair!" when i clearly never said such a thing.

If your whole arguments is only to put words in my mouth when i never said so, then don't @ me anymore. Because i don't have times to have a childist debates with childish people.

My whole argument was, that DE shouldn't locked it at MR 15 while saying that it is for experience player only. When clearly that there are plenty other ways to lock it for experience player only beside MR. In case you still didn't get it here is a simpler way to put it: I don't agree with DE on MR 15 as experience measurement, but i'm up for a compromise that DE lower the MR requirement a bit, while adding other ways to prevent access of newer players, maybe by making it rank 30 warframe only that is available to be sacrifice, or make it more resource hungry since it have a diminishing return anyway.

[Enialyx]

My friendly advice is buying plat and buying inventory space.

The game is much more fun when you won't have to delete weapons and keep just those few weapons and frames. Leveling up stuff is far better when you can keep it. Helps with the development of the game too.

[zanzibar9]

48 minutes ago, Berserkerkitten said:

I reckon this whole thing would go down better if MR wasn't DE's way to gauge player "experience" and "knowledge". Things like overall kills, time spent in missions, mod ranks, used forma, lots of things which require players to spend time using game mechanics that go beyond raising gear to rank 30, don't factor into MR at all. I think that's unfortunate. While I don't believe it's particularly difficult to get to MR15, there are clearly players, who spend massive amounts of time playing the game, yet never raising MR at all. Again, easy enough to raise one's MR a bit for the sake of accessing content, but it's unfortunate MR is solely tied to ranking up a bunch of stuff and nothing else.

Thanks for seeing where this whole arguments came from.

Well for me though, why we are up  in arms is because we felt left behind, we too are customer of DE (some are paying customer too), can't we have our opinions? Maybe OP didn't get his/her opinion acrosed because he was shrouded in angger and can be seen as childish whining to others. But, is it suddenly make his opinion invalid?

For myself personally, i want to prevent myself from burning out like many others, when my limited weekends is spent only to grind for a month or two. I didn't say that i wouldn't do it. But there are those who want to experience the new system while not burning out (maybe for 2nd or more times).

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

12 minutes ago, zanzibar9 said:

1. Everything i said was wrong? The whole post was wrong? Really? So is it wrong that there are other ways to determine whether a player is "experience player" or not? Can you only determine it through MR? There is no other way? Oh god, lol. Tell that to veteran players who have 5-8 years account, see if most agree with you.

(btw, it's easy to nick picked a point while ignoring the whole argument. Such a cheap debate trick.)

1, Did you miss the fact that I quoted a specific part of your post? I'm thinking that you did. Just as you seem to have missed quite a lot of what goes on in the game. 

Quote

2. Where in my post that i said that it is their fault? I only point out that there are other ways to make this system only for experience player, which if you still don't understand that i only disagreeing with DE on their "experience player" definition, which apparently is MR 15+ players. Because we all now, that MR 15 is the only thing that determined that whether a player is an experience one or not.

Not at all, but experienced players would have no significant difficulty in getting to MR 15. You literally only need one quarter of the available mastery points in the game to be eligible for the rank. 

Feel free to attempt justify the whole "people who have interacted with less than one quarter of the things that are available are still really, really, really experienced". 

Quote

3. You can call that an incentives, i called that pittance. Is there no Rivens at lower MR? because i found many at MR 8-11. Higher starting mod on rank zero items? is that what you call a rewards? an incentives? Even though it matter not after you max rank it? Right.

Sorry Mr Fox, doesn't matter if you want to call all the grapes sour, it doesn't make them sour. That sort of claim has been making folks like you look silly for over 2500 years since Aesop first told the fable. 

Finding low MR requirement rivens, doesn't make high MR requirement rivens cease to exist either. 

By the way, many of us do this thing called "adding forma" where we rank up the same weapon from zero repeatedly, and having a higher capacity at rank zero makes that far less annoying. 

 

So again what you're saying has so many things wrong with it that you should be ashamed of yourself. 

[Berserkerkitten]

vor 9 Minuten schrieb zanzibar9:

Well for me though, why we are up  in arms is because we felt left behind, we too are customer of DE (some are paying customer too), can't we have our opinions? Maybe OP didn't get his/her opinion acrosed because he was shrouded in angger and can be seen as childish whining to others. But, is it suddenly make his opinion invalid?

Eh, opinions are just that. Doesn't mean people have to agree with them. I don't, either. I don't like MR, but acting like it's such a massive hurdle to get to MR15 in this day and age is ridiculous. There are more warframes and weapons to level up than ever before, affinity boosters are a thing, even Steel Path contributes to MR a little bit. Besides, you won't be able to access Helminth Chrysalis without a massive grind, anyway, because it'll be tied to syndicates just like the gravimag was on Venus. MR is really the easiest part of it.

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

1 hour ago, Berserkerkitten said:

I reckon this whole thing would go down better if MR wasn't DE's way to gauge player "experience" and "knowledge". Things like overall kills, time spent in missions, mod ranks, used forma, lots of things which require players to spend time using game mechanics that go beyond raising gear to rank 30, don't factor into MR at all. I think that's unfortunate. While I don't believe it's particularly difficult to get to MR15, there are clearly players, who spend massive amounts of time playing the game, yet never raising MR at all. Again, easy enough to raise one's MR a bit for the sake of accessing content, but it's unfortunate MR is solely tied to ranking up a bunch of stuff and nothing else.

After awhile, all that accumulated knowledge and experience should make someone eventually just do some incredibly easy MR tests. They take the same time as a relic capture.

You're missing out on basically free plat by selling Vox Solaris arcanes.

 

[zanzibar9]

55 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

1, Did you miss the fact that I quoted a specific part of your post? I'm thinking that you did. Just as you seem to have missed quite a lot of what goes on in the game. 

Yes, i miss it. But, do you have reading comprehension? Because you still missed my whole point by only quoting my specific point while ignoring my whole argument. 

55 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Not at all, but experienced players would have no significant difficulty in getting to MR 15. You literally only need one quarter of the available mastery points in the game to be eligible for the rank. 

Feel free to attempt justify the whole "people who have interacted with less than one quarter of the things that are available are still really, really, really experienced". 

Sorry Mr Fox, doesn't matter if you want to call all the grapes sour, it doesn't make them sour. That sort of claim has been making folks like you look silly for over 2500 years since Aesop first told the fable. 

LMAO!!!!!!!! This guy, you only play after what? PoE? MR meant nothing to veteran of this game. And before you said that it does, then are you claiming that veteran of this game who have low MR is not an experience player on warframe? Right...

Are you there, when loki is the most meta frame in the game? are you there when invisible=invincible meta? No? well, then too bad. you have less experience than me then. There are plenty other example on how you have less experience in this game compare to those of that plays longer than you while having low MR.

By "Feel free to attempt justify the whole "people who have interacted with less than one quarter of the things that are available are still really, really, really experienced"." Then by your standard the only one who should have this system it the one that have interacted at least quarter+ of the in game content, no? what if it's MR 20, since it's half way up to MR 30. What if DE say that an experience player is those who have at least interacted with half of it? What if DE say that it's for MR 25 only. What would you say?

Because, my whole argument was that MR mean jack S#&$ to determine someone is experience or not.

55 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Finding low MR requirement rivens, doesn't make high MR requirement rivens cease to exist either. 

By the way, many of us do this thing called "adding forma" where we rank up the same weapon from zero repeatedly, and having a higher capacity at rank zero makes that far less annoying. 

 

So again what you're saying has so many things wrong with it that you should be ashamed of yourself. 

And what is the original points you bring the rivens? Because it was incentive to have High MR no? So to call it an incentive is a far fetch as a calling yourself an experience player, because clearly you didn't experience what is before september 2018, which is less than me.

And i do too have Forma'ed my weapons and warframes, what's your point? Do you think i never forma'ed my gears? Just FYI, i have forma'ed a standard loki 4x, vectis 3x, standard chroma 6x, arca plasmor 4x, venka prime 4x, nikana prime 3x, etc. And you know what? those forma aren't tied to our MR no?  so........ yeah. Do you honestly think bringing forma to this whole MR argument helping your point? Thanks for proving my point, because it only add more to mine, since it's a prove that, one need no high MR to be experience player since you can access any content with any weapon you have, specially since you have low level riven and since melee 3.0 gave us a fair playing field to many non-meta melee weapons before 3.0.

See how easy for me to turn around your flawed logic? If your whole argument is just that, a flawed logic, while not adding anything substantial, then good day, don't @ me anymore.

[zanzibar9]

39 minutes ago, Berserkerkitten said:

Eh, opinions are just that. Doesn't mean people have to agree with them. I don't, either. I don't like MR, but acting like it's such a massive hurdle to get to MR15 in this day and age is ridiculous. There are more warframes and weapons to level up than ever before, affinity boosters are a thing, even Steel Path contributes to MR a little bit. Besides, you won't be able to access Helminth Chrysalis without a massive grind, anyway, because it'll be tied to syndicates just like the gravimag was on Venus. MR is really the easiest part of it.

But maybe that where we disagree, i and (probably) many others think that MR grinding is such a hurdle when there are players who have limited times with the game already. And because to access helminth you need so massive grind, why adding burden to us with MR locking which in turn, make it near un-accessible for me and other player like me? Let say, i need a month or two to grind myself to MR 15, add grinding the whole syndicate for, let say, a month or two. By that time, the new war maybe already come out, and i've burn myself out with grinding. Do you think that it will be a great experience for any players? i don't think so.

Look, what i ask for DE is to lower the MR requirement a notch or two, what difference would it make do you think beside giving players like me more easy access to it? because i don't think there is. Because like you said, it is already soft locked behind massive syndicate grind, behind resource, behind frames to sacrifice, etc. So why don't give a bit leniency by lowering the MR a little bit?

[Berserkerkitten]

vor 22 Minuten schrieb zanzibar9:

But maybe that where we disagree, i and (probably) many others think that MR grinding is such a hurdle when there are players who have limited times with the game already. And because to access helminth you need so massive grind, why adding burden to us with MR locking which in turn, make it near un-accessible for me and other player like me? Let say, i need a month or two to grind myself to MR 15, add grinding the whole syndicate for, let say, a month or two. By that time, the new war maybe already come out, and i've burn myself out with grinding. Do you think that it will be a great experience for any players? i don't think so.

Look, what i ask for DE is to lower the MR requirement a notch or two, what difference would it make do you think beside giving players like me more easy access to it? because i don't think there is. Because like you said, it is already soft locked behind massive syndicate grind, behind resource, behind frames to sacrifice, etc. So why don't give a bit leniency by lowering the MR a little bit?

Because it isn't necessary. Because it's incredibly easy to get to MR15. Because everyone has limited time. Because the world isn't going to end if it takes you an extra month or two to get there. 

I strongly believe that MR and the calculation thereof could use a major overhaul. But all this drama about having to spend a few hours leveling up a bunch of gear in a game, which, in essence, always, inevitably revolves around grind. If it burns you out so much, why are you even playing at all? I'm not defending MR. I couldn't possibly care less about MR or MR-gating. But oh no, I'm actually forced to play the game for a bit in order to access new content, how very dare they! Jesus Christ man.

[Sahansral]

vor 31 Minuten schrieb zanzibar9:

But maybe that where we disagree, i and (probably) many others think that MR grinding is such a hurdle when there are players who have limited times with the game already. And because to access helminth you need so massive grind, why adding burden to us with MR locking which in turn, make it near un-accessible for me and other player like me? Let say, i need a month or two to grind myself to MR 15, add grinding the whole syndicate for, let say, a month or two. By that time, the new war maybe already come out, and i've burn myself out with grinding. Do you think that it will be a great experience for any players? i don't think so.

Look, what i ask for DE is to lower the MR requirement a notch or two, what difference would it make do you think beside giving players like me more easy access to it? because i don't think there is. Because like you said, it is already soft locked behind massive syndicate grind, behind resource, behind frames to sacrifice, etc. So why don't give a bit leniency by lowering the MR a little bit?

If your time is so precious and you hate grinding so much, DE offers the perfect solution for players like you.

Buy progress. Spend platinum.

So why don’t you give a bit of support to the devs by paying a little bit of your money?

 

[zanzibar9]

13 minutes ago, Berserkerkitten said:

Because it isn't necessary. Because it's incredibly easy to get to MR15. Because everyone has limited time. Because the world isn't going to end if it takes you an extra month or two to get there. 

I strongly believe that MR and the calculation thereof could use a major overhaul. But all this drama about having to spend a few hours leveling up a bunch of gear in a game, which, in essence, always, inevitably revolves around grind. If it burns you out so much, why are you even playing at all? I'm not defending MR. I couldn't possibly care less about MR or MR-gating. But oh no, I'm actually forced to play the game for a bit in order to access new content, how very dare they! Jesus Christ man.

"Because the world isn't going to end if it takes you an extra month or two to get there." Are you sure? This is 2020 we are talking about, when people thought that nothing couldn't get worse, it seems 2020 can up it self twice over.

On more serious note, "for few hours" more you say?

i only have plays on weekends, which mean i only have 3 days. i have little kids a 7 and a 1 years old. They slept around 8-9 on the weekend which make me only have 2-3 hours top each day, hell on sunday i can only play till before it hit 0.00 since i should get up at 5 am and get to my office at 7, because i need to open it for my employee so we can open at 8am. to me those 2-3 hours is my precious time. I don't feel like it if i pushed to boring grinding to MR 15, and only need to grind A lot more just to access an in game system.

"If it burns you out so much, why are you even playing at all?"

Well then if this is the official respond of DE then they again probably lost more of they player base however few there will be, since we all know that they lost their top 10 rank of concurrent players on steam just last year. We all know that DE need more player retention, and to me and many others the only highlight about this whole Deimos update is the Helminth system which they lock it behind High MR.

Well, to end this i say agree to disagree then.

[(PSN)Shaun-T-Wilson]

6 minutes ago, Sahansral said:

If your time is so precious and you hate grinding so much, DE offers the perfect solution for players like you.

Buy progress. Spend platinum.

So why don’t you give a bit of support to the devs by paying a little bit of your money?

 

Even if you buy everything with plat you still have to rank them up. In addition you can't bypass Mastery tests with plat either.

[(PSN)Wil_Shatner_face]

2 hours ago, zanzibar9 said:

It is you, not me. I too have a wife and kids, i too have a business to run, but i don't spend my weekends to bored myself with boring grind. Especially, because there was no incentive before, beside the small pool of "end game" weapons. I played games to relieve myself from weekdays stress not to add S#&$ to it, mind you.

And of course i wasn't trying, have you not read my whole post? I was already said that my account was 3-4 years old and on that time, i only reach MR 11. So why no progression you would asked? because there was no incentive for me to reach higher ranks. no incentive = no rewards beside small pool of "end game" weapons, if you can even call it rewards. You can then make a conclusion that i, most of the time, play with the same frame, with the same weapon all those times. So is it wrong for me to ask for DE to lower the MR requirement so that it can make more sense progression wise? Rail Jack is locked behind what? MR 10? 11? so why the suddenly MR 15? If the whole reason for DE to do it is only for catering to more experience player. Why not make it more forgivable for us casual players? So that we can still enjoy the game while rank up our MR?

Hell, i even up, if let say DE lower it to MR 13, but it is locked progression wise. Say that at MR 13 you can only have the helminth original skills to add to your warframes. Say that at MR 14, you only can sacrifice (insert your number of choice here) of warframes, at MR 15, you can then enjoy the whole system. So, why not that?

The thing is, there are plenty other easily coded ways to cater it just for the experience players while not locking everything at MR 15.

One more things, the other reason why many are suddenly at arms with the MR 15 requirement is, because there are those who things that the only highlights about the whole Deimos expansion is this very systems, and a lot of people aren't happy that it was lock behind High MR, just because DE decided that MR 15 is the "experienced player" MR number.

The MR requirement is fine. Literally all you have to do is level some weapons passively while playing the game. You don’t even have to go out of your way to do it, you can clear content in this game while ranking up weapons.

And honestly if you hate grinding in games then Warframe is probably the wrong game for you. This game is all about doing the same thing over and over and over again. You call it boring grind but some of us actually enjoy the grind. Personally, I think Warframe just feels so good to play that the grind has never bothered me at all.

To each their own, but don’t blame the game just because it’s not your cup of tea.

[fo3nixz]

7 hours ago, Berserkerkitten said:

I mean, if getting another couple ranks is already such a bother, you're gonna hate unlocking Helminth anyway, because there's gonna be a huge syndicate standing grind attached to unlocking it as well.

and will probably complaining its to grindy again

[zanzibar9]

28 minutes ago, Sahansral said:

If your time is so precious and you hate grinding so much, DE offers the perfect solution for players like you.

Buy progress. Spend platinum.

So why don’t you give a bit of support to the devs by paying a little bit of your money?

 

Oh but i did!!!

Did you missed when i said that i bought 1k+ plats just to reward DE for coming up with new exciting system?

Did you also missed that i said i was disappointed few days later when i found out that it was locked behind MR 15? Well then too bad boo hoo me, a paying customer complaining and whining.

i was also planning to buy nezha prime access when it's going out on the year end, since i have more than spare money to throw around, but to bad, you think that my whining isn't justified because you missed the whole that i specifically said on my original post that i'm a paying customer.

[Berserkerkitten]

vor 3 Minuten schrieb zanzibar9:

"Because the world isn't going to end if it takes you an extra month or two to get there." Are you sure? This is 2020 we are talking about, when people thought that nothing couldn't get worse, it seems 2020 can up it self twice over.

On more serious note, "for few hours" more you say?

i only have plays on weekends, which mean i only have 3 days. i have little kids a 7 and a 1 years old. They slept around 8-9 on the weekend which make me only have 2-3 hours top each day, hell on sunday i can only play till before it hit 0.00 since i should get up at 5 am and get to my office at 7, because i need to open it for my employee so we can open at 8am. to me those 2-3 hours is my precious time. I don't feel like it if i pushed to boring grinding to MR 15, and only need to grind A lot more just to access an in game system.

"If it burns you out so much, why are you even playing at all?"

Well then if this is the official respond of DE then they again probably lost more of they player base however few there will be, since we all know that they lost their top 10 rank of concurrent players on steam just last year. We all know that DE need more player retention, and to me and many others the only highlight about this whole Deimos update is the Helminth system which they lock it behind High MR.

Well, to end this i say agree to disagree then.

Alright, the fact it's 2020 is actually an excellent point. Still, assuming we're not going to die of the pandemic, world war 3 or the entire planet catching on fire, what's a few more hours? I'm so sorry you decided to have children. Obviously, the entire progression system should change because of that.

Seriously though, where are you gonna draw the line? How much progression is the game allowed to have in your opinion? Instant gratification for everyone? 

It's this kind of attitude which already gave us new quests and missions always starting at levels 1-3, warframes with literal god mode, nerfs to just about every bit of content that is even remotely challenging. If they keep making things easier and quicker and tone things down more and more, maybe the game will appeal more to people who don't actually have the time to play. But this is exactly the kind of thing that is driving me away.

[zanzibar9]

12 minutes ago, Berserkerkitten said:

Alright, the fact it's 2020 is actually an excellent point. Still, assuming we're not going to die of the pandemic, world war 3 or the entire planet catching on fire, what's a few more hours? I'm so sorry you decided to have children. Obviously, the entire progression system should change because of that.

Seriously though, where are you gonna draw the line? How much progression is the game allowed to have in your opinion? Instant gratification for everyone? 

It's this kind of attitude which already gave us new quests and missions always starting at levels 1-3, warframes with literal god mode, nerfs to just about every bit of content that is even remotely challenging. If they keep making things easier and quicker and tone things down more and more, maybe the game will appeal more to people who don't actually have the time to play. But this is exactly the kind of thing that is driving me away.

"Alright, the fact it's 2020 is actually an excellent point. Still, assuming we're not going to die of the pandemic, world war 3 or the entire planet catching on fire, what's a few more hours? I'm so sorry you decided to have children. Obviously, the entire progression system should change because of that."

Touche. Meh, my kids are alright, if you past the nasty things that they do, past their endless question that sometimes you have no idea how to answer, past that they always ruin your plans with your wife, past that they it's a major effort just to bring them on vacations, past that they always clingy to you specially my little one, past that my 1 years old always put god knows what in his mouth, one have to wonder indeed why one need such a thing, only to be reminded that it was your wife who want 1 child at first, then she asked for a baby brother 5 years later and my wife agreed to it. Like many married couples, sometimes you can't say no to your lovely wife constant begging. LOL!

"Seriously though, where are you gonna draw the line? How much progression is the game allowed to have in your opinion? Instant gratification for everyone? "

Of course not my friend, there is no instant gratification, not in IRL nor in game. Everything require efforts.

See, i wasn't trying to make this whole system free for all, including to new players. My aim was to lower the MR requirement a little bit, one or two MR would do. Because i understand that DE for gate locking it, but i disagree with DE to gate lock it at MR 15. I think MR 13-14 is better for it with various add-on suggestions that i said on my previous posts. It make sense progression wise, as it make sense since Rail jack is locked not far behind it. That's it.

[Krankbert]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb MagPrime:

While MR doesn't equal experience  

That's always been a dishonest argument anyway. Yes, MR doesn't technically equal experience. MR and experience are still heavily correlated, and that's blindingly obvious to everyone because both come from spending time playing.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

1 hour ago, zanzibar9 said:

Yes, i miss it. But, do you have reading comprehension? Because you still missed my whole point by only quoting my specific point while ignoring my whole argument. 

No I left out the parts that I wasn't bothering to comment on. That's why I selectively quoted the section and explained why it was nonsense. 

That's how reading comprehension works. 

1 hour ago, zanzibar9 said:

And what is the original points you bring the rivens? Because it was incentive to have High MR no? So to call it an incentive is a far fetch as a calling yourself an experience player, because clearly you didn't experience what is before september 2018, which is less than me.

The original point was that you need to hit MR 16 to have access to all rivens. That's an indisputable fact. So yes rivens are an incentive to get to at least MR 16. 

I'm going to go ahead pretend that you wrote September 2016, not 2018. Doesn't matter when someone started the game. Also I don't recall saying that I am an experienced player in what you replied to, but at nearly 2k hours in missions and 1.6 million mastery points, I probably am one. 

1 hour ago, zanzibar9 said:

Are you there, when loki is the most meta frame in the game? are you there when invisible=invincible meta? No? well, then too bad. you have less experience than me then. There are plenty other example on how you have less experience in this game compare to those of that plays longer than you while having low MR.

 

This is nonsense and not really worth replying to but I will anyway: if someone played in 2013 and left the game for 7 years, that does make them more experienced, in fact using only what they knew 7 years previous would be a terrible idea, because the game has evolved and they've been left behind. 

1 hour ago, zanzibar9 said:

By "Feel free to attempt justify the whole "people who have interacted with less than one quarter of the things that are available are still really, really, really experienced"." Then by your standard the only one who should have this system it the one that have interacted at least quarter+ of the in game content, no? what if it's MR 20, since it's half way up to MR 30. What if DE say that an experience player is those who have at least interacted with half of it? What if DE say that it's for MR 25 only. What would you say?

Fine by me, I'm good to go as far as points go, I'd need to take almost a week's worth of tests, but no skin off my back. Again whatabout-ism isn't really relevant to the situation at hand. The fact of the matter is that a quarter of the items in game is a pretty paltry amount to be whining about. And most of the folks who've not done that should be seriously questioning why they thought themselves "experienced" in the first place. 

1 hour ago, zanzibar9 said:

And i do too have Forma'ed my weapons and warframes, what's your point? Do you think i never forma'ed my gears? Just FYI, i have forma'ed a standard loki 4x, vectis 3x, standard chroma 6x, arca plasmor 4x, venka prime 4x, nikana prime 3x, etc. And you know what? those forma aren't tied to our MR no?  so........ yeah. Do you honestly think bringing forma to this whole MR argument helping your point? Thanks for proving my point, because it only add more to mine, since it's a prove that, one need no high MR to be experience player since you can access any content with any weapon you have, specially since you have low level riven and since melee 3.0 gave us a fair playing field to many non-meta melee weapons before 3.0.

See how easy for me to turn around your flawed logic? If your whole argument is just that, a flawed logic, while not adding anything substantial, then good day, don't @ me anymore.

Let's try to answer this rant... Oh wait I already did that in the post you replied to:

2 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

By the way, many of us do this thing called "adding forma" where we rank up the same weapon from zero repeatedly, and having a higher capacity at rank zero makes that far less annoying. 

See? 

Now, do you want to go on embarrassing yourself, or do you figure it's worth it to stop and actually think about what you're replying to? 

[Berserkerkitten]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb zanzibar9:

"Alright, the fact it's 2020 is actually an excellent point. Still, assuming we're not going to die of the pandemic, world war 3 or the entire planet catching on fire, what's a few more hours? I'm so sorry you decided to have children. Obviously, the entire progression system should change because of that."

Touche. Meh, my kids are alright, if you past the nasty things that they do, past their endless question that sometimes you have no idea how to answer, past that they always ruin your plans with your wife, past that they it's a major effort just to bring them on vacations, past that they always clingy to you specially my little one, past that my 1 years old always put god knows what in his mouth, one have to wonder indeed why one need such a thing, only to be reminded that it was your wife who want 1 child at first, then she asked for a baby brother 5 years later and my wife agreed to it. Like many married couples, sometimes you can't say no to your lovely wife constant begging. LOL!

"Seriously though, where are you gonna draw the line? How much progression is the game allowed to have in your opinion? Instant gratification for everyone? "

Of course not my friend, there is no instant gratification, not in IRL nor in game. Everything require efforts.

See, i wasn't trying to make this whole system free for all, including to new players. My aim was to lower the MR requirement a little bit, one or two MR would do. Because i understand that DE for gate locking it, but i disagree with DE to gate lock it at MR 15. I think MR 13-14 is better for it with various add-on suggestions that i said on my previous posts. It make sense progression wise, as it make sense since Rail jack is locked not far behind it. That's it.

Are you sure you don't want to lower it to 13-14, because that's closer to where you're currently at? 😉

I'm sorry if I'm being a bit harsh here. It's just, this thread is just a couple threads away from a very similar one, where somebody complains about Steel Path requiring MR10. And I'm sitting here, I've also got a kid, I'm trying to keep my business alive in this stupid crisis and somehow I managed to get to MR16 without ever deliberately grinding stuff solely for the sake of raising MR. And find it hard to understand what all the fuss is about. And I'm worried that difficulty and requirements just erode more and more all the time.

Anyhow. Like you said. Agree to disagree and all that. I don't mean to fight over this. I have my point of view as you have yours and that's perfectly fine. May you get to enjoy Helminth Crysalis within a reasonable amount of time.

[(PSN)Shaun-T-Wilson]

3 minutes ago, Krankbert said:

That's always been a dishonest argument anyway. Yes, MR doesn't technically equal experience. MR and experience are still heavily correlated, and that's blindingly obvious to everyone because both come from spending time playing.

True, you use experience to pass the MR tests.