Why players are starting to check out

[(PSN)MYKK678]

1 hour ago, master_of_destiny said:

High roading the conversation, while being a stubborn individual incapable of reading while demanding facts, is pretty stupid.  That's not an opinion, it's a statement of duplicity in reasoning and commentary on your choice of response.  If you wanted facts, spoon fed to you, then maybe ask for them.  Heaven forbid, maybe educate yourself.  Nope, just state that somebody is wrong because it didn't conform to your opinion.  When confronted respond like Eric Cartman.  "Screw you guys, I'm going home."  A phrase I enjoy quoting to no end.

 

Why did you even bother to engage?  There appears to be no facts which can shape your opinions.

 

 

 

You'll note evidence for your opinions is a bar apparently beneath you to provide.  You can't even acknowledge facts because you don't read.  Let me quote you, as it highlight everything:

"...Covid's still around. We're all down and bored and fed up. I get it. Please don't let that turn into the type of Arrogance required to believe yourself the only one who knows what's wrong with the game or how to fix it OP. You don't..."  

Bring up something else, miss the point of the statement (no claims as to listing everything wrong with the game), construct a strawman to attack about something else (I explained how to fix what exactly?), personal attack (I'm arrogant, but you cannot be bothered to do anything and only need to say no to be right), and then claim arrogance because you don't want to understand any indicators (financial or player count).  This is the definition of a strawman and arguing from a point of ignorance.  Textbook.

 

It's fine.  You win the argument from your perspective.  There's nothing to be won, and it's effectively allowing a game to continue to decay, but who cares?  Slow clap for you.

 

 

As an aside, I suggested one better system in my statement that DE already has, Moas.  I provided no other fixes, only outlined the issues.  You seemed to not even want to read the original post.  It's baffling that you could be so far off base, and try the high road.  Whatever though, you're free to be exploited.  If you wanted to make a reasonable reply, there are ways. 

If you decided to educate yourself the arguments you could stand on are peak player counts instead of averages, the fact that Sony and Microsoft seem to be making a case for the game, the occasional media highlights that keep coming out, the largely fair free to play model, or even focus on the fact that the game is nearly a decade old but still makes great leaps forward.  Nope, just wave your hands and scream that an opinion that doesn't agree is invalid.  No need to debunk, just deny.

Please see previous reply

[master_of_destiny]

1 minute ago, (PS4)MYKK678 said:

Please see previous reply

[(PSN)MYKK678]

2 minutes ago, master_of_destiny said:

Please see previous reply

[Aldain]

...What the $&*# is even going on in this thread?

[master_of_destiny]

55 minutes ago, Aldain said:

...What the $&*# is even going on in this thread?

The traditional discussion.  Or, maybe rage topic.  It depends upon who is asking, and how they initially respond. 

Basically, if they start with an insult they receive them back and then act violated.

 

Somebody suggests bad things are happening.  People who hate anyone who hate something they like irrationally defend it, while people with an axe to grind praise anything.  The result is trolling on both sides.  Some say what pisses them off, some tell others to just leave, and the message gets lost along the way.

 

 

The original goal was to tell DE why things are not going well.  It is constructed around the premise that decreasing financial performance, and the slow bleed of players are problems that they would like to address.  It highlights the three issues that the OP, me, identified as the largest issues which are present and why they need to be addressed.

 

Along the way people decided to add their own issues, take umbrage that the facts were not laid out for them, instigate personal attacks because they disagree with the statement and that everything is fine, and some good people asked questions about why the conclusion were being drawn.  They also asked pretty reasonable questions about the reasons for assumptions, and highlighted some basic questions showing they wanted to understand things.

 

Pretty much standard here.  The people who professionally hate piled on as though I had reason to hate DE.  The defenders immediately defended it as a bad assumption without any facts or figures.  Neither party brought facts to the table, and only after about three pages did I get any request for showing my work.  For the record, I don't hate DE.  I do hate that they make bad decisions and won't compromise, and I do hate that their "fix" to the content droughts has been to progressively make grind worse.  The thing is, that one sentence is never actionable.  Unless it's 140 characters (yes, I know it's been increased) or from a celebrity then people trying to make warframe better by highlighting flaws are lost amongst a choir of the extremes.  Extremes who never need fact, don't need to listen, and cannot compromise.  

 

 

 

I am surprised it's gone on this long.  We've nearly gotten to the Godwin's law point.  I'm sure it'll be soon.  I know my choice to respond to someone with a gif of Golum due to their rather...explicit choice to not listen while starting a discussion at an insult is pretty near the point of death by frustration.  We shall see.

 

 

 

-Edit-

As an aside, we only got two of the big three stupid arguments.  Stupid for either making assumptions or for not basing your arguments in facts.  They are:

The Strawman - We got this one, where people assume the OP hates DE, and that outside influences are creating more hate than usual.  This despite gaming seeing a huge increase in popularity with the prevalence of lockdowns.  For the record, I am guilty of this myself in trying to preemptively respond to arguments with this.  It's often used and misused when responding to an otherwise completely unknown entity. 

The Statistics aren't clear - A lack of 100% matching to functions and data being incomplete is not a reason to disregard a hypothesis.  It's especially not so with more than 50 data points and demonstrated correlation between multiple data sets (read: financial performance and player counts).

Correlation is not Causation - We lacked this.  I though for sure people were going to state something like "my clan is bigger now than a year ago."  Perhaps even the argument that "but now it's not just PC, we have the consoles" should have come up.  It's a sign that things are changing, now that this argument isn't trotted out nearly instantly.  

 

Whatever your poison, it's pretty ludicrous to personally attack someone.  It's reasonable to respond in kind to someone who begins with personal attack, but the resolution there is generally as above.  One of the parties simply doesn't want to listen and thus demonstrates why their opinions are not valuable.  I'm glad that argument happened, because I cannot do better to demonstrate why some people simply shouldn't say anything more than "I disagree."  It would be refreshing though to see an actual counter argument based in facts.  I'd like to understand why people defend bad decisions by DE, or perhaps why they don't think them bad.  This was demonstrated when a different poster said a 20 hour grind was fine, which I didn't agree with but did respect their opinion. 

If you go in eyes wide, expecting this game to be a Korean MMO level grind, it's different from what is being sold.  That's great, but selling a looter-shooter about space ninjas with loot requiring literal thousands of boss kills for a 50% chance to get power is not on the store page.  That's a pay to win scheme.  DE should be admonished for this, but to this day they get a pass.  I'd like them to either be transparent on the grind or more reasonably decrease it.  I don't want that for me, I want it so that the game can continue.  Another dead game, due to painful grind, is not a future I'd like.