Heart of Deimos: The Helminth System Feedback Megathread

[MrHBN]

Marked For Death Complaint:

Marked for death was due a nerf which everyone agrees with.

We did not want it smashed in the ground and turned to paste.

Now that Empower is the best pick of the helminth abilities can we expect a nerf to that also?

Actual Ideas for making helminth abilities better & (after the community annoyance) Simple, Easy Buffs to Implement That Even a Child Could Implement With Ease.

• Empower: Fine as is (please don't murder it too).
• Energised Munitions: Make it reach a cap of 100% with strength mods or increase the base duration by a good 3-5 seconds.
• Infested Mobility: 1. Increase base duration by 3-5 seconds. 2. Give it a 8m-10m AOE that gives your allies the buff but at half strength. 3. Lower the energy cost. 
• Masters Summons: 1. Give a 30 second armour buff when cast. 2. Change the ability to give a passive buff to companion survivability and will revive them instantly if they die. Maybe give a energy drain but considering the cost of resources and giving up a ability slot it should just be a free passive thing (like Oberon's passive but it would stack with Oberon's passive). 3. Give a 50% damage buff (mod-able) to companions for 10 seconds base (also mod-able) which works on all companions (sentinals, kubrows etc)
• Rebuild Shields: If shields are at max capacity then it maxes out overshields instead with a longer cooldown (like 15 seconds) and lower normal cooldown to 10 or 8 seconds.
• Perspicacity: Remove the parazon animation and literally make it instant. The second you press the interact button it should instantly hack the terminal.
• Marked For Death: It's dead. Revert some of the nerfs or keep as is and refund players who wasted time and resources by putting it on frames.
• Expedite Suffering: Increase range by 3m-5m and have it double the remaining damage left on the toxin & slash procs. Not sure if it's a thing (because no one in their right mind would waste time on this ability) but it would be nice if status duration mods would affect the overall damage as well.

Expedite Suffering:

This ability needs a major change. Rank 9 to get this?! WHY?! There is almost... wait sorry, there is "no" useful situation where you could use this ability unless is gets a big buff. More than what I mentioned above in my list for changes. In all honesty it needs to be majorly buffed or removed and replaced with something else that's good.

Overall view on the Helminth abilities:

Aside from Empower they all need a good buff. Marked for Death did need a nerf and clearly had some bugs with damage calculation but now needs a buff because of poor handling. All the rest need some slight buffs but if you handle buffs like your nerfs then they would be way too OP. In all seriousness they just need a few light but simple buffs and they will be picked more, well used more in gameplay rather than used to rank up the Helminth.

Warframe subsumed abilities:

This is simple but Steve's and Scott's reaction to being asked if the least used and/or replaced abilities would get buffs don't give me any confidence. However They should be looking to buff said abilities which they can clearly see are being used by no one now. Even though every had been telling them some abilities were useless. Now with clear data showing that they aren't being used and/or completely removed by players. They should be able to see what needs a few buffs. It's not clear if said they weren't looking to use the data to buff. Anyone with a working brain can understand from that data what needs buffs and understand they should be buffed ASAP. Not dance around the issue saying the Helminth System is "The Wild West".

       

 

[Kefirno]

Energized munitions needs a buff. Either more duration or less cost and quicker cast. It's almost useless on a frame that doesn't build 250%+duration. I was hoping it'll be a cheap fix for guns with horrible ammo efficiency, but it turned out to be another case of dedicating your entire loadout to fixing one gun.

Also, it has wonky interaction with Grakata's augment. Instead of shooting until magazine is empty it shoots remaining magazine worth of ammo and then stops, making each consecutive burst shorter until you reload.

[quxier]

4 hours ago, (PS4)Rainbow_Neos1 said:

16 hours ago, quxier said:

 

Nope. Only text size in chat and HUD size is able to be changed. I want everything to be editable tbh. 

To be honest, I would like this as well, like make end mission's screen little wider. Or Foundry takes 3 rows instead of 2, no "pseudo 3D".
... but maybe it's good for new suggestion.

[quxier]

2 hours ago, MrHBN said:

•  
• Perspicacity: Remove the parazon animation and literally make it instant. The second you press the interact button it should instantly hack the terminal.

Whole auto-hacking should be faster. It's faster to go to cipher - hack using cipher (press Y) THAN using auto-hacking.

[(PSN)larsonsier]

I was very upset today to learn that the colors of the flowers for the helminth are based upon the colors of the frames.  I feel like this information should have been in the warning dialogue.  A solution would be to implement a way via the decorate menu to change their colors.

It's frustrating to find this out after spending so much time refarming every frame and resources.  And since I've already subsumed the majority of them, I'm basically SOL.  I just can't believe there was no warning about it.  I only discovered this by accident when I made an all black frame which does not make a pretty flower btw. 

Also, I've found no clear cut answers as to what sections of the frames correspond to the flowers as one forum post said the wiki wasn't accurate.  With fashion frame being the true end game, please implement a way for us to fix these!

[(PSN)Rainbow_Neos1]

1 hour ago, (PS4)larsonsier said:

I was very upset today to learn that the colors of the flowers for the helminth are based upon the colors of the frames.  I feel like this information should have been in the warning dialogue.  A solution would be to implement a way via the decorate menu to change their colors.

It's frustrating to find this out after spending so much time refarming every frame and resources.  And since I've already subsumed the majority of them, I'm basically SOL.  I just can't believe there was no warning about it.  I only discovered this by accident when I made an all black frame which does not make a pretty flower btw. 

Also, I've found no clear cut answers as to what sections of the frames correspond to the flowers as one forum post said the wiki wasn't accurate.  With fashion frame being the true end game, please implement a way for us to fix these!

Primary Color = Outer Petals 

Secondary Color = Inner part of flower 

Tertiary Color = Stem color 

Energy Color = Glow color of flower 

[RivaAurelius]

With regards to last night's home devstream, isn't it funny how the devs nerfed abilities like roar in order to prevent roar from being the overwhelming choice for players to subsume, AND YET players still chose roar the most anyway. It's almost as if nerfing roar didn't make decoy any more useful XD now marked for death has been nerfed, probably because it is popular, but that doesn't make the more useless helminth powers more useful. Buffs not nerfs, come on! 

[DroopingPuppy]

2 hours ago, RivaAurelius said:

With regards to last night's home devstream, isn't it funny how the devs nerfed abilities like roar in order to prevent roar from being the overwhelming choice for players to subsume, AND YET players still chose roar the most anyway. It's almost as if nerfing roar didn't make decoy any more useful XD now marked for death has been nerfed, probably because it is popular, but that doesn't make the more useless helminth powers more useful. Buffs not nerfs, come on! 

I expect this already, and that only proves why DE have to do that as well. Additional damage buffing source is always welcome and many warframes are even accept the nerfed one for they didn't have their own already. It is always better than nothing, and that's why DE have to nerf it and why still many players are still pick the nerfed one.

[RivaAurelius]

1 hour ago, DroopingPuppy said:

I expect this already, and that only proves why DE have to do that as well. Additional damage buffing source is always welcome and many warframes are even accept the nerfed one for they didn't have their own already. It is always better than nothing, and that's why DE have to nerf it and why still many players are still pick the nerfed one.

From what I can gather, your point undoes itself. You say DE HAS to nerf damage buff abilities because they are better than nothing? But if they are better than nothing, nerfing them won't make other abilities more attractive, it'll just make people unhappy, which is what happened. Other abilities didn't become attractive and the original Helminth dev workshop thread had over 200 pages of angry players who were unhappy with the nerfs. As we can clearly see, the nerfs did not do what DE intended, which was to make players consider other abilities, it ended up not changing the outcome at all. The nerfs need to be reverted and the bottom tier abilities need to be buffed. My mind will never be changed about this. 

[RivaAurelius]

Just gonna leave this here.

[Proscriptor]

so the video sets the following premises

• de made a resource sink mechanic, which works for old players
• de lowered the barrier to entry by setting the MR to 8, which corresponds to new players
• de didn't lower costs for the new players, which means the whole system based on the resource sink doesn't work for them
• MR doesn't mean anything, you can't gauge how experienced someone is based on mr

and as a conclusion to the above you advocate that costs should be lowered

but if MR doesn't mean anything, what does it matter if DE lowered the barrier to entry?

it doesn't

it's precisely because you can't gauge how experienced someone is based on MR, that the MR requirement was made just a token requirement and essentially set aside, while the whole system remained geared for very experienced players because it's inextricably tied to the resource sink mechanic and only very experienced players can benefit from it

edit: i'm aware that the video deals with other things later, but this part is timestamped, and is particularly interesting for it's lack of logic

[DroopingPuppy]

26 minutes ago, RivaAurelius said:

From what I can gather, your point undoes itself. You say DE HAS to nerf damage buff abilities because they are better than nothing? But if they are better than nothing, nerfing them won't make other abilities more attractive, it'll just make people unhappy, which is what happened. Other abilities didn't become attractive and the original Helminth dev workshop thread had over 200 pages of angry players who were unhappy with the nerfs. As we can clearly see, the nerfs did not do what DE intended, which was to make players consider other abilities, it ended up not changing the outcome at all. The nerfs need to be reverted and the bottom tier abilities need to be buffed. My mind will never be changed about this. 

It's better than nothing, for most frames lacks a damage buff in the first place.

 

For example, if an ability buffs +60% damage but its Helminth version cuts by a half(+30%) then it is indeed a serious nerf. But anyway. a frame without any damage buff still gets +30% damage buff by nerfed damage buff, along with its advantageous abilities for lacking a damage buff.

 

And Rhino is built around Roar, but Volt is not built around nerfed Roar already so even if you gives the nerfed version Volt can enjoy Roar much. If Volt can use full Roar then it is fatal to Rhino's position of the buffer, for Volt can use the other abilities while also buff as much as a Rhino. It justifies why damage buff abilties are must be nerfed. It is not nerfed enough to make it useless either so it is a fair trade.

 

Also, there is no point on making some choice useless. Both nerfing those damage buffs too much and make it virtually useless and simply keep its original stat and make it overshadows all are not a good move either for both will simply make the useless choice.

[RivaAurelius]

8 minutes ago, DroopingPuppy said:

It's better than nothing, for most frames lacks a damage buff in the first place.

 

For example, if an ability buffs +60% damage but its Helminth version cuts by a half(+30%) then it is indeed a serious nerf. But anyway. a frame without any damage buff still gets +30% damage buff by nerfed damage buff, along with its advantageous abilities for lacking a damage buff.

 

And Rhino is built around Roar, but Volt is not built around nerfed Roar already so even if you gives the nerfed version Volt can enjoy Roar much. If Volt can use full Roar then it is fatal to Rhino's position of the buffer, for Volt can use the other abilities while also buff as much as a Rhino. It justifies why damage buff abilties are must be nerfed. It is not nerfed enough to make it useless either so it is a fair trade.

 

Also, there is no point on making some choice useless. Both nerfing those damage buffs too much and make it virtually useless and simply keep its original stat and make it overshadows all are not a good move either for both will simply make the useless choice.

Why do most frames need a damage buff? Is it because damage is the meta, or because their kits are inadequate for the game? 

 

Rhino is not built around roar. I don't know why people say this, but I rarely see it. Most meta builds for rhino focus on iron shrapnel and ironclad charge for tankability. Roar is a nice damage bonus on top of that, but certainly not the bread and butter of rhino's kit. Rhino is not even used as a buffer very much, because in case you have not noticed, there are frames that do the job of a team buffer far better than rhino does. Even an oberon with a smite infusion slapped into his build will buff a team better than a rhino. 

 

On your final point. I agree. There is no point on making some choice useless. But there are so many choices that ARE useless that DE did NOT buff, and instead they nerfed what they hypothesised would be the top choice. They didn't even playtest it. Rather than nerf the abilities that may "overshadow", instead, buff the abilities so that there is competition for which ability you should choose. The approach of nerfing the top choices and doing nothing to the bottom choices means the top choices will still be picked, because abilities like decoy have not been changed and are still useless.

[(XBOX)Architect Prime]

I don't usually speak on nerfs. But this one is a fascination. I would like to expand a few thoughts and questions on the Marked For Death ability. Know that I'm on xbox, so I can only comment on the state of the ability as I currently have it, but still speaking in past tense. 

I found that Marked For Death was making a good chunk of frames viable. I urge you to find some way to nerf it without actually touching the lethality. You can increase energy cost, limit the number of enemies it can hit somehow, cause it to do some self damage (good for chroma?), give it a cooldown or make it slow, or remove the ability to carry status to other enemies which seems to happen with it. And what's so bad about arcane trickery finally having a use?

The ability makes frames that I've wanted to use for years viable. Is it right to increase the balance of the system at the cost of leaving the rest of the game unbalanced? Because this ability and several others were working wonders for the game as whole in my opinion. 

But I would say that if it's allowed to be powerful, it should be unlocked after the weirdo and possibly useless status proc ability good luck with that nonsense. 

 

 

[Culaio]

3 hours ago, Traubenzuckr said:

so the video sets the following premises

• de made a resource sink mechanic, which works for old players
• de lowered the barrier to entry by setting the MR to 8, which corresponds to new players
• de didn't lower costs for the new players, which means the whole system based on the resource sink doesn't work for them
• MR doesn't mean anything, you can't gauge how experienced someone is based on mr

and as a conclusion to the above you advocate that costs should be lowered

but if MR doesn't mean anything, what does it matter if DE lowered the barrier to entry?

it doesn't

it's precisely because you can't gauge how experienced someone is based on MR, that the MR requirement was made just a token requirement and essentially set aside, while the whole system remained geared for very experienced players because it's inextricably tied to the resource sink mechanic and only very experienced players can benefit from it

edit: i'm aware that the video deals with other things later, but this part is timestamped, and is particularly interesting for it's lack of logic

problem with lowering MR while keeping the same resource cost is the fact that lower experianced players may waste resoruces they need for other stuff, throwing resource sink at very new players is bad idea. At worst new players may think that they have to farm for this system to be powerful in this game which may affect negatively their experiance with this game.

[(PSN)Rainbow_Neos1]

4 hours ago, Traubenzuckr said:

so the video sets the following premises

• de made a resource sink mechanic, which works for old players
• de lowered the barrier to entry by setting the MR to 8, which corresponds to new players
• de didn't lower costs for the new players, which means the whole system based on the resource sink doesn't work for them
• MR doesn't mean anything, you can't gauge how experienced someone is based on mr

and as a conclusion to the above you advocate that costs should be lowered

but if MR doesn't mean anything, what does it matter if DE lowered the barrier to entry?

it doesn't

it's precisely because you can't gauge how experienced someone is based on MR, that the MR requirement was made just a token requirement and essentially set aside, while the whole system remained geared for very experienced players because it's inextricably tied to the resource sink mechanic and only very experienced players can benefit from it

edit: i'm aware that the video deals with other things later, but this part is timestamped, and is particularly interesting for it's lack of logic

He's pointing out DE's inconsistency. 

[(XBOX)toughdragon17]

The helmeth system is basicly garbage now you guys were so nerf happy you even nerfed it before it came out 

Now your siting hear saying oh this is to fun to play with and is  populer we half to nerf the crap out of it, this over hear ya to fun nerf it basicly nerfing anything good about the system leaving nothing but a broken peace of crap behind ringing all the fun out of it marked for death was fine the way it was but you made the desision to go nerf happy like youve been doing for a while now and nerf somthing fun just becouse it was populer doing that just makes the game not worth playing 

Insted of nerfing populer choices that are LITERALY THE ONLY GOOD ABILITYS TO USE how about buffing the unpopuler abilitys to be onpar with the populer ones like you sead you were going to do in the first place but never did  

[DroopingPuppy]

9 hours ago, RivaAurelius said:

Why do most frames need a damage buff? Is it because damage is the meta, or because their kits are inadequate for the game? 

 

Rhino is not built around roar. I don't know why people say this, but I rarely see it. Most meta builds for rhino focus on iron shrapnel and ironclad charge for tankability. Roar is a nice damage bonus on top of that, but certainly not the bread and butter of rhino's kit. Rhino is not even used as a buffer very much, because in case you have not noticed, there are frames that do the job of a team buffer far better than rhino does. Even an oberon with a smite infusion slapped into his build will buff a team better than a rhino. 

 

On your final point. I agree. There is no point on making some choice useless. But there are so many choices that ARE useless that DE did NOT buff, and instead they nerfed what they hypothesised would be the top choice. They didn't even playtest it. Rather than nerf the abilities that may "overshadow", instead, buff the abilities so that there is competition for which ability you should choose. The approach of nerfing the top choices and doing nothing to the bottom choices means the top choices will still be picked, because abilities like decoy have not been changed and are still useless.

I don't said that I need one. That's not my point.

 

What I want to say is, Roar is not the sole ability alone. It is the part of the kit we called Rhino. Initially all the other kits are not supposed to use Roar, because it is exclusive for Rhino. And the other abilities on Rhino are consider its presense as well. So, while Rhino's advantages are gives additional health, damage buff for himself and party, and hold the enemy for a while, Volt's advantages are gives the speed buff for a very short duration, make an invulnerable barricade that also adds lightning damage, and cause the damage as well as hold the enemy for a while. While Rhino can do stuffs and buffs allies, the other frames are does something else and they are their own advantage. And gives full Roar to the other warframe means his buffing capability is no longer an advantage on the party composition. That's why I think that nerfing the damage buffing ability is a must - for it will keep the position of the buffer for those buff's original users.

 

I do think that Roar is not the core ability until late game. The main ability to pick Rhino is his Iron Skin. But, still Roar is still a powerful ability on its own and is very powerful on the hands of the weapon focused warframes. Rhino does not have Exalted Blade or Peacemaker, for example. Rhino had it because his other kits are focused on defense rather than offense.

 

And I said better than nothing because of the same reason. Normally Volt didn't have a damage buff, and now he can have it. Then why not to enjoy it? Although I prefer Empower and Perspicacity on my Volt Prime.

 

Also, damage buff is good but is not an only option. For example, my Wukong loadout only holds Kuva Bramma and random secondary so my twin always grab his bramma(for I don't carry a melee weapon the twin always holds the primary). I replace Primal Fury for Silence(of Banshee), and I am really enjoy to shoot Bramma to the floundering enemy with my twin. Since most enemy groups are easily crushed with some Bramma shots with my twins already I don't care for the damage at all.

[RivaAurelius]

8 hours ago, DroopingPuppy said:

I don't said that I need one. That's not my point.

 

What I want to say is, Roar is not the sole ability alone. It is the part of the kit we called Rhino. Initially all the other kits are not supposed to use Roar, because it is exclusive for Rhino. And the other abilities on Rhino are consider its presense as well. So, while Rhino's advantages are gives additional health, damage buff for himself and party, and hold the enemy for a while, Volt's advantages are gives the speed buff for a very short duration, make an invulnerable barricade that also adds lightning damage, and cause the damage as well as hold the enemy for a while. While Rhino can do stuffs and buffs allies, the other frames are does something else and they are their own advantage. And gives full Roar to the other warframe means his buffing capability is no longer an advantage on the party composition. That's why I think that nerfing the damage buffing ability is a must - for it will keep the position of the buffer for those buff's original users.

 

I do think that Roar is not the core ability until late game. The main ability to pick Rhino is his Iron Skin. But, still Roar is still a powerful ability on its own and is very powerful on the hands of the weapon focused warframes. Rhino does not have Exalted Blade or Peacemaker, for example. Rhino had it because his other kits are focused on defense rather than offense.

 

And I said better than nothing because of the same reason. Normally Volt didn't have a damage buff, and now he can have it. Then why not to enjoy it? Although I prefer Empower and Perspicacity on my Volt Prime.

 

Also, damage buff is good but is not an only option. For example, my Wukong loadout only holds Kuva Bramma and random secondary so my twin always grab his bramma(for I don't carry a melee weapon the twin always holds the primary). I replace Primal Fury for Silence(of Banshee), and I am really enjoy to shoot Bramma to the floundering enemy with my twin. Since most enemy groups are easily crushed with some Bramma shots with my twins already I don't care for the damage at all.

By your logic, any ability that can buff yourself or other team mates should then be nerfed, to preserve the interests of the original frame's position in a group. Smite infusion? Nerfed. Shock trooper? Nerfed. That's not what this system was for. 

[Casardis]

1. Railjack Resource Cost

We've had many hotfixes and a full update since the Home Time where Rebecca talked about the Railjack resources.

With all due respect, I honestly cannot see what kind of statistics you've based those numbers on. Clearly a lot of people play in the Void to get argon crystals among other things, and probably are swimming in Control Modules, yet it requires only around 25 each feeding. On the other hand, your stats and data should have shown that you get TWO Fresnels as bonus rewards in Railjack, and how to Fuse\Build a T3 Railjack part, it requires only about 5 Fresnels, which should give an idea of the rarity of that resource.

How, for the love of the Void, did your statistic say that 1000 Fresnels for a single feeding was reasonable, and why after so many updates already, not even 1 adjustments to Helminth resource cost has been done? Sorry if I sound blunt here, or perhaps a bit salty, but I cannot wrap my mind around this decision to let it stay this way for so long, or for having it cost 1000 Fresnels on day 1. I'm not even that invested in the Helminth system, nor have I wasted resources by feeding it without restraint, but that doesn't make the situation less head-scratching than a bitey scratchikin.

 I'm sure the statistics you've seen is somewhat correct within that context, but counter-verifying with other elements in the game should have been done more thoroughly so this wouldn't have happened.

2. Where are all my resources?

Currently we're missing a lot of resources that could clearly be used for feeding. This ranges from fish part, mining extractions, but also miscellaneous stuff like Eidolon Shards (why is this not part of Sentient resources...?). I personally don't see any reasons not to include them when you included Railjack resources and Free Roam plants resources, even Deimos ones. 

[Flying_Scorpion]

Regarding Marked for Death:

You said you nerfed marked for death to make it more in line with developers original intentions for the usage of the ability: To use it on high value targets. Here's an alternative way you could have incentivized this behavior without pissing off so many players:

1. reduce the % of damage it converts into AOE 
2. give it a % damage multiplier onto the marked target 
3. % of defenses removed from target (armor/shield reduction)

If you don't agree with this, then it's worth considering what are the other reasons for the nerf. My suggestion would incentivize Marked for Death to be used on high value targets, and at the same time allow it to continue to nuke like it did pre-nerf. I'm sure there are other reasons why you nerfed it. Just trying to be helpful in solving the original issue/explanation brought forth by DE and reconcile it with the players who are pissed off.

Marked for death was not popular. I don't think I saw anyone use it, and I never even used it, even though I knew about the combinations of it with Ash's Fatal Teleport and Nyx's Mind Control. If I want to nuke something, I can just use something else like Equinox. So far, I've mostly just slapped roar on Warframe's that I like. The fact that I can slap Roar onto Equinox is hilarious and makes me perceive the nerf to MFD to be silly. You need to consider the setup time for things like that. If it takes time to set something like that up, and if it's not easy, then it's probably not going to get abused.

Just my 2 cents.


Moving on:

The devstream showed some charts and some abilities are obviously more replaced than others. Like Chroma's 1st ability for example. I think it's fair to let the data build up overtime so you have a large sample pool, but seriously...this data is VALUABLE! Please do not just ignore it. At least check on this data again, like schedule a review in 6 months or something.

Okay other feedback: 

• The flowers are cool
• The entire process of subsuming is awesomely cinematic
• 23 hour timer is good (24 hour timer would suck)
• The abilities available seems like a good mix
• Some abilities should probably be buffed to be more in line with average popularity. Like Chroma's 1 could use more range or secondary effects or something.
• Prices on stuff seems fine to me but I'm out of touch with how hard it is to acquire resources in this game.

[master_of_destiny]

So, day 1 it was apparent to the community that Bile costs were absolutely insane.  It was also apparent that Bile was going to be a forced time gate, given that it's basically a component in all of the powers which are new and a part of most of the easiest powers to obtain and apply without requiring huge investment.  Instead of dealing with the costing of a critical component, you've decided to nerf the one power which is supposedly mechanically broken.  Not fixing it, but fixing and applying a nerf.  It's absolutely idiotic, but at this point entirely what I expect.

 

Regarding the developer stream...I want to point out the idiocy.  Syndrome wanted to do something good, in an abundantly evil way.  Your community is asking for you to buff abilities, so that everything is good.  Not great, not over powered, just good.  The result isn't going to be not engaging with the system, it's going to be a much more difficult time deciding to give up the worst powers.  The conclusion that should be drawn is that Mesa's 1 is not particularly exciting, and that it needs to be changed to make it a much harder choice to give up.  Likewise, it should be noted that the grind for Zephyr is a joke, but she's seen as much action as Nidus.  A frame that you have to get to reward rotation C on a single mission, just to get the pieces.

 

I cannot believe after watching this stream that you even play the game.  It's insane to hear this from you, and the thing that people are most proud of it getting a new compression algorithm so that the textures take up less space.  

That's absolutely great to push your technology forward.  The obvious response there is that you're the next Bethesda.  The creation engine is a revised version of gamebryo....and after a decade it's just not enough.  The thing is Bethesda can count on outside modding.  They can count on community bug fixes.  You cannot.  The Helminth is proof of this, because at this point I'm just ignoring it once everything is fed in.  It's not like there's a compelling reason to use it when all of the powers will simply be nerfed to be equally bad choices.  If you only nerf then it's going to be the simplest meta, that is to say more damage is the only option.  

[AeinzPrime]

yeah skip nerfing this system and then delete it because it give player too much fun, your slogan is no fun allowed right? RIGHT?

[thurmack]

Two items of feedback:

1. Please consider some kind of infusion memory, so if I infuse a Warframe with an ability I can toggle that ability on an off without going back to Helminth and reinfusing at great expense. As it stands, experimentation is far too costly so I (and I suspect many others) just pick one ability that looks decent and leave it.

2. Perhaps as an adjunct, could we please have ranks of subsumes? I'd like to keep feeding Nekroses to Helminth to unlock infusion upgrades for that ability. Offhand the upgrades could reduce infusion costs, or maybe even unlock the aforementioned infusion memory.

[DarthBane1]

Would be cool if you could re-organize all the warframes powers. IE: I put the 1st ability on the second, fourth on first, etc.