The helminth system changes on some abilities as a people was calling it nerf don't have to be a complete Nerf if y'all change it a little bit

[(PSN)Dragontruemight]

Okay by changing some of the stats of the abilities into more weaker version of the original doesn't always have to be the case abilities you can change in some other aspects tweak the abilities as a compromise                                                                 Rhinos war:                                          maybe there's a chance you can increase the range and lesson aggro                                                                                                  Mirage - eclipse                                  it's not much I can think about it for compromise for disability all I can think of is increased the duration a bit more that's about it. So will be less work for modding for the ability and maybe increase the augments range greatly when it on a different frame.                                            Valkyr - Warcry :                           you could increase the slow effect of ability and the range so can it can affect more enemies I think that would be helpful for crowd control.                                                                                                                       Protea- dispenser?                    this one is kind of hard to think for a compromise for the reducing the duration all I can think of is it shoots out a sonic wave that lessons the aggro maybe .I don't know maybe that idea can an argument mod.                                                                                                                                     Nidus - larva                           since it range got reduced is there anyway y'all can make it draw the enemy's attention away from the caster.                                                                                          Wukong - Defy.                                   All I can think of for this one is maybe a longer stun effect on affected enemies after the ability is finished.                                                                                               Well this is end of my spitballing here. Maybe next changes for abilities that may have been tweaked from The originals can come with a little bit of compromise. Thank you for taking the time for reading

[(PSN)Dragontruemight]

Sorry for it not looking professional when I finished I when enter it to the system it kind of jumbled up all bit  I apologize😓

[(PSN)MYKK678]

This is what all the "PLEASEFFSDONTNERFMYPOWER!!!!!" people don't really understand. They saw a "nerf" and decided to throw a tantrum, without actually realising that ZERO information had actually been given, other than to say they'll be decreased. Rhino's Roar power has just as much of a chance of coming out of the decrease at 45% as it does 5%. But unfortunately nobody ever taught them why its a bad idea to "assume", and so they just assume the worst

[Shaburanigud]

I just hope they rework the underwhelming abilities when this patch goes up.

 

Whether or not it is a shared ability doesn't matter.
The fact that you could replace it or should replace an ability only shows how much of a problem that ability is right now.

[DeadlySurgeon]

8 minutes ago, (PS4)MYKK678 said:

This is what all the "PLEASEFFSDONTNERFMYPOWER!!!!!" people don't really understand. They saw a "nerf" and decided to throw a tantrum, without actually realising that ZERO information had actually been given, other than to say they'll be decreased. Rhino's Roar power has just as much of a chance of coming out of the decrease at 45% as it does 5%. But unfortunately nobody ever taught them why its a bad idea to "assume", and so they just assume the worst

One does learn to extrapolate from previous experiences with DE. I feel like the more damning bit is the fact that no hard numbers *have* been released, despite the fact that they could very easily allay the outcry...

Unless they just confirm what people are complaining about.

[(PSN)ChaosTheNerd]

1 hour ago, (PS4)MYKK678 said:

This is what all the "PLEASEFFSDONTNERFMYPOWER!!!!!" people don't really understand. They saw a "nerf" and decided to throw a tantrum, without actually realising that ZERO information had actually been given, other than to say they'll be decreased. Rhino's Roar power has just as much of a chance of coming out of the decrease at 45% as it does 5%. But unfortunately nobody ever taught them why its a bad idea to "assume", and so they just assume the worst

THISSSS

This is why I cant take this community seriously or these youtubers when we havent got actual abilities like watch the nerfs barely have any changes to the abilities I will laugh my ass off towards every nut job that lost their S#&$ in the last 24 hours.

[RazerXPrime]

I'm expecting this system to undergo a lot of changes once it comes out. This all is very complex from a balance standpoint. You're not looking at balancing 1 single frame, you're looking at balancing all of them at the same time. But we can all wait for those ignorant to what it means to manage something like this to cry once the first change hits. They will all be like: Oh see DE messed up and here's the first change. 

Trust me guys, this system will undergo a slew of changes before it settles down. It's only natural.

[CopperBezel]

Yep. Every new system. Don't know what game y'all been playing.

 

.... Bleh. Because this subject needed another topic.

2 hours ago, DeadlySurgeon said:

One does learn to extrapolate from previous experiences with DE. I feel like the more damning bit is the fact that no hard numbers *have* been released, despite the fact that they could very easily allay the outcry...

Unless they just confirm what people are complaining about.

I'm expecting Roar to be 35% and larva to be 10 m. I don't know (or care) whether those numbers are what you would consider worthy of this level of blind, screeching outcry. I do think that if those numbers were real and released, the people who are screaming about their nerfs and their entitlement now wouldn't be any happier.

The numbers literally can't be any more severe than that, either. Nourish Strike is 50% toxin damage that doesn't apply to procs and some abilities, and Ensnare is a 10 m grab radius. If Roar and Larva were nerfed below that floor, people would just use Nourish Strike and Ensnare, which we know weren't intended to be reduced. So if DE planned to reduce Roar and Larva any more than that, they'd have to have planned to reduce Nourish Strike and Ensnare too. 

[(PSN)Dragontruemight]

I was hoping to make a nice conversation 😅 for these abilities compromised on the changing  they doing the abilities by tweaking them a little bit so it won't feel as much as Nerf to some people. I didn't mean for to piss off some people that come out of nowhere to start complaining healthy small changes that we all know it was going to happen.

 

[CopperBezel]

If abilities get any kind of bonus, it makes sense that they get that bonus on the base frame, not as a result of using the Helminth. It'd just be thematically weird for abilities to come with extra bonuses when other frames used them. I mean, in theory, you could have a system where all of these abilities worked a little differently with every frame, but we know how many combinations that is.

It's just so much easier to say that the only frame that gets a bonus with Roar is, you know, Rhino. And that bonus is that it's a bigger damage increase than anyone else gets out of it.

[(PSN)Dragontruemight]

I do agree with you Copper when it comes to the original ability of the frame should be stronger that does make sense. I was just hoping since the ability have a slightly different tweak, since it won't be as strong being done by different frame. In that since makes it still plausible it won't feel like it a rip off in comparison it's some player eyes.

[(PSN)MYKK678]

On 2020-08-21 at 10:09 PM, DeadlySurgeon said:

One does learn to extrapolate from previous experiences with DE. I feel like the more damning bit is the fact that no hard numbers *have* been released, despite the fact that they could very easily allay the outcry...

Unless they just confirm what people are complaining about.

Sorry was away the last few days. Extrapolation is fine, if its based on actual data and not just hearsay or opinion. Personally i havent put any numbers together myself so i cant extrapolate anything, but my opinion is based on the decreases to recent items such as Catchmoon and Bramma. I'm sure we all have different opinions on those but i personally feel the right amount of decreasing was implemented. And if i believe the last 2 were correct i'm willing to wait and give them the benefit of the doubt.

Doesn't mean i'm right ofc, you cant be with a hypothetical opinion, but its just how i see it.

[gabuchan]

On 2020-08-22 at 5:07 AM, Shaburanigud said:

I just hope they rework the underwhelming abilities when this patch goes up.

 

Whether or not it is a shared ability doesn't matter.
The fact that you could replace it or should replace an ability only shows how much of a problem that ability is right now.

Yes. The main outrage wasn't exactly the nerf to the abilities anyway. It's the fact that DE said they're making that change so that those abilities don't become the overwhelming choice. If the goal is to increase player choice, it's just disappointing that their solution to that is to make the best abilities worse instead of making the other available abilities better.

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

I don't understand DE's logic in nerfing the Helminth stuff.

Ultimately the Objective of Helminth, is to encourage Plat Spending as people buy hard to farm duplicate frames from Market,

If they Nerf Helminth and make it so its not really worth bothering with, people will have less a reason to Spend.

Nerfing goes against the Objective of encouraging Spending.

 

If they're going to do any ability 'balancing' what they really ought to do is alter the selection so that the most powerful choices are from the grindiest frames like Nidus, Harrow, etc. while the least powerful choices come from the more common frames. Trying to aim for a equal power level in all abilities isn't going to maximize sales....

[CopperBezel]

DE has specifically removed elements before that had the potential to be arm twisting for plat. That's part of the ethos they try to maintain. 

They described their intentions for the Helminth as being a system for players with some experience and some resources to burn. I genuinely don't see any reason to think otherwise. The reason that's good for their bottom line is that it's yet another system for us to get invested in, leading us to continue to value our very special frames and buy them cosmetics and forma for their guns. At no point in that process does anyone seem to have considered or cared that Rhino is a 20 minute farm for MR10s, and I think that's pretty clearly a good thing.