Heart of Deimos: New Syndicates & Economy Feedback Megathread

[Els236]

il y a 4 minutes, ixidron92 a dit :

Why in the gods' name is conservation, a system so universally hated and barely played that might as well be called "Lunaro 2: electric boogaloo" is a goddamn requirement to rank up? Worst still, You need 5 son tokens to rank up and I can't stress this enough:

Son might ask you to deliver tags from species you can't capture because you don't have a high enough rank to buy the lures.

Son might ask you to deliver tags from species you can't capture because you don't have a high enough rank to buy the lures.

Son might ask you to deliver tags from species you can't capture because you don't have a high enough rank to buy the lures.

Son might ask you to deliver tags from species you can't capture because you don't have a high enough rank to buy the lures.

Son might ask you to deliver tags from species you can't capture because you don't have a high enough rank to buy the lures.

 

 

Animals free-roam like they do on POE.

 

Daytime you get Kubrows, Mites and Dragonflies

Nighttime you probably get Kavats and whatever else.

[vasRayya]

damn all you had to do was copy paste the fortuna syndicate leveling
this is literally worse and more confusing, and you can't even progress properly because it was so poorly thought out
really killed my hype

[-VS-Tora]

vor 1 Minute schrieb rachjumper:

this is literally worse and more confusing, and you can't even progress properly because it was so poorly thought out
really killed my hype

this

[RyuhoTheDragon]

The grind hit new levels of dumb. Need drops from things you cant even get. Very smart

[o0Despair0o]

I don't mean to be rude, but honestly, how did you believe that this token system and the absolute spam of Gates was a good idea?

 

Let me give you an example;

I want a Infested Kavat and Necramech, but I need to get past like 4 different gates to get them.

- Tokens, which are an absolute pain to aquire

- Standing, which is even more annoying to get (seriously, why can't I just get standing directly for completing bounties? These tokens are an insult!)

- Forced minigames like fishing and mining. These are nothing more than gimmicks. They were fun for a few minutes when PoE released but they got painfully boring soon after. And all these cheap reskins of said minigames don't make it any better.

- Even more new ressource types that have no use outside of Deimos. What did we tell you about content islands, DE?

And oh so many more issues with this update, not to mention bugs. Like, I had to restart the introduction quest to Deimos 3 times because your scripted events keep breaking.

 

Now that my rant is over, some suggestions:

1. Get rid of the token system. Please. Doesn't matter what game you play, Tokens have always been absolute nonsense and this game is no exception. Just let us gain standing directly for bounties, like PoE and Fortuna, and allow us to offer raw ressources instead of tokens for rank up

2. Reduce overal ressource costs. I can't even express it in words how bad these requirements are.

3. Stop forcing your minigames on people. If I want to catch fish I'll play a damn fishing simulator.

4. Put a sticky note on your monitors that says "no reputation walls for future content"

[RadicalZer0]

fishing,  mining and conservation ............ ? really... ?

ok, ...better skip  this update

[BlackCat500]

It was probably a mistake to put all kinds of non combat activity resources as requirements for ranking up the syndicate(s), even if on the previous ones we had the same thing. Probably a lot of people are about to complain. I'm not going to bother with it for today and I will explain why, but if you don't want to hear the actual reasoning for why a player does not want to do partake in that activity just skip to the bold text. Granted, I'd like if you did read the rest.

 

Spoiler

As much as I hate bounties for how long they are in comparison to normal missions and how I still have to wait out conversations before finally starting a bounty (long standing complaint of mine, to be honest, but that's beside the point), I would rather do many more bounties than to bother with conservation, mining and fishing just for ranking up - rather than when I actually feel like it, which is almost never. I hate most of those systems. They're not bad, in fact I think their design is fairly good - it's just not the thing I look for in warframe. Like...at all. Ever. It's not what I play it for. For those things I'd rather play games that are respectively focused on it. Stardew valley, minecraft, anything of that sort, but not warframe. The name itself kind of opposes that very idea to me.

 

The feedback here (bolding this so it catches your attention), is the following: I would love to see an alternative to ranking up each level in the syndicates, the idea would be very simple: depending on what activity a player enjoys, they can choose the activity-related resource to contribute.

For example, let's say a rank requires 1000 credits and ? fish scales to level up. You could turn that into: 1000 credits and ( x mother tokens OR y fish scales OR z amounts of this and that). You're the type of player who prefers combat? Great! Fight your heart out in bounties. You like fishing? Excellent, go dive in some mucus for scaly bois. Etc.

[ixidron92]

Next time you develop a new economy system, every single member of the developing team should play until they get everything and agree that everything is ok. Only then should you proceed with that economy.

[QU67]

I wasn't expecting a huge revision to the way the open world's systems work. I also wasn't expecting a regression of the leveling systems. I dislike the bounty/mining grind as much as the next player, but I'd rather do endless bounties than be forced to do RNG fishing or conservation missions to rank up the Entrati. I'm fine with having to do fishing or conservation if I need a specific resource from them, but having to deal with vendor RNG on top of activities that I'm ambivalent toward makes me actively dislike those activities.

Fortuna's and Cetus's grinds were boring, but they're functional. So far, Deimos' seems poorly planned out and needlessly complicated. Adding more and more layers of RNG does not make things more interesting or fun.

[blitzsharp]

Locking progress behind Conservation, which was a suppose to be an optional side quest is a huge mistake. Also, needing tags from high level animals, which are not available in the first tiers, to pass level 1. This is not properly thought of.

[ixidron92]

Gotta agree with pretty much everyone in the thread; tokens are stupid and should go the way of the dodo. 

Conservation, fishing and mining should be optional for progression, just like the PoE and Fortuna. 

[Kuilvax]

Forcing people to do fishing and observation just to progress to even first tier is just straight up a joke. I'm okay with being have to do mining fishing and observation to craft warframes mechs and guns but doing them to level up a syndicate ? thats a big no no no no. Just remove the whole token system

[QU67]

The only thing I like about the tokens is being able to bank standing and not have to worry about logging in every reset to do bounties. I just have to log in and turn the tokens in.

That being said, it's giving me vanilla Destiny 2 flashbacks.

[Pancoar]

Please don't force fishing and conservation on me to rank up. Fortuna was was fine, just let me get rep from the bounties PLEASE....

[Althaline]

See, the tokens themselves aren't the issue here. The issue is how difficult they are to obtain and the overspecialization of every token. It's like you took Ticker's trade-in, locked the trades to only new resources, made each tier of Debt-Bond equivalent require a different activity, then made the Debt-Bond equivalents required for literally everything.

[Aldain]

8 minutes ago, Iamabearlulz said:

See, the tokens themselves aren't the issue here. The issue is how difficult they are to obtain and the overspecialization of every token. It's like you took Ticker's trade-in, locked the trades to only new resources, made each tier of Debt-Bond equivalent require a different activity, then made the Debt-Bond equivalents required for literally everything.

[Xylena_Lazarow]

54 minutes ago, -VS-Tora said:

really killed my hype

Yea I'm not even excited for Helminth anymore. I'll check it out when I don't have to do chores to unlock it.

WTB Helminth Segment 200p

[ixidron92]

Let's hope they removed son tokens from all progression ranks or this is one standing I might never rank up. 

[attilathehunnybun]

I actually really like the system of getting tokens instead of standing for bounties. That way, if I feel like doing bounties all day I can hoard tokens, and the next day when I feel like doing something else I can just cash in the tokens from the day before. 

[(PSN)thegarada]

2 hours ago, Voltage said:

This forced requirement to do conservation and mining is straight up bad. Let me do bounties and play Warframe to progress syndicates, not fishing, mining, or spending Platinum (to buy fish parts/gems/ores) to get these dumb tokens.

Remove Tokens

Remove Grandmother

Make this like PoE/Fortuna with multiple avenues for progression and just use standing. Stuffing non-combat activities down players' throats isn't fun.

Quoting so I do not re-type. Having mining, fishing and conservation as options is one thing. Having them as mandatory is hard #*!%ing no. REMOVE ALL THE TOKENS. If they are not removed, I will not even bother with Helminth.

Locking the main part of the update behind boring syndicate grind activities, that most players despise, is beyond design fail. 

Also, is mining, fishing and conservation the only extracurricular activities we can ever have? Having them in every single open world is getting old to begin with. +

Since I started playing WF, this update is unquestionably the worst.

[lukinu_u]

Il y a 1 heure, kohlths a dit :

honestly my only problems are the rng aspect of the tokens and how you cant see what is required

tokens should be more direct like:
son accepts different tiers of tags for different amounts of tokens, more tokens for more difficult creatures

daughter should allow fish to be directly traded in for tokens directly based on rarity and size

grandmothers tokens are fine as they gain you alot of standing

father could have a sort of resource bar where you can give him materials to fill the bar and get tokens from it (sorta like helminth system item feeding)
 

I second this, +1

[Steel_Rook]

My first reaction to the Anthrati Token progression system was confusion and frustration. At a glance, this seems complicated for the sake of being complicated and wasting my time, and no other compelling reason. I realise there are benefits to it, such as being able to hoard tokens. However, the Tokens system as currently designed has the same issue as the initial implementation of Nightwave:

Forcing everyone to participate in all the activities ensures that everyone is miserable because everyone ends up having to do activities they don't like.

Forcing people to fish, mine and do conservation just to progress through the Anthrati Syndicate is a BAD idea. Not everyone likes all of these things. Worse - this goes entirely against the economy changes done to Fortuna and Cetus, where combat alternatives were introduced to the various mining, fishing and conservation activities. There's a reason that the Exploiter Orb and the various Tusk Thumpers drop fish parts, ores and gems - because it's a way for people who don't like "MMO peasant simulator" to still progress without bogging down the experience. I thought you guys had learned this two years ago with Fortuna, yet here we are again.

I'll need to experiment some more with the Anthrati Syndicate - chances are it's not AS bad as it appears at first experience. However, my disagreement with it is ideological. DON'T force players to do all the activities. Let US pick which activities we like and which we'd rather not do.

[NightmareT12]

Okay, so I think I've finally cracked this after doing a few bounties.

The real issue here is that token acquisition doesn't feel progressive -- it actually isn't bad at all, although I will agree forcing people to play certain aspects can be not compelling.

Because you land on Deimos with a new system and see all of this overwhelming stuff at first, with all resources at 0/X, it scares you, and some people will not even grant the system a chance due this. However doing a couple missions (and I really mean it, especially for Vault ones) will get you enough material to get you started doing the various trades for tokens.

So I would probably suggest making sure you direct players to these resources better, especially with bounty rewards.

I would probably suggest increasing Vault difficulties as you rank Mother up with better rewards in the drops, hmm.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

Why are the conservation animals locked behind the day/night cycle?

All these changes to the Entrati reputation progress just feel bloated and arbitrary.

[Chaos0Frenzy]

This whole system is crap. It railroads players into doing things they hate to progress. It needs a complete rework to resemble the other open world systems.