Remove trade chat, it is toxic

[winterau]

The trade chat channel should simply be removed as it is toxic.

There is a third party auction house and it serves perfectly well because there is no in game auction capability. Instead you have the useless trade chat where people want to buy for 50% of the 3rd party auction house prices and people want to sell for 200% of the 3rd party auction house prices.

The only thing the trade chat achieves is to scam noobs who don't know any better. Why would you want to keep that in place? Replace it with a link to the 3rd party auction houses which allow market forces to set prices instead of just allowing people to get scammed.

[krc473]

5 minutes ago, winterau said:

Instead you have the useless trade chat where people want to buy for 50% of the 3rd party auction house prices and people want to sell for 200% of the 3rd party auction house prices.

When did the prices on these third party sites become the correct prices? 

[Voltage]

You can remove yourself from trade chat if you do not like it. It's entirely optional. If you want to use Warframe.Market so badly, then go use that website instead of trying to ask trade chat to comply with some unaffiliated website basically run by desperate players undercutting for a quick buck.

[Miyabi-sama]

6 минут назад, winterau сказал:

Why would you want to keep that in place?

To scam noobs who don't know any better. Platinum must flow.

[Xolgys]

so, this is ur personal take on trade chat. the few individuals ive come accross which really were "toxic" were an easy insta ignore - done. ppl nowadays are so fast to use "toxic" when the term doesnt even really apply for the most part. if u dislike trade chat feel free to not use it, ur choice.

calling everyone, including me by the way, toxic just because we use trade chat is pretty bold to say the least.

 

in terms of prices: no matter which of the external auction houses u use u can get "scammed" anywhere since riven prices vary wildly wherever u look. other things have more or less fixed prices varying based on accessability and demand, as per usual.

if people dont inform themselves about prices they are always easy targets for people who overprice but thats also their own fault too. happens in real life, happens in games. knowledge is power/money.

u cant bandaid that.

[WarmongerExtraordinare]

10 минут назад, winterau сказал:

Replace it with a link to the 3rd party auction houses which allow market forces to set prices instead of just allowing people to get scammed.

free. market.

[Above]

Nah

[taiiat]

remove Humanity, it is toxic.

 

oh, does your logic now suddenly not seem as broadly applicable as you wanted it to be 3 seconds ago? heh.

[Faras]

 

[winterau]

Hahaha, I can see this is an unpopular opinion. So I see a lot of people want to continue to be able to scam the noobs.

Just ridiculous people trying to buy for way below market prices and sell for way above. The only people who will fall for that are noobs who don't know any better.

Keep on scamming 🤑

[khazlol]

Trade chat is the Mos Eisley of warframe.

[Letter13]

13 minutes ago, winterau said:

Hahaha, I can see this is an unpopular opinion. So I see a lot of people want to continue to be able to scam the noobs.

Just ridiculous people trying to buy for way below market prices and sell for way above. The only people who will fall for that are noobs who don't know any better.

Keep on scamming 🤑

Nothing scamming about it. It's a free market. Sellers are allowed to advertise/sell for whatever price they want, just as buyers are allowed to buy for whatever price they feel is fair. Worth is subjective in that regard.

 

I'm guessing you ended up paying more for an item than what it's displayed for on Warframe.market. Well, Warframe.market is not an official site. It's a third party resource that can be manipulated pretty much the same way that the in-game chat can. While I'm sorry to hear that you had a less than desirable experience with trading with other players, but the simple fact is that if you were willing to pay that amount for said item then you felt at the time that it was a fair amount. Sometimes you wind up buying something you find is cheaper somewhere else.

 

Want to know the best way to approach trade chat? 

"Looking to buy <item> provide best offer" or "Looking to sell <item> provide best offer" and then wait a bit, after you've gotten some offers, pick the one that's the best.

[nslay]

I like to use "WTT" in trade channel. I trade very rarely, but I have traded item-for-item without having to work directly with plat. Though, I do try to gauge fair trades off of warframe.market et al. Anyway, I would not like to see the removal of the trade chat in favor of using eBay style auction houses because I prefer not to work directly with plat and I prefer not to play the game like a shopping/auction simulator.

[hs0003]

I vote Letter13 for best community moderator.

[winterau]

1 minute ago, Letter13 said:

Nothing scamming about it. It's a free market. Sellers are allowed to advertise/sell for whatever price they want, just as buyers are allowed to buy for whatever price they feel is fair. Worth is subjective in that regard, and it's a free market economy.

 

I'm guessing you wound up paying more for an item than what it's displayed for on Warframe.market. Well, Warframe.market is not an official site. It's a third party resource that can be manipulated pretty much the same way that the in-game chat can. In this case, sorry to hear that you had a less than desirable experience with trading with other players, but the simple fact is that you were willing to pay that amount for said item and felt at the time that it was a fair amount.

It isn't a free market. It is a limited market that is being exploited by the lack of information about what something is actually worth. When you have an interaction between only 2 people, it isn't representative of the worth of an item, it is purely just about knowledge. Like the person who tries to buy Weeping Wounds for 60 plat or the person who tries to sell it for 200. They are trying to exploit a lack of knowledge. That is not a free market.

 

Nope, I didn't end up paying more for an item that is displayed on warframe.market because I already knew about it. I'm saying that the trade chat only serves a single purpose and that is to scam people who don't know any better (e.g. trying to sell Atlas Prime for 60 plat when you can get him for 35 plat). The people that are for the trade chat simply want to exploit other players ignorance, and sure, that makes sense from a wanting to screw other people to benefit yourself, but from an overall game positivity perspective, it is a net negative.

[Above]

FeelsBadMan that you overpaid but life goes on my guy

[bibmobello]

It's not free market because it's just influenced by Partner streamers and with absurd inside trading actions.

[Letter13]

2 minutes ago, winterau said:

Like the person who tries to buy Weeping Wounds for 60 plat or the person who tries to sell it for 200. They are trying to exploit a lack of knowledge. That is not a free market.

You literally just described what a free market is.

Person A is only willing to spend 60 platinum on an item.

Person B is only willing to sell said item for 200 platinum.

Person A and Person B can negotiate to see if they can reach an amount that is satisfactory to both sides, or they can simply not go through with the deal.

Person C might be selling said item for only 100 platinum, but this isn't actually indicative of what the item is actually worth; it's indicative of what the item is worth to Person C but not necessarily what it's worth to Person B. Meanwhile, Person A believes the item is worth only 60 platinum.

Then let's introduce Person D (for Dolla-Dolla-Bills-Y'all). Person D has lots of the item that Person A wants to buy, and many more copies than Person B and Person C. To Person D, this item is worth only 20 platinum because they have a large supply of it.

So, Person A only pays 20 platinum to Person D, despite having been willing to originally pay 60 platinum. So I ask you... is Person A now scamming Person D by only paying 20, and not 60? Wouldn't this mean Person A is now exploiting the lack of 'knowledge' of Person D?

...

The answer is no, they are not, just as Person B and Person C are not scamming Person A by wanting 200 and 100 platinum respectively. This is the hallmark of a free market; people are allowed to sell items for what they believe they are worth. If they price something too high, then no one will buy it, just as if someone is looking to buy something for too low of a price, they'll never find a seller.

[(PSN)Silver1593]

Today i saw a seer riven for 4000 platinum , i think that was  a joke

[Rhyandra]

vor 53 Minuten schrieb krc473:

When did the prices on these third party sites become the correct prices? 

Nobody said they're correct. Have you ever even looked at trade chat? People try to sell literally everything for the most ridiculous prices. Hell, anytime I tried to sell god rivens from meta weapons there, people tried to screw me over (Price ranges from 50-150). Trade chat is useless 99% of the time if you wanna try to buy or sell anything. Would it help getting rid of it? I honestly don't know. But I can for sure say that me, and a LOT of other people would never miss it.

[bibmobello]

8 minutes ago, Letter13 said:

You literally just described what a free market is.

Person A is only willing to spend 60 platinum on an item.

Person B is only willing to sell said item for 200 platinum.

Person A and Person B can negotiate to see if they can reach an amount that is satisfactory to both sides, or they can simply not go through with the deal.

Person C might be selling said item for only 100 platinum, but this isn't actually indicative of what the item is actually worth; it's indicative of what the item is worth to Person C but not necessarily what it's worth to Person B. Meanwhile, Person A believes the item is worth only 60 platinum.

Then let's introduce Person D (for Dolla-Dolla-Bills-Y'all). Person D has lots of the item that Person A wants to buy, and many more copies than Person B and Person C. To Person D, this item is worth only 20 platinum because they have a large supply of it.

So, Person A only pays 20 platinum to Person D, despite having been willing to originally pay 60 platinum. So I ask you... is Person A now scamming Person D by only paying 20, and not 60? Wouldn't this mean Person A is now exploiting the lack of 'knowledge' of Person D?

...

The answer is no, they are not, just as Person B and Person C are not scamming Person A by wanting 200 and 100 platinum respectively. This is the hallmark of a free market; people are allowed to sell items for what they believe they are worth. If they price something too high, then no one will buy it, just as if someone is looking to buy something for too low of a price, they'll never find a seller.

Negotiate? Are you kidding me? i still remember i wanted a tiberon prime riven , i didn't have any experience  and a guy put an insertion(it was a good one ,without price) in the wrong chat. I called him and...

Fk..

Is it ok 100?

yes but i have to call my friend because it's not mine

hey

after 10 minutes

he call his friend (that it was just another account...)

after 40 minutes of absurd phrases..

 

I am a scammer, he wanted 9000 plat,  i am a toxic person and i am the kind of people destroying

 game like warframe.

blocking me...

 

All this from a closed beta tester 30 years old...

 

So please continue to just  "moderate" here...

[---Swaggi---]

Ok Boomer. 

[(PSN)Deeceem]

I always tell people who try to tell me my price is wrong according to warframe.market to go buy it from there then. Sorry, bud. I value my time higher. That's what you ultimately pay plat for: my time modified by supply and demand which fluctuates in trade chat. So you don't have to spend your time.

[Voltage]

13 minutes ago, (PS4)martinsuha593 said:

Today i saw a seer riven for 4000 platinum , i think that was  a joke

Depends on the roll, but on PC, that sort of price for a Riven is not unheard of.

[(XBOX)KayAitch]

56 minutes ago, winterau said:

There is a third party auction house and it serves perfectly well

It really doesn't. It's full of scams, is easy to game (and has been multiple times), and bases prices off those listed in trade chat.

It's also very skewed to PC, and US region PC has a particularly toxic riven asset bubble (ie people buying rivens as 'investments' rather than for what gameplay they offer) resulting in rivens costing tens or hundreds of thousands of plat.

59 minutes ago, winterau said:

The only thing the trade chat achieves is to scam noobs who don't know any better

It's the only option on console, where you often can't connect to anyone you meet online due to how XBL or PSN regions are siloed.

However, on trade chat in the UK I have sold lots of rivens and bought lots of rivens, never for crazy prices (500p absolute max in any one trade) and while it's not great it's way better than the third party sites. 

DE doesn't want an auction house, because of how they've destroyed the player base in games like Diablo. They want the market a little buried and a little awkward for players to reach, precisely because of the aforementioned asset bubble - they don't care about protecting anyone's investment into rivens (quite the opposite) they care about new players getting reasons to keep playing.

I think they could just fix trade chat really easily:

- make it easier to link items

- all posts must be either buy, sell or swap.

- can't post to sell without linking an item and listing a guide price.

- can't post to buy without a guide offer

- can't post to swap without linking 2 items.

Nothing has to actually sell for these guide amounts, it's just to stop the weird toxic PMO thing where nobody wants to make a starting offer or has any idea what ballpark the other is operating in. That's the rediculous bit that's a pain and a waste of time in the chat - real markets work just fine with listing prices, even if it's offers-over, or auction guide, or whatever.