Being Overpowered is Good and Nerfs are Bad.

[Marvelous_A]

I dare DE can simply cut 25% damage from our most powerful weapons and they'd still be overpowered for our content.

Challenge in this game are coming from getting one-shot and power nullifying. That's why the normally weak Stalker become the most powerful enemy in Steel Path because he does both. And Corpus.

[Opyt]

18 hours ago, Teljaxx said:

See, you guys aren't actually complaining about the nerfs themselves. You are just upset that your perceived value of the item is no longer worth the price you paid. If its not the best gun in the whole game, then its not worth the time, effort, or money you spent on it.

Its really just buyer's remorse, and it wouldn't be nearly as bad if the grinding in this game wasn't so stupid. If getting all the resources, forma, potatoes, exilus, and riven rolls you need to maximize your gear didn't take so frustratingly long to do, then this wouldn't be as much of an issue. Because, if you're going to spend all that effort on a weapon, it dang well better be the best, most overpowered god cannon in the entire universe, right?

Even though you cry "NERF!", and whine that your gun is worthless now, it really isn't. Its actually still perfectly useable, and more in line with the rest of the guns in the game. But, an average weapon isn't worth the premium price you paid, so you complain.

In  your eyes, what's an acceptable reason to be disappointed in nerfs?  Is it okay to be disappointed in DE when they have something new about to be released but don't deliver on their promise of buffing abilities to be more appealing?  Or is that just buyer's remorse for spending the past 5 years giving them money and playing for 7?

Is it okay to be mad at DE for nerfs when they can't, or won't, deliver on their promises?  Like queueing items in the foundry?  Remote foundry operation from places like Cetus and Fortuna?  "Viable" objective healing as a way to give more choice in what you take to a mission with a stationary objective?  What about things like when they don't deliver on their promised content for railjack but instead go off and make a third open island 

Is it "buyer's remorse" when after 3 years of Vazarin's Protective Dash they jerk their knee and #*!% it into the dirt so that now it heals 100hp/s for 5s instead of 60% over 5 seconds?

Maybe it was buyer's remorse when they finally changed Gara's 2 so that it now only gives a flat 50% damage reduction to stationary objectives. 🤔

[bibmobello]

7 minutes ago, Opyt said:

In  your eyes, what's an acceptable reason to be disappointed in nerfs?  Is it okay to be disappointed in DE when they have something new about to be released but don't deliver on their promise of buffing abilities to be more appealing?  Or is that just buyer's remorse for spending the past 5 years giving them money and playing for 7?

Is it okay to be mad at DE for nerfs when they can't, or won't, deliver on their promises?  Like queueing items in the foundry?  Remote foundry operation from places like Cetus and Fortuna?  "Viable" objective healing as a way to give more choice in what you take to a mission with a stationary objective?  What about things like when they don't deliver on their promised content for railjack but instead go off and make a third open island 

Is it "buyer's remorse" when after 3 years of Vazarin's Protective Dash they jerk their knee and #*!% it into the dirt so that now it heals 100hp/s for 5s instead of 60% over 5 seconds?

OMG  i cried so much for these "nerfs"...😭 

If this game was a real game, you didn't have any operator, free healing, OP AoE weapons, immortal frames, spamming abilities every second like an idiot or smashing the melee button like an epileptic guy.

Remove all these craps and kick the occasional players away can be a solution instead to appear ridiculous with a such incomplete messy game after 7 years...

[Teljaxx]

41 minutes ago, Opyt said:

In  your eyes, what's an acceptable reason to be disappointed in nerfs?  Is it okay to be disappointed in DE when they have something new about to be released but don't deliver on their promise of buffing abilities to be more appealing?  Or is that just buyer's remorse for spending the past 5 years giving them money and playing for 7?

Is it okay to be mad at DE for nerfs when they can't, or won't, deliver on their promises?  Like queueing items in the foundry?  Remote foundry operation from places like Cetus and Fortuna?  "Viable" objective healing as a way to give more choice in what you take to a mission with a stationary objective?  What about things like when they don't deliver on their promised content for railjack but instead go off and make a third open island 

Is it "buyer's remorse" when after 3 years of Vazarin's Protective Dash they jerk their knee and #*!% it into the dirt so that now it heals 100hp/s for 5s instead of 60% over 5 seconds?

Maybe it was buyer's remorse when they finally changed Gara's 2 so that it now only gives a flat 50% damage reduction to stationary objectives. 🤔

As I said in my other post, these aren't nerfs. DE took completely overpowered abilities, and made them less overpowered. They aren't useless, and in most cases, they are still too good. The only reason you think they aren't is because you don't want them to be good enough, you want them to be the best.

Good does not equal powerful. Bad does not equal weak. Sometimes, when something is working properly, it feels weak. But that's because you aren't supposed to rely on it alone to carry you through the entire game. You need to strategically combine it with other minor abilities to win. Good game design comes from limiting the player, then making them find interesting ways to get around those limitations. Like how, in Darksiders II, the entire parkour/wall climbing system works because Death can barely jump. Instead, any time you need to get across a big gap, or up to a high place, you go through a fun wall climbing puzzle section. But, that wouldn't work if you could simply fly wherever you wanted. And that's just what Warframe lets you do with bullet jumping and aim gliding. Not to mention all the Frames that can literally just fly. How often do you wall run in Warframe, and how often do you just fly past everything? And which one is more interesting to do?

Its the same reason a game like Doom isn't nearly as fun if you just turn on godmode and infinite ammo. Managing your limited resources, like HP and ammo, is one of the most basic, yet important, things that makes games fun. And taking away that need, whether with cheat codes or overpowered abilities, also takes away the fun. In Warframe, its way too easy to just become nigh-invulnerable and kill everything so fast that managing ammo, health, and energy don't matter. So what limitations do we have? What resources do we have to carefully manage? What challenges do we have to overcome?

That's why those abilities you mentioned got "nerfed". They made all this important resource management far too easy, and the whole game boring as a result. As I said, the main reason people get so angry about this in Warframe specifically is because it takes so much effort to get these abilities in the first place. Grinding focus or farming rare Frame parts and mods takes so long that it better be worth it. And way too many people have been trained by modern games to think that the only thing worth it is not just more power, but the most power. But, that's just a crutch that they lean on because they don't want to get better as a player. If you take it away, and force them to walk on their own for once, they hate it. They cry about "muh power fantasy!" instead of simply adapting, and realizing that they could be having more fun now, than before.

I get the whole power fantasy thing. I love when games make me feel super powerful. But, the power fantasy aspect only works if there is some kind of challenge to overcome. But, what ever challenges the self propelled obliteration engines we have become in Warframe? What part of the game can you look at and be proud that you overcame it? Nothing. You, as a player, never have to work to overcome anything. You just strap on better gear, and let your absurdly huge numbers do all the work.

 

Also, not delivering on "promised" content, like the forge features you mentioned, has nothing to do with buffing or nerfing, so I have no idea why you brought that up.

[(PSN)AyinDygra]

The problem with the word "Overpowered" is that it's always relative to the design parameters envisioned by the creators of the individual scenario, and is not all-game-encompassing.

Balance then depends not on some spreadsheet of numbers or resultant numbers in the game even... it's the experience in the game.

This means a weapon could be JUST RIGHT in some content, but "Overpowered" in other content. Like a Mastery Rank 15 weapon with max mods and forma taking a few shots to kill a level 100+ bombard, but one-shotting a level 3 Bombard on earth (for argument's sake) ... this MR15 weapon would not necessarily be "Overpowered," despite its performance on earth.

Beyond even this evaluation, there are Mastery Ranking brackets that each weapon falls into. A Mastery Rank 1 weapon should not out-perform a Mastery Rank 15 weapon. When it comes to balance, weapons with in a Mastery Rank should probably be of like power. There can and should be variations within ranks, such as better against certain weapon types, different gameplay quirks (charged shots, continuous beams, rapid fire, etc). Ideally, there would be one weapon in each rank that fit into each category of play style or niche specialty that a person could advance with the entire way up at each stage (the lower MR weapons becoming fodder as one progressed.)

 

One must then look at the content and the design parameters envisioned by the creators of the individual scenario.

MOST of Warframe is currently a horde shooter-looter, which, by its very nature, is centered around scenarios where you are killing a large number of enemies collecting mostly trash gear or crafting components over a long period of time (grinding). If they suddenly started "balancing" the game around each enemy taking strategy to approach and kill as a team, or using cover, or switching to a certain weapon, or aiming for weakspots/headshots... it would ruin the flow of the game. Having mini-bosses to mix things up a little are already in the game as Eximus units and hunting assassins/kill squads.

Horde shooter-looter games like this benefit greatly from the "overpowered" or "power fantasy" feeling people get of wiping out hordes of enemies (which is the most efficient way to progress in the game.)

Nerfs are usually going to come across as "Bad" in my evaluations. If a weapon doesn't fit its Mastery Rank bracket... I'd say move it higher up, until it reaches a bracket with similar power levels of other weapons.

Nerfing breaks an unstated, but implied promise: these are the stats of this weapon. This is what you need to do to get this weapon. This is the amount of effort you need to put into this weapon, and these are the things you need to add to this weapon (sometimes costing real money, when they speed through the process, like not waiting to farm and build forma) to make it as powerful as it can be.
When something is nerfed, those are no longer the stats of the weapon, the effort put into acquiring the weapon, and all the effort put into advancing the weapon/frame to is potential maximum could all be wasted if those stats no longer make it "worth" the investment. This leads to distrust of DE, and lack of motivation to put ANY effort into any future weapons/frames with the subconscious thought that if it's good, it'll probably be nerfed, and all that effort will be wasted.

Nerfs are bad. Overpowered is wishy-washy good.

Edit:

Spoiler

Don't make me laugh about GGG balancing right... they're insane over there. Every time I see DE doing something they're copying from GGG, I am sad. (from what I have seen/read, DE does hold GGG in high regard for their success in the Free-to-play arena, but I really hope they don't try to "learn" from them... GGG makes so many stupid decisions it's not even funny.)

 

[Opyt]

34 minutes ago, Teljaxx said:

As I said in my other post, these aren't nerfs. DE took completely overpowered abilities, and made them less overpowered. They aren't useless, and in most cases, they are still too good. The only reason you think they aren't is because you don't want them to be good enough, you want them to be the best.

Good does not equal powerful. Bad does not equal weak. Sometimes, when something is working properly, it feels weak. But that's because you aren't supposed to rely on it alone to carry you through the entire game. You need to strategically combine it with other minor abilities to win. Good game design comes from limiting the player, then making them find interesting ways to get around those limitations. Like how, in Darksiders II, the entire parkour/wall climbing system works because Death can barely jump. Instead, any time you need to get across a big gap, or up to a high place, you go through a fun wall climbing puzzle section. But, that wouldn't work if you could simply fly wherever you wanted. And that's just what Warframe lets you do with bullet jumping and aim gliding. Not to mention all the Frames that can literally just fly. How often do you wall run in Warframe, and how often do you just fly past everything? And which one is more interesting to do?

Its the same reason a game like Doom isn't nearly as fun if you just turn on godmode and infinite ammo. Managing your limited resources, like HP and ammo, is one of the most basic, yet important, things that makes games fun. And taking away that need, whether with cheat codes or overpowered abilities, also takes away the fun. In Warframe, its way too easy to just become nigh-invulnerable and kill everything so fast that managing ammo, health, and energy don't matter. So what limitations do we have? What resources do we have to carefully manage? What challenges do we have to overcome?

That's why those abilities you mentioned got "nerfed". They made all this important resource management far too easy, and the whole game boring as a result. As I said, the main reason people get so angry about this in Warframe specifically is because it takes so much effort to get these abilities in the first place. Grinding focus or farming rare Frame parts and mods takes so long that it better be worth it. And way too many people have been trained by modern games to think that the only thing worth it is not just more power, but the most power. But, that's just a crutch that they lean on because they don't want to get better as a player. If you take it away, and force them to walk on their own for once, they hate it. They cry about "muh power fantasy!" instead of simply adapting, and realizing that they could be having more fun now, than before.

I get the whole power fantasy thing. I love when games make me feel super powerful. But, the power fantasy aspect only works if there is some kind of challenge to overcome. But, what ever challenges the self propelled obliteration engines we have become in Warframe? What part of the game can you look at and be proud that you overcame it? Nothing. You, as a player, never have to work to overcome anything. You just strap on better gear, and let your absurdly huge numbers do all the work.

 

Also, not delivering on "promised" content, like the forge features you mentioned, has nothing to do with buffing or nerfing, so I have no idea why you brought that up.

I brought it up because not delivering on "promised content" (and I like how you demonstrate that sarcasm there, I don't like it), is a vital part of a dev team's reputation, and I wanted to see how you'd react to it as an ardent defender zealot.  This forum is rife with people that run around laughing at people because their toys got shoved back in the sandbox and I find that to be disgusting.  What makes a game fun for you doesn't make the game fun for me.  The game WAS fun, but then because of people like you I'm not allowed to have my fun, and have to go back to "damage go brrrrr".  No more rescuing a defense objective from being nearly destroyed because I'm playing solo, no more NOT playing one of the defense-heavy frames, because if I wanted to play Gauss on a Lich Mobile Defense, I'm gonna be SoL if I can't kill the enemies faster than they spawn.  No more enjoying the game at my own pace.  No more Baza because it can't keep up with the sheer amount of health on enemies after a certain point, no more Corinth with a decent riven because, again, the health, armor and shields scale up to the point where it doesn't keep up.  No more fun.  All because people like you want everyone to be the same carbon #*!%ing copy of one another running around with the same 9 or so warframes and the same 6 or 7 weapons out of the dozens that exist.

You and the people like you defending DE every time they decide a nerf (the lazy way to fix things) is the only way can go #*!% yourselves.  But have a nice day... I guess.

[844448]

13 hours ago, killerJoke66 said:

@Krankbert Tell me how these two sentences any conflicting , i want a well constructed answer. 

1- they mostly nerf stuff when it is trivializing the game too much yes i know that , 
2 - As someone has said earlier that DE don't nerf stuff that is overpowered and slips under radar but rather popular stuff that clears 50 level enemies fast .. anything clears these fast 

The reason why there are things being overpowered and slips under the radar is because of the statement itself, "slips under the radar" means it doesn't draw attention. DE monitor the statistics on the usage so if things are too high on the sheet, expect the nerf like catchmoon with 50% usage across the playerbase

Let's say stug is overpowered where you can wreck steel path with the weapon alone for example, but since almost no one but me using it, the number on the chart is way too low to warrant a nerf, let alone investigation, thus, slipping under the radar

Do you understand the meaning "slip under the radar" in the first place?

[_Anise_]

if everyone is overpowered and you balance your content around that then its fine (and no one is really "overpowered")

[844448]

11 hours ago, Demqnboii said:

Yeah but DE will never understand that challange doesn't mean bullet sponges but enemies with delegraphed attacks that you have to dodge in time or you'll be punished. AI in warframe is dumb as a headless cockroach, it waddles around bumping into whatever it still feels. I feel like the game would be 80%+ fun and engaging if every enemy had something special about them that is dangerous, and im not talking about erasing the undestructible space ninja vibes but atleast make me feel like i need to focus and not just spam the mouse click or E button. We need more stuff like the noxes, atleast they run at you, or something like the leaping thrasher that does have some telegraphed attacks you can dodge. Bossfights like the Ropalolyst or reworked Jackal had used the telegraphed attacks department pretty well. I mean sure, challange can be different for people but wouldn't you enjoy dodging an attack and you could do somekind of epic parazon move to turn the tables around? I swear to god i think i played way too much Metal Gear Rising Revengeance xD, but i mean that game implemented telegraphed attacks that could harm you if you don't dodge/block them pretty well ó.ó

Telegraphed attacks wouldn't be completed and have any effect when we're killing enemies in one hit, and bullet sponge is on every game and for some reason it's only bad to have in warframe when other games get praise for that and I don't think telegraphed attack where you dodge or get punished won't cause any crying somewhere asking for the nerf

You want more focus when playing? Have this

 

[killerJoke66]

9 minutes ago, 844448 said:

"slips under the radar" means it doesn't draw attention. DE monitor the statistics on the usage so if things are too high on the sheet, 

 

yes , i basically said the said thing responding to the guy that insisted on that i was conflicting .

 

9 minutes ago, 844448 said:

but since almost no one but me using it, the number on the chart is way too low to warrant a nerf, let alone investigation, thus, slipping under the radar

 

also yes , it was literally on the part where i double dipped on explaining , just read my guy . have a good day.

[844448]

14 hours ago, killerJoke66 said:

weird personal attack but whatever .. you do you salty 

they mostly nerf stuff when it is trivializing the game too much yes i know that , what they dont consider is that even without any weapons most frames also triviliazes 50 levels(or whatever the casuals playing their fissure missions) with absolute no issue whatsoever. So they actually never touch on the real issues but rather scrap whats on the surface level for minimal work .

You see, why they never touch on the real issue like you said is because the popularity, where the data is right in front of their eyes while most frames probably have lower % on their chart compared to catchmoon with 50% before the "nerf" so it doesn't show as much unless you have a whistleblower with people or data backing up the report

[killerJoke66]

1 minute ago, 844448 said:

You see, why they never touch on the real issue like you said is because the popularity, where the data is right in front of their eyes while most frames probably have lower % on their chart compared to catchmoon with 50% before the "nerf" so it doesn't show as much unless you have a whistleblower with people or data backing up the report

and .. ive been saying this in this post for about how many times i've lost counting . so .. i agree what can i say 

[844448]

2 minutes ago, killerJoke66 said:

and .. ive been saying this in this post for about how many times i've lost counting . so .. i agree what can i say 

Your wording makes it confusing to understand so try to straighten it

[killerJoke66]

i agree on that ; they nerf stuff that most percantage of  players pick over the other alternatives (be it weapons or frames or even sentinel choices)  thus creating a stagnant meta ,  whats the meta can sometimes be actually more inherently usefull in high level content but most of the time its not necessarily the stuff that people use/prefer in high level content but rather the stuff that makes hydron or fissure missions go faster which is level 50 area for enemies at best , BECAUSE thats where the majority playerbase is at . 

In other words(second attempt) , something can be popular for variety of reasons , as for the why DE nerfing things that are popular , is not necessarily if a weapon/frame/sentinel/kavat/mod is overpowered in itself or out of itself but rather that whatever thing occupies that space of choice dominantly for more than half of the playerbase , and that reason is enough for them to nerf it . So they nerf those things not out of REAL balance concerns but for whatever is being too dominant of a choice.

As for whats my stance on this ; i want them to be bold and transparent on what type game design they are working towards , or do we just do things for short term income , even if thats the case be public about it , say that ' we are for chill content and just want to expand our playerbase reach ' , dont be shady and make some of us chase a wrong dream . I could give less than 2 cents of worry for bramma or xoris nerfs , didnt change the way we play in any shape or form . 
So you may say why bother ? well i dont but its a little bit of annoyence when you know something is popular so its gonna get nerfed , there are speculations for why they do that , that involves shady riven economy but i personally dont accuse any of their employers or company managers for such contraversies. I would simply say for whatever reason they do nerf most popular things , gets old , people get tired , bored of it .

[Xepthrichros]

When people ask for nerfs, most of them are not interested in actual balance.

They happily exploit one, or several, or all of the following mechanics, like mashing E to win, achieving 12x combo multipliers with 0 effort, or instant tanking arcanes, abilities and mods, that let you stroll through a level 100 map and not fear death at all. They would happily invest in mods and equipment to deal 6 digit damage numbers, one-shotting bosses with minimal effort. They use invisibility to ghost run levels, or pick frames with indefinite invulnerability. Or they use things like specters, Wukong Clone, Cloudwalker, etc. to dash through missions with little self input. This list is far from exhaustive, and many of these options have been around in the game so long, that it is part of the game's "power fantasy".

Very few people around here who ask for nerfs are interested in real balance. It is far more likely that all they care about is "Fun for me, but not for thee"

They are fine with abusing whatever OP mechanic they happen to like, or think that mechanic grants them "fun" or thrill, as long as nobody else uses some other OP mechanic that is different from their definition of fun. Some of these people do not even understand that "fun" is different to different people, and there others that just blindly hate the meta cos they think that makes them cool. Which is untrue since anti-meta folks tend to just be using some other OP mechanic that is under the radar at the moment, and not picked up by majority yet, not necessarily that they are actually doing something balanced. Heck, almost all the players advocating for nerfs are overgeared all the time anyway and unless you practice what you preach, unequip and adjust mods such that you do not one-shot the enemies of whatever level mission you load into, you really are in no position to advocate for nerfs without your words being hollow... or looking like you are playing the wrong game, cos really, in a game that has 95% OP options, and said options have been around for years, and you are still here complaining about being OP? Interesting.

Overall, balance was never the goal. It is often more about the selfish elimination of anyone that plays differently from them.

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

On 2020-08-23 at 12:34 AM, (NSW)JJA209 said:

To an extent yes but isn’t that was nerfs do to the items is make them weaker. And I’m not specifically talking about my builds per say just the idea the items need to be weaker for the sake of  “balance”.  

Well, yeah, balance implies both sides of the proverbial scale are generally equal. 

Sometimes items will receive hefty nerfs.

Sometimes items will get a massive buff.

DE does want the game to continue, and the most they expect out of us is to just press a button or two. If something is far too effective at clearing rooms in an instant, you'll see that get nerfed pretty quick. Yet if you can do the same thing over time DE mysteriously doesn't care much about it.

You can't just keep buffing things and leaving things as ludicrously strong as they are, that isn't healthy for any game.

[bad4youLT]

On 2020-08-23 at 7:35 AM, Alkarnus said:

I think this is where most people who bothered arguing would argue. Modding your gear right through investing forma and time is simply grinding at an exp farm node of your choice. There is no "challenge". However, I do enjoy being powerful and if I want some so-called challenge, I simply go play other games. Here's the kicker: a "challenge" has different meanings for different people.

Early game with no knowladge or helping hand is hard and chalange as you need to learn about factions , mission tipes and modding just to aproach those factors . Then you have to deal in some capacity with resource managment , should I use my endo on this mod or this ? should I spend my credits on blueprints and crafting or upgrades ? what should grind for , rare resources for forma or frames ? . 

What are companions or syndicates ? should I get those ? wich to chose ?

In early days of the game we didnt had things like life strike or specters wich now days make game easy mode .

There is sence of acomplishment once you get to the point then you become demigod. 

[Teljaxx]

14 hours ago, Opyt said:

I brought it up because not delivering on "promised content" (and I like how you demonstrate that sarcasm there, I don't like it), is a vital part of a dev team's reputation, and I wanted to see how you'd react to it as an ardent defender zealot.  This forum is rife with people that run around laughing at people because their toys got shoved back in the sandbox and I find that to be disgusting.  What makes a game fun for you doesn't make the game fun for me.  The game WAS fun, but then because of people like you I'm not allowed to have my fun, and have to go back to "damage go brrrrr".  No more rescuing a defense objective from being nearly destroyed because I'm playing solo, no more NOT playing one of the defense-heavy frames, because if I wanted to play Gauss on a Lich Mobile Defense, I'm gonna be SoL if I can't kill the enemies faster than they spawn.  No more enjoying the game at my own pace.  No more Baza because it can't keep up with the sheer amount of health on enemies after a certain point, no more Corinth with a decent riven because, again, the health, armor and shields scale up to the point where it doesn't keep up.  No more fun.  All because people like you want everyone to be the same carbon #*!%ing copy of one another running around with the same 9 or so warframes and the same 6 or 7 weapons out of the dozens that exist.

You and the people like you defending DE every time they decide a nerf (the lazy way to fix things) is the only way can go #*!% yourselves.  But have a nice day... I guess.

How exactly am I the "ardent defender zealot" here? You're the one defending DE for their terrible game design choices, and trying to maintain the status quo so you can keep your overpowered crutches. I'm the one attacking them for their complete inability to bring any semblance of balance to their game. Also, yeah, DE sucks at keeping promises. But your examples were never promises, they just mentioned that they might do that at some point, so I put it in quotes.

And, just like somehow thinking I'm defending DE by criticizing them, you also have the entire point of balance completely backwards. Proper balance creates diversity, it doesn't take it away. Having an extremely strong meta, like the Kuva Bramma was, is what limits your choices, because why ever use anything but the absolute best? Doing so would just mean your farming goes slower, and you'll get left behind by all the other players that do follow the meta. But, if things are actually balanced, all the gear in the game should have a valid use. Nothing should be good at everything, but it should all be good at something different, otherwise what's the point of having so many choices?

Limited usefulness allows for role specific gear, which allows for more variety. Like having to choose between taking a light, rapid fire gun to mow down weak swarms, or the slow, high powered cannon for taking on elites. Either way, you can't be good at everything, but you are good at something. Then, hopefully, your teammates will fill in the gaps by taking different gear with different strengths. But, that doesn't work when everyone just uses the same couple OP guns, and the same couple OP Warframes for every single mission, like now.

If done right, you can still be plenty powerful in a balanced game. You'll just have to actually find the right tool for the job, instead of just lazily taking the unbeatable multi-tool for everything. You'll want to bring the defensive Frame for defense missions, and the DPS Frame for exterminate missions, etc. You'll still be able to pull off dramatic, come from behind wins, IF you brought the right tools for the job. And it will be much more satisfying than now, because, instead of just letting big brother Powercreep hold your hand the entire time, it will be your skill and your knowledge that let you win.

 

But, hey, your entire argument was a strawman anyway, since you're making the clearly flawed assumption that the only way to achieve "balance" is by weakening our gear, and changing nothing else at all. Obviously, doing it that way would create the problems you describe, and not be much fun. Because that's not balance, that's just imbalance in the other direction. Simply reducing how powerful we are is not the end goal, its just one of many steps DE will have to take on the road to a balanced game.

[Highresist]

On 2020-08-23 at 10:01 PM, (PS4)Yggranya said:

Maybe they do that because it brings in the most money? Maybe they are keenly aware what they should do but since that might be bad for their gains, they won't do it.

No, they aren't. It's extremely well documented that DE are disorganized and have no idea on what to focus on. Rather they constantly do side projects that gain no benefit neither for gameplay, nor for monatization. Their last "big" updates, for the past 2 years, were failiures, released unfinished or flatout not working. Their events are lackluster at best and complete disapointment at worst and their "balance" changes are illiterate. The mele changes made mele weapons the only usable viable ones, while any good primary or secondary got nerfed to the ground, regardless that even in its best condition, they barely were able to compete with meles.