So the New player experience....

[RazerXPrime]

But there is only one Tenno there.

[(PSN)Frostelus]

Just now, RazerXPrime said:

But there is only one Tenno there.

If you're referring to the girl who put down the Lotus flowers in front of the Warframes, I don't think she's a Tenno since all Tenno are sleeping on Lua (except Rell of course). She seemed more likely to be a villager who escaped the Grineer attacks and went to send prayers for the Tenno to return to their Frames and fight.
As seen in the cinematic, all three Warframes fought alongside each other, meaning there are three Tenno controlling their respective Frame. thus it would've made more sense if all three came back instead of there being just one.

[RazerXPrime]

8 minutes ago, (PS4)Frostelus said:

If you're referring to the girl who put down the Lotus flowers in front of the Warframes, I don't think she's a Tenno since all Tenno are sleeping on Lua (except Rell of course). She seemed more likely to be a villager who escaped the Grineer attacks and went to send prayers for the Tenno to return to their Frames and fight.
As seen in the cinematic, all three Warframes fought alongside each other, meaning there are three Tenno controlling their respective Frame. thus it would've made more sense if all three came back instead of there being just one.

Maybe you should watch the trailer again. There's clearly a sign of transference and she has the Tenno markings on her head.

[(PSN)Frostelus]

19 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

Maybe you should watch the trailer again. There's clearly a sign of transference and she has the Tenno markings on her head.

We don't know if that's really transference. We don't know anything about her and there are no true indication that she's the player Tenno at all. Plus it doesn't add up to the lore at all. If she was the one controlling the Warframe, then how do you explain the Second Dream, Zariman Ten Zero incident or any of the other Operator related stuff? If she really was the Tenno, then what was she doing there in the first place, why did she suddenly end up on Lua after that? Not to mention during the tutorial gameplay, you can't switch to your operator or use Transferense at all.

[RazerXPrime]

19 minutes ago, (PS4)Frostelus said:

We don't know if that's really transference. We don't know anything about her and there are no true indication that she's the player Tenno at all. Plus it doesn't add up to the lore at all. If she was the one controlling the Warframe, then how do you explain the Second Dream, Zariman Ten Zero incident or any of the other Operator related stuff? If she really was the Tenno, then what was she doing there in the first place, why did she suddenly end up on Lua after that? Not to mention during the tutorial gameplay, you can't switch to your operator or use Transferense at all.

Your Tenno is on your orbiter the entire time you play as your frame. You use tranference and they manifest through the void at the spot of the frame. It's not like your Tenno is physically inside the frame. I mean where did you think the operator was when you play after the War within? The actual physical location of the operator is irrelevant, because through transference they can go anywhere they want.

I believe it's definitely transference what we're seeing. The girl 100% has Tenno markings and disappears in a similar fashion as transference. I also think it's a bit off from the story since we're supposed to be in deep sleep without transference, but using a different means to connect. Hence the confusion.

[SpringRocker]

18 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Probably the first time we actually see atrocities committed by grineer against other non combatants.

[(PSN)Frostelus]

18 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

Your Tenno is on your orbiter the entire time you play as your frame. You use tranference and they manifest through the void at the spot of the frame. It's not like your Tenno is physically inside the frame. I mean where did you think the operator was when you play after the War within? The actual physical location of the operator is irrelevant, because through transference they can go anywhere they want.

I believe it's definitely transference what we're seeing. The girl 100% has Tenno markings and disappears in a similar fashion as transference. I also think it's a bit off from the story since we're supposed to be in deep sleep without transference, but using a different means to connect. Hence the confusion.

Wrong. You may forget that this tutorial is a new player experience and it serves as the very first quest for new players and thus take place before any other quests, including the Second Dream and War Within. Lore-wise, during the tutorial, the operator currently resides on Lua, not in the orbiter. Once the player completes the Second Dream, that's when the Operator will permanently stay in the Orbiter.

[RazerXPrime]

8 minutes ago, (PS4)Frostelus said:

Wrong. You may forget that this tutorial is a new player experience and it serves as the very first quest for new players and thus take place before any other quests, including the Second Dream and War Within. Lore-wise, during the tutorial, the operator currently resides on Lua, not in the orbiter. Once the player completes the Second Dream, that's when the Operator will permanently stay in the Orbiter.

Not wrong. You're misunderstanding this. My point is rather that through the power of transference it doesn't matter where the operator is. Lua or Orbiter it makes no difference. So through transference the operator can be there even though being on Lua. Same way as they are on your orbiter and can appear in your mission.

The only issue I have is that our operator is supposed to be in deep sleep and not have access to transference. I think they just messed it up.

[Ethorin]

10 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

The only issue I have is that our operator is supposed to be in deep sleep and not have access to transference. I think they just messed it up.

Mmmmmm... Deep Sleep yes... but remember, we're "dreaming" in that state, if we aren't "dreaming" of being a Warframe... what were we "dreaming" while the Warframes idled?

[(PSN)Frostelus]

27 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

Not wrong. You're misunderstanding this. My point is rather that through the power of transference it doesn't matter where the operator is. Lua or Orbiter it makes no difference. So through transference the operator can be there even though being on Lua. Same way as they are on your orbiter and can appear in your mission.

That is were you're missing the fact that The Tenno were not aware of operator or transference until they reached Second Dream.
First of all, Margulis sent the operator to Lua, and in the process, the Tenno lost their memories and by the time they woke up in the tutorial scene, they don't know anything about transference at all and their consciousness are basically with the Warframes for now as if they're dreaming. Which means the operators were "stuck" on Lua at that time and couldn't be anywhere else.
During the Second Dream and The War Within quests, that's when Tenno slowly regained their memories piece by piece and learn about their operator and transference, which is when the operator was now taken to the orbiter and are able to use transference.
Because of that, it doesn't make sense for the girl in the tutorial to be the player Tenno that controls the Warframe as the operator was still on Lua during that time with no knowledge about transference.

[RazerXPrime]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)Frostelus said:

That is were you're missing the fact that The Tenno were not aware of operator or transference until they reached Second Dream.
First of all, Margulis sent the operator to Lua, and in the process, the Tenno lost their memories and by the time they woke up in the tutorial scene, they don't know anything about transference at all and their consciousness are basically with the Warframes for now as if they're dreaming. Which means the operators were "stuck" on Lua at that time and couldn't be anywhere else.
During the Second Dream and The War Within quests, that's when Tenno slowly regained their memories piece by piece and learn about their operator and transference, which is when the operator was now taken to the orbiter and are able to use transference.
Because of that, it doesn't make sense for the girl in the tutorial to be the player Tenno that controls the Warframe as the operator was still on Lua during that time

Oh I 100% agree it doesn't make sense. But she's definitely a Tenno and she's using transference.

During the War Within Dax teaches you Transference as it was lost to you. It's not something that didn't exist before.

Also you're being confusing with the use of Tenno and Operator. They are one and the same. The operator is Tenno.

[Lutesque]

So.... Will new players have a steady supply of Energy now or will they still be limited to one Ability cast per mission ?

[(PSN)Frostelus]

10 hours ago, RazerXPrime said:

Oh I 100% agree it doesn't make sense. But she's definitely a Tenno and she's using transference.

During the War Within Dax teaches you Transference as it was lost to you. It's not something that didn't exist before.

Also you're being confusing with the use of Tenno and Operator. They are one and the same. The operator is Tenno.

I know the Tenno and Operator are the same. I never said they were different either. It's you who are confused with what I tried to explain. I'm merely using the term Tenno to refer to the Tenno overall, as for operator, I'm using that term to refer to the "child" basically.

Anyway, I give up. No point in going further with this as we're getting nowhere. I'll leave you to your opinions as neither of us are right or wrong

[0_The_F00l]

10 hours ago, RazerXPrime said:

Oh I 100% agree it doesn't make sense. But she's definitely a Tenno and she's using transference.

During the War Within Dax teaches you Transference as it was lost to you. It's not something that didn't exist before.

Also you're being confusing with the use of Tenno and Operator. They are one and the same. The operator is Tenno.

Or , she is just one of the quills.

[Ethorin]

5 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Or , she is just one of the quills.

...Quills can dissolve into the aether?

 

I'm reasonably sure she was, in fact, a Tenno, Dreaming a life that wasn't as an Orokin Thug.

 

Besides, I don't think Quills that look like kids are a thing.

[0_The_F00l]

4 hours ago, Ethorin said:

...Quills can dissolve into the aether?

 

I'm reasonably sure she was, in fact, a Tenno, Dreaming a life that wasn't as an Orokin Thug.

 

Besides, I don't think Quills that look like kids are a thing.

We dont actually know what the hell the quills can do , they are very much connected to the void and have a powerful backer (unum) it may just be one of the quills that is from the past of a future yet to be.

[Ethorin]

1 minute ago, 0_The_F00l said:

We dont actually know what the hell the quills can do , they are very much connected to the void and have a powerful backer (unum) it may just be one of the quills that is from the past of a future yet to be.

...We also get a dead Quill, at least one, potentially a BUNCH depending on how you take the Profit Taker Bounties...

 

We don't know what the Quills can do true, but we do know that the ONLY group who do Transference the way the Tenno do IS the Tenno. Soooooo...

[Corvid]

IIRC the devs did state that Trailer Girl wasn't a Tenno. One of the things I was hoping for was clarification of exactly what she is (especially since she clearly didn't transfer into the Warframes, she just vanished).

Even if she is one, she isn't the player character, considering that we customise our appearance (and also because Vor credits the Lotus with waking us up, which doesn't make sense if we were already awake and running around outside the frame). So there's nothing stopping the other Warframes from waking up and fighting alongside you for at least the first portion of the tutorial.

[(NSW)Edcaous]

The new cinematic is pretty, but not much has changed really. They removed the ziplines and that blocking section so I guess you could say they made it worse.

 

[0_The_F00l]

11 minutes ago, Ethorin said:

...We also get a dead Quill, at least one, potentially a BUNCH depending on how you take the Profit Taker Bounties...

 

We don't know what the Quills can do true, but we do know that the ONLY group who do Transference the way the Tenno do IS the Tenno. Soooooo...

Yes, a dead quill,  some must die so others may find a fishing rod to get the last piece of the puzzle. doesnt need to make sense to you or me , it makes sense to the one writing the story.

We dont really see the girl do any transference, we only see her fade away.

[Ethorin]

23 minutes ago, Corvid said:

(and also because Vor credits the Lotus with waking us up, which doesn't make sense if we were already awake and running around outside the frame)

Dreaming.

[so_many_watermelons]

1 hour ago, Corvid said:

IIRC the devs did state that Trailer Girl wasn't a Tenno. One of the things I was hoping for was clarification of exactly what she is (especially since she clearly didn't transfer into the Warframes, she just vanished).

Even if she is one, she isn't the player character, considering that we customise our appearance (and also because Vor credits the Lotus with waking us up, which doesn't make sense if we were already awake and running around outside the frame). So there's nothing stopping the other Warframes from waking up and fighting alongside you for at least the first portion of the tutorial.

You should link a source for that claim, because she very clearly has the somatics on her face and ears that we can have. She does disappear in a wisp of energy, similar to a Tenno going back into their frame.

I think the point is that the girl is merely a representation of either the Tenno, or the Lotus' intentions to wake us. Our Tenno, our Operator, is deep in sleep on Lua, with our Warframe in this tower somewhere in the Plains of Eidolon. This intro doesn't change that. If the girl is a representation of the Tenno, then it is a sign, a hint at the Second Dream reveal. For the rest of us who have played it, that's what it clearly seems to look like. The implications this situation would offer, is that of a Tenno child who was living among Ostrons, outside of her Second Dream or perhaps never having entered it at all. Perhaps her Warframe is elsewhere, and after the attack, she ran off to wake the nearest dormant Warframe (and therefore wake up a Tenno from their First Dream) and then disappeared into the Void or back to wherever her own Warframe could be.

If she is a representation of the Lotus waking us up with those flowers, then you'd probably have to pay attention to the change in time of day. The girl reaches the tower during sundown, and she places the flowers. The way the scene plays, it would look like they just melded the two events together; her placing those flowers and the Grineer arriving at the tower. The eyeball zoom and wispy energy can just be a thematic sort of way to tie the two different scenes together. When the Grineer arrive, it's no longer sundown but deeper into the night, with a storm having brewed over the forest. So perhaps it's not longer after she was there, but not immediately after.

 

Annnyyyyways, rather than discussing the cinematic, which is merely that, I'd rather make a big-ass post criticizing ( constructively ) how this did not equal a true "new player experience" change, and how such a task could really be done. Because I like helping new players, and I'm kinda sick of this S#&$ with DE being so awful about it. They get a guy to make a nice trailer giving that insight into the power of the Tenno and some of the history of the game without context to keep it vague for the rest of the game to open up, and then they did little else to back it up. It's so frustrating, really.

[0_The_F00l]

15 minutes ago, so_many_watermelons said:

The implications this situation would offer, is that of a Tenno child who was living among Ostrons, outside of her Second Dream or perhaps never having entered it at all. Perhaps her Warframe is elsewhere, and after the attack, she ran off to wake the nearest dormant Warframe (and therefore wake up a Tenno from their First Dream) and then disappeared into the Void or back to wherever her own Warframe could be.

Possible , but unlikely cause the only other tenno that were not in lua would likely have died or aged (like rell) unless that tenno too practiced continuity like the queens.

18 minutes ago, so_many_watermelons said:

If she is a representation of the Lotus waking us up with those flowers, then you'd probably have to pay attention to the change in time of day. The girl reaches the tower during sundown, and she places the flowers. The way the scene plays, it would look like they just melded the two events together; her placing those flowers and the Grineer arriving at the tower. The eyeball zoom and wispy energy can just be a thematic sort of way to tie the two different scenes together. When the Grineer arrive, it's no longer sundown but deeper into the night, with a storm having brewed over the forest. So perhaps it's not longer after she was there, but not immediately after.

a lot more plausible that it was just a cinematic event but if people are arguing over it it was not obvious enough. An extension of the lotus is also a posibility , she has shown that she can leave the lotus room and can also influence events outside maybe she possessed a nearly dead being with a hint of void like she guides the tenno.

20 minutes ago, so_many_watermelons said:

Annnyyyyways, rather than discussing the cinematic, which is merely that, I'd rather make a big-ass post criticizing ( constructively ) how this did not equal a true "new player experience" change, and how such a task could really be done. Because I like helping new players, and I'm kinda sick of this S#&$ with DE being so awful about it. They get a guy to make a nice trailer giving that insight into the power of the Tenno and some of the history of the game without context to keep it vague for the rest of the game to open up, and then they did little else to back it up. It's so frustrating, really.

Yes.

[so_many_watermelons]

23 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Possible , but unlikely cause the only other tenno that were not in lua would likely have died or aged (like rell) unless that tenno too practiced continuity like the queens.

I dunno, it hasn't quite been shown if the kids can age or not due to their affliction with the Void. That was the basis for much speculation with the Duviri Paradox trailer too, either that a Tenno who has grown will lose their connection with the Void due to the age itself? ( since only the children on the Zariman 10-0 lived and in fact thrived in the Void vs the adults who went insane and murderous ), or if the age itself is not the issue after the fact of the 10-0 incident, and that rather the Void affliction is actually keeping the Tenno from aging. Because remember, Tenno were in fact a structure of Orokin society for an untold amount of time well after the 10-0 incident and beyond; it is not likely that the kids were always locked up in pods. 

Point being that I don't think the Tenno on Lua are not sleeping in cryopods to keep alive, they've been sleeping in Transference pods while kept in a lucid dream state, and so their age in the current times has nothing to do with them being on Lua or their pods. You could argue for the Lua option while it was in the Void all this time before the quest, but the Tenno are always connected to the Void in the way that they are.

I believe it's that the Tenno cannot age while their Void affliction continues to exist, and that the Duviri Paradox will be about losing that affliction/connection in that location, and thus growing up. Probably some kind of Ocarina of Time deal, being able to go back and forth through this location and therefore age as well.

[DatDarkOne]

On 2020-08-26 at 1:34 AM, 0_The_F00l said:

So the tutorial is really cool and all with a lot more of a "purpose" to identify with and a mini cetus tileset.

Probably the first time we actually see atrocities committed by grineer against other non combatants.

But i am not sure just a tutorial re work is gonna help new players much without some explanation of modding and game mechanic stuff, 

i dont know if that is explained properly to actual new players (i can only replay the quest up to getting back to the ship)

Is there more?

Should i expect more ?

I personally feel there should be more than the same quest with a change in locale.

See there's an interesting thing about the new player experience.  

Way back about 4 years ago a friend introduced me to Warframe.  When I made an account, I had teamed with him for a few missions.  He was blazing through them so fast that I was missing all kinds of details, etc.  So I quickly set the game to solo mode and went my merry way very happily.  After doing that, I was able to learn all kinds of things directly from the game itself and the during the missions.  

I created a second account when Spectors of the Rails update hit with the changes to the Star chart and new player progression changes.  I did this just to see how different things would be.  I instantly noticed a more obvious progression path to the Star Chart and quests.  

I've said all that as a point that this issue with the new player experience might not be as much DE's or the games fault as it is with how much the players in groups blaze through everything without really taking anything in. 

I even noticed this very same thing with the new content that just dropped.  Players are jumping on the forums complaining about nothing being explained.  When it really was but they just weren't paying attention.  

That's just my 2 cents from my experiences and what I've noticed on the forums.  

Edit: This is not to say that it couldn't be better.  More a statement that players need to also start holding themselves accountable for some things as well.