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Animal Conservation: Can it F-Off?


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I'll be obvious with my points, to express exactly why I don't get it your thinking. In my opinion, you are a player that enjoy rushing things and this open world is the most easy to do that.

This isn't the first time they do content block behind something and it's pretty resonable at this time, the grind isn't too much

As far as I'm concerned, isn't necessary to take this too rough

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Hey folks. First thing's first, love the update.

I don't like the tone some folks are taking here in this thread so I'm reluctant to bump it. But yo.

Hunting the Avechaeas is tedious and frustrating, often broken (animal poop markers where no animal poop can be found), or just feeling broken (birds spawning high up in the air right after Son tells you they like to cling to walls).

The problem isn't that you used the syndicate ranking to showcase game mechanics that are more off the beaten path. It's that hunting in the new zone doesn't feel ready for prime time. It's a bad experience that sours an otherwise great, exciting experience.

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6 hours ago, CDRAlbrecht said:

Hey folks. First thing's first, love the update.

I don't like the tone some folks are taking here in this thread so I'm reluctant to bump it. But yo.

Hunting the Avechaeas is tedious and frustrating, often broken (animal poop markers where no animal poop can be found), or just feeling broken (birds spawning high up in the air right after Son tells you they like to cling to walls).

The problem isn't that you used the syndicate ranking to showcase game mechanics that are more off the beaten path. It's that hunting in the new zone doesn't feel ready for prime time. It's a bad experience that sours an otherwise great, exciting experience.

It is being required to hunt, fish and mine at all that's leaving the bad taste.

Fishing and mining for resources is fine, fishing and mining for progress through the syndicate isn't, add in a token system that also gets in between activity and progress and you can see why people are't happy.

On the plus side we can now buy daily specials of 5 tags each that can translate in to lots of son tokens. <100 platinum and I should be able to ignore conservation and lures.

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I played most of my time on Cetus and then realized that in order to get one of the better amps, I needed to go to Orb Vallis. I purposefully stayed away from Orb Vallis, especially hunting because no matter where you went, you'd be swamped with Corpus. That was until I got the Ivara WF and it just made hunts so much more easier. I should imagine (although not really dived into the new Deimos, other than the main quest) that the hunts will be no different - equip Equinox/Ivara - sleep/prowl ability - job done.

Hunts overall, well, I really avoided them. What I really loved about Cetus and the Plains of Eidolon was the wandering Cavats. You can get your standing SO quickly there, which is such a bonus. There are no wandering animals on Orb Vallis, but thankfully I'm nearly at Old Mate standing so can hunt Stovers and Horrasques, which give a good amount of standing, especially the rarer ones.

The hunts on the Plains of Eidolon and Orb Vallis are completely optional, but from what I gather, they have to be done in order to use the Helminth system, which I think is just plain wrong. For faction standing, yes, it's absolutely great, but should not be a mandatory, pre requisite for an important game mechanic.

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do people not get that you can hunt without ever doing the tracking stuff? I've caught EVERYTHING just by going around with my tranq gun waiting for beeping noises thats how I have always done it. hell the first thing I caught was a weakened pharaoh which people seem to have a hard time finding.

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1 hour ago, (NSW)Mercwithamouth22 said:

do people not get that you can hunt without ever doing the tracking stuff? I've caught EVERYTHING just by going around with my tranq gun waiting for beeping noises thats how I have always done it. hell the first thing I caught was a weakened pharaoh which people seem to have a hard time finding.

In all the flying around I've done (edit: outside of hunts), I've only seen one Achevaea. You need 5 to progress to rank 3. They also have a chance to be a special type of Achevaea, which, if what you want is to progress in syndicate rank, feels less special and more like bad luck.

Nobody's saying this is impossibly hard or unfair; they're saying it's tedious and inconsistent. If you had a good experience with it, that's great for you. Other people (such as myself) have put hours into it and have had a much more uneven, much more frustrating experience, so that's what we're here to communicate.

Edited by CDRAlbrecht
clarity
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On 2020-08-27 at 2:28 AM, kevoisvevo said:

hehe you are right but DE knows if they don't content gate it behind crap then people will speed through it, not like most won't now anyway lol. they are hoping all this fishing, mining and conservation nonsense slows down players enough for a month or 2, unlike planes of eidolon or fortuna where people blizzed through in 2-3 weeks due to the things being locked behind warframe-core content 

What would be the issue if the Helminth was released to everyone? Getting 1 skill requires farming frame parts, building the parts, which costs resources. Building the frame. Combined takes 3.5 days (unless you spend platinum). Not only that, it the Helminth also requires additional resources to be able to put the skill on a frame. So why the f**k on top of all this we need to create additional lock outs?

And more importantly, this was the most important of the update to begin with. Why lock it behind bull s**t? 

And yes, conservation, mining and hunting should f**k off. That is not why I play warframe. 

Edited by (PS4)thegarada
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6 hours ago, CDRAlbrecht said:

In all the flying around I've done (edit: outside of hunts), I've only seen one Achevaea. You need 5 to progress to rank 3. They also have a chance to be a special type of Achevaea, which, if what you want is to progress in syndicate rank, feels less special and more like bad luck.

Nobody's saying this is impossibly hard or unfair; they're saying it's tedious and inconsistent. If you had a good experience with it, that's great for you. Other people (such as myself) have put hours into it and have had a much more uneven, much more frustrating experience, so that's what we're here to communicate.

just fly around the edge of the world with the tranq out listening for beeps and within an hour or 2 you should have more than you need of everything.

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В 27.08.2020 в 13:00, RazorCure сказал:

Oh for #*!%'s sake. I got the 5th common one I needed, but it was like 5 miles in the air, then fell over a huge tumor..and no I can;t FIND it. WOuld it have been rocket science to place a marker on a Traq'd animal?

Alright so incase anyone else will need to hear that.
To avoid that always, ALWAYS mark the birds with you G.

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48 minutes ago, (NSW)Mercwithamouth22 said:

just fly around the edge of the world with the tranq out listening for beeps and within an hour or 2 you should have more than you need of everything.

My guy. That's what I was doing, a large portion of the time. I never found a single Avichaea that way; the one I did find was further inland and I came across it by total chance.

Seriously. Please just understand that while you may have had one experience and gotten the whole thing done in a couple hours, other people are struggling and it's not fun for them. Telling people how it should be isn't helpful. They're not doing it wrong. This is just some content in need of a few tweaks.

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20 hours ago, CDRAlbrecht said:

My guy. That's what I was doing, a large portion of the time. I never found a single Avichaea that way; the one I did find was further inland and I came across it by total chance.

Seriously. Please just understand that while you may have had one experience and gotten the whole thing done in a couple hours, other people are struggling and it's not fun for them. Telling people how it should be isn't helpful. They're not doing it wrong. This is just some content in need of a few tweaks.

well idk like I can go around just destroying cysts and have all the animals following me around randomly (don't think they are supposed to do that) so I tranq them. I have gotten so many sly, pharaohs, and Avichaea this way among others but also being on the edge of the world should make it MUCH easier to spot them with the gun. Avichaea still do seem to be the rarest though but are typically in groups of 3

20 hours ago, Rantear said:

Alright so incase anyone else will need to hear that.
To avoid that always, ALWAYS mark the birds with you G.

or use the Tranq gun to see them they will still flash white until caught

Edited by (NSW)Mercwithamouth22
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On 2020-08-27 at 1:48 AM, RazorCure said:

Maybe this wont be constructive feedback, but hey..

Animal hunting? Again? Seriously?

I NEVER once did this for PoE or Fortuna, because I said 'to myself' that it sounded totally boring and unfun, and is 100% NOT what I think of when I wanna go play Warframe did some mining and fishing on both planets, because you basically HAVE to (unless you pay) in order to rank up the syndicates. And now, on Deimos, you are forced into animal hunting. FORCED. If a gameplay mechanic is unfun (as all 3 of the mining/fishing/hunting modes are), forcing people to do it is basically saying 'Oh yeah, we know this SUCKS, but we spent our time on it, so you better do it.'

Did my first hunts today, and the animal tracks can be stupidly hard to see, especially with all the infested grass. The Predasite hunting is not bad (as in, its easy, but it still is totally not fun in ANY way)..bit those Birds? REALLY? The first 4 times I called a bird (in teh SAME damn spot, in the entry to that white tunnel thing), I didnt see anything. ANd it was only the 4th time that Son told me to look up. Because...why would I be looking up when the tracks are on the ground?

So I got one. Finally. But I need FIVE for the syndicate. No words.

The new zone is amazing. AMAZING. ANd I had fun on the first day. A lot of fun.

But now I am forced to do things that not only do I not want to, but things that I find utterly mind numbing and stupid.

 

The constructive bit.

Never, ever, ever lock cool stuff (like the Helminth) behind stupid game modes that are NOTHING at all like the actually game play many people play the actual game for.

 

 

I agree completely

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  • 1 month later...

At least animal hunting in deimos is easy. Animals will definitely show up, and most of them will actually charge at you instead of running away like they do on earth & venus.

Even if they got mauled by enemies, you can still grab them and get the tag.

I got every animals in deimos, and have every floofs just using mesa. The next part of my post is true story: i NEVER even SEE the animals on earth & venus.

I'll reach the spot, use the lure correctly, prepare my tranq gun, then npc will tell me that i fail. I never even see the animals. This comes from a guy who have every floofs from deimos.

Might as well call it the "go make ivara" quest. Cuz it's gamebreakingly undoable without invisibility.

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On 2020-08-27 at 2:31 AM, RazorCure said:

I honestly didn't totally hate the Predasite hunting..at first. At least those are obvious too see ( I only had one vanish on me). Then I saw that the Tag you need for Rank 3 is a Medjey (rare) Predasite. Which requires pheromones that are single use! And don't even make it certain you get the special capture.

It is sad that Hunting is required, because I think the Token for Standing system is much much better than Fortuna/PoE, cause you can just keep doing bounties and redeem tokens for standing every day.

 

Medjay are the uncommon ones, and are actually pretty common. They'll spawn naturally very regularly, and I've never used pheromones. Ever. Honestly, the Avichaea was the real bottleneck for me, and now that I've hit rank 4 with Entrati, I've stopped. At least until they add literally anything to rank 5.

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3 hours ago, (PS4)CurioPrime said:

I farmed relics, traded prime parts for plat and bought the tags that I needed from Son’s Today’s Specials when they were available. Am I doing it wrong?

Yes. You're paying money to make an arbitrarily introduced unpleasantness go away.

It doesn't matter that you didn't buy the platinum yourself or who the money came from, all that matters is that it was spent on this. By rewarding DE with money on this specific item, you are actively telling them that it is OK to bottle off unrelated parts of the gameplay behind bullcrap grindwalls.

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1 hour ago, DoomFruit said:

Yes. You're paying money to make an arbitrarily introduced unpleasantness go away.

It doesn't matter that you didn't buy the platinum yourself or who the money came from, all that matters is that it was spent on this. By rewarding DE with money on this specific item, you are actively telling them that it is OK to bottle off unrelated parts of the gameplay behind bullcrap grindwalls.

That’s DE bussiness model since... day one. Grind or Pay. The only way for DE to change it to get someone like Jim Sterling or some way to get the silent casual majority to listen to your demand.

Edited by DrivaMain
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1 hour ago, DoomFruit said:

It doesn't matter that you didn't buy the platinum yourself or who the money came from, all that matters is that it was spent on this. By rewarding DE with money on this specific item, you are actively telling them that it is OK to bottle off unrelated parts of the gameplay behind bullcrap grindwalls.

As if they didn't know that until we told them so. This IS Warframe - you pay for your stuff with Plat, or else you waste your time with deliberate menial tasks. I've often described this game as "a paid title with a free demo." You can technically get everything for free, but you're clearly not meant to. Most everything that comes out is released ostensibly as DLC you can buy, but ALSO have the option of earning if you don't spend money. There's no point in pretending that if we boycott a specific activity, DE will stop gating things. They're not giving us content to earn with a paid alternative. They're selling us content with a gameplay alternative. That's been the case at least since I started playing.

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On 2020-08-27 at 7:39 AM, Chewarette said:

Exactly this. This is the reason why I won't even unlock Helminth, Conservation will never be fun in my book. That it exists, no problem, I know people who genuinely enjoy that. That it's a prerequisite for the biggest addition to this update, well no.

I won't unlock Helminth and I hope many people will do that. That's the only way for them to understand how much they failed.

even then they wont because they only listen to themselves and their small pocket of player friends, "normal" folks sane suggestions simply dont count, and you are 100% correct, I'm also 1 of the people who does not like being forced to do utterly boring/mundane and garbage activities in a so called fps horde shooter, so i can happily look at fishing/mining/conservation/etc and simply go "nope, ill just not bother with that garbage then, back to ESO and hydron it is.".

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Don't do it. 

Won't do it. 

Will not comply. 

Aside from the snark, I have no interest in this game mode. When I run up against it, I just get the urge to go play something else. 

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It still genuinely shocked me that people can get SO DAMN ANGRY about coming to Warframe and realizing the gameplay isn't the same old, one-dimensional KILL ALL THE THINGS CAUSE YOU'RE A MURDER MACHINE design 100% of the way through.

On 2020-10-26 at 6:19 PM, Soy77 said:

Might as well call it the "go make ivara" quest. Cuz it's gamebreakingly undoable without invisibility.

I'd say that's true on PoE and OV. But on Cambion Drift, it's so damn easy to cap animals that I've bopped them on the head with a Bo Prime and tagged them after because I stumbled upon it mid-bounty while Infested were swarming both me and the animal.

Of course, sometimes I'm Ember and I'm too busy burninating everything in sight to realize something is there... and then Son gets mad at me. Screw him, he's Orokin anyways!

 

Edited by DrakeWurrum
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Conservation isn't even a game. It's something you have to do, you never ever want to do. Not fun. Dead game. Dead game design. Dead game designer and its clear you don't care. The tranquil rifle keeps swapping out whenever you get into your archwing, losing targets. So piss poor.

Tracks disappear.

Animals runaway you can only do it in Ivara on first two terrains. 

Animals disappear underground.

Troops spawn when the enemy spawns.

Poop that is invisible impossible to find. Makes one want to poop in your office and have you spend hours looking for poop.

This is bitter, because after leaving it for so long and coming back to it, nothing has changed. Its the reason to ditch the game and always to keep looking for something else to get away from such poor game design and implementation. 

Can't take it any more. Impacts on general feelings on playing the game. Its really sad. The principle I can whole heartedly agree on, but you created something that isn't game and expect it to pass as game in a game. You need to sit down together and discuss what is a game and what is game play. Perhaps even delete conservation instead of double downing (penetrating?) in the anality in Deimos.

I had begun recruiting people to the game, just can't do it like this, you're killing the love. Fixed in two or three weeks? Don't want to consider playing the game with conservation as part of it.

The rest of the game modes are just ok, quite repetitive, you want to take it to a place where you play like you don't want to play.

Truly amazing game design, DotA. MR 28 and just can't find the will to get to 29 with the game pulling you into conservation. If you want people to care about conservation, make it fun. You're not doing the idea of conservation and favours. You're literally pooping all over conservation, screwing with peoples mental health, yes its depressing and aggravating. Tragic to have got this far to feel like this.

Edited by Burosan
Had to express what a good game is.
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I have to apologize to everyone, since I spent some plat I won on the bird tags, which does nothing to disuade DE to keep junk like this in the main progression path.

I agree that they should not be a requirement for rank ups.

I also think Son's token trades should be generic"Predasite" (of any kind), or what-have-you. No specific breeds.

I randomly tranq wildlife that I come across, if I think of it fast enough to tranq them before the enemies in the area kill them stupidly fast. I've NEVER seen a bird in the wild. I've caught mostly Predasites and Vulpaphylas (enough for making my own pets and a couple trade-ins.) I caught a few of those burrowing things, but they're a pain. I really hate how going airborne in your archwing unequips the tranq gun... and then those stupid air-squids attack every 10 seconds, preventing you from leisurely gliding around while aiming with the gun to spot random wildlife.

 

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You can technically buy tags. It's annoying, but personally, I'd be happier if it was fixed and improved.

We were supposed to get a Sentinel precept that helped us track... would be a really good companion mod to add universally to make this not an eyesore. 

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