Reconsidder HoD Tokens

[ShortCat]

Dear DE,

economy connecetd to HoD update is a major downgrade compared to existing open world areas. Reason for this is the newly introduced token system.

Economy in PoE/Fortuna: gems/fish/hunts ---> standing
Economy in HoD: gems/fish/hunts ---> tokens ---> standing

Cons of a token system:

• Pointless middlemen, as we still traide collectibles for staning.
• Unnecessary currency bloat
• Less intuitive/straight forward excahnge approach, which leads to a worse user experience
• Additional RNG layers, as the exchange from collectibles to tokens has an additional RNG requirement
• Additional time-gate, as token pool is replanished after a timer

Pros of a token system:

• Standing gained from bounties can be hoarded. Mother tokens are a convenient novelty.

Please reconsidder HoM token system.

[(XBOX)NekoKami7532]

dont see any reason for these to be reconsidered as the RNG and time gate dont really effect much, most things are bought with standing so if you just do bounties you'll get plenty of mother tokens and with the farming needed for Xaku you'll get a stockpile of tokens to trade in when you havent hit the daily cap. the RNG and timegate are only really a problem if you have COMPLETELY avoided fishing, mining, conservation and avoided collecting resources as with just a handful of common items from those activities you can at least trade in the 1 token exchanges and sometimes the 2 token exchanges to get the tokens to rank up. if anything this system is an improvement since if you're farming bounties to get some specific resource, mod or relic you wont hit a point where you're completely missing out on standing like the other open worlds which means less grind when you actually need to get standing to rank up

[Rantear]

Only real issue is Grandmother tokens.
But mostly she only sells cosmetics and captura scenes, for functional parts you only need 40 (well "only", that's actually quite alot), for new guns, and that seems to be a nice way to keep players from instantly getting them, especially if they're any good (there's no way those guns are not another power creep, considering how good is the default mech archgun...)

[Kahrain]

I like tokens over the limited daily standing from bounties. I can build up a bunch of tokens doing various things (some I enjoy more than others... SON) and then trade them in for fast standing. There's no reason for me to stop doing bounties and wait for the next day to roll around.

Having tokens for the other side activities also means that I can turn in those resources and bypass bounties if I want too.

 

 

[ShortCat]

21 hours ago, (XB1)jake01262 said:

the RNG and timegate are only really a problem if you have COMPLETELY avoided fishing, mining, conservation and avoided collecting resources as with just a handful of common items from those activities you can at least trade in the 1 token exchanges and sometimes the 2 token exchanges to get the tokens to rank up.

Incorrect. In PoE or Fortuna you can cap your standing just by doing any side activity and trading gatherred collelctibles, which already act as tokens. However, you cannot do it in Deimos, because...

She offers 23 tokes, which are worth 2.3k standing. I cannot even trade all the fish I cought in one session, because she is looking for specific fish. My best bet is to come again in 2 hours (if I am still playing) for another shot at 2k standing. Otak's shop has the same limitations. I cannot max my standing with Son's tokens, even though his are worth 500 each. 
On the other hand, in Cetus, I can trade as many as 1k Mortus Lungfish and get as much standing as I want. Anytime.

21 hours ago, (XB1)jake01262 said:

if anything this system is an improvement since if you're farming bounties to get some specific resource, mod or relic you wont hit a point where you're completely missing out on standing like the other open worlds which means less grind when you actually need to get standing to rank up

It is an improvement for bounties only and I explicitly mentioned it. However, it is a downgrade if you want to rank up by doing other activities.

 

21 hours ago, Rantear said:

for functional parts you only need 40 (well "only", that's actually quite alot), for new guns, and that seems to be a nice way to keep players from instantly getting them

Tokes = collectibles and/or standing. There is no need to gate any gear behind tokens, since you always can increase BP costs or put rare materials into BPs for the same result. In the end we sill trade gems or fish parts or hunt trophies for weapons.

 

20 hours ago, Kahrain said:

There's no reason for me to stop doing bounties and wait for the next day to roll around.

Yes, and I mentioned it.

20 hours ago, Kahrain said:

Having tokens for the other side activities also means that I can turn in those resources and bypass bounties if I want too.

We already could do it. In Cetus, you trade gems or fish for standing; in Fortuna you trade gems and fish for standing. Also, look at the picture and explainatio above.

[(XBOX)NekoKami7532]

On 2020-08-29 at 8:42 PM, ShortCat said:

Incorrect. In PoE or Fortuna you can cap your standing just by doing any side activity and trading gatherred collelctibles, which already act as tokens. However, you cannot do it in Deimos, because...

 

yes you CAN cap that way but the common gems and fish arent worth much meaning bounties are gonna get you way more standing in a much shorter span of time. for example i can currently get 22 thousand standing a day (thats rounded down just to make the maths easier) and the RAREST gem that drops on the plains is worth 400 standing which means i would have to get 55 of the rarest gem to get to my cap but theres other gems that i could get instead of the rarest which are worth less meaning id need to mine more than 55 gems which is a lot even considering the rarest gems (nyths and Sentirum) drops in amounts of 1 and only have a 15-30% chance of dropping WITH the best drills so if i hadnt bothered to rank up Cetus before hand and decided to max Cetus before going to Fortuna (which i did back when PoE was first added) i would have to mine the more common gems worth 100, 75 and 50 standing. now what if i wanna fish instead? well that would take me longer as the fish that show up without bait are only worth 200 standing IF its a large variant and the most common fish are only worth 50 standing if large meaning id need 110 large uncommon fish to reach my daily cap of 22 thousand. now a rank 1 bounty that takes less than 5 minutes to complete nets you a total of 1,440 which means that in 16 short runs i would be over my daily cap, but of course theres also the fact that theres now optional bonus objectives meaning i could reach my cap in less than 15 runs and now that theres huts for starting bounties without going back to cetus so the time taken to return to cetus and load is is gone making the runs shorter and thats just the LOWEST difficulty bounty if i was to do bounties made more for my equipment and skill level id do the rank 5 bounties which give 4,470 with no bonus and 5,020 with no bonus on steal path and a regular rank 5 bounty takes me on average 10 mins to finish which means id receive just over 3 thousand more than a rank 1 for only double the time meaning id hit my 22 thousand in only 5 runs which would take an average of 40 minutes and once again less runs would be required if we take in the relatively easy bonus objectives and unlike mining and fishing theres no standing spent on equipment and bait AND a guaranteed amount of standing not effected by our pord and saviour RNGesus and also unlike mining and fishing getting shot at by groups of grineer isnt gonna slow down the process unlike mining in which grineer can knock your sights off the mining point therefore reducing the amount and rarity of the gems and fishing in which gunfire will scare away the fish. now as for the randomised tokens in deimos, theres always a few that cost only common drops and each one gives 1 or 2 tokens with each token being worth 100 standing as opposed to the 25-50 common fish on the plains are worth and if you REALLY cant make any standing with fishing then go smash some containers and talk to father as he will give you plenty of tokens for the most common resources on deimos. its quite obvious the only problem you have is that you only like 1 or 2 open world systems and this open world is trying to make people actually do more than 1 activity so they will actually try everything the open world has to offer instead of just fishing or mining for hours and completely ignore bounties and conservation