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On 2020-09-01 at 11:21 AM, (XB1)CI shadow2397 said:

Nekros he is a good frame but the problem is outside of desecrate and showdown of the dead, he is useless. His 1 to too bad to be viable in any way, terrify is good and cool, but it’s just kinda lackluster. And to top it all off he has poor survivability on his own even with his passive. If DE could give him some love that would be nice.   Thoughts?:

I'd say Nekros is way, way down the list of Warframes in need of help.  Personally I'd rate Loki, Frost, Nyx, Valkyr and even Ember as needing a look before Nekros.  His biggest issue is that his first power (Soul Punch) is completely disposable, and Terrify isn't really desirable in a lot of missions.  (Enemies stop attacking, but also scatter which makes them obnoxious to kill.)

What I would really like to see is DE going through and *buffing* powers based on Helminth stats.  Mesa's Ballistic Battery, Nekros' Soul Punch and Inaros Sandstorm are apparently completely disposable and are the obvious choice to replace with just about anything.  ("It's free real estate...")  To me, that says those powers need to be improved, so that it's NOT such an obvious choice which power to drop kick out the airlock.  I have no idea what could be done for them though.  What I really DON'T want to see is DE nerfing the most used powers for being "too good."  Which they reflexively did before the system even launched.  (Except for Defy, nerfing that just doesn't make any sense at all.)

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If they rework him they need to start removing mana. We need less mana based frames and more frames with unique resources.

 

passive kill things you make thralls. Maybe every 5 seconds summon a thrall.

1 channel eat thralls gain armour. This is needed as a way to not summon thralls if they player does not want them at that moment. Could also restore health of you and party.

2 rip the souls out of 2 thralls, ability besides that same as now.

3 same as it is as augmented now. Lose life for each body.

4 empower thralls for x time. Damage they deal and damage they soak for the time is stored. And end of duration they explode with all that damage.

 

Just an idea, but unique resources is where Warframe needs to go. It’s a none competitive pve game yet extremely competitive pvp games have piles of unique resources. Think every moba and how much it changes normal game play to have a new not man resource.

Edited by BDMblue
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2 hours ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

Disagree about poor survivability, it's hard to die with Nekros.

in arbitrations its easy to die...stay near drones and kill drones....the explosion kill nekros very easy.

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Most agree that his (3) Desecrate and (4) is fine for the most part.....besides he has two of the best augments in despoil and Shield of Shadows when used with certain Mods...

Soul Punch....on the face of it...it looks powerful and good but the mechanic....sending a enemy souls as projectiles is weak. The initial damage is not bad but the "Soul" sent flying is just 50 Impact....basically it's a very weak Blast. If they upped that damage and maybe added Slash and/or say Toxin to the Soul Projectile, could be better overall...

Terrify....on paper it's opposite of what many especially in Group Play wants...in Solo, it's a great "Oh...Crap" Panic Button...yea, it does reduce their Armor but what good does that do when they run away and no-where to be found scattered all over......instead of running what about "Freeze-in-place" keeping the Won't Attack mechanic like say 4, 6, 8, 10 seconds based on Strength, Range and Duration...almost something like Equinox Sleeping Time....one can do a lot more to Enemies To Terrified To Attack Standing Still in a few seconds that Enemies fleeing over over,,,,

....just my two cents....

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On 2020-09-01 at 1:48 PM, -FrutyX- said:

Clearly you have no idea how to mod him,Nekros doesn't need a rework at all,he can be a perfect farmer or a tank,even hybrid,his first ability is not really good,that's true,it does not deal decent dmg and it does not work with his other abilities,but like on many other frames,their first abilities are always weaker,because not all abilities are meant to be overpowered.

Also there is an augment for his first ability.

but the point is he shouldn't be either a tank or a farmer, he's a summoner so he should have abilities that cater towards his original use which is as a summoner, DE isnt going to get us good summoners if we keep accepting nekros as he is we need nekros to be an actual summoner.

also your wrong because his first even with his augment is bad and the only really good ability is his 4th his 3rd is a farming ability and his 2nd doesn't work well with his current fourth because you need to get his summons to only drain 1% health and thats what we mean with this kind of frame is it feels like you have to focus on one ability and degrade the others for it to work well and thats not how a warframe should be.

Edited by (PS4)Cool_TRG
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7 hours ago, BDMblue said:

If they rework him they need to start removing mana. We need less mana based frames and more frames with unique resources.

 

passive kill things you make thralls. Maybe every 5 seconds summon a thrall.

1 channel eat thralls gain armour. This is needed as a way to not summon thralls if they player does not want them at that moment. Could also restore health of you and party.

2 rip the souls out of 2 thralls, ability besides that same as now.

3 same as it is as augmented now. Lose life for each body.

4 empower thralls for x time. Damage they deal and damage they soak for the time is stored. And end of duration they explode with all that damage.

 

Just an idea, but unique resources is where Warframe needs to go. It’s a none competitive pve game yet extremely competitive pvp games have piles of unique resources. Think every moba and how much it changes normal game play to have a new not man resource.

ive made a concept kind of what your talking about you should check it out!.  

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VnIo-IYKy6wM1NeKTxmDuutmxw_VVXVJSISyQrW952o/edit?usp=sharing

Edited by (PS4)Cool_TRG
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On 2020-09-01 at 1:58 PM, ChaoticEdge said:

You got that damn right.  I been augring non stop about this everytime its a super gag, a absolutely mediocre and top of it all that abusive meme (I can make players fetch the enemy, don't ask how just his 1 and special ability to make enemies float in the air).

this is about rework, not try replace with solution that is a biggest problem.  He is dieing for super rework from the very start, his original before all his crazy rework was super terrible, everytime his desecrate ability is 3rd mediocre and they change it because his old desecrate if anyone remember you have to FLIPPING DANG NAB IT PRESS 3 QUICKLY BECAUSE THE DEAD BODIES DISAPPEARED TOO FAST!  Top of it off they never change his 1 and 2 they KEPT IT THE WAY IT IS! This gag of a joke been over more then flipping decades more likely when his day pop up the 1st time never got change and they kept him like how Ember was or Vauban that got SO MANY TIME DENIED FOR REWORK! I won't let this be denied for a REWORK!

______________________________________________________________________________________________________________

His 1 ability should of have a chance if killing an or more then 1 enemy for the chance it turn perimeter undead ally like how Inaros when he ate his enemies it turn into sand being.  For I would like change his "RAGDOLL" just a stun spot because I made so many enemies flying to space thanks to the update for I can send my enemies to space and drop them millions of miles across the map!  Also renaming "Soul Punch" to be "Slander Shell" because it was terrible gag that is top the worst name ever stuck with it on day 1 he show up

His 2nd ability how I wanted have the that mod augment that pose to make every enemies slow just slap it down implemented already with it because it is better not have separate mod because it is a waste and make it terrible using the mod because no one had freaking USE THAT MOD FOR WHAT REASON?!  It it is better come up with dmg reduction from the enemies with that mod unless you prefer my 2nd option making terrified to decrease enemies's aim power and dmg so it show that you can debuff enemeis a heck a lot.

you should check out my rework concept id really want this on nekros because it caters to his actual purpose of being a summoner.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VnIo-IYKy6wM1NeKTxmDuutmxw_VVXVJSISyQrW952o/edit?usp=sharing

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8 minutes ago, (PS4)Cool_TRG said:

but the point is he shouldn't be either a tank or a farmer, he's a summoner so he should have abilities that cater towards his original use which is as a summoner, DE isnt going to get us good summoners if we keep accepting nekros as he is we need nekros to be an actual summoner.

That's what you want him to be, he originally never was an summoner (yes,his ult are shadows,but that does not make him a summoner only), but a looter/farmer, even his shadows augment was added later. And most importantly, I don't see a reason, why he shouldn't be good for multipurpose. 

Some Warframes aren't played because of their ult abilities, but for their non-ult abilities because they are much better than the actual ults.

Yes, his first two abilities are very meh, but I can still get him to tank anything (90% damage reduction from his augment,90% resistance for any damage type from Adaptation + some armor) and he is very good, you can still even desecrate with it. Then again, he can still be a farmer only with some big range.

One Warframe, two purposes , what else does he need? You want him to become god? To make a huge army and spam resources? Remember that Warframe has it's limits, and you cannot have that huge army, and shadows cannot oneshot enemies, because that would be too OP and would be immediately nerfed anyway.

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18 minutes ago, (PS4)Cool_TRG said:

you should check out my rework concept id really want this on nekros because it caters to his actual purpose of being a summoner.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VnIo-IYKy6wM1NeKTxmDuutmxw_VVXVJSISyQrW952o/edit?usp=sharing

It is nice on paper but this means the dev have to "Rework the trailer" I think new frame sound good on paper and it sound like Spiritualist frame which I think it is nice ring to it.  We had not a single frame focus on actually focus support and AoE stunlocks.  Which I know Rhino is like that but everyone threw out Rhino's roar or stomp and it seem that it is more effective then nearly all frame.  Naming the frame who acts like twilight from light and dark, more of fitting name it requires.

*edit*

I think a name perfect fitting and it's a boy name " Lucrecio "

Edited by ChaoticEdge
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8 hours ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

Disagree about poor survivability, it's hard to die with Nekros.

Then you had not run against leech enemies or either your fighting the wrong type of enemies.  Try SP Corpus Survival prepare for be trigger.

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2 hours ago, -FrutyX- said:

That's what you want him to be, he originally never was an summoner (yes,his ult are shadows,but that does not make him a summoner only), but a looter/farmer, even his shadows augment was added later. And most importantly, I don't see a reason, why he shouldn't be good for multipurpose. 

Some Warframes aren't played because of their ult abilities, but for their non-ult abilities because they are much better than the actual ults.

Yes, his first two abilities are very meh, but I can still get him to tank anything (90% damage reduction from his augment,90% resistance for any damage type from Adaptation + some armor) and he is very good, you can still even desecrate with it. Then again, he can still be a farmer only with some big range.

One Warframe, two purposes , what else does he need? You want him to become god? To make a huge army and spam resources? Remember that Warframe has it's limits, and you cannot have that huge army, and shadows cannot oneshot enemies, because that would be too OP and would be immediately nerfed anyway.

no i want a summoner necros because he was originally as a concept a summoner i dont want him to be op i want him to make sense

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2 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

It is nice on paper but this means the dev have to "Rework the trailer" I think new frame sound good on paper and it sound like Spiritualist frame which I think it is nice ring to it.  We had not a single frame focus on actually focus support and AoE stunlocks.  Which I know Rhino is like that but everyone threw out Rhino's roar or stomp and it seem that it is more effective then nearly all frame.  Naming the frame who acts like twilight from light and dark, more of fitting name it requires.

*edit*

I think a name perfect fitting and it's a boy name " Lucrecio "

i think thats a cool name how do you pronounce it?

also is it derived from anything?

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he needs 2 more modslots other than that he's amazing with the new helminth system. Exchange his useless 1 for warcry, petrify, larva or rly anything and you'll get a nice melee support frame.

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3 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

Then you had not run against leech enemies or either your fighting the wrong type of enemies.  Try SP Corpus Survival prepare for be trigger.

No need I already have. Perhaps you're not using him properly?

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4 hours ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

No need I already have. Perhaps you're not using him properly?

Had you ever had leech stuck in the wall before?

6 hours ago, (PS4)Cool_TRG said:

i think thats a cool name how do you pronounce it?

also is it derived from anything?

use google translate for they pronounce it for you.

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With the right build, Nekros actually becomes pretty tanky, and can contribute rather notably to his team thanks to Desecrate. However, I agree with the OP that he needs a rework, because said build is heavily dependent on augments, most of his abilities aren't too useful, and ultimately his key contribution is probably not even something that should exist in Warframe. Aside from Desecrate, none of his abilities are that amazing on their own: Soul Punch is just generally awful, Terrify can be outright counterproductive due to how it makes enemies run away, and Shadows of the Dead are useless as an actual army, because enemy damage scales horribly against enemy EHP. Despoil and Shield of Shadows go a long way towards helping the frame, but at the end of the day, all he ends up being is the game's loot frame, which is rather disappointing for what is meant to be a necromancer archetype. He's not even the only loot frame in the game anymore, what with Khora's Pilfering Strangledome allowing her to increase loot drops while still outputting lots of crowd control and damage (also with the generous help of augments).

Given that Warframe is a game largely about accruing loot, I think extra loot generation itself should not be a niche for specific frames to cater to, because that so far has led to reductive gameplay and compositions, in addition to overuse of loot generation effects as an attempt to give otherwise mediocre frames a niche. There's probably a place for Nekros to generate additional health, Energy, and ammo, drops, like a more aggressive Protea, but beyond that he could be so much more than just a loot frame.

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Nekros can be extremely tanky with Shield of Shadows and Health Conversion. His survivability is fine, if you build him for it. The shadows could use a damage buff because they don't scale well even in mid level. Soul Punch is nothing more then a candidate to be replaced via Helminth.

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1 hour ago, Prexades said:

Nekros can be extremely tanky with Shield of Shadows and Health Conversion. His survivability is fine, if you build him for it. The shadows could use a damage buff because they don't scale well even in mid level. Soul Punch is nothing more then a candidate to be replaced via Helminth.

That is depending in some point but we are basically talking about how terrible it is and energized arcane if you don't have it your basically screwed adding negative to survivability which I think not lots of players have it or either have it on full rank on it for they end up either relying on zaw weapons but getting riven for it is pretty much your playing a shuffle deck of cards as you pull out one is basically will not turn out be the card you wanted as for ppl sell riven mod zaw they attend sometime sell it but higher price and players aren't willing to hand out huge plat and sometime it takes days for players do agreement agreed on but only thous who really want rush for some plats will get it quickly with in probably only good 1-10 mins for it for quick trade.  Basically we aren't even talking about "REPLACEMENT" as again we are discussing his abilities and how it rendering useless in the game as always for I took good laughing spin of soul punch and Lantern ability and still watching enemies fly.  The ability is absolute doodle and giggles for it always been and will has been and I been abusing it lately using it as a joke and yes I got newbies laughing hard off their tail racket about seeing this.

Edited by ChaoticEdge
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