Make the Simularcum more useful

[TripleMax]

The Simulacrum has no other use then to check how strong your weapon is.
How about letting the players chimp out with their mod collections on their warframes/weapons without the need of actually using formas, let us polarize weapons freely without needing to actually use formas, isn't the point of the SIMULAcrum is to simulate things? why can't we simulate builds without needing to waste a lot of time and resources just to test 1 build in the simulacrum?! that's genuinely stupid in my opinion. Why force new players to check youtube for the ideal builds? why not let them try out their own builds without wasting resources and time as I've stated previously?! this is seriously mind boggling.. and I hope something gets done about this topic.

[Proscriptor]

if that was allowed many players would never leave the simulacrum

without capacity restrictions, they would hallucinate how they have reached the apex of power, how the actual game is "artificial limitations" and only the simulacrum is "real", and simply stop playing the game as a consequence

[(PSN)NoTrollGaming]

I’d love it

[(PSN)NoTrollGaming]

2 minutes ago, Traubenzuckr said:

if that was allowed many players would never leave the simulacrum

without capacity restrictions, they would hallucinate how they have reached the apex of power, how the actual game is "artificial limitations" and only the simulacrum is "real", and simply stop playing the game as a consequence

I doubt people will stop playing the game, bit of a stretch

[TripleMax]

Just now, Traubenzuckr said:

if that was allowed many players would never leave the simulacrum

without capacity restrictions, they would hallucinate how they have reached the apex of power, how the actual game is "artificial limitations" and only the simulacrum is "real", and simply stop playing the game as a consequence

But the point of the simularcum is that everything you do in it is meaningless, no loot drops, no completion of challenges. Sure maybe removing mod capacity is stupid I'll agree with you on that part, but I still stand by my point of allowing players to freely polarize their own weapons.

[Proscriptor]

On 2020-09-16 at 1:45 PM, (PS4)NoTrollGaming said:

I doubt people will stop playing the game, bit of a stretch

many people have already went down the path of actual game > simulacrum (riven testing etc.) > quit game

  

On 2020-09-16 at 1:46 PM, 110Maxim said:

But the point of the simularcum is that everything you do in it is meaningless, no loot drops, no completion of challenges. Sure maybe removing mod capacity is stupid I'll agree with you on that part, but I still stand by my point of allowing players to freely polarize their own weapons.

if your experience in the game is meaningless, your experience won't be good, and you will just go on with your life. there is nothing to hook you to the game anymore. 

[krc473]

13 minutes ago, 110Maxim said:

isn't the point of the SIMULArcum is to simulate things?

We are simulating enemies. We are using our standard frame. 

13 minutes ago, 110Maxim said:

Why force new players to check youtube for the ideal builds

Nobody is forced to check YouTube for ideal builds. I haven't ever copied a build from YouTube (excluding from friends). New players are better off trying builds for themselves, rather than blindly following random people.

• Yes, I accept that this is where your suggestion comes in.

 

Your logic is completely flawed, but DE should remove mod capacity in Simulacrum so we can actually test builds we might want to use.

 

 

Edit:

1 minute ago, Traubenzuckr said:

many people have already went down the path of actual game > simulacrum (riven testing etc.) > quit game

You forgot to include links of your evidence.

[Proscriptor]

de will never do that, for them the simulacrum is already a problem because it leeches activity from the actual content

  

On 2020-09-16 at 1:48 PM, krc473 said:

You forgot to include links of your evidence.

send me 1500$ and i'll include them

[TripleMax]

1 minute ago, krc473 said:

We are simulating enemies. We are using our standard frame. 

Nobody is forced to check YouTube for ideal builds. I haven't ever copied a build from YouTube (excluding from friends). New players are better off trying builds for themselves, rather than blindly following random people.

• Yes, I accept that this is where your suggestion comes in.

 

Your logic is completely flawed, but DE should remove mod capacity in Simulacrum so we can actually test builds we might want to use.

How is my logic flawed? Why force a player to use his formas for builds that he's unsure of? You copying builds is the same as copying them from youtube doesn't debunk anything,
you just change the source of your copying, you didn't make those builds yourself, people did the job for you.

[Proscriptor]

1 minute ago, 110Maxim said:

Why force a player to use his formas

this feeling of progress being artificial and forced is what already corrupts the game. making simulacrum a dream machine will only feed into this delusion

[krc473]

Just now, 110Maxim said:

How is my logic flawed?

You came up with something about simulations that has no evidence to support it. You stated that people must use YouTube for builds - I mean, come on, YouTube isn't even the only source of builds. At least try and make your argument logical. 

1 minute ago, 110Maxim said:

you just change the source of your copying, you didn't make those builds yourself, people did the job for you.

I make my own builds. I don't copy others. Making a sensible build is pretty easy. Copying a friend's build to give them feedback on it really isn't the same as copying a build to use for general mission use. The problem with copying builds from others is that you then rely on others to do the thinking for you. And lets be honest, there are fairly limited options for each frame.

6 minutes ago, 110Maxim said:

You copying builds is the same as copying them from youtube doesn't debunk anything,

It certainly goes against your suggestion that people must copy builds from YouTube. And that is the point I am making. You explicitly stated that new players must use YouTube for their builds. I don't believe this is true. If you are lumping "copying a friend" who could have linked their build in chat with "YouTube builds" I have even more questions about how illogical your argument is. There are many ways for new players to get builds. YouTube is far from the exclusive source of these.

• While I agree that DE should let us mod however we like in the Simulacrum I cannot agree with most of your reasons for it.

[krc473]

14 minutes ago, Traubenzuckr said:

send me 1500$ and i'll include them

You also could have said that you don't have any evidence. I get it, you are trying to mislead people (its a common swindler's trick). I haven't heard of even one person that followed that progression. Not that I care enough about content creators to follow it. But anyone of importance would have been mentioned somewhere I could have seen.

[Proscriptor]

Just now, krc473 said:

You also could have said that you don't have any evidence. I get it, you are trying to mislead people (its a common swindler's trick). I haven't heard of even one person that followed that progression. Not that I care enough about content creators to follow it. But anyone of importance would have been mentioned somewhere I could have seen.

stop the ad hominem crap

i can discuss freely without providing evidence, this isn't a scientific symposium

[(PSN)SouthSideSwanga]

I disagree with removing mod capacity because you’re simulating your current warframe as it is. It would also make the simulacrum less useful imo because many people would probably come up with builds that are impossible in the main game. 
 

I think a better option is to add simulated forma so you can polarize a mod slot to test things out before using an actual forma and the polarity would disappear when you leave. I also think it would be nice if we could spawn in more than just enemies (such as defense objects to test if a build can defend something) and set enemies to respawn automatically shortly after being killed.
 

I never really use the simulacrum though because if I want to test something, then I just run a mission type that I’ll be using the build in. I feel like running missions is better than the simulacrum anyway since there’s no punishment for failure (other than wasted time). Simulacrum is only really useful if you want to find out how quickly you can kill things, which you could also do in onslaught or elite onslaught and you’d get rewards out of it. 

[TripleMax]

33 minutes ago, krc473 said:

You stated that people must use YouTube for builds - I mean, come on, YouTube isn't even the only source of builds. At least try and make your argument logical. 

 

33 minutes ago, krc473 said:

It certainly goes against your suggestion that people must copy builds from YouTube. And that is the point I am making. You explicitly stated that new players must use YouTube for their builds. I don't believe this is true. If you are lumping "copying a friend" who could have linked their build in chat with "YouTube builds" I have even more questions about how illogical your argument is. There are many ways for new players to get builds. YouTube is far from the exclusive source of these.

This is some serious nitpicking bud, your whole argument is;" haha you're wrong Youtube isn't the only source for copying builds"
Which is not even the main point of my argument. My main point is that people rely on others for different sources for builds, because doing your own builds and spending your formas to test builds is just not worth it because it takes a lot of time and resources. And that's the entire issue.

And that somehow lead you to the conclusion that my logic is flawed? because youtube isn't the only source that people use for builds in warframe?
And my logic is flawed...
 

In simple terms:
Ready build from "X" > Trying out your own builds
In terms of time & resources.
 

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

38 minutes ago, 110Maxim said:

The Simularcum has no other use then to check how strong your weapon is.
How about letting the players chimp out with their mod collections on their warframes/weapons without the need of actually using formas, either remove mod capacity altogether in the simularcum, or let us polarize weapons freely without needing to actually use formas, isn't the point of the SIMULArcum is to simulate things? why can't we simulate builds without needing to waste a lot of time and resources just to test 1 build in the simularcum?! that's genuinely stupid in my opinion. Why force new players to check youtube for the ideal builds? why not let them try out their own builds without wasting resources and time as I've stated previously?! this is seriously mind boggling.. and I hope something gets done about this topic.

It's for more than your weapons.....it's for your frames and pets. You can use it to actually learn the games mechanics and test exactly how an ability works for example. 

You can test mods and other things. Try putting an actual potato on something and with a decent MR you should be able to fit most basic mod configs.

 

[(PSN)Jacobivan]

Agreed. Maybe special unlimited  capacity loadout slot could be added, usable and visible only in simulacrum. It doesn't even have to save when leaving to orbiter. (no extra cost for DE, because apperently server space costs) 

Another thing i'd love to see would be ability to start special 'test missions' from simulacrum (or maybe something like simulacrum control console on orbiter?) This would allow players to start any mission in game, with selectable enemy level. Special unlimited loadout slot would apply on this mission. No rewards, affinity, focus or loot can be gained except ammo, health and energy globes. Gear items would gain unlimited usage during the mission and 'call simaris control console' and 'call arsenal' gear items coud be added. This missions would be for training/testing purposes only, they would not alter player progression in any way. 

 

[Proscriptor]

as soon as DE removes capacity/polarity restrictions from simulacrum, people will scream for simulacrum missions, because they won't have anything to do in simulacrum, but also will not want to leave it to play the actual game because they will feel powerless outside. 

[(PSN)Jacobivan]

Just now, Traubenzuckr said:

as soon as DE removes capacity/polarity restrictions from simulacrum, people will scream for simulacrum missions, because they won't have anything to do in simulacrum, but also will not want to leave it to play the actual game because they will feel powerless outside. 

They could add 'simulacrum tokens' used to start simulacrum missions. 1 added as an extra reward for 1st daily mission completion:-) 

[TripleMax]

5 minutes ago, Traubenzuckr said:

as soon as DE removes capacity/polarity restrictions from simulacrum, people will scream for simulacrum missions, because they won't have anything to do in simulacrum, but also will not want to leave it to play the actual game because they will feel powerless outside. 

Yeah I don't think so and I don't see why they would want to if there's no real progression?
People don't get to use any mod and max out mods in the simularcum you use what you've got, just without the forma restrictions. So you could understand what build you'd wanna make, I genuinely don't see why people would stay in the simularcum like you claim, to feel powerful? feeling powerful with no rewards gets dull and boring after 2 minutes.

But this is my opinion and there are people with think otherwise, but I don't think your way of thinking is a majority within the warframe community or that there's a lot of people that think that way.

[krc473]

4 minutes ago, Traubenzuckr said:

i can discuss freely without providing evidence, this isn't a scientific symposium

You are correct. But evidence of your point does help in non-scientific scenarios too. You could just say that you don't have evidence, or are too lazy to find any (laziness is an acceptable excuse). But don't derail the thread over it. You seem to be against OP's suggestion, but are trying to come up with pointless excuses. 

 

 

4 minutes ago, 110Maxim said:

And that somehow lead you to the conclusion that my logic is flawed? because youtube isn't the only source that people use for builds in warframe?

That was more about the simulation of Simulacrum. It seems more that we simulate enemies while just using our normal stuff. Imagine a VR world where you play as yourself, but can change external factors.

6 minutes ago, 110Maxim said:

This is some serious nitpicking bud, your whole argument is;" haha you're wrong Youtube isn't the only source for copying builds"

I wont pretend like your not correct with this statement. I figure it is better to be direct and to the point with what I am thinking.

11 minutes ago, 110Maxim said:

My main point is that people rely on others for different sources for builds, because doing your own builds and spending your formas to test builds is just not worth it because it takes a lot of time and resources. And that's the entire issue.

I don't get the whole "relying on others" part. Coming up with a build, then testing it is not that hard. You can see how unranked/low ranked mods would perform, and imagine how they would do maxed. Its not hard. You don't really need to spend Forma to guess whether something is worth doing (especially after trying it on a few other frames). While I don't agree with your reasoning, I do think we should be allowed to do whatever we like in the Simulacrum. Testing mod combinations would be good. But what about testing how various Helminth abilities work?

[Proscriptor]

Just now, krc473 said:

You are correct. But evidence of your point does help in non-scientific scenarios too. You could just say that you don't have evidence, or are too lazy to find any (laziness is an acceptable excuse). But don't derail the thread over it. You seem to be against OP's suggestion, but are trying to come up with pointless excuses. 

i'm gonna say what i'm gonna say and there's nothing you can do about it

[Nailclipper]

This is actually a very good idea. 

But like some posters said above, let us simulate formas an potatoes. Also give players ALL available mods.

This would encourage people to experiment, something which is lacking in the current system (you have to commit spending potatoes and formas to try out a build). It would also incentivize people farm more mods and potatoes outside of simulacrum if they've found some possible builds they like. 

[TripleMax]

8 minutes ago, krc473 said:

 

I don't get the whole "relying on others" part. Coming up with a build, then testing it is not that hard. You can see how unranked/low ranked mods would perform, and imagine how they would do maxed. Its not hard. You don't really need to spend Forma to guess whether something is worth doing (especially after trying it on a few other frames). While I don't agree with your reasoning, I do think we should be allowed to do whatever we like in the Simulacrum. Testing mod combinations would be good. But what about testing how various Helminth abilities work?

You don't see the full capability/potenital with low ranked mods & terrible low polarity mods in general.
That's why you need formas to see what the full builds is capable to compare between different builds and then you're able to choose the ideal build.
For maxed primed mods/maxed corrupted mods & umbral mods

[TripleMax]

1 minute ago, Nailclipper said:

Also give players ALL available mods.

Don't agree with this part chief but the rest we can totally agree upon.