Discussion about Revenant survivability and base status.

[gouki123]

Hello everyone, I want to discuss with you all about changing Revenant's base status.

First, we need to remember what is a eidolon: A giant titan, with powerful shields, a ton of health, and decent armor. 

Now let's take a look at Revenant:

300 health

675 shield

125 armor

Based on the eidolons, Revenant should have statuses similar to them.

Shields are acceptable, they are big.

Armor is very small, but considering the eidolon, that is acceptable too.

Health is terrible, an eidolon have tons of health, so 300 health at lv 30 is just crazy.

But then you must be thinking: "So what? I can just build him with shields and adaptation, problem solved!"

I wish was just that easy, but let's remember 2 things:

Armor does not affect shields, meaning that high level enemies will need to hit you only 3 times to wipe out your shields.

Revenant's second ability, Mesmer Skin, does NOT trigger adaptation while receiving damage, resetting the mod, making the player vulnerable, and forcing them to keep spamming Mesmer to not get 1-shotted.

Conclusion: Revenant survivability is horrible, but there are ways to make it a lot better without making him a sudden immortal.

Increase his shield capacity by a great amount,

During Mesmer Skin, allow adaptation to activate,( I know this has no relation to base status, but I felt this is worth mentioning)

Give him more armor, to have some hope to survive when shields are down,

Keep the armor low, but give Revenant more shield and health capacity.

This post was made based in my in-game experience, with my personal opinions, having the purpose of discussing with others what they think about it. 

I am totally open to criticism, do not hold back, have a nice day everyone.

[Bronjun]

lol

 

You don't need to face tank everything even if certain frames possess damage mitigation/reduction abilities. I took Revenant to steel path and he's totally fine, and I wasn't even building around his 2. I use vitality and adaptation as my defence. Keep moving: Bullet jump, aim glide, doge for damage reduction, backspring to avoid melee... you get the idea. Mesmer skin protects you from some unexpected shots and you have enough shield and health to tank a bit while you recast. Also reave is a great mobility and minor healing skill that really improves flow in high level contents. 

[YUNoJump]

Mesmer Skin with decent strength can have 8-10 charges which can be replenished at any time, and a single enemy can't drain more than one charge unless you let them wake up somehow. MS also makes a noise when it goes down; combined with his significant shields and Shield Gating, this gives you plenty of time to recast before you are killed. If it's too slow for your tastes it could be worthwhile to use a +cast speed mod. Even if you happen to take health damage in that time then Reave can heal it afterwards.

Other than that, his 1 actually provides pretty good protection, as an enemy can easily Enthrall others and result in a mass of allies drawing aggro away from Revenant himself. It's criminally underrated as a 1 IMO.

I think it's incorrect to try and play Revenant by relying on his health pool. Big shields, and a 100% DR ability should be more than enough to rely on if you keep an eye on how many charges you have left.

[Nailclipper]

Conclusion: Revenant survivavibility is great, unless when suddenly you have a tentacle monster on your head in Deimos SP bounty :(((

[Fallen77]

il y a une heure, gouki123 a dit :

 

Conclusion: Revenant survivability is horrible.

 

No it's not, he's one of the best, if not THE best frame in terms of survivability. You don't need adaptation, nor shield, nor armor, nor health, just mesmer skin.

Make a build around mesmer skin, you won't be spamming it as much as people would lead you to believe, and go enjoy any high level content in the game, you WILL NOT die.

This message has been brought to you by someone who actually played Revenant a lot. 

So no OP, I strongly disagree with you. But if you wanna petition to give my boy more tankiness on top, I won't fight you ^^

[Butterfly85]

42 minutes ago, Nailclipper said:

Conclusion: Revenant survivavibility is great, unless when suddenly you have a tentacle monster on your head in Deimos SP bounty :(((

Yeah, getting combo'd by one of them and a jugulus before I have time to react by going to operator mode is probably the only time I get killed as Rev 🤨

 

[DrivaMain]

I am surprised a certain Revenant basher hasn’t invaded this thread already.

You clearly build revenant wrong. Mesmer Skin is his source of survivability. Ditch adaptation you don’t need it. You need STR MOAR STR. 7 charges of 100% Damage reduction is pretty strong.

[ThorienKELL]

I am reading your post and can't believe what I'm reading.
Rev is top tier borderline immortal tank, comparable only to inaros. 
He made Rhino on index OBSOLETE - (if you still play rhino on index, well, insert *future is now old man /meme)
So, no Rev does not need to improve, but YOU do : ) Find a decent build and learn to use his hit properly. 

[Hyohakusha]

3 hours ago, gouki123 said:

Conclusion: Revenant survivability is horrible, but there are ways to make it a lot better without making him a sudden immortal.

The statement of someone who doesn't know how to use Revenant.

2 hours ago, Fallen77 said:

No it's not, he's one of the best, if not THE best frame in terms of survivability. You don't need adaptation, nor shield, nor armor, nor health, just mesmer skin.

Make a build around mesmer skin, you won't be spamming it as much as people would lead you to believe, and go enjoy any high level content in the game, you WILL NOT die.

The statement of someone who knows how to use Revenant.

Aim for 250%+ Power Strength, pick up a copy of Rolling Guard if you can, though it's not necessary. Revenant, like Nekros, is one of those rare frames who doesn't rely on the same cookie cutter meta builds as everything else to survive. The only thing you need to worry about with a proper Rev build is purely mechanical auto turrets on PoE and the Kuva fortress, and Tusk Bolkors, because they can't be stunned by Mesmer skin.

[0_The_F00l]

This feels like a thread made by someone who only knows one way to tank damage and hasnt tried to understand all his abilities. And since you have said to be critical i will not hold back :P

 

Your first mistake was comparing him to Eidolons - Eidolons (in this game) are Zombie Sentient appendages like a hand that is crawling around looking for the rest of itself.

Compared to a proper sentient it is a husk - like a tree thats been wormed out and rotten - so the Eidolons are actually having poor armor shields and health compared to their actual sentient bodies.

Revenant is not so much based on Eidolons as he is "risen from the dead but changed" by the energy of the plains which also happens to animate Eidolons.

Second was that you are implying survivability needs to be build for armor or health or shields, while true for most other frames Revenants mesmer skin nullifies all damage and can be replenished using his reave. Enemies that damage him also get stunned so they dont keep attacking (exceptions exist) so they dont go down as fast so you can cast enthrall on them (for free) and regain your mesmer skin charge and do damage to the enemy and gain health and shields at the same time - giving you plenty of over shields (assuming enemies have shields) or while using the danse.

Putting more strength in place of mods that would normally give you survivability would work better (more charges on mesmer skin)

Third was trying to imply adaptation needs to be usable , Adaptation only works when it damages your health or shields , abilities that give you a "skin" do not work.

Revenant is very tanky , the only issues he can occasionally have is in corpus missions with nullifiers, that remove all mesmer skin charges , but his reave passive that grants overshields in these missions can give you a few seconds of breathing room to clear the bubble and cast it again.

[(XBOX)bigsnake84]

I use Revenant with zero defense mods. Mesmer Skin is that good. Best used with high Strength, I'm sitting at 13 stacks. Its actually 14 stacks since it goes over 13 by the decimals, and even a .01 stack protects fully.

Also people seem to not realize how much less fire you take if you constantly spread and kill your thralls. Get used to the flow of keeping your thralls under 7 so they continue to affect other enemies. Don't get attached, thralls are meant to be discarded.

High duration is also good as it increases the time Mesmer Skin stuns, and allows Enthrall plenty of time to spread.

[gouki123]

On 2020-09-17 at 6:28 AM, Nailclipper said:

Conclusion: Revenant survivavibility is great, unless when suddenly you have a tentacle monster on your head in Deimos SP bounty :(((

Totally agreed.

On 2020-09-17 at 7:01 AM, Fallen77 said:

No it's not, he's one of the best, if not THE best frame in terms of survivability. You don't need adaptation, nor shield, nor armor, nor health, just mesmer skin.

Make a build around mesmer skin, you won't be spamming it as much as people would lead you to believe, and go enjoy any high level content in the game, you WILL NOT die.

This message has been brought to you by someone who actually played Revenant a lot. 

So no OP, I strongly disagree with you. But if you wanna petition to give my boy more tankiness on top, I won't fight you ^^

Hahahaha

On 2020-09-17 at 7:51 AM, DrivaMain said:

I am surprised a certain Revenant basher hasn’t invaded this thread already.

You clearly build revenant wrong. Mesmer Skin is his source of survivability. Ditch adaptation you don’t need it. You need STR MOAR STR. 7 charges of 100% Damage reduction is pretty strong.

But against grinner mesmer will be depleted in seconds thanks to their ranged shots no?

On 2020-09-17 at 8:40 AM, ThorienKELL said:

I am reading your post and can't believe what I'm reading.
Rev is top tier borderline immortal tank, comparable only to inaros. 
He made Rhino on index OBSOLETE - (if you still play rhino on index, well, insert *future is now old man /meme)
So, no Rev does not need to improve, but YOU do : ) Find a decent build and learn to use his hit properly. 

Guess so.

On 2020-09-17 at 9:52 AM, 0_The_F00l said:

This feels like a thread made by someone who only knows one way to tank damage and hasnt tried to understand all his abilities. And since you have said to be critical i will not hold back :P

 

Your first mistake was comparing him to Eidolons - Eidolons (in this game) are Zombie Sentient appendages like a hand that is crawling around looking for the rest of itself.

Compared to a proper sentient it is a husk - like a tree thats been wormed out and rotten - so the Eidolons are actually having poor armor shields and health compared to their actual sentient bodies.

Revenant is not so much based on Eidolons as he is "risen from the dead but changed" by the energy of the plains which also happens to animate Eidolons.

Second was that you are implying survivability needs to be build for armor or health or shields, while true for most other frames Revenants mesmer skin nullifies all damage and can be replenished using his reave. Enemies that damage him also get stunned so they dont keep attacking (exceptions exist) so they dont go down as fast so you can cast enthrall on them (for free) and regain your mesmer skin charge and do damage to the enemy and gain health and shields at the same time - giving you plenty of over shields (assuming enemies have shields) or while using the danse.

Putting more strength in place of mods that would normally give you survivability would work better (more charges on mesmer skin)

Third was trying to imply adaptation needs to be usable , Adaptation only works when it damages your health or shields , abilities that give you a "skin" do not work.

Revenant is very tanky , the only issues he can occasionally have is in corpus missions with nullifiers, that remove all mesmer skin charges , but his reave passive that grants overshields in these missions can give you a few seconds of breathing room to clear the bubble and cast it again.

Reave can actually replenish mesmer charges? I used reave with mesmer but the number of charges was the same afterwards.

[(NSW)Reason]

Build maximum power strength, have 19 charges. Even with minus duration (like 45 or so) Mesmer skin still stuns things long enough to kill (like 2.5 seconds or something). Try not to have minus duration though

[vegetosayajin]

5 hours ago, gouki123 said:

Conclusion: Revenant survivability is horrible

bs

learn how to mod and play him
 

 

2 hours ago, ThorienKELL said:

comparable only to inaros

oh no, don't compare this god frame to that meat sack that can be one shot after a level, inaros should not be compared to a good frame :D

[DrivaMain]

24 minutes ago, gouki123 said:

But against grinner mesmer will be depleted in seconds thanks to their ranged shots no?

there is a small delay between mesmer skin uses to prevent High ROF enemy weapons to deplete it.

[Berzerkules]

2 hours ago, ThorienKELL said:

Rev is top tier borderline immortal tank, comparable only to inaros. 

Inaros is not a tank. He is a walking pile of health. He has no damage reduction in his kit instead, he has 2 healing abilities that lock him in place when he uses them with no way to mitigate the incoming damage. With no shields Inaros is the only frame in the game that can get one shot. Nidus has no shields but with 15 stacks he essentially has health gating. 

Revenant is a tank. He has 100% damage reduction. He can literally tank an infinite amount of damage. If he loses all charges of mesmer skin you can proc rolling guard for 3 seconds of invulnerability and recast. There is no reason he should ever take damage. 

Wisp's 2 makes her a better tank than Inaros. She also has passive healing from her 1 which also provides cc and mobility. Not that the hp regen is even needed since she can abuse shield gating and use her 2 to negate all damage to her health. 

[Fallen77]

Il y a 2 heures, Hyohakusha a dit :

The statement of someone who doesn't know how to use Revenant.

The statement of someone who knows how to use Revenant.

Aim for 250%+ Power Strength, pick up a copy of Rolling Guard if you can, though it's not necessary. Revenant, like Nekros, is one of those rare frames who doesn't rely on the same cookie cutter meta builds as everything else to survive. The only thing you need to worry about with a proper Rev build is purely mechanical auto turrets on PoE and the Kuva fortress, and Tusk Bolkors, because they can't be stunned by Mesmer skin.

Yeah, pretty much my build. Tho I don't even use rolling guard, never found it usefull on Rev. But to each his own

[0_The_F00l]

1 hour ago, gouki123 said:

Reave can actually replenish mesmer charges? I used reave with mesmer but the number of charges was the same afterwards.

Conditions:

you need to have atleast one mesmer charge active on yourself,

You need to have thralls

Reave must pass though thralls ,

each thrall that you pass through gives you one mesmer charge up to your max possible (as per your power strength).

 

[SneakyErvin]

7 hours ago, gouki123 said:

Conclusion: Revenant survivability is horrible, but there are ways to make it a lot better without making him a sudden immortal.

Say what now?

Mesmer Skin + Shield Gate = Immortal, except versus very few specific enemies where you dont bring him eitherway. He was near immortal pre- shield gate aswell, shield gate simply made it so you dont really need to watch mesmer stacks anymore since you have the invulnerability window at all times.

[ThorienKELL]

57 minutes ago, Berzerkules said:

Inaros is not a tank. He is a walking pile of health. He has no damage reduction in his kit instead, he has 2 healing abilities that lock him in place when he uses them with no way to mitigate the incoming damage. With no shields Inaros is the only frame in the game that can get one shot. Nidus has no shields but with 15 stacks he essentially has health gating. 

Wisp's 2 makes her a better tank than Inaros. She also has passive healing from her 1 which also provides cc and mobility. Not that the hp regen is even needed since she can abuse shield gating and use her 2 to negate all damage to her health. 

Well I guess I'm using my immortal inaros tank build wrong : )

There is no way to say this politely so ...you have no idea what you're talking about. 
If you need a proper inaros build and methods how to use his kit, just ask. 
 

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

Maybe try reading a wiki or playing him more to acquire more experience.

[Berzerkules]

1 hour ago, ThorienKELL said:

Well I guess I'm using my immortal inaros tank build wrong : )

There is no way to say this politely so ...you have no idea what you're talking about. 
If you need a proper inaros build and methods how to use his kit, just ask. 
 

Sure. Give me an Inaros lesson.  

Immortal vs. what lvl enemies? Max lvl? If you can find proof of that then I'd love to see it. As far as I know any amount of hp regen, damage reduction, armor or anything else Inaros can use for survivability will eventually fail. 

[vegetosayajin]

20 minutes ago, Berzerkules said:

Immortal vs. what lvl enemies? Max lvl?

very very far from max tbh
he can get 1 shot above lv500 no prob
If you don't get another ability from helminth he is still bad

[gouki123]

On 2020-09-17 at 11:28 AM, DrivaMain said:

there is a small delay between mesmer skin uses to prevent High ROF enemy weapons to deplete it.

Nice to know, by the way, is it possible to increase the delay?

On 2020-09-17 at 12:42 PM, 0_The_F00l said:

Conditions:

you need to have atleast one mesmer charge active on yourself,

You need to have thralls

Reave must pass though thralls ,

each thrall that you pass through gives you one mesmer charge up to your max possible (as per your power strength).

 

Ohh, so that's why.

[Umquaptovis]

There are very few things that revinent can not survive. And in fact he thrives more the harder the content. Just like shattering impact revinent works at max power the whole time and is linear in scailing. In short or standard missions any other dps frame will out pase him, but at the truly high end he will out perform them.

To get revinent to be at his best you want to basicly go all in on strength at all costs, your goal is to get reav to 100%+ health drain this will also give you about 16 ish charges for your skin. Then you go in on duration as much as you can. You lose range and efficiency but you should not have Manny issues. His 1 will cost nothing as dashed targets are free and you should not need to cast the skin more than once after that reav will kill mobs and recharge the skin so it dose alot for the cast. The dance is mostly for covering friends and can patch the range but at the cost of energy. The only defence mod I run is rolling guard as I just like the protection but is is an open slot for changes.

Frames with percent biased or true damage abilities will not follow the meta though they will be their own and require more knowledge and skill on the users part to work.