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Where is veil proxima?


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I am very curious, the wiki says that:

Veil Proxima is a remote location, far outside of Origin System, where the Sentients travel back from the Tau System. In this regard, it is probably also where the original Sentients embarked to the Tau System via Void Jump during the Orokin Era.

And I'm bad about the Lore, is there no additional information related to Veil proxima?

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If the Void surrounds the solar system (i.e. you can't travel between the solar system and any surrounding stars without passing through the void), then I'm assuming that Veil Proxima is just the region surrounding the solar system before one reaches the void. Like, maybe it's called Veil Proxima because it's in close proximity with the void (the "veil" that surrounds us).

Crappy diagram of my thinking:

pT9gGy7.png

 

I very, VERY strongly doubt that it has anything to do with the Veil Nebula.

The Veil Nebula is 2400 lightyears away from us. On the other hand, the Tau system in real life (i.e. Alpha Centauri, the nearest star system) is around ~4.3 lightyears away.

 

Edited by SortaRandom
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il y a 6 minutes, SortaRandom a dit :

Si el Vacío rodea el sistema solar (es decir, no puede viajar entre el sistema solar y las estrellas circundantes sin pasar por el vacío), entonces supongo que Veil Proxima es solo la región que rodea el sistema solar  antes de que  uno alcance el vacío. . Tal vez se llame Veil Proxima porque está muy cerca del vacío (el extraño y tenue "velo" que nos rodea).

Diagrama de mierda de mi pensamiento:

pT9gGy7.png

 

Dudo muchísimo que tenga algo que ver con la Nebulosa Velo.

La Nebulosa del Velo está a 2400 años luz de nosotros. Por otro lado, el sistema Tau en la vida real (es decir, Alpha Centauri, el sistema estelar más cercano) está a unos ~ 4,3 años luz de distancia.

 

I was also surprised with the distance of the nebula, even so this explanation feels better 

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12 minutes ago, trunks013 said:

Wait what ? The void is not on parallel plain of existence ? Ha man you messed up all my theory LOL

Maybe it's both? idk XD

I don't remember how much the game explains about it, but I was under the impression that the Veil was a physical location that the Sentients had to pass through to travel between the two star systems. But I'm sure the void also exists "within" the solar system as a separate dimension, since the moon was hidden inside it and all. And since Albrecht Entrati was already able to enter the void before long-distance space travel had been invented by humans.

 

Like, if our plane of existence (i.e. our regular world + our regular laws of physics) were called Dimension A, and the void (space magic n stuff) exists in a parallel plane called Dimension B... then maybe the "void" surrounding our solar system is just a region where void magic is so powerful that everything gets forced into Dimension B?

(Just spitballing here; idk if this is actual canon 😂)

Edited by SortaRandom
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16 minutes ago, SortaRandom said:

If the Void surrounds the solar system (i.e. you can't travel between the solar system and any surrounding stars without passing through the void)

 

The Void is another dimension, not a physical location in realspace

Your drawing, hilariously enough, still has merit. It's functionally a drawing of the Kuiper Belt

1 minute ago, SortaRandom said:

I don't remember how much the game explains about it, but I was under the impression that the Veil was a physical location that the Sentients had to pass through to travel between the two star systems.

 

From the original version of the lore, no. The Sentients have the option of passing through the Void to get to the Solar System faster (which causes them to suffer metaphorical ovarian cancer) or going the slow route through realspace

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Just now, TARINunit9 said:

The Void is another dimension, not a physical location in realspace

Your drawing, hilariously enough, still has merit. It's functionally a drawing of the Kuiper Belt

From the original version of the lore, no. The Sentients have the option of passing through the Void to get to the Solar System faster (which causes them to suffer metaphorical ovarian cancer) or going the slow route through realspace

Oooh, interesting!

I thought that interstellar travel had basically been solved at this point in the game's story, but it was only external inconveniences that prevented travel between the two stars. Namely, Sentients (and the lack of a habitable planet) being very hostile to humans, and the Void being very hostile to sentient genitalia.

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1 minute ago, SortaRandom said:

Oooh, interesting!

I thought that interstellar travel had basically been solved at this point in the game's story, but it was only external inconveniences that prevented travel between the two stars. Namely, Sentients (and the lack of a habitable planet) being very hostile to humans, and the Void being very hostile to sentient genitalia.

Hmm... Have you visited the Entrati Lore Room in Necraloid?

The Old Blood, were Explorers at their simplest. They looked at the stars above but with no real way to get there. Interstellar travel had clearly not been discovered (yet), and this resulted in Albetect (I think I misspelled his name...) Entrati to do research on the "Void", which I think he "discovered" the void (Or at least, largely involved in the usage of the void for large distance travel.)

You can see the railjack utilizing void travel to cross large distances, however, its only the railjack that is known which is able do this. The OTHER mode of transport is Solar Rails, which as you can already guess, had very limited range.

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Just now, Aadi880 said:

Hmm... Have you visited the Entrati Lore Room in Necraloid?

The Old Blood, were Explorers at their simplest. They looked at the stars above but with no real way to get there. Interstellar travel had clearly not been discovered (yet), and this resulted in Albetect (I think I misspelled his name...) Entrati to do research on the "Void", which I think he "discovered" the void (Or at least, largely involved in the usage of the void for large distance travel.)

You can see the railjack utilizing void travel to cross large distances, however, its only the railjack that is known which is able do this. The OTHER mode of transport is Solar Rails, which as you can already guess, had very limited range.

Oh, I know about the Albrecht lore entries; I mentioned them in a comment above XD

Up till I read @TARINunit9's comment, my impression was that Albrecht's experiment was for using void magic to propel humanity through space at incredibly high speeds (where "realspace" and "void space" occupy the same physical space in separate planes of existence).
But given what Railjack loading screens look like, yeah, it definitely makes more sense for the Void to be a dimension that humans/sentients use for rapidly "wormholing" across extreme distances, whereas simply flying through space the normal way is just too slow to be viable.

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9 minutes ago, SortaRandom said:

Oh, I know about the Albrecht lore entries; I mentioned them in a comment above XD

Up till I read @TARINunit9's comment, my impression was that Albrecht's experiment was for using void magic to propel humanity through space at incredibly high speeds (where "realspace" and "void space" occupy the same physical space in separate planes of existence).
But given what Railjack loading screens look like, yeah, it definitely makes more sense for the Void to be a dimension that humans/sentients use for rapidly "wormholing" across extreme distances, whereas simply flying through space the normal way is just too slow to be viable.

I see it as slipspace from Halo.

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4 minutes ago, SortaRandom said:

Oh, I know about the Albrecht lore entries; I mentioned them in a comment above XD

Up till I read @TARINunit9's comment, my impression was that Albrecht's experiment was for using void magic to propel humanity through space at incredibly high speeds (where "realspace" and "void space" occupy the same physical space in separate planes of existence).
But given what Railjack loading screens look like, yeah, it definitely makes more sense for the Void to be a dimension that humans/sentients use for rapidly "wormholing" across extreme distances, whereas simply flying through space the normal way is just too slow to be viable.

However some lore entries suggest that the Void can interfere with our dimension. That's how the Orokin (possibly Albrecht) discovered the Void exists. But they didn't thought it had any real use for spacefaring.

Before the Void Era, the Orokin could "see" the Void. After the Void era, with the Heart, the Zariman and Solar Rails, the Void is much more active in our dimension. Creating storms, rifts and all kind of sh*t.

"Originally we studied Void occurrences from afar, observing and cataloguing the distribution of galaxies and refining cosmological evolution models. We are in a new age of cosmic exploration. Advancements in space travel partnered with determined curiosity have brought us closer to our object of study, and with it, revelation."

So... yeah, the Void can be both. A Dimension and at the same time an area close to the edge of the Origin System where Void Storms never ends or something...

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9 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

In the Tenno on 2019, Cy called it Heliosphere AKA the edge of where the Sol's solar winds meets the Interstellar radiation and slows it down.

I was about to mention this. I've always just head canoned Veil as being the edge of the solar system

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basically where the Void meets the rest of space, as far out into space as most are willing to go.

would be cool if we do ever get to reach tau, Scarlet Spear was just tackling a scouting force but it had that feel of a proper, alien fleet bringing impending doom: I hope that the main fleet of Sentients will be BIG, like, many hundreds of motherships big, and we get to start fighting those in the railjack, that'd be awesome.

 

Edited by (PS4)robotwars7
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IMHO, Void does not have a pure physical definition like another dimension or parallel universe as it obviously has a spiritual/pure energy component. It can be projected into a normal material spatiotemporal continuum by some natural fluctuations that destabilize either material or void systems or by specific devices like void drive, transference, etc. There might be multiple ways to rationalize it or simply accept as space fantasy mumbo-jumbo and forget about it.

However, railjack veil location, void nodes on starchart, and some communications systems are fairly accessible by grineer, corpus and infested, who get there either on their own or are transferred there. Physically, they can be anywhere, it does not matter IMO. There may be only two reasonable ways to get there: using a void device/entity or physical slow/regular travel. Hence, it is logical to assume that railjack veil proxima is within reach of grineer slow travel. Alternatively, we have to assume that grineer have some shielding technology which permits void travel, which seems to be extremely unlikely based on the lore. Maximum the Queens can master is a little siphon or a couple of kuva liches. It should be essentially impossible to transport to the void on a scale of galleons/crewships/multiple fighters to build bases there. So, seems like it is fairly close to colonized areas of Sol.

Also, it seems that there is regular sentient presence there as well, and the area is used to transport sentient forces to Earth based on Scarlet Spear.

Edited by akots
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Reality is we just don't know.

Seems the void is a region of space disturbances not governed by our physics.  Whether this is a sub-space or other phenomenon, who knows.

It is still unclear to me if the orokin acheived interstellar travel without the use of the void anomalies.   I lean towards this travel not being possible, but they were working on it, just the void was a shortcut, and naturally a focal point of their research.

Veil proxima could just be the space around the void space where it is in transition, and perhap things get wonky, but not quite full void nuts.  Whether or not the void is a region of anomalies, or fully encases our system remains inconsequential.

Edited by (PS4)TheWanderer17
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10 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

In the Tenno on 2019, Cy called it Heliosphere AKA the edge of where the Sol's solar winds meets the Interstellar radiation and slows it down.

10 hours ago, Butterfly85 said:

I was about to mention this. I've always just head canoned Veil as being the edge of the solar system

Oooh, I like this explanation! It makes a lot more sense when you think of the Veil as a literal, physical "veil" of thin, wispy gases colliding into each other.
And most importantly, as you said-- since it was literally the name for Veil Proxima during the tennocon demo, it's probably canon.

DExflJ4.png

For those curious, here's a diagram of the heliosphere from wikipedia, where the Sun's constant outward stream of solar wind is kind of colliding with interstellar gases as we orbit the center of our galaxy:

PIA22835-VoyagerProgram&Heliosphere-Char

 

10 hours ago, --F--NerevarCM said:


"Originally we studied Void occurrences from afar, observing and cataloguing the distribution of galaxies and refining cosmological evolution models."

 

Okay, this quote is hella important-- this Cephalon fragment refers to visible occurrences of the Void (capital V; the ingame space-magicky Void of the warframe universe) as being the same cosmological voids that are known today.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Void_(astronomy)

For those curious, here's a diagram of relatively nearby voids (and I say "relatively nearby" EXTREMELY loosely; these superclusters are some of the largest structures in the entire known universe):

Galaxy_superclusters_and_galaxy_voids.pn

 

So, assuming that this hasn't been retconned: If these voids are filled with fancy warframe-y space magic like the cephalon fragment suggests, then maybe the "Void is a physical AND an extra dimension" theory actually has some weight to it!

Maybe "void space" and our "realspace" occupy the same physical space in separate planes of existence, and Void occurrences can be observed directly in areas of vast emptiness (e.g. between superclusters in the present day, and beyond the solar system by the time Warframe takes place)-- as if the void magic were so powerful there that the "void space" plane began leaking into our "realspace" plane.

Like, one possibility is: the "emptier" a pocket of space is, the stronger the manifestation of Void magic in that space. So in the olden days that the cephalon fragment describes, the most obvious occurrences of Void were these supercluster-scale pockets of emptiness that are pictured above. But as the Orokin era is about to begin, humans (who know a bit about Void magic, but cannot yet manipulate it) begin to peer into the Void in less-empty pockets of space-- e.g. the ~4-lightyear gap between our Sun and the nearest star, Tau.
And finally, from the start of the Orokin era all the way to the year that the game takes place: humans+Sentients are scientifically advanced enough to manipulate Void magic, and use it for long-distance travel. Or hiding moons. Or mind-controlling the Infested. Or contraception, if you're a Sentient.

 

This could still make sense in regards to the interstellar travel problem. Like, the Void ingame is described as a region where the known laws of physics don't exactly apply as we'd expect them to. So perhaps the way that high-speed space travel works in this game (Railjacks, Solar Rails, etc) is that the traveler's ship briefly moves into the Void, where the very concept of distance is so damn freaky that a short trip in the Void can translate to a much larger distance covered in "realspace".

 

Just spitballing. 😂

 

---------------------------------------------------------------

TL;DR

Veil Proxima = Heliosphere is probably canon, according to Tennocon 2019 demo.

Also, I think that the Void is an alternate dimension that occupies the same physical space as our "real" universe.
Since space+time get all wonky in the void, humans/sentients in Warframe probably have a way of manipulating that wonkiness to get from point A to point B really really fast. This is the only known way of faster-than-light movement, so dipping into the void is practically necessary for interstellar travel-- which kinda sucks for any Sentient soldier who wanted to have kids.

(Our Railjacks literally enter the void to cross the solar system in a matter of seconds, which seems to support this.)

Edited by SortaRandom
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  • 2 months later...
On 2020-10-02 at 12:59 PM, JohnnyMeta said:

I am very curious, the wiki says that:

Veil Proxima is a remote location, far outside of Origin System, where the Sentients travel back from the Tau System. In this regard, it is probably also where the original Sentients embarked to the Tau System via Void Jump during the Orokin Era.

And I'm bad about the Lore, is there no additional information related to Veil proxima?

Railjack

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