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October 2020 Riven Disposition Update Preview


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6 hours ago, Xylena_Lazarow said:

How would the game be better for you without rivens? They are never mandatory, anywhere. You lose nothing from avoiding the riven system. Dissolve your rivens and pretend they never existed then, why ruin it for those who enjoy how rivens enrich the build system, beyond just unga bunga god rolls. I also happen to really like the pseudo-gambling part, since I can get my gambling thrills and win pseudo-money without ever risking losing real money. The youtube lemming who drops a thousand plat on a mediocre riven for the overrated Kronen, that's on them, not the existence of rivens.

The game wouldn't necessarily be 'better' without Rivens, but the economy would have less arbitrary inflation due to people purchasing rivens based on knee-jerk responses to Youtube people, as you've described.

The Riven system is complex enough that an easy solution doesn't really exist, outside of removing them altogether IMO. Like I said, I've spent a lot of time and plat on Rivens to get the collection I have. But that doesn't mean I'm blind to the fact that this system is inherently problematic. 

Mods to make weaker weapons more viable? Sure. I can get behind that. 

Mods that are essentially promoting gambling and ripping people off? I can't get behind that.

 

What I would love to see is a system of control with how rerolls occur (maybe locking one or more stats and rerolling to get better stats like what we have with valence fusion). The rarity of god-roll rivens speaks to the problems in this system. People will spend tens/hundreds of thousands of kuva getting a really good roll. DE would do well to understand how forced-gameplay is really only successful in the short term. 

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1 minute ago, Xylena_Lazarow said:

The most predatory thing isn't rivens, it's the 200p for Wukong Prime type scams specifically targeting new or uninformed players.

I would certainly agree that what you've described is a problem but the riven situation is far more problematic. 

Though BOTH issues stem from one problem. DE continues to reinforce the "free trade" economy they've currently got without putting time into developing a cohesive way for people to trade goods without relying on third party applications/websites. 

The community has asked for an auction house for years but DE continues to shut this down because they don't like the idea of an auction house in Warframe.

 

It just goes to show. The developers prioritize non-issues like lighting (Come on, Steve.. how many times are you going to screw around with lighting. While it is certainly nice to see these upgrades you fail to recognize the fact that no one is sitting here complaining about issues related to lighting. Spend your time on productive stuff instead of focusing your resources on non-issues).

Useless Old Timey Baseball GIF by Team Coco

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The hate nerf hurts. My riven will go down from 31.4 initial combo to 29. something. With my current build that means that my combo multiplier will decrease by one. So -20% from the gladiator set + -60% from blood rush = -80% cc which equals 24%?

You guys have to stop using this weapon NOW!


PS:
Yes, i am "complaining" about -24% cc on a heavy attack hate

 

 

🤣

Edited by (NSW)Asthmatis
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On 2020-10-19 at 4:16 AM, kevoisvevo said:

You bet. Millions of damage on a nonrivened stropha heavy attack. What do you need riven for lmao.

well yeah i know it's a really good riven but it's still weird seeing it at the absolute lowest

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i dont really get the hate with the riven system. i mean you can do the high level stuff with meta weapons without any rivens, i can, youtube videos shows you can,  the way i see it they make the unpopular ones useable to some extent. and please dont tell me that you werent expecting a nerf when you bought your kronen/gram/ etc rivens.

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11 hours ago, (PS4)ArianaG_-- said:

i dont really get the hate with the riven system. i mean you can do the high level stuff with meta weapons without any rivens, i can, youtube videos shows you can,  the way i see it they make the unpopular ones useable to some extent. and please dont tell me that you werent expecting a nerf when you bought your kronen/gram/ etc rivens.

Hate, at least from my perspective, is a rather a strong word regarding this particular topic.  Let's call it frustration and proceed from there.

For me, personally, it isn't about the the meta. It isn't about acquiring a god tier riven. And it isn't even about the some of the insane prices for rivens that I see in trade chat ( which is an entirely different topic).

The frustration for me is DE's lack of... Well, let's call it appreciation, for a players time and investment for when ever a person get's lucky enough to grab a decent riven that they've been trying to acquire for what ever wep that they've been longing for. An individual spends a great deal of time farming kuva ( and yes, I know, boosters, certain frames, teams, etc.) on what limited amount of free time that they have available to play Warframe ( personally, I work 10-12 hr days, so my time is limited). In addition to the kuva, there's always the potential necessity of adding another forma or 2 for build changes to a new wep loadout to accommodate said riven. So more time and investment given in order to get your shiny new toy just the way you want it.

Now, DE has decided in it's infinite wisdom that because players are gravitating to specific weapons ( I.E. meta or stat sticks), that they're going to nerf your shiny new toy that you spent all the time and resources on, based on some arbitrary usage chart. DE's stated reason for this is that they want to see a more varied usage of other weapons in the game, to create a more level playing field across the weapons board. Except it isn't a level playing field, and DE knows this. It's a strawman argument, which DE can hide behind, instead of doing what they should be doing as a developer. Fixing the host of glaring issues with all weapon families, and make them competitive again so the players will be willing to actively engage and come out with better loadouts.

My frustration factor is that DE doesn't respect the player's time or investment. Ironically, especially over the 6 months+, DE doesn't appear to respect the player as a customer as well. A host of buggy issues, lack of documentation, stealth nerfs, an unwillingness to fix a plethora of reported issues with frames, and an exceedingly lack of communication in the message boards ( This is probably the only forums I've ever been on where CM's rarely acknowledge their players existence). DE is perfectly willing to take your money for shiny new cosmetics, Tennogen, or what ever, then hide safely behind the "Beta" tag for anything else.

So yeah, frustration. People have a legitimate reason to be frustrated to see all their hard work, time and efforts, just go up in flames because of some arbitrary usage chart. It's easier for that to be used as a justification for nerfing rivens, as opposed to be doing what DE should be, fixing their stuff.

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21 hours ago, Old_Fogie said:

Hate, at least from my perspective, is a rather a strong word regarding this particular topic.  Let's call it frustration and proceed from there.

For me, personally, it isn't about the the meta. It isn't about acquiring a god tier riven. And it isn't even about the some of the insane prices for rivens that I see in trade chat ( which is an entirely different topic).

The frustration for me is DE's lack of... Well, let's call it appreciation, for a players time and investment for when ever a person get's lucky enough to grab a decent riven that they've been trying to acquire for what ever wep that they've been longing for. An individual spends a great deal of time farming kuva ( and yes, I know, boosters, certain frames, teams, etc.) on what limited amount of free time that they have available to play Warframe ( personally, I work 10-12 hr days, so my time is limited). In addition to the kuva, there's always the potential necessity of adding another forma or 2 for build changes to a new wep loadout to accommodate said riven. So more time and investment given in order to get your shiny new toy just the way you want it.

Now, DE has decided in it's infinite wisdom that because players are gravitating to specific weapons ( I.E. meta or stat sticks), that they're going to nerf your shiny new toy that you spent all the time and resources on, based on some arbitrary usage chart. DE's stated reason for this is that they want to see a more varied usage of other weapons in the game, to create a more level playing field across the weapons board. Except it isn't a level playing field, and DE knows this. It's a strawman argument, which DE can hide behind, instead of doing what they should be doing as a developer. Fixing the host of glaring issues with all weapon families, and make them competitive again so the players will be willing to actively engage and come out with better loadouts.

My frustration factor is that DE doesn't respect the player's time or investment. Ironically, especially over the 6 months+, DE doesn't appear to respect the player as a customer as well. A host of buggy issues, lack of documentation, stealth nerfs, an unwillingness to fix a plethora of reported issues with frames, and an exceedingly lack of communication in the message boards ( This is probably the only forums I've ever been on where CM's rarely acknowledge their players existence). DE is perfectly willing to take your money for shiny new cosmetics, Tennogen, or what ever, then hide safely behind the "Beta" tag for anything else.

So yeah, frustration. People have a legitimate reason to be frustrated to see all their hard work, time and efforts, just go up in flames because of some arbitrary usage chart. It's easier for that to be used as a justification for nerfing rivens, as opposed to be doing what DE should be, fixing their stuff.

somehow i do get your point but again the way i see riven is they are just bonus/power creeps, i can still remember the feeling when i finally understood riven dispo after buying a nikana riven and see its stat go rock bottom when i used it with the nikana prime hahah. but imo the riven dispo promotes diversity to build and creating new possibilities and it offers options like:

1. stick with the popular weapons and suffer lower stats/nerfs

2. make new builds with high/decent dispo weapons. thats what imma do with the buffed rivens :3

 

fyi i do have kronen/gram rivens too (average stats) and imma just set them aside till they get decent again and just try some new stuff for now

 

 

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On 2020-10-21 at 7:52 PM, Old_Fogie said:

Hate, at least from my perspective, is a rather a strong word regarding this particular topic.  Let's call it frustration and proceed from there.

For me, personally, it isn't about the the meta. It isn't about acquiring a god tier riven. And it isn't even about the some of the insane prices for rivens that I see in trade chat ( which is an entirely different topic).

The frustration for me is DE's lack of... Well, let's call it appreciation, for a players time and investment for when ever a person get's lucky enough to grab a decent riven that they've been trying to acquire for what ever wep that they've been longing for. An individual spends a great deal of time farming kuva ( and yes, I know, boosters, certain frames, teams, etc.) on what limited amount of free time that they have available to play Warframe ( personally, I work 10-12 hr days, so my time is limited). In addition to the kuva, there's always the potential necessity of adding another forma or 2 for build changes to a new wep loadout to accommodate said riven. So more time and investment given in order to get your shiny new toy just the way you want it.

Now, DE has decided in it's infinite wisdom that because players are gravitating to specific weapons ( I.E. meta or stat sticks), that they're going to nerf your shiny new toy that you spent all the time and resources on, based on some arbitrary usage chart. DE's stated reason for this is that they want to see a more varied usage of other weapons in the game, to create a more level playing field across the weapons board. Except it isn't a level playing field, and DE knows this. It's a strawman argument, which DE can hide behind, instead of doing what they should be doing as a developer. Fixing the host of glaring issues with all weapon families, and make them competitive again so the players will be willing to actively engage and come out with better loadouts.

My frustration factor is that DE doesn't respect the player's time or investment. Ironically, especially over the 6 months+, DE doesn't appear to respect the player as a customer as well. A host of buggy issues, lack of documentation, stealth nerfs, an unwillingness to fix a plethora of reported issues with frames, and an exceedingly lack of communication in the message boards ( This is probably the only forums I've ever been on where CM's rarely acknowledge their players existence). DE is perfectly willing to take your money for shiny new cosmetics, Tennogen, or what ever, then hide safely behind the "Beta" tag for anything else.

So yeah, frustration. People have a legitimate reason to be frustrated to see all their hard work, time and efforts, just go up in flames because of some arbitrary usage chart. It's easier for that to be used as a justification for nerfing rivens, as opposed to be doing what DE should be, fixing their stuff.

Have to say I agree. This seems to be a very accurate description of what Im seeing go on. Seeing it enough has driven me entirely off anything to do with rivens. I won't buy,sell, or use them. If the weapon sux itll suck. Ill hit 30 and scrap it. If i like it ill build it and see if its effectiveness is worthy of mention. If its not then moving on....

 

Thats what nerfing hard work leads to.......total evasion of the system entirely or for some they just flat out quit. I can honestly say in the last few months of crap patches and now the next riven nerf ive lost over 20 friends/clanmates to the glaring but continuously avoided issues.....

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I still believe that the riven system is broken in the current system as it is. Simply put, DE needs to do the same thing they did with primed reach. instead of giving boosts in percentages, give boosts in terms of real values. Like, instead of giving a +400% damage boost to a 18 damage per shot pistol, give it + 400 damage. That would allow for a much fairer system. Also, DE needs to stop basing their data on weapons like paracesis on base use. FFS, that weapon needs to be 'maxed' 5 times, and need to be used in railjack sentient anomaly. Outside that, i have never seen a single player using, or even asking for its build.

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So nearly every weapon melee weapon I use is nerfed except Broken War. I was hoping that Orthos Prime sees a buff.. but nope, just Orthos. The 0.55 disp is okay, with some weapons with similar stats are about ~1.0 disp. The Paracesis seems to be coming out of no where. I do not have a riven for it, but even if I would, I would not use it in anything but fighting sentinels. Acceletra nerfed again. I guess I should be happy that Fulmin was not nerfed...

This system is so arbitrary and... bad. I have never purchased a riven for platinum, and never will. It is not worth it to invest possibly real money in something that gets demolished.

Edited by (PS4)thegarada
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Were the stats even updated in game yet? All the rivens I have that are on that list haven't even been updated yet. They match the same exact stats as before. Whenever a disposition changes the stats of the rivens change if its a singular weapon riven say like the paracesis or the shedu or zenistar, etc none of those rivens stats changed at all.

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