Conclave rework idea

[(XBOX)elementXGHILLIE]

Make it PvE where players compete for score. Make scoring come from things beside just killing

 

[Stormdragon]

So basically add value to leaderboards, which can be done with no need of touching conclave in the slightest and even then I really doubt DE ever makes something like that since even the old event leaderboards were made pointless years ago due community complaints and DE's attempt to cater to these.

[Loxyen]

another troll post smh

[(XBOX)elementXGHILLIE]

Troll?

 

[Sevek7]

30 minutes ago, (XB1)elementXGHILLIE said:

Troll?

 

I'm not sure what exactly was meant by "Troll post" in response to your original post. But I think it has something to do with a bit of history:

You had this idea for PvE with scoring to compete against others. This falls under the category of what is usually called PvEvP. This type of idea has had some success in games like Destiny, and various others. It's usually implemented side-by-side with PvP modes, and players can choose one or the other, according to their preference. 

Warframe could certainly do the same, but there is a bit of a difficult history here. Up until now, DE have employed an extremely radical approach to PvP that nobody has ever tried before. It's characterized by two things:

1) Never fix any exploits.

2) Never ban any cheaters.

These two points are completely the opposite of what any successful PvP game does. Currently, if a new player attempts to play Warframe's PvP, due to the cheating and exploit abuse they will typically spend most of the match in the skybox, instead of in the match itself. Clearly, this radical idea has not worked. So, if Warframe were to implement a PvEvP mode, we would have the same exact problem. Unless DE are willing to start fixing exploits and banning cheaters, PvEvP will just be a contest of "who can exploit / cheat the most." 

These issues go beyond PvP, however, and are commonly echoed by the statement "DE doesn't play their own game" which is often stated by players. I'm not sure if this is factually true, but there is some evidence to support it. Some extremely common bugs have not been fixed for several years.

For example, a couple of ubiquitous bugs that appear in all game-modes are:

1. The weird bunny-hopping that your frame sometimes does after landing from a bullet jump.

2. Your frame gets stuck on some geometry for a moment, and the game treats that as "falling" so you end up with a hard landing even though you only fell a small distance.  

These are two very simple, small bugs that would have been fixed ASAP in a normal game. They have been around for ... I don't know ... 3 years? Unfortunately, DE focuses only on things that get a lot of attention. Bugs reported in the forums very rarely get fixed, whereas bugs reported on reddit / twitter that get a lot of upvotes / retweets get fixed extremely fast [side note: the cosmetic team seems to be better than the rest, cosmetic bugs are fixed much faster, but still only if the bug gets a lot of attention]. So, if some part of the game is broken and can be exploited, it will be abused by the playerbase and reported as a "tactic" instead of a bug. This is why things like the broken condition overload math took ... 4 years to fix? 

So, if DE implemented a PvEvP mode, it would be absurdly imbalanced and filled with exploits, because the entire game is. It would then become wildly unpopular almost immediately, because there would be rampant abuse. The abusers would never get banned, so they would continue to abuse in every game, and anybody else would need to begin abusing just to keep up. 

Due to this history and the fact that DE has still not fixed a single PvP exploit in over a year, I (and others I'm sure) have very little faith that they could make a PvEvP mode that is successful. 

As for the "troll post," I think there is a history also among players to suggest any PvE alternative to get PvP rewards, and often this comes with very aggressive insults to the people who enjoy warframe's PvP. So, I understand why some might think your post is yet another of these troll-style posts, but I think we shouldn't be so quick to judge :)

Your idea has merit, but would require a development team that focuses more on balance and less on constant new content & grind.

To be fair, I don't really blame DE. I think they started this game with hopes it could be a skill-based shooter with some powers and melee. But, they fell into the trap of not balancing / fixing exploits fast enough. So all the competitive gamers left and went to different games [because there's no real competition in an unbalanced game]. So they were left with a community that always wanted new stuff, but never wanted challenge. So they designed the game to fit their community. It was the right business decision, but left the game in the awkward state of being a "win simulator." 

[Loxyen]

On 2020-10-21 at 9:39 AM, Sevek7 said:

PvEvP

Thats simply competitive pve... pvx or how you call it pvevp has to implement direct pvp elements.... and what do you do in a shooter the most even if its 3rd person and has melee + space magic elements? Kill ppl... therefore my reasoning. What he's asking for are basically the ranked events from back then where a task had more priority than just killing the ai.

[(XBOX)elementXGHILLIE]

Just an idea, to easy fix a broke system, and allow players access to the conclave rewards.

 

[Stormdragon]

10 hours ago, (XB1)elementXGHILLIE said:

Just an idea, to easy fix a broke system, and allow players access to the conclave rewards.

 

Easy fixes aren't always the best ones, specially when the system is perceived as broken simply because it makes players use all of the game mechanics that exist in the entire game, like energy management, positioning, dodging, animation cancelling, aiming (in a shooter, lmao); but can be totally bypassed in PvE since in there we get practically unlimited energy, huge damage reductions, powerful heals (some are instant), the ability to disable the enemy AI and huge aoe nukes that simply shred enemies even without line of sight.

The rewards are there for anyone to take, people being used to be nearly immortal gods who can shred entire hordes of enemies with a single movement of their warframe's arm and refusing to let that go to compete against other players and refusing basic stuff such as improving mechanically or going deeper into warframe's mechanics just because of reasons is an entirely different isuue.

[RRRRRRRAAAAAAA]

I think the main problems of the Conclave are: the lack of good rewards for the missions themselves that are constantly needed (like Kuva), the lack of good special rewards for pve that could not be obtained anywhere else, too much abundance of weapons (basically, each player uses only one type of weapon on each mission, and there is simply no time to change) and the selection limit depending on the rank of the Conclave.

First of all, I would introduce more game types, but they should be divided into three groups: battle, game and race. Only three types will be available at a time (one from each group). In each game mode, you can get a reward once a day: in battle mode, one random reward from the list (as in a sortie), in game mode, the reward will depend on the victory of the player or team, in race mode, the reward will depend on the place that the player took. As the Conclave rank increases, the player will gain access to mission types with more valuable rewards. But at the same time, one type of mission will be available every day, which all players have access to (it is on this mission that the team selection will be as fast as possible and players will always be sure that they can have fun playing at least one type of mission). To improve the balance between players and just add the spirit of the Conclave to the games, you need to enter a feature on the battle missions like "melee only "or"bow only". I also advise you to work out the drop for each warframe. I mean that with each warframe in battle mode, with some probability, the resources that were spent on its creation will fall. 10% of these resources or a rare resource with a very low chance. For example, 350 Kuva from Garuda or Lazulite Toroid with a small chance with Heldrin. This will make the Conclave a unique place for farming. 

So...

And now I'll just describe seven new types of games that I came up with.

First, there are four types of race mode.

The first available with 0 rank is a race on warframes. In this type of race, four players must run from the beginning of a random normal location to the escape point (which will be displayed in black and white). At the same time, there will be no enemies on the location, parts of locations with elevators will not appear, players are immortal, can use any one ability once per race, have melee weapons (except for shooting melee weapons), any damage is transferred to the cold status. Special mods for warframes fall from the warframe race. 

At rank 1 (Mistral), the player opens the K-drive race mode. Four players appear at the beginning of one of the K-drive races of one of the free worlds. All damage becomes cold status, there are no enemies on the location. Rewards-special mods and parts of K-drives or the reputation of pipe kids.

At rank 2 (Whirlwind), access to the archwing race opens. The rules are almost the same as with the warframe race. Rewards-special archwing mods.

At rank 4 (Hurricane), access to the LANDING CRAFTS race opens ! The game already has five types of Landing Craft. Everyone has their own abilities, a lot of skins, but...almost no one uses abilities and the skin can only be boasted when loading...I thought it would be fun to introduce races on Landing Crafts! Railjack locations. Players must pass through all markers, all damage is cold status, each player can use the Landing Craft ability once per race. Abilities: Liset-failure interface all rivals in radios around, Mantis-the removal of any effect from itself, and invulnerability to them for a few seconds, Nightwave-leaves the mine with the effect it cold in radios, Scimitar-leaves a carpet of bombs subject to the effect of cold in the explosion, Xiphos-fire status cold all enemies in front of him. Rewards-special railjack mods.

On account of the battle mode:

At rank 0, Team Annihilation will be available.

At rank 2 (Whirlwind), access to the Typhoon Challenge opens. In fact, the two new types of battle mode are one type. In Typhoon Challenge, players in a team must defeat a single rank 5 player (Typhoon). At the same time, players will be allowed to use all three types of weapons. The peculiarity is that a rank 5 player can put a build on a warframe almost like on a pve. But all the characteristics of abilities(including the amount of energy and energy efficiency) can be improved by a total of 100%. For example, power by 50%, amount of energy by 25% and duration by 25% , or only power by 100%. In this case, the basic characteristics will be from the Conclave. The remaining characteristics can be similarly changed by a total of 100%. In this game mode, there should be features of resource drop. Typhoon gets a resource drop multiplier while it drops a lot more resources.

At rank 4 (Hurricane), access to Annihilation opens.

And at rank 5 (Typhoon), you can access the Typhoon Challenge mode like a Typhoon. 

At the expense of game modes:

At rank 0, Cephalon Capture will be available, but with changes. Cephalon Capture is similar to capturing a flag. But in reality, this mode turns into Team Annihilation. I offer to make it so that the damage is converted to the status of cold and when accumulated to a certain level, the player is completely frozen and only an ally can release it by simply clicking the action next to it. Rewards-drop a special "cephalon" reward from each cephalon (for example, a splinter of the rift mod with a small chance) and a special reward for the winning team and a consolation for the losing team.

At rank 3 (Tempest), access to Lunaro opens. I also think it would be fun to broadcast the best games of the day over the Conclave menu in Orbiter and lead the top players. Special rewards for the winning team and consolation for the losing team.

And at rank 5 (Typhoon), access is granted to...the game with stones from the Sacrifice quest. It was quite an original and fun game like checkers it's a pity that now it is nowhere else. This will be a pvp gambling game in which players must place their bet to enter the opponent selection menu. Bets will be different in terms of risk level as on the Index, but the player will be able to bet different resources (the amount will be fixed for each risk level), for one game, you can only bet one type of resource. When winning, the winner receives the loser's bet and does not lose their bet. When making a bet, the player will enter the opponent search menu. In this case, the game request will not be sent to the player, such as a request to trade on Maroo's Bazaar. The player will have a list of players who want to play with him and their bets. So...I don't know why I wrote all this...who needs it? ... but now my soul is calm.

And I apologize for my lame English. I wrote through a translator.)