DirectX 12 Beta Support: Is Now Live!

[-Kittens- 2,381]

2 hours ago, Alucardiy said:

Vulcan is better than DX12

Factually false. It is far more efficient at particular rendering models it is not a kind of "better" in any other category and moreover linux for gaming is a rapidly dying paradigm. Maybe next time in your rush to evangelize you might put your helmet on facing forward, much better to see that way.

 

2 hours ago, Danielw8 said:

vulkan works bad on AMD

Also factually false.

[Denizium 160]

1 hour ago, SortaRandom said:

This is awesome news!!

Out of curiosity-- when you say "for your specific model of graphics card", will this be tied to the driver version as well? i.e. For someone who keeps their drivers up to date, will they have to go through each of the shader micro-stutters again each time they update their GPU driver?

I'm only asking because this is the case on the Wii U emulator that I use, and it's a wee bit tedious to go through every time a new driver comes out 😢

This is unavoidable as upgrading the driver wipes the shader cache for vulkan and dx12. 

 

Though they could make it optimize the shaders in the launcher instead of on the fly, it'd take a minute but it'd look better than random stutters.

Edited November 2, 2020 by Denizium
More information

[DrivaMain 6,821]

While Vulkan is better in average FPS than DX12. DX12 still wins in minimum FPS. DX12 is less stuttery.

Well, looks my my RX 580 will get a nice boost and my GTX 1660 ti laptop finally can use Variable Rate Shading.

[Alucardiy 23]

1 час назад, -Kittens- сказал:

Фактически неверно. Он намного более эффективен в определенных моделях рендеринга, он не является чем-то вроде «лучше» в любой другой категории, и, более того, Linux для игр - быстро умирающая парадигма. Может быть, в следующий раз, когда вы будете спешить с евангелизацией, вы сможете надеть шлем лицом вперед, чтобы было лучше видеть его.

At least I'm not toxic, as practice has shown, Vulcan copes better with tasks if you work on it well. 3A projects RDR2 for example, in the presence of a weak processor (4/8,6/6) works much better on Vulcan

[Alucardiy 23]

Also, DX12 is only supported in windows 10, unlike Vulcan, which is supported even in windows 7, it would be nice to improve performance on older hardware until people can upgrade the computer

[SortaRandom 15,145]

2 hours ago, Denizium said:

This is unavoidable as upgrading the driver wipes the shader cache for vulkan and dx12. 

 

Though they could make it optimize the shaders in the launcher instead of on the fly, it'd take a minute but it'd look better than random stutters.

Ah, that's a shame. I'd definitely prefer a launcher option instead of having to go through the whole set of ingame stutters every time.

Thanks for the info though 😀

[-Kittens- 2,381]

On 2020-11-02 at 2:55 PM, Alucardiy said:

At least I'm not toxic, as practice has shown, Vulcan copes better with tasks if you work on it well. 3A projects RDR2 for example, in the presence of a weak processor (4/8,6/6) works much better on Vulcan

Cool story except AMD and nVidia have been caught colluding three different times to fix prices and in the San Diego days AMD did to Intel what Intel proceeded to do to AMD five years later.

These companies are financial constructs of technology and commerce; nothing more, nothing less. What's going to save warframe's dwindling user base is compelling gameplay and compelling presentation, not hugs and feels and "the good guys", whom are neither guys nor good. Microsoft is actively incentivizing API molding for developers BY developers and whether or not they pet homeless puppies every morning and wisk them away to happyland is completely immaterial to the on-the-ground consumer.

If the philosophical movement you purport is occurring was actually occurring, DE would still be using dx9 via DXVK, the reality is WF has been showing its age for years and there are literally six competitors on the horizon for the same consumer dollars as DE is currently vying for, whether happy feels for supporting older hardware exist or not. People with massively aged hardware do not spend money on F2P near as much as people with new hardware, and two decades of buying habits bear that out. DE is going to go where the money is, and the most money with the largest and fastest continual return is concentrated in dx12 consoles, period.

Edited November 5, 2020 by -Kittens-

[Alucardiy 23]

16 минут назад, -Kittens- сказал:

Крутая история, за исключением того, что AMD и nVidia трижды были уличены в сговоре с целью установления цен, а во времена Сан-Диего AMD сделала с Intel то, что Intel продолжила делать с AMD пять лет спустя.

Эти компании являются финансовыми конструкциями технологий и коммерции ; ни больше ни меньше. Что спасет сокращающуюся базу пользователей Warframe в захватывающем игровом процессе и убедительной презентации, а не в объятиях и чувствах и «хороших парнях», которые не являются ни парнями, ни хорошими. Microsoft активно стимулирует создание API для разработчиков ПО-разработчиками, и для обычного потребителя совершенно неважно, гладят ли они бездомных щенков каждое утро и уводят их в счастливую страну.

Если философское движение, о котором вы говорите, действительно имеет место, DE все равно будет использовать dx9 через DXVK, реальность такова, что WF показывает свой возраст годами, и буквально на горизонте буквально шесть конкурентов за те же потребительские деньги, что и DE в настоящее время соперничают за поддержку старого оборудования или нет. Люди с сильно устаревшим оборудованием не тратят на F2P столько же денег, сколько люди с новым оборудованием, и два десятилетия покупательских привычек подтверждают это. DE собирается пойти туда, где есть деньги, и большая часть денег с наибольшей и самой быстрой непрерывной прибылью сосредоточена в консолях dx12.

You have a funny reaction, I was talking about something completely different, about video cards from 2012 on the GCN architecture, AMD (GPU) works better with multithreaded calculations, and there are asynchronous calculation blocks, they take over the work of the processor in drawing geometry, and do it much faster than the processor itself. They also allow you to still support games on PS4. Weak dual-core-Quad-core processors, I'm just talking about the lower-level operation of the Vulcan API. And there is no DX12 on PS4, there is Vulcan. but on XBOX, it is possible and DX12 Vulcan-cross-platform, and it is most likely required for cross-platform saves. Anyway the game needs to be adapted for Nintendo and PS4

[LordOfWar666 56]

I prefer vulkan but dx12 is good!!! Thanks DE!!!

[OniDax 13,274]

12 hours ago, -Kittens- said:

Cool story except AMD and nVidia have been caught colluding three different times to fix prices and and in the San Diego days AMD did to Intel what Intel proceeded to do to AMD five years later.

These companies are financial constructs of technology and commerce; nothing more, nothing less. What's going to save warframe's dwindling user base in compelling gameplay and compelling presentation, not hugs and feels and "the good guys", whom are neither guys nor good. Microsoft is actively incentivizing API molding for developers BY developers and whether or not they pet homeless puppies every morning and wisk them away to happyland is completely immaterial to the on-the-ground consumer.

If the philosophical movement you purport is occurring was actually occurring, DE would still be using dx9 via DXVK, the reality is WF has been showing its age for years and there are literally six competitors on the horizon for the same consumer dollars as DE is currently vying for, and whether happy feels for supporting older hardware exist or not. People with massively aged hardware do not spend money on F2P near as much as people with new hardware, and two decades of buying habits bear that out. DE is going to go where the money is, and the most money with the largest and fastest continual return is concentrated in dx12 consoles, period.

If only DE cared as much about compelling gameplay as they do compelling presentation. And even then, they only somewhat care about compelling graphics, as they focus on lighting and shadows and not on texture quality and clean map design (look at how much terrain clipping there is in their tilesets). It's great that DE is trying to improve their API, but they really need to improve texture quality, shaders, environment design, character design, weather effects, and, most importantly for gameplay, animations.

Edited November 3, 2020 by OniDax

[MouadSaqui 646]

On 2020-11-02 at 9:45 AM, Danielw8 said:

I think vulkan works bad on AMD, specially on cpu 

I'm running Linux in my AMD rig, It works just fine 

[White_Matter 2,972]

This week can't come soon enough- Oh wait.

[Alucardiy 23]

What about x16 anisotropic filtering? =)

[Myscho 6,381]

Resolution scale higher than 100% ?  200% which could be alternative to SSAA 4x

[DoomFruit 7,524]

Even if Linux is not a concern, Vulkan works just fine under Win7 and Win8.1 while DirectX 12 does not. No, I don't care that Win7's support has ended, it's still got 1/5 of the Internet-facing marketshare (https://tech.slashdot.org/story/20/11/03/222240/windows-7-wont-die-still-second-most-popular-os) and I still consider it to be a much more user-friendly OS than Win10 (which I will never use unless it receives some very serious changes).

It is explicitly designed as a cross-platform standard which is always going to be helpful when moving Warframe (or, if Tencent decide to go into the engine licensing business, anything else which uses WF's engine) to other hardware. Especially so given that the Switch supports Vulkan (https://mynintendonews.com/2016/12/19/nintendo-switch-listed-as-vulkan-and-opengl-conformant/) and that because its hardware is relatively weak, every single little bit of extra performance will be vital. Likewise, Android supports Vulkan from 8.0 onwards, though I don't know how likely it is that we'd ever see a phone version of Warframe.

[[DE]Helen 10,254]

Hey Tenno,

A quick update for you! DirectX 12 Beta Support will no longer launch alongside The Great Ensmallening: Part 2 build. The team needs extra time and more testing to get the Beta where we want it before launch. You'll instead see DirectX 12 Beta Support at a later date!

Stay tuned! More info coming soon.

[NightmareT12 10,621]

Thanks for the heads up Helen! A shame though, I was hoping for a horrible rainbow bug :P

[LordOfWar666 56]

Too bad I was loking formard to DX12, but I guess it would the best for everyone!!!

[sam686 466]

On 2020-11-02 at 9:44 AM, [DE]Helen said:

DirectX 12 driver must convert shaders from a generic format to versions optimized for your specific model of graphics card.
Other games work around this process by forcing massive shader compiles in their launchers.

What about download optimized shaders? I have 500 Mbps download speed. Download optimized shader would be a fast 17 second to download 1 GB of shaders with no excessive CPU usage and to minimize the amount of stutters.

What about Vulkan? Steam have shader pre-caching option which does not work on DirectX on Windows 10, it only works on Vulkan and OpenGL. I have pre-cache option enabled with "0 MB pre-cached", sad.

 

The shader cache CPU or stutter problem...
To reset cache, delete:
- C:\ProgramData\NVIDIA Corporation\NV_Cache
- %LocalAppData%\AMD\DxCache
Edit: Found a Dx12 shader cache path: %LocalAppData%\D3DSCache

Then, start up game and watch CPU usage. Then load Cetus, Plains of eidolon, and Orb Vallis. Watch CPU usage on each areas.

The "automatic" Dx11 have very high CPU usage for about 1 minute after loading screen. This can be slow on CPU with 4 cores or less. All this while the game is trying to use some CPU to run. Doing this time, lots of stutters and lower frames per second. This looks like Warframe game is "forcing massive shader compiles".

Video: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/393810271

Edited February 13 by sam686
Dx12 shader cache path found

[Myscho 6,381]

Prepare your eyeballz for "Optimizing shader cache" on every game start up

[Ketec 3,458]

Will it also be dx12 Ultimate compatible or just the dx12?

[--PV--Argo 4]

Nice

[White_Matter 2,972]

Any news on the new release date ? 

[Executor_Aeternus 219]

On 2020-11-10 at 3:03 PM, White_Matter said:

Any news on the new release date ? 

I second this. Still looking forward to seeing the potential changes, but haven't heard word about it for a while.

[Sonic4181 11]

Am 10.11.2020 um 21:03 schrieb White_Matter:

Any news on the new release date ? 

i third this. I was hoping for it to be a part of Deimos Arcana, but i just updated and still cant switch to dx 12