Glaive Revisit Workshop

[[DE]Connor 4,009]

Greetings Tenno!

Warframe currently offers 22 different classes of melee weapon for players to choose from, but Glaives hold a special place in the game’s history. First introduced in Digital Extremes’ 2008 title Dark Sector, Hayden Tenno’s unique and vicious playstyle captures the hearts and imaginations of many.

A lot has changed in the twelve years since that game was released: Warframe has gone through many major reworks, including complete melee overhauls, and the addition of a “Glaive + Gun” combo system. With several overlapping systems at play, Glaive gameplay was no longer consistent, working differently depending on how it was used. This revisit intends to combine these two modes, preserving and enhancing the best parts of both.

Many of these changes focus on enhancing the unique gameplay options that a Glaive can offer. We’ll start simple with throwing mechanics, and work our way up:

Heavy Attack (aka Glaive detonation) will now do more damage, more consistently! Damage numbers have been increased, and the area-of-effect falloff has been removed, meaning max damage no matter what part of the explosion hits an enemy. This should help encourage use of Glaives’ unique detonation functionality; another option to compliment swinging and throwing the weapon, allowing for massive bursts of damage when needed.

“Hold throw” mechanics now apply in Equipped Melee mode! When we added the ability to wield a Glaive alongside any one-handed secondary, we introduced a new system for throwing Glaives that was quicker and more intuitive. This modern system for both ground and air throwing has been applied to pure melee mode, making Glaives consistent no matter how they are used.

Spoiler

In “Glaive + Gun” mode, players must use the melee key to detonate the Glaive while in flight. With only the Glaive in hand, the alt fire button is no longer reserved for your secondary weapon, which allows for added flexibility - press alt fire for a Heavy Attack detonation, or tap melee for a simple recall.

Glaive throws can now be performed while sliding! Tap to perform a regular spin attack, or hold to throw. An added level of flexibility to the Glaive playstyle.

Spoiler

Throw melee inputs can be “queued up”, one after the other! Also known as “buffering”, this means if you are holding a melee input as the Glaive returns to your hand, you will start charging another throw as soon as possible. With this change, a smooth gameflow emerges: throw a Glaive, hold melee as it returns, catch, release, repeat. 

Spoiler

Glaives can now be thrown multiple times in a single jump! Limitations to this type of throw have been removed to allow more chained throws.

With all of these improvements, Glaive throwing and detonating should become a more prominent and viable way to use these weapons. But we’re only getting started!

Another feature that makes Glaives stand out from other melee weapons, is their ability to be wielded alongside a one-handed secondary. This “Glaive + Gun” mode is also getting a couple upgrades:

Melee stance combos are now available in Glaive + Gun mode! Using a weapon combo will no longer restrict your melee options and movement, making Glaives even more deadly.

Spoiler

Glaive + Gun mode now utilizes melee auto blocking when not aiming or firing! This feature introduced in recent melee system updates will now also apply to the weapon combo mode, offering the benefits of actively equipped melee while still keeping your secondary at the ready.

With all these changes combined, we hope Glaive gameplay will feel more fluid, fun and unique. To encourage exploration of these new mechanics, we are also making changes to Glaive Modding options, improving old Mods and introducing new choices for players to try!

For example, the Glaive Mod Power Throw will be getting a major revision...
Old: +0.6m Punch Through
New: +2m Punch Through. On Consecutive Throw: +100% Throw Damage (up to maximum 3 stacks)

This Mod will now be great for players who embrace the “catch and release” playstyle introduced by the changes to melee input queueing.

We also have two new Mods coming, to help modify your playstyle even further… 
Volatile Rebound: 100% Chance to explode on Bounce (Disables Punch Through)

Spoiler

Volatile Quick Return: -4 Bounce. +100% Blast Radius. 100% chance to explode on Bounce (disables Punch Through).

Spoiler

Unlike a Heavy Attack, the explosions from these Mods do NOT consume your combo counter. Equip Volatile Rebound to inflict as much chaos as possible from a single throw, or Volatile Quick Return for rapid targeted strikes.

We hope you’re as excited for these changes as we are - coming soon to a public build near you!

Thanks everyone!

[Muxailo 246]

Allow Wolf Sledge to use Combo Killer and Combo Fury mods please.

[(XBOX)TheWayOfWisdom 1,186]

Can other non-glaive class weapons that have a throwing part get some of these benefits? Mainly Wolf Sledge and Sigma & Octantis.
Don't forget Deconstuctor too

Edited November 6, 2020 by (XBOX)TheWayOfWisdom

[Yamanoki 53]

Sounds like you finally added back in the functionality that was removed in the last two melee revamps. I'm excited to try these out in-game... but I'm apprehensive, as there's been such a long history of melee changes screwing with Glaives. A lot of the recent Melee updates seem to have completely forgotten that the Glaive class even exists.

[Navarchus 2,539]

Sweet, will we see more non-glaive thrown weapons such as Wolf Sledge then, will Wolf Sledge even get these benefits?

[skzskormz 40]

Things we didn't ask for, glaive rework. 

edit, looks interesting, gotta get it into the game to see if it's helpful to raise popularity of the weapon type itself. I particularly never enjoyed the stances, so I have no clue if I'm excited for it or not.

Edited November 6, 2020 by skzskormz

[Auroreon 158]

The revamped and new mods for Glaive are a fantastic signal of much more meaningful design.

I love the trade off of one effect for another that really pushes a player to make a choice for their playstyle. I more than hope to see this being a core ideal for most if not all mods in the game!

Edited November 6, 2020 by Auroreon

[Maggy 76]

Oh my, I played Dark Sector and adored the glaive mechanics in it! Loving these changes, glaives needed some love.

[UnderRevision 79]

Oh, I am very much looking forward to trying these changes out.  The glaive has always been my favorite melee weapon type conceptually, going right on back to when I first played Dark Sector, but it felt a little too awkward to use on a regular basis in Warframe.  Especially after the last couple rounds of melee reworks.  These changes look like a lot of fun and I can't wait to try them.  I especially like the look of those chained throw animations.  Very glad to see this workshop!

[ZAXNIGHTMARE 244]

looks promising

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako 10,861]

a good qol changes to a nice system, now if only single arm melee and guns in general can be used simultaneously it would expand this

[ReaverKane 1,772]

Pretty cool changes... But this post begs the question... When will the Glaive + Gun become one-handed melee + gun like it was promised for melee 3.0?

[standardheadache 277]

This looks really cool! I always felt glaives were missing some sort of oomph in PvE, and this is sure to make me break out my Glaive Prime riven more often.

I do have a quick question, though: How will glaive explosion buff and no falloff be balanced for Conclave? In balanced lobbies, glaives can generally be decent, but if they get set to the PvE minimum falloff damage for the explosion like Tigris Prime and Vectis Prime did in PvP, this is sure to lead to another abusable mechanic.

 

[Upright1 103]

This looks really neat but with these changes, the gun+glaive combo ends up serving no purpose.I suppose it's a cool reference or something but I think it should have an impact on gameplay beyond just looking cool

[Pandaxtor 13]

Just now, Upright1 said:

This looks really neat but with these changes, the gun+glaive combo ends up serving no purpose.I suppose it's a cool reference or something but I think it should have an impact on gameplay beyond just looking cool

Gun + Glaive has around 10-20% more damage than pure glaive.

[Aphelion_Sole 380]

2 minutes ago, Upright1 said:

This looks really neat but with these changes, the gun+glaive combo ends up serving no purpose.I suppose it's a cool reference or something but I think it should have an impact on gameplay beyond just looking cool

Agreed. Not only does the quick switching with melee make this mode irrelevant, but the weapon type as well. This mode would have made more sense with weapons like machete or single sword not a weapon type thats already designed for high range.

[Kaokasalis 4,186]

Looking good, keep it up.

[Mephane 1,431]

2 hours ago, [DE]Connor said:

Greetings Tenno!

Warframe currently offers 22 different classes of melee weapon for players to choose from, but Glaives hold a special place in the game’s history. First introduced in Digital Extremes’ 2008 title Dark Sector, Hayden Tenno’s unique and vicious playstyle captures the hearts and imaginations of many.

A lot has changed in the twelve years since that game was released: Warframe has gone through many major reworks, including complete melee overhauls, and the addition of a “Glaive + Gun” combo system. With several overlapping systems at play, Glaive gameplay was no longer consistent, working differently depending on how it was used. This revisit intends to combine these two modes, preserving and enhancing the best parts of both.

Many of these changes focus on enhancing the unique gameplay options that a Glaive can offer. We’ll start simple with throwing mechanics, and work our way up:

Heavy Attack (aka Glaive detonation) will now do more damage, more consistently! Damage numbers have been increased, and the area-of-effect falloff has been removed, meaning max damage no matter what part of the explosion hits an enemy. This should help encourage use of Glaives’ unique detonation functionality; another option to compliment swinging and throwing the weapon, allowing for massive bursts of damage when needed.

“Hold throw” mechanics now apply in Equipped Melee mode! When we added the ability to wield a Glaive alongside any one-handed secondary, we introduced a new system for throwing Glaives that was quicker and more intuitive. This modern system for both ground and air throwing has been applied to pure melee mode, making Glaives consistent no matter how they are used.

  Reveal hidden contents

In “Glaive + Gun” mode, players must use the melee key to detonate the Glaive while in flight. With only the Glaive in hand, the alt fire button is no longer reserved for your secondary weapon, which allows for added flexibility - press alt fire for a Heavy Attack detonation, or tap melee for a simple recall.

Glaive throws can now be performed while sliding! Tap to perform a regular spin attack, or hold to throw. An added level of flexibility to the Glaive playstyle.

  Reveal hidden contents

Throw melee inputs can be “queued up”, one after the other! Also known as “buffering”, this means if you are holding a melee input as the Glaive returns to your hand, you will start charging another throw as soon as possible. With this change, a smooth gameflow emerges: throw a Glaive, hold melee as it returns, catch, release, repeat. 

  Reveal hidden contents

Glaives can now be thrown multiple times in a single jump! Limitations to this type of throw have been removed to allow more chained throws.

With all of these improvements, Glaive throwing and detonating should become a more prominent and viable way to use these weapons. But we’re only getting started!

Another feature that makes Glaives stand out from other melee weapons, is their ability to be wielded alongside a one-handed secondary. This “Glaive + Gun” mode is also getting a couple upgrades:

Melee stance combos are now available in Glaive + Gun mode! Using a weapon combo will no longer restrict your melee options and movement, making Glaives even more deadly.

  Reveal hidden contents

Glaive + Gun mode now utilizes melee auto blocking when not aiming or firing! This feature introduced in recent melee system updates will now also apply to the weapon combo mode, offering the benefits of actively equipped melee while still keeping your secondary at the ready.

With all these changes combined, we hope Glaive gameplay will feel more fluid, fun and unique. To encourage exploration of these new mechanics, we are also making changes to Glaive Modding options, improving old Mods and introducing new choices for players to try!

For example, the Glaive Mod Power Throw will be getting a major revision...
Old: +0.6m Punch Through
New: +2m Punch Through. On Consecutive Throw: +100% Throw Damage (up to maximum 3 stacks)

This Mod will now be great for players who embrace the “catch and release” playstyle introduced by the changes to melee input queueing.

We also have two new Mods coming, to help modify your playstyle even further… 
Volatile Rebound: 100% Chance to explode on Bounce (Disables Punch Through)

  Reveal hidden contents

Volatile Quick Return: -4 Bounce. +100% Blast Radius. 100% chance to explode on Bounce (disables Punch Through).

  Reveal hidden contents

Unlike a Heavy Attack, the explosions from these Mods do NOT consume your combo counter. Equip Volatile Rebound to inflict as much chaos as possible from a single throw, or Volatile Quick Return for rapid targeted strikes.

We hope you’re as excited for these changes as we are - coming soon to a public build near you!

Thanks everyone!

I love the pistol + glaive combo in particular and am looking forward to these buffs, my highlight is the stance attacks becoming usable in the dual mode.

But all of this makes me wonder, maybe all one-handed melee weapons should allow being dual wielded with one-handed secondaries, if not for additional game mechanical effect, then at least for style.

[Sintag 1,961]

5 minutes ago, Upright1 said:

This looks really neat but with these changes, the gun+glaive combo ends up serving no purpose.I suppose it's a cool reference or something but I think it should have an impact on gameplay beyond just looking cool

Not really.  Combo Fury/Killer can make this mode relevant, plus the added boon of having something constantly ready is a nice plus.

Now uh, DE?  When is 1H-Melee + Gun coming?

[Pandaxtor 13]

Will DE add an option to ignore attack speed buff on glaives? Sometimes Gun + Glaive is unplayable when there is a wisp, valkyr, etc.

[Tricky5hift 3,331]

I've grown to love glaives over the years. Really glad to see you're continuing to improve on this weapon type.

Hopefully single-handed swords get the same treatment eventually.

[Watsof 44]

Absolutely fantastic changes! I recently picked up the Glaive Prime and the limitations of the gun+glaive system quickly become apparent (mainly the lack of stance moves), so I'm pretty stoked for this workshop.

[ABlindGuyPlays 4,794]

34 minutes ago, Muxailo said:

Allow Wolf Sledge to use Combo Killer and Combo Fury mods please.

Allowing wolf sledge to count as a glaive for glaive + gun mode would be the dream, but I would love being able to equip glaive mods. that should be far less headach inducing.

[TheGrimCorsair 2,504]

So glaives are infinite ammo guided explosion generators that get to run off melee mods and damage while taking advantage of Condition Overload and easy enemy priming.

Edited November 6, 2020 by TheGrimCorsair

[Gene_Freak 639]

These are some excellent sounding changes. Glaives have felt too neglected for too long, and this all sounds like it'll bring them not only in line with the rest of melee but fun and exciting in their own right.