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Nightwave End Date & November Update!


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I'm not a huge fan of the previous alert system, even though nightwave is far from perfect. Alerts were frustrating for me because it seemed like I was constantly missing the ones I wanted to do. 

That being said, everything has room for improvement, nightwave included. 

I'm a little miffed at the idea of needing two arcanes to interact with one another for an effect, but I'll stay reserved on judgments until I actually get to mess around with them.

Thanks for the info update. Here's to hoping that spore ephemera comes back -- still missing it and my nidus boi needs more grossness in his fashion frame.

Edited by lushelocution
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5 hours ago, ADirtyMonk said:

This nightwave is probably one of the most mismanaged bullS#&$ events I've ever seen in my almost 20 years of gaming.

After 2 prior nightwaves and 2 intermissions all of which except the first campaign resulted in delay after delay and missed goals I have to conclude that you guys just dont learn from your mistakes at all.

I would almost rather have the old alert system back. At the very least that encouraged players to do different nodes around the star chart and was consistently there. And for players who needed a helmet. It was rewarding. Hell it would have been fine to keep that system if the rewards were more often important consumables like forma the various adapters, kuva, etc instead of worthless "rare" resources and one off alt helms. Now after the first 30 ranks you get the equivalent of jack all per rank. Its so much more efficient to do plat farms or other farms to get the potatoes and reactors. .

 

Nightwave is a failure, imo. It's Battle Pass done wrong. And what is most pathetic is that DE absolutely refuses to learn from those who have successfully implemented a Battle Pass system. They are so focused on being unique as a means of getting attention from the rest of the gaming industry that they refuse to do what is proven successful. That's why all of their "unique" features/systems (like Conclave, Archwing, Trials, Lunaro, Frame Fighter, Nightwave, Kuva Liches, and Railjack) have all failed. DE needs to humbly look at games that are successful at doing what DE is trying to do, and learn from them.

Edited by OniDax
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1 hour ago, (PSN)chabala said:

. I'm sorry alerts were too hard for you

Too hard? I think the right term is "Too bad you have a life".

 

1 hour ago, (PSN)chabala said:

All alerts would happen again

Yes, and they will pop when I don't have the time to login.

1 hour ago, (PSN)chabala said:

but Nightwave is not a good replacement.

Is it the perfect system? No. But it's far superior compared to alerts. I and probably a lot of people will not miss the system that creates the infamous old Vauban and Nitain grind.

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while you buff chroma i hope yu dont forget abput afterburn augment

 

also....

 

does the new arcane work with effigy , nechro shadow and such ?

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I'm always in awe for the team to come up with words that I never heard before.
Learning something new from those words (Malodor, viremia, demulcent), really love it 🥰

But, glass resonance til january? omg 😨

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Don't remove the Steel Essence from eximus units, add better ways to people get it casually, but if someone wants to stay 1 hour farming one interception missions, let them do so, please and thank you.

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I sincerely hope that y'all can get Nightwave back in order, for people who've been playing along the full duration of glassmaker and the proceeding intermission it has been a horrible experience. It gets worse as the glassed enemies are disruptive for any stealth activities, fishing or conservation. It's unnecessary friction. 

Anyway, im sure you are painfully aware of this DE. Nightwave is great, but it should not go on this long.

41 minutes ago, MobyTheDuck said:

Don't remove the Steel Essence from eximus units, add better ways to people get it casually, but if someone wants to stay 1 hour farming one interception missions, let them do so, please and thank you.

I would also like the new SE farming methods to be in addition to the current eximus one. No idea what rates DE are considering to be in line with their expectations for SE though, 2+ per minute is far too good apparently. It is nice to have had such a demanding farm though, only reaching its potential with every resource booster and good charm luck. 

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I was worried about the unreasonable grind that would be needed for the new Arcanes. But thanks to this post and their description, I feel better, I won't even need to get them at R0 in the first place.

I yawned when I read "Standing in a zone..." and immediately my interest dropped to 0.

So in a sense, I want to say thank you. But don't waste too much time developping/balancing Arcanes that are entirely pointless, dev time will be appreciated anywhere else (even balancing the MK1 weapons would be less of a waste, as people actually have to use them at one point).

Edited by Chewarette
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11 hours ago, TheVeiledScion said:

Another thing you might consider more broadly is rearranging your release cycle such that Nightwave is the first or second piece of content you release.

Binding lore to release cycle and temporal events is very painful for new players. They either meet lore not in proper order (Saya's vigil, Jupiter) or don't know it at all (in case of temporal events). Nightwave can be replayed later by new players, yes, but for your idea it should have some binding to what player have completed yet, so acts should simply become more quests (otherwise one would complete all acts while being on earth, and another would discover "replay" button after a year of playing). But "releasing temporal events as quest" wasn't common approach before, so so I wouldn't expect it to be the case with Nightwave.

Also SS is not always present, so act 1 shoul be bound so something else.

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14 hours ago, LordPreda said:

I certainly hope people at DE haven't been discouraged by the overblown negative comments about the Glassmaker series. I personally loved it (and the ending bossfight) very much. Nihil was a great villain! It might be that interactive investigation events aren't the best way to go forward, and more cutscene-like story dioramas like Series 1 and 2 would be less finnicky. But I personally really enjoyed the investigative aspect and I always love the chance to learn more about the world and lore of the game. I also want those clue items we found in series 3 as decorations for my ship.

So please, whatever angry comments might say, please don't retire Nightwave. Expand it, iterate further and improve on it. But it's the right way to go!

Couldn't agree more :]

 

I believe there's a lot of potential for Nightwave too, but it'll need some testing and results-gathering. I've mentioned before about tying Nightwave creds into the acts players complete, (5 for dailies, 10 per weekly, 15 per Elite Weekly, roughly 100 creds a week) so if you'd like to try that for Intermission 3, perhaps that could alleviate some concerns of not having enough creds (Considering how high the cap will be on ranks, players have hit the ceiling seemingly earlier than expected before) for things.

Maybe test servers (Or just staff) can try out different Nightwave series concepts, and see how they play out in missions. Do enemies show up every few runs, or not often enough? Depends on how easily they're dealt with i suppose, and if they have a required resource to get. As for storylines, any idea can be a good idea, since it's material for future concepts (I keep that in mind for my own projects)!

 

Aside from that, I do have one other Nightwave suggestion regarding Nora's lines in-between Nightwave acts. Every time she's detected glass resonance in our vicinity, she occasionally mentions something about shooting them (I need to find the exact line for reference), but the way she says it implied she hasn't acknowledged all the Cephalites we previously dealt with. That line makes it sound like the first Cephalites encounter happening again; If any future enemies come into a mission rewarding standing, etc. upon defeat, maybe when she lets us know they're there, she could say "You know the drill" (Maybe a changing line based on the current episode / Nightwave enemies killed in total). Just something I noticed over time, but it's not a big concern ultimately.

 

Besides that, speaking of Arcanes, I have been wondering if there are any possible ideas for Necramech Arcanes (Only one slot should be enough, considering the 12 mod slots!)?

Maybe if the engine runs out of energy (But only if at least half the engine was consumed in one go), it could have a near 50% chance to trigger a % of increased Archgun damage for up to 12 seconds (For balancing, maybe only while used by the mech itself, as much as I love Mirage; Unless staff and players want the bigger numbers too! It'll only hurt the enemies more in my opinion, so no harm in it for us).

Perhaps an Archmelee Arcane for Bonewidow could be when it's shield blocks an instance of damage, a near 50% chance for a % of increased Archmelee damage for the same max time (So players can choose an equivalent Arch-ane :) Of course these would benefit their exalted abilities too, I imagine).

As far as decor goes, I think it'd be nice to have all the evidence become usable rather than letting it be forgotten. Some of them were really interesting (Especially the little floof that the Grineer had, and the Solaris things), so hopefully they can be declassified, so to speak. If nothing else, maybe they can be rotated in Nora's wares to add slots to the miscellaneous section (Combined with greater cred availability / amounts that should be feasible).

I'm looking forward to Intermission 3 as well, so I'll keep on keepin' on for now. If Baro Ki'teer shows up one day with a Prisma Nightwave skin (Or if a Mithra Nightwave Tennogen happens), that'll be an amazing Christmas gift :)

Sorry for the wall of text, but take care everyone!

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Great, so more of Nora whinging.

Please for the love of all things, add a 'Nora shut up' option like you did for Ordis.

Looking forward to the new content, including the Corpus Lichs and hopefully some changes to the currently awful Deimos grind (looking at you conservation and mining

I enjoyed the whole Glassmaker arc, was nice to have a mechanical boss fight for a change, but it has gone on too long with glassed enemies every 24 minutes.

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16 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

When is Nightwave Series 3: Glassmaker ending?
This is a big one - our last ‘October’ post detailed out the release of the finale, and now that it’s here, it’s time to talk wrapping things up.

First, since we are launching on Next-Gen, we don’t want players joining the Tenno fold and having a Glassmaker experience that’s only one month long or less.

For this reason, we are running Glassmaker until the end of 2020, and in January 2021 we will be swapping into Intermission #3 (which will bring back old items, and offer Duplicate protection for those who already have items)! At that time in January, we’ll have a post up about our plans for Nightwave based on 3 Series of experience (one of which endured a pandemic)! 
 

This is a poorly thought out idea. It should end this month.

1. How many people do you think are buying next gen consoles to boot up warframe? Most new console owners will likely be playing other things on release. 

 

2. Even if a few people are buying next gen to play warframe for the first time, who do you think is going to readily engage in nightwave? How many MR0s are going to be completing Elite weekly challenges like profit taker or ESO?

 

3. News is going around about pre-order delays for consoles. Some people will struggle to even get to next get, meaning completing rank 30 nightwave may be impossible by January.

 

4. What's the point of delaying if you're adding old items to Intermission #3? If people missed things, they can get them in intermission...

 

I honestly don't think DE is going to change their mind, but I just want to say this is probably the worst thing you could have done with this overstretched nightwave event.

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5 minutes ago, Deminisis said:

This is a poorly thought out idea. It should end this month.

1. How many people do you think are buying next gen consoles to boot up warframe? Most new console owners will likely be playing other things on release. 

want to say this is probably the worst thing you could have done with this overstretched nightwave event.

1) Me soon as i can get one, 10 seconds into any of the Open Worlds, yes please oh and No Mans Sky

overstretched is an understatement

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i think VIREMIA and CONTAGION will have interesting play. imo only the toxin and electric ones since most weapon builds tend to have heat, and ice tends to just kinda be not worth using. the main profit is addiction status type for condition overload

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The kitgun arcanes look decent if they scale with damage mods but the warframe arcanes just look really pointless.

Standing still in a highly mobile game? Arcanes that sync with a gun type but requires you to be on the mobs you kill to get the effect? What? 🤔

I'd say keep the gun arcanes as is (with weapon scaling of course if that isnt the case yet), then have the warframe arcanes simply work without any need to stand in any residual thingymajibhookeystuff. The Theorems could simply add a buff each time an enemy is killed and triggers the Residual effect. Since we wouldnt need to stand in the field the duration of the buff that triggers on the frame could be 5 seconds long, where each tick adds a stack, after 5 seconds the buff starts to count down 1 stack each 5 seconds. So aslong as you keep killing with the gun you'll have the buff active and maxed out after the initial ramp up.

So all Residuals would have their 12 second effect, then all Theorems would get a 5 second buff that stacks up per second, where the 5 second buff duration is refreshed with each new kill that triggers a residual effect.

Contagion should likely also be 1 orb/sec in this case. Given how it has only a 5m reach and requires gun kills/procs to become active. Or you could just rework it into something that is actually more fitting for gunplay instead of something that would actually fit Zaw weapons.

 

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18 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Theorems (Warframe Arcanes):

I would contemplate murder for an arcane like this:

Magus Mysterium: While in warframe, (read, on transferenene in) 100% chance to resist nullifier bubbles, chance decays to 0% over 1.5-2 seconds.

This stops your powers from instantly turning off the moment you clip a nullifier bubble BUT you have to kill them fast or they pop off. Its a small safety net.

Thats it.

 

Those arcanes are weaksauce btw and need to be livened up pre-release

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19 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

We are releasing new Deimos Arcanes called Residuals and Theorems. These are meant to be synergized Arcanes for Infested Kitguns and Warframes to play off each other. Take a look: 

Residuals (Infested Kitgun Arcanes)

RESIDUAL BOILS 
20% chance to grow cysts on the corpse for 12s that explode for 80 Heat Damage in 10m and applying Heat Damage type to Theorem Arcanes. 

RESIDUAL MALODOR
20% chance to create a frigid mist for 12s, dealing 40 Cold Damage/s and applying Cold Damage to Theorem Arcanes.

RESIDUAL SHOCK
20% chance to electrify the corpse for 12s, dealing 200 Electricity Damage to enemies within 10m and applying Electricity Damage to Theorem Arcanes.

RESIDUAL VIREMIA
20% chance to create a pool of toxic blood for 12s, dealing 40 Toxin Damage/s and applying Toxin Damage to Theorem Arcanes.

Theorems (Warframe Arcanes):
THEOREM INFECTION 
Standing in a zone created by a Residual Arcane increases damage of companions and summoned allies within 60m by 4%/s stacking up to 15x. Effect persists for 5s upon leaving the zone. 

THEOREM CONTAGION 
Standing in a zone created by a Residual Arcane creates a globe that orbits the player every 2s. The globes will strike the nearest enemy within 5m dealing 100 damage and applying a Status Effect. Globes will persist for 8s upon leaving the zone. 

THEOREM DEMULCENT 
Standing in a zone created by a Residual Arcane increases weapon damage by 4%/s stacking up to 15x. Effect persists for 5s upon leaving the zone. 

A few things:
* I'm not against trying new things.

Synergy: Synergy is an interaction or coöperation giving rise to a whole that is greater than the simple sum of its parts. 
*
Dependency: The  quality or state of needing something or someone.
To wit: 
Nidus' 2->1 is a synergy. Limbo Stasis depends on either Banish or Catalysm to have an effect.

Residual -> Theorem is a dependency. Residuals have an independent effect, Theorems do not.

* Use case?
For Residuals - 
> Their damage is literally irrelevant past Saturn or so, on the one hand, which makes them aimed towards newer players; on the other, they're locked behind (supposedly) Deimos syndicate rep and are only useable with Infested Kitguns (which, again, locked behind Deimos syndicate rep), which means they're not aimed towards newer players.
(Have you tried doing Deimos bounties on a mid-or-less geared account? I have.)
> The Residuals don't list their radius, nor their status chance, so it's unclear whether they have any utility as a status applicator, which, given the former, will heavily decide whether they have any use for mid-or-later geared players.
> It's not stated, but I assume their effects are 'On Kill', rather than applying a debuff that'll trigger 'on unit death while active'.
This makes them anti-synergistic, isolated, a self-referential damage source, disincentivizing anything but stacking anything that'll let you kill with the thing the Residual is on. (Read: No weapon-switching, no nuking, just more Rhino/Chroma/Mirage weapon-boosting.)

For Theorems - 
Mechanically, 
> Warframe is at its best when it's a mobile, high-action hack-n-shooter.
> Warframe, as time goes on, is leaning less on reward rarity to serve as the limiting factor in the reward schedule, and more on literal timegating, such as the 'hurry up and wait' of the Iso Vaults.
* Between requiring you remain tethered to a spot for 15 seconds to ramp up the bonus, and giving you a bare 5 seconds lingering bonus, Theorems do not mesh well with non-stationary play, to say the least.
This, of course, assumes that the area will be a ~3m radius, same as e.g. the Kavat-modset area.
If the area were to be, for instance, 20m across, this would -of course- be less of an restriction, but wouldn't not be a spoke in the wheels of Warframe-at-its-best.

With regards to their effects:
> Infection is straight-up useless.
* Even if NPCs did relevant damage to other NPCs,
(Reminder: a player geared towards the primary minion-ability -Shadows, in other words-, will have them doing upwards of triple damage (1.5*2.14), a Nyx player who's geared for only 100% armor strip will have them doing a minimum of x6 damage. Neither of these cases will do appreciable damage unless you've also stripped the enemy of their defenses.)
they'd still be effectively irrelevant, what with AI and pathing being what they are.

* As to companions, you've got 8 slots to mod for both the companion's survivability (a fool's errand) and utility as well as their attack.
Between the limited mod slots, companions' reliance on pure stats for survivability (lol), their damage application rate, and their also using NPC AI and pathing... Increasing their damage is useless, and that's ignoring the opportunity cost that Theorem Infection imposes.

> Contagion is not absolutely useless.
Which isn't the same as saying it's worth using, or even just 'good'.
Whether it's worth the price of admittance? Min-max wise, I doubt it. Aesthetically, perhaps.

> Demulcent
A) See: Mechanics.
B) If the damage is multiplicative, you're incentivizing sewer-camp style "gameplay". Which you seem to hate, on the one hand, yet keep making the most lucrative, on the other.
If the damage is additive, you're either still incentivizing squatting on the buff, or - likelier - the damage increase is irrelevant, even before the mechanical restrictions.
The arcanes do not affect abilities, and in the absolute best case scenario, a fully ramped Demulcent grants a ~27% damage increase to a lone max Pressure Point.
Add any of: Serration/Hornet Strike with their higher %increase than Pressure Point's, Corrupted base damage mods, rivens, and the damage contribution of Demulcent drops to 'Not worth jumping though the hoops, unless you happen to enjoy the act of jumping through hoops' (re: Extrinsic vs, Intrinsic reward).

 

Suggestions, since I assume you don't want to/don't want me to reinvent the whole implementation of Residuals and Theorems?
* Nerf damage mods across the board. Lower enemy eHP commensurately.
This increases the impact of the arcanes' damage.

Alternatively,
* Disallow stacking mods for the same modifier (and either buff the corrupted base damage mods, or nerf the vanilla ones).
This lowers the maximum damage obtainable, increasing the arcanes' contribution.

"Less beneficial", but more likely:
* Give the arcanes some form of scaling.
-> Buffed damage contributes a greater % of the total. woo.

Or, of course:
* Do nothing.
This still leaves the arcanes mostly DoA, but at least doesn't make the damage problem worse.

-----

Don't really have anything helpful to say regarding the rest of the post, beyond:
A) Thanks for the info.
B) *shrug* alright. Que sera, and all that.

Edited by Chroia
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Those are not synergistic arcanes, for them to synergise they need to be good by themselves and become better when used together.

the right term is co dependent,

each is weak unless you have both and even then they just become merely mediocre (as per current description).

Pretty weak in my opinion (compared to some other arcanes that exist),

there is firstly a small chance to trigger the residuals ,

Then the residuals are over a small area,

Then you have the buff for a very small time on theorem (which stacks ? how exactly do you add stacks ? more dead bodies?)

Assuming they will act like elemental mods and combine with existing elements? or will they be more like xatas whisper where they are their own instance of damage? would like some clarification.

Of course i may be completely wrong and they turn out great ,

not too concerned about the numbers,

cause if they are triggered on death of an enemy , there should be plenty of dead bodies , so more for status than any damage i suppose,

 

Residual arcnes i see potential , theorem arcanes? dont really think anything other than THEOREM DEMULCENT would be effective.

And again , Co dependent arcanes are a bad design decision like tie racks and motors.

Just make it one item.

Also , really disappointed with your decision to extend the nightwave cause you dont have any actual new season planned.

Wish you didnt use the "we are going next gen" as an excuse.

You could have ended it now (end of November), started intermission (whole of December) and have a fresh season ready for the Next gen if it was the real reason.

Truly disappointing that nightwave is on the "not worth the effort anymore" pile , was really hopeful when it started and opened creative avenues.

Edited by 0_The_F00l
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