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Deimos: Arcana - Bonewidow Necramech Megathread


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Welcome Tenno!

With the release of Deimos: Arcana, we have included Bonewidow Necramech!

This fearsome Necramech, fashioned in honor of the Entrati matriarch, is a robust front-line fighter. Favoring armor and health over shield strength, Bonewidow can grab and hurl enemies, deploy a heavy shield for personal defense, and cleave through opposing ranks with a massive warblade.

ABILITIES:
MEATHOOK
Skewer and hold a target. Use again to hurl the victim damaging them and anyone near the impact site.

SHIELD MAIDEN
Raise Bonewidow’s shield to block incoming forward damage.

FIRING LINE
Sweep surrounding enemies into the line of fire with a force beam.

EXALTED IRONBRIDE
Summon a devastating exalted blade.

If you have feedback to leave on the subject of Bonewidow Necramech, then please do so in this thread. Please remember that you should keep your feedback constructive and civil.

  • If you like an aspect of the new content, tell us what you like.
  • If you do not like an aspect, then tell us why, and what you would change to make it better!

Please bear in mind this is not a place to leave bugs you discover while playing. If you do need to report a bug, please use the dedicated Deimos: Arcana Bug-Hunting Megathread!

Thank you!
 

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I think Arcana overall is a step in a good direction and I realize many of the people working on Bonewidow simply did not have time to make any major changes before release, but I hope you'll strongly consider reworking her kit in the near future as a high priority considering how many of us love the design and are hyped for more big robot action in the future.

UPDATE: I've been playing with Bonewidow for a while now, and even after the changes her kit needs a rework which can't be fixed by simply tweaking values and I know it's probably going to be a while before that can realistically happen.

MEATHOOK: Even if the utility isn't that great, I can appreciate the idea behind throwing enemies at each other with a giant fist. It's a good gimmick ability to keep if the rest of Bonewidow's kit can be improved enough to support it. Although I wouldn't mind also having it inflict a bleed proc considering you've just impaled the enemy with your fist.

UPDATE: Also the thrown enemies don't seem to take any damage which needs to be fixed. It should at the very least function similarly to Grendel's regurgitate.

SHIELD MAIDEN: Several shots seemed to pass through the shield where it should have blocked them. Hopefully the changes implemented allow for more consistency. Will update this section once I have more hands on testing.

UPDATE: Even after the first round of changes, Shield Maiden continues to be very unreliable at blocking frontal shots.

FIRING LINE: Unfortunately I can't sugar coat this one. Firing Line by far stands out as a completely useless ability and I would never use it even if it costs 0 energy. Here are the reasons why.

  • The effective radius is too small for open world content. Even if the radius was massively increased, the enemies would still be outside of melee distance and continue shooting you.
  • The ability has no defensive or offensive utilities because it neither damages enemies nor prevents them from attacking you. At least Voidrig's Gravemines can soften up enemies or kill some of the cannon fodder.
  • Does nothing to help Bonewidow deal with enemies at a distance.

Possible solution: My assumption is Necramechs are designed for combat in open spaces. A melee oriented class designed for combat in the open needs some way to close the distance between enemies outside of normal movement options. Either replace this ability with an enhanced mobility option (like a speed boost or teleportation/archwing blinking), or create an ability which brings enemies closer to you instead while applying crowd control effects (like Mag's Pull or Vauban's Tether Coil). Better yet, maybe even copy Gravemines from Voidrig but reduce the amount of mines and replace them with Tether Coils (make sure the mines can be destroyed by players for the enemy variants)? Pretty much anything would be better that what it currently is.

UPDATE: Even with the added stagger effect, Firing Line simply isn't a viable ability due to the reasons mentioned previously.

EXALTED IRONBRIDE: Missed opportunity to call it Iron Maiden. Jokes aside, this absolutely must have the same effects as Excalibur's Exalted Blade considering how many enemies will used ranged attacks against you, especially on open world levels. Compared to other Exalted melee abilities, Bonewidow's seems especially lackluster considering the following.

  • Excalibur's Exalted blade has projectiles to deal with distanced enemies, or to cut through several enemies at once.
  • Valkyr's Talons grant her temporary invulnerability and lifesteal.
  • Wukong's Iron Staff has good stats and an absurdly large range.
  • All 3 previous examples have a much wider variety of mods which drastically increase their performance compared to archwing weapons which Ironbride is based on.

Possible solution: UPDATE: Either give Ironbride lifesteal properties, or add projectiles to the weapon while swinging like Excalibur's Exalted Blade. Even with the increased stats, Ironbride struggles due to the necramech having several long pauses in both movement and melee animations. The lack of gap closers or other mobility options on a melee oriented mech does not allow this ability to deal with multiple enemies effectively, and I'm better off just using archguns for the entirety of the fights. Also Ironbride has an unacceptably high chance of making Bonewidow unable to attack at all due to bugs where the weapon is not properly summoned.

Overall it's far worse than I had anticipated, and I feel sorry for whomever gets assigned to fix this because Bonewidow has a lot of issues.

Edited by notHunky
Updated to reflect the results of further testing.
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all xp that your bonewidow has gained disappears after it dies, i just experienced this in fortuna once i reached level 13 then died and got set back to being unleveled once resummoned, this bug is one that ruined necramechs for a lot of people when the voidrig was first released so i hope you fix it fast so it doesnt ruin the bonewidow for others aswell

Edited by K555
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the ultimate so incredibly underwhelming it's actually insane
I have the voidrig artillery forma'd and maxed out and it does 250k damage per shot in a 6m aoe with no damage falloff and a 100% crit chance/5.4x crit multiplier
it does a raw 1.36 million damage PER SHOT after crit
it also shoots really quick
it works well for voidrig because it's a fairly squishy ranged unit, a glass cannon

bonewidow's main damage would be the sword. SHOULD BE the sword.
but it's not. it's really REALLY undertuned. If I'm going to put myself at risk in melee with a mech that has no way to heal:
1. I need more health and armor
2. I need to be crapping out way more damage then I would with a gun

I'm hitting a couple thousand damage tops with this sword. it struggles to kill starchart enemies, let alone anything past level 30.
all the archwing melee mods need to be dramatically buffed, and the base stats on the sword need to be ALOT higher then they are now.
if I kit this sword out I should be doing AT LEAST the same amount of damage the voidrig artillery does, preferably more since I have to walk up and smack them with it.

other then the sword being hot garbage:
the first ability is a meme but that's fine, I found grabbing frost eximus with their shield up blocks enemy projectiles and is a pretty neat interaction. also tossing annoying enemies away is pretty cool.
the shield could be stronger, if I don't get 360* damage immunity like the voidrig equivalent power, the frontal shield should be blocking a lot more damage to compensate.
the third ability doesn't even work half the time so I can't really say anything on it until it gets fixed, but considering what it does it costs too much energy.

I like the kit overall but all the numbers are way too low.
 

Edited by rachjumper
muh crit
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Without playing Bonewidow at all, I'd like to address a concerning trend. Why are melee units getting directional defense? I get that it's a shield, so you want it to be directional for immersion, but warframe is virtually never organized combat, and using a directional defense when your plunging into a group of enemies is tactically flawed. 

It was tactically flawed when you put it on Garuda, and it's still silly for a Necramech. I don't know what the other defensive stats are on this thing, but with limited health recovery, I gotta wonder how durable this thing will be. Gonna wade into a group of melee centric faction and whip out an exalted blade, which will surely surpass Excalibur and Baruuk?, and get pummeled on the sides and back. 

Again, I haven't played it yet... but I question the wisdom of continually making melee units with directional defense. Meanwhile, we have several artillery units with protective layers or 90% general damage reduction, that's omnidirectional. Voidrig has a counter layer, Mesa and Nova have up to 90% reduction, Ember has reduction. 

Ideally a melee unit would be like Gara, 90% reduction on a frame that wants to plunge into a target to attack. Meanwhile, an artillery unit like Voidrig or Mesa can actually seek a vantage point where they can get the foe in front of them, than use the location to block directional damage as well as frame their attack. 

All of that is challenged by the fact that enemies swarm you from any direction, making battlefield strategies ridiculous. But if your going to use directional defense, they need to be planned with obscene effectiveness, like reflecting damage and restoring the unit. Funny, Voidrig turns on an omnidirectional shield that makes players commit suicide, I wonder how fighting against Bonewidow will fair...

Again, I haven't had time to test it yet, that's just my prejudice. Hopefully I'm wrong. 

Edited by BahamutKaiser
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5 hours ago, rachjumper said:

the ultimate so incredibly underwhelming it's actually insane
I have the voidrig artillery forma'd and maxed out and it does 250k damage per shot in a 6m aoe with no damage falloff and a 100% crit chance/5.4x crit multiplier
it does a raw 1.36 million damage PER SHOT after crit
it also shoots really quick
it works well for voidrig because it's a fairly squishy ranged unit, a glass cannon

bonewidow's main damage would be the sword. SHOULD BE the sword.
but it's not. it's really REALLY undertuned. If I'm going to put myself at risk in melee with a mech that has no way to heal:
1. I need more health and armor
2. I need to be crapping out way more damage then I would with a gun

I'm hitting a couple thousand damage tops with this sword. it struggles to kill starchart enemies, let alone anything past level 30.
all the archwing melee mods need to be dramatically buffed, and the base stats on the sword need to be ALOT higher then they are now.
if I kit this sword out I should be doing AT LEAST the same amount of damage the voidrig artillery does, preferably more since I have to walk up and smack them with it.

Out of curiosity, are the mods you've equipped all maxed out on Ironbride? I haven't personally seen the ability in action (Currently the only Bonewidow gameplay I've seen are recent devstreams), but I'm surprised to hear those numbers, compared to the Voidrig's 4th ability (Which honestly is perfect as-is, considering that it's an Exalted ability (Which generally do a lot of damage) involving an Archgun!).

 

Considering how the Arquebex is already nicely balanced (Since it has as long a casting animation that it does, makes you stay put and drains energy over time), yet is very powerful when you need it, I think it can actually be used as an example to draw from for what is essentially Warframe's first Open World Archmelee weapon (An Exalted one at that!). I'm sure it'll be updated over time up till / after it arrives on Consoles, but I would think that Ironbride would at least have roughly the same base damage per hit as Excalibur's Exalted Blade.
 

However considering the lethality of Archmelee in Archwing missions (As well as how strong it can be in Railjack when hitting enemy fighters; At least in the highest levels at Earth Proxima) to enemies of a given level, I always thought it would be even stronger against a crowd of enemies in a ground mission (Perhaps depending on the situation). I don't mean to get too off-topic with this, but mainly regarding Bonewidow's Ironbride ability, what are the current numbers for it before and after adding your mods? If it helps as a reference I can take a picture of my Prisma Veritux build (With and without mods) to maybe provide a comparison (Regular Archmelee vs Exalted Archmelee) when I get back on.

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Hey guys.  Just ran with my buddy last night.  He has the Bonewidow.  Noticed a few things.  First is that his Mech seemed to be sucking up all the drops and carrying them around with him,  i would have to dash through his Mech in order to get my loot.  And second was that when he pulled out his sword, the animations seemed broken on my end.  His sword never showed on my end, even with a full relog.  and his attack animation was bugged as well.  he went into a strange twitchy stance when trying to attack with the sword.  he would just twitch all over the battlefield with enemies dying around him but never realy attacking anything.

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1 hour ago, (XBOX)HollowCube987 said:

I'm on Xbox so I just wanted to ask the PC Chads a question

Upon building the Voidrig Necramech, you are rewarded with a free Mausolon. What are you given upon building the Bonewidow?

another mausolon unranked, it does seem a little strange but at the same time its fair since thats the default weapon for a necramech

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14 minutes ago, K555 said:

another mausolon unranked, it does seem a little strange but at the same time its fair since thats the default weapon for a necramech

also the new slates are pretty hot, check your emails everyone!

maybe they remind me of relics which eventually could be used to access other items o r enhanced, they would make cool glyphs.

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4 hours ago, (NSW)Gamer-Steve said:

Out of curiosity, are the mods you've equipped all maxed out on Ironbride? I haven't personally seen the ability in action (Currently the only Bonewidow gameplay I've seen are recent devstreams), but I'm surprised to hear those numbers, compared to the Voidrig's 4th ability (Which honestly is perfect as-is, considering that it's an Exalted ability (Which generally do a lot of damage) involving an Archgun!).

 

Considering how the Arquebex is already nicely balanced (Since it has as long a casting animation that it does, makes you stay put and drains energy over time), yet is very powerful when you need it, I think it can actually be used as an example to draw from for what is essentially Warframe's first Open World Archmelee weapon (An Exalted one at that!). I'm sure it'll be updated over time up till / after it arrives on Consoles, but I would think that Ironbride would at least have roughly the same base damage per hit as Excalibur's Exalted Blade.
 

However considering the lethality of Archmelee in Archwing missions (As well as how strong it can be in Railjack when hitting enemy fighters; At least in the highest levels at Earth Proxima) to enemies of a given level, I always thought it would be even stronger against a crowd of enemies in a ground mission (Perhaps depending on the situation). I don't mean to get too off-topic with this, but mainly regarding Bonewidow's Ironbride ability, what are the current numbers for it before and after adding your mods? If it helps as a reference I can take a picture of my Prisma Veritux build (With and without mods) to maybe provide a comparison (Regular Archmelee vs Exalted Archmelee) when I get back on.

I don't have it fully modded but the base stats are pretty telling, not to mention archgun mods are way better stat wise.
https://imgur.com/a/006i8fc
it's a lot harder to level necramechs up now that trinitys 4 doesn't instaheal mechs, so any content where you get a decent amount of xp to level them up just causes them to blow up very quickly.

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32 minutes ago, rachjumper said:

I don't have it fully modded but the base stats are pretty telling, not to mention archgun mods are way better stat wise.
https://imgur.com/a/006i8fc
it's a lot harder to level necramechs up now that trinitys 4 doesn't instaheal mechs, so any content where you get a decent amount of xp to level them up just causes them to blow up very quickly.

ok

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58 minutes ago, rachjumper said:

Prisma Veritux

maybe a third, if the attacks started consuming "fuel" or energy cells from the pickups we could see that the sword has a reload and third attack option added with a new UO/UI features intertwined in the blade would cause energy-paradoxes or channelling modes which influence how fast the blade moves and could be added to necramech melee later on, i would think that these weapons should find a place later its own soundtrack and music intro_lol, or whatever makes them more epic, so what's to have the prisma include a few stances or mod/passives which players could use on regular swords, if deemed exclusive or on-sale, if each relay's specialized on non-duty and blackmarket was outside of darvo in the hands of the grineer and scienties of each party

  • outside of the dojo i can only see that each relay gets its own kit-gun and unique zaws per planet.
  • the marking of vandal weapons and skins should have some bonuses keys which contribute access to shops and combat enhancements, for a weapon like the snipetron vandal for instance it is stuck with a mastery rank 2 i belive
  • the load out screen also has default marking with no appealing bonuses, ei. NEW color palette, or ephemeral bonuses, rewards from ordis, points, trade, gift, BP, so players still have to guess and wait for weapons any update would be great, considering combining the loadout screen and navigations pannels into something useful.
Edited by SnakeBadger
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TL;DR at the bottom.

The BONEWIDOW is very close to being a fun mech, but its missing a small couple things that i think would really bring it in line with the voidrig but keep its own unique brawly flavour.

Meathook: the ability simply cant do enough damage to be worthwhile for that, so why not make it about something else? i would simply this this ability gains a health regeneration aspect, when hooking a enemy you  gain say (4%-6%-8%-10%) or (5%-10%-15%-20%) of your health back.

this would give it the sustainability regen it needs to stay in melee combat, which is what it is designed for.

SHIELD MAIDEN: a generally fine ability but i would give it additional teamplay functionality and extend its shield to either side with energy flaps like a volt shield to cover allies. after all this is a squad focused game, might aswell let it help your squad.

FIRING LINE: i would make it stagger enemies as they are being pushed, nothing major just something to stop them in their tracks and stop shooting for a moment.

IRONBRIDE: alright this is a two parter, first the fun part

the ironbride is a fun enough weapon to use but its a bit one tone.
so i thought what is already astablished in both melee and entrati that we could use here?

answer: give it a combination of heavy attacks and the signature entrati "kill 5 enemies for alt attack" mechanic.

every 5 kills, hit alt fire to let the mech swing its sword in one wide mighty energy infused swing, doubling its range, giving it 100% crit chance (crit chance instead of just upping damage for player feedback reasons and modding diversity) and gain 1%-2%-3% health back per hit. and apply a stagger/knockdown (this enhances player feedback further and prevents surviving enemies from simply stripping the health you just gained during your recovery, also becouse they just got hit by a mech swinging a sword)

while in the air this is simply the ground slam with the same effect. (for consistancy with normal melee heavy attacks)

this would fit thematicly, make the sword more fun to use, and once again give it a bit more sustain to keep up with the melee focused style it is designed for. (being in melee range means enemies getting to your sides to shoot around your shield so you will lose health)

now for part 2: its damage.

i know i know everyone always goes "more damage pls"

but please do understand that this weapon is currently outdone by the mausolon, the necramechs basic pre-packaged weapon is better than this mechs exalted weapon.

and thats not even mentioning the voidrigs monstrous exalted weapon.

the voidrig's Arquebex deal a whopping 12.000 damage per shot, with 50% crit chance, 3x crit damage, 50% status, at 3.33 firerate

modded this easely becomes 200,000 damage per shot, with 100% crit chance, 5.4x crit damage, 200% status chance, and 5.33 firerate, all while having long range and AOE.

and then here comes IRONBRIDE the mighty sword with.. 
like 800 damage, 5% crit chance, 1.5x crit multiplier, 15% status chance, 0.833 swing speed. and being melee and thus short range.

modded this becomes like 6,000 damage per swing, 12.5% crit chance, 2.9x crit damage, 60% status chance, 0.317 swing speed.

i think the numbers speak for themselves, and they are staggering, a fully modded IRONBRIDE doesnt even get close to a UNMODDED arquebex in stats, and the arquebex is ranged and rapidfire where the ironbride is slow and melee

and the voidrig is really not a lot less tanky than the bonewidow (infact id argue the opposite as the voidrigs shield fully protects its body where the bone widows does not)

and i really must restate: the ironbride is beaten out by the mausolon, the base necramech weapon.

this thing needs to do like 5,000-10,000 damage base if it wants to hope to keep up with its brother the voidrig.

having its crit and status and speed be low is fine, but it does need flat damage then, a lot of it.

please make this truely worthy of being called a mighty blade


in closure i do hope that these changes prove to be easy to impliment and vastly improve the mech in both usability and just fun factor. as i really do very much enjoy this thing on paper.

TL;DR: make the grab heal you, let the shield extend out to protect your allies, firing line is fine imo, let the sword use staggering heavy attacks using the entrati "5 kill charge" mechanic and have said heavy attack heal on hit. also make the sword do much more damage.

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First things first: I'm glad that Bonewidow doesn't need a separate "Damaged Component" to repair her components; the Damaged Necramech parts before the update used to repair and make Voidrig is universally used to repair any Necramech component.

Bonewidow needs a lot of changes/revisions:

  • Meathook (1)

This is functionally similar to Grendel's Regurgitate, but weaker it seems without any enemy level scaling. Certain enemies that are immune to ragdolling, but still affected by the ability such as the Deimos Saxum can still freely attack you.

Add in a function similar to Garuda's Blood Altar, where Bonewidow would siphon the hooked victim's life to heal Bonewidow. The life drain is automatic, without the need to drain additional energy. The life drain scales with the enemy's health, while ignoring Armor/Shields.

  • Shield Maiden (2)

As noted with some people, some attacks are still ignoring the Shield even if held in front of the enemy. This case has been seen with other "shield" related mechanics (Odonata's Energy Shell, piloting a Tusk Shield Dargyn). The shield blocking damage should be more consistent.

  • Firing Line (3)

I cannot sugarcoat this one; it needs either a full rework/replacement.

For my rework, I would change the functions of the laser walls to act like Hildryn's Pillage. Enemies hit by the lasers will have their Shields/Armor sapped, while using that sapped energy to synergize with Bonewidow's other abilities:

  1. Meathook: Increased impact explosion radius and damage. Explosion will stagger/stun enemies briefly.
  2. Shield Maiden: Restore the shield's health, similar to Rhino's Reinforcing Stomp to restore his Iron Skin.
  3. (Exalted) Ironbride: The Kallim will shoot out smaller sword beams similar to Excalibur's Exalted Blade. Increased damage overall.
  • (Exalted) Ironbride (4)

The Kallim should not be worse than the Veritux. Having a 5% Crit chance, 1.5 Crit Multiplier, and 15% Status Chance is inexcusable compared to the Voidrig's Arquebex. There needs to be mobility contrast of the Kallim to the stationary, but powerful Arquebex.

Increased the Kallim's stats: 45% Crit Chance, 3.0X Crit Damage, 0.9 Attack Speed, triple the base total damage (300 to 900).

The Kallim will have a similar "life siphon" mechanic to the other Entrati weapons: killing 3 enemies will fully charge its Alt-Fire, a large powerful sword beam. The beam will having a 8 m explosion should it hit an enemy or terrain. Beam stats: 60% Crit Chance, 3.5X Crit Damage, 25% Status Chance, 5000 Base Damage (80% leans towards Blast).

The Kallim's third swing will apply a ground slam, similar to certain Stance combos (Tempo Royale as a common example).

Bonewidow is visually great, but functionally not good. These are suggestions that encourages more of a close combat Necramech over the explosive-orientated Voidrig.

EDIT:

Take the opportunity of improving the Kallim to also improve the Archmelee mods. They are inferior to the current Melee mods, so buffing the mods should help improve the usability of the Kallim.

 

Edited by Duality52
Archmelee mods improvements
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Found a bug where Bonewidow turns in to a corn cob, can't use any ability or transfer out of the mech or use melee (says every ability is in use)
Also another one that occours when shieldmaiden is up and you activate Bonewidow's 4th ability, basically it equips the sword but it's non existant and you cannot swing it

 

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