Jump to content
Dante Unbound: Share Bug Reports and Feedback Here! ×

Octavia's mallet vs Necramech


AdriXL

Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, Loza03 said:

The idea that Warframe the easy game is the 'game players want to play' is shakey at best.

Steve ran a survey back at the end of 2019, and a majority cited difficult content and gear balance as major issues - 9.7% of participants judged it the single biggest factor for negative impact on the experience.

  Reveal hidden contents

KZAuVI6.jpg

The 9.8% slice is update pace, not 'too much difficulty'. Trust me, I've made this mistake too. 'Too much' difficulty is the smallest slice, although granted Grind is definitely the top dog.

HdgxJ6Q.jpg

OwSd1rI.jpg

And I've already heard the 'it wasn't a big enough sample'. There were. The survey had 28,000-ish participants, and not only is there advice to say that more than 1,000 participants won't dramatically increase the accuracy (1,000 has a margin of error of 1%), some calculators I ran suggested that survey of just 400-odd people would be enough to get a fairly accurate result. Steve got seventy times that. So whilst it's probably still like, a 1% margin error... that does seem to indicate that these survey results are proportional.

Thankyou for introducing me to this survey and it's results, and I agree, the sample size isn't big enough if the player base is as big as DE claim it is, but instead of running surveys in the open, Steve has this weird habit of only posting them in his Twitter. Was this one of those? It would explain the sample size, and why I've never heard of it until now.

But.

Think about this, in this very update in Isolation Vaults the timer of the survival portion has been cut by 50% making that whole part of the game easier. Yes, the Necromechs have better immunities now, but they way they suffer status procs has made them weaker, also, in every vault that I've run I've only had to fight them one at a time as they seem to be spaced further apart now? Before, in Tier 3 vaults I often had all of them attacking me at once. I haven't seen this myself yet this time around.

I'm a solo player by the way, I play the game solo for the challenge, I run the isolation vaults by myself to increase the difficulty of them and they don't feel any harder after the update. The rebalance of Railjack made that mode easier, Kuva Liches had their murmur farm reduced and status effects added to make their grind and killing easier. their ability to one shot a player was removed because it violated the players power fantasy.

Khora has had an LoS check added to her whipclaw, I've tried this a dozen times, it hasn't effected my Khora game play at all, she's still stupidly powerful. you just have to aim a little, which I do anyway.

Octavia still destroys everything that comes too close to her Mallet, just not Necramechs until you blow their arms off (which is easy from her invisibility)

Game wide, the mob rebalance made them weaker over all making the game easier, the melee rebalance pushed melee through the roof making the game easier.

The over all trend of updates in Warframe over the past few years has been aimed towards making this game easier. We had Umbral mods that no frame needs added to the game that everyone has to include because they're there. What has been added to the game that requires Umbral levels of power? How about Rivens? What mob in the game requires 300% crit chance or 500% extra damage? (I'm making the numbers up, I have no clue about rivens, I don't need them)

We have steel path. Face it, it's a gear check, there is nothing difficult about it. With the right build on frame and weapons nothing in it holds any fear to a player grouped or solo.

Warframe is not a game based around difficulty, it never has been, and If you look at the trend of updates and rebalance both before and since that survey, it never will be.

Because, looking at the statistics yes, 9.7% of people questioned thought that the game is too easy in 2019, but the majority of people didn't see it like that, because If they had, they would have voted for that instead of any of the other options.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, sitfesz said:

Because drop chances of 2% and 5% exist.

Well DE, if players are justifying AFK macros. You might want to take a look at these accounts that should be dealt with.

I don't agree with low drop chances but I will never AFK macro like some.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

44 minutes ago, Fl_3 said:

Thankyou for introducing me to this survey and it's results, and I agree, the sample size isn't big enough if the player base is as big as DE claim it is, but instead of running surveys in the open, Steve has this weird habit of only posting them in his Twitter. Was this one of those? It would explain the sample size, and why I've never heard of it until now.

I feel like you misread my point. 

4 hours ago, Loza03 said:

 

And I've already heard the 'it wasn't a big enough sample'. There were. The survey had 28,000-ish participants, and not only is there advice to say that more than 1,000 participants won't dramatically increase the accuracy (1,000 has a margin of error of 1%), some calculators I ran suggested that survey of just 400-odd people would be enough to get a fairly accurate result. Steve got seventy times that. So whilst it's probably still like, a 1% margin error... that does seem to indicate that these survey results are proportional.

That sample size is MORE than large enough to get a good idea about what the playerbase wants.

I also decided to run those calculators again, with far stricter requirements.  For a 99% confidence level, and a margin of error of 1% (I was previously looking at a 95% and 5% respectively), for a sample size of every account that has ever registered for Warframe as of last year (50,000,000), which includes every alt account, every trader bot, every person who quit and every fake-name account on the Forum (which people make from time to time, I've seen it once or twice), you would need about 16,000 entrants to have a good sample size. Steve's Survey still surpasses that number by a wide margin.

Still not some be-all, end-all that has all the answers, because the chances of it being wrong are still there (and certainly, there IS more than just sample size) but

In this vein, I'll jump ahead and address the next statistics part

1 hour ago, Fl_3 said:

Because, looking at the statistics yes, 9.7% of people questioned thought that the game is too easy in 2019, but the majority of people didn't see it like that, because If they had, they would have voted for that instead of any of the other options.

You're misinterpreting the data.

9.7% of people judged it as the single biggest negative impact. This does not necessarily represent how many people consider it a negative impact at all - just the worst part of the game. It's a first-past-the-post situation. For all we know, 90% of the people who answered that question would have said it was their second-biggest issue, which would have made it by far the single-biggest. But since it's only the 'most negative', the single biggest issu

 

If we're looking at just what the playerbase's general opinion, this graph is far more helpful. This represents a proportional system.

OwSd1rI.jpg

Note that the majority of players value difficult content, but that the majority of that majority does not place it as a rank 5 value. 

 

Overall, whilst people who think Warframe's lack of difficulty is the biggest problem are definitely in the minority, there is substantial evidence to suggest that a majority considers it an issue.

 

1 hour ago, Fl_3 said:

 

Think about this, in this very update in Isolation Vaults the timer of the survival portion has been cut by 50% making that whole part of the game easier. Yes, the Necromechs have better immunities now, but they way they suffer status procs has made them weaker, also, in every vault that I've run I've only had to fight them one at a time as they seem to be spaced further apart now? Before, in Tier 3 vaults I often had all of them attacking me at once. I haven't seen this myself yet this time around.

I'm a solo player by the way, I play the game solo for the challenge, I run the isolation vaults by myself to increase the difficulty of them and they don't feel any harder after the update. The rebalance of Railjack made that mode easier, Kuva Liches had their murmur farm reduced and status effects added to make their grind and killing easier. their ability to one shot a player was removed because it violated the players power fantasy.

Khora has had an LoS check added to her whipclaw, I've tried this a dozen times, it hasn't effected my Khora game play at all, she's still stupidly powerful. you just have to aim a little, which I do anyway.

Octavia still destroys everything that comes too close to her Mallet, just not Necramechs until you blow their arms off (which is easy from her invisibility)

Game wide, the mob rebalance made them weaker over all making the game easier, the melee rebalance pushed melee through the roof making the game easier.

The over all trend of updates in Warframe over the past few years has been aimed towards making this game easier. We had Umbral mods that no frame needs added to the game that everyone has to include because they're there. What has been added to the game that requires Umbral levels of power? How about Rivens? What mob in the game requires 300% crit chance or 500% extra damage? (I'm making the numbers up, I have no clue about rivens, I don't need them)

We have steel path. Face it, it's a gear check, there is nothing difficult about it. With the right build on frame and weapons nothing in it holds any fear to a player grouped or solo.

Warframe is not a game based around difficulty, it never has been, and If you look at the trend of updates and rebalance both before and since that survey, it never will be.

I don't disagree that the general trend has been towards making the game easier.

I do, however, think that this is a bad idea based on the information that we know.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, PhiThagRaid said:

Wait, the Mausolon added significant damage? When I was running with Octavia a while back my focus was to get it to spray its mines onto it. Many frames would get 1-shot by these mines so they definitely had massive damage potential. 

The missions would run as follows: Use 3 to go invisible. Chuck down 1 and 4. Nechramech fires at 1 reflecting some of the damage. Nechramech uses its mines. Nechramech is now dead.

I've yet to try Octavia since the update, but if what you have written is true the  Octavia should be unaffected. 

Part of the change, is that Mechs now almost never use their grenades unless they'd lost their arms. In the past they would throw everything at you from the get go, but now you need to force them to use grenades

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

Part of the change, is that Mechs now almost never use their grenades unless they'd lost their arms. In the past they would throw everything at you from the get go, but now you need to force them to use grenades

Oh, that makes a lot more sense. In terms of what can be seen as a nerf and in terms of it actually being a boss with multiple stages. I always thought that it would make sense for they fighting strategy to adapt to the amount of limbs they have.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...