Request: Customize Weapon Trigger Functions

[Salenstormwing]

Hey all! Guess who got to see his doctor about his tendonosis? THIS TENNO!

The good news: My right hand is "okay". No need for surgery. A cortisone shot isn't really necessary either.

The bad news: I've lost my double-jointedness in my hand and I still suffer if I aggravate my trigger finger overly much.

That means while my hand is okay, it's best if I don't overdo it (like with a Zakti Prime after having just built one). Mostly, the doctor said to keep an eye on it. If it gets worst, I can always go back, and see about surgery or other things, but for now, I've got about as best as I can manage with the small bits of tendonitis that do show up in x-rays at this point.

And that comes back to what this was all about in the first place....

 

Trying not to hurt myself for a game I love.

I want to continue to play ALL aspects of the game. One of those aspects is a plethora of weapons that are now much more unhelpful for my continued health and wellbeing.

I don't want to limit what games I play. I don't want to limit what weapons I can play with in-game. I just want a way where I can enjoy some of my weapons in the least painful way possible. And that's why I suggested the Mod System as a method to allow trigger changes. Because in the end, MODS do change the feel of weapons, and real-life modifications have been done to semi-auto weapons to allow full-auto use. The main issue would be balancing them (maybe as an exilius mod slot or some trigger mod slot), but I'm less worried about that than just the fact that it would allow players to play Warframe the way they want, and maybe when they're my age, they'll be glad to know that someone before said "Hey, can I get a trigger modification so I can continue to use my favorite weapon without future hand pain".

 

Plus I love Auto-Burst weapons in other games. I WOULD SO LOVE TO USE AN Auto-Burst BURSTON PRIME! GIVE IT TO ME!

[Redfeather75]

I know the feeling so bad. Last few months my hand starts to hurt a lot if I have to click buttons often in games. I can't use controllers anymore either as it makes my hands numb and wrists hurt. I'm getting too old I think. 😢

[Uhkretor]

... I wouldn't mind having Tigris and its variants with proper double shot instead of... whatever is called that they're using to "represent" single barrel firing... Having to press & release to fire both barrels is an awkward mechanic to me... If that was the intended weapon function, I would've left it on Semi, but I want to press the button once and fire both barrels because, you know... They have 2 barrels... So~... yeah, I wouldn't mind firing both barrels...

 

... In fact, DE, just change how it works directly because it doesn't change anything in the weapon other than a mechanic that's awkward to use for something better.

[Salenstormwing]

1 hour ago, Redfeather75 said:

I know the feeling so bad. Last few months my hand starts to hurt a lot if I have to click buttons often in games. I can't use controllers anymore either as it makes my hands numb and wrists hurt. I'm getting too old I think. 😢

My doctor was worried I might be getting "trigger finger" but I gave up the controller (on PC for Warframe) a while back. Honestly, I think with the trigger mods, it could help both controllers and mouse & keyboard folks.

But yeah, we all get old, our bodies don't hold up quite the same way. Just as Warframe has grown up and changed, so can the weapons to be a bit more friendly to us Tenno who still want to enjoy the simple pleasure of letting a pair of revolvers do the talking and merely want to hold down the button and hold onto the mouse in an attempt to reign in the power unleashed in a flurry of bullets straight from High Noon.

[Tiltskillet]

6 hours ago, Uhkretor said:

... I wouldn't mind having Tigris and its variants with proper double shot instead of... whatever is called that they're using to "represent" single barrel firing... Having to press & release to fire both barrels is an awkward mechanic to me...

 . . .

... In fact, DE, just change how it works directly because it doesn't change anything in the weapon other than a mechanic that's awkward to use for something better.

It's drifting off-topic, but AFAIC the Tigris duplex trigger is a fun thing that I'm glad exists just because it is different.   But practically speaking, on a high damage weapon, it makes sense to me.  (Zylok, not so much.)  More ammo control than conventional two-round burst fire, for half the mandatory button presses of conventional semi-auto. 

I'd have no problem at all with an optional way to change the trigger,  or an alt-fire that shot both barrels.  But straight out removing the Tigris duplex trigger from the game would be sad.

9 hours ago, Salenstormwing said:

The good news: My right hand is "okay". No need for surgery. A cortisone shot isn't really necessary either.

The bad news: I've lost my double-jointedness in my hand and I still suffer if I aggravate my trigger finger overly much.

Glad to hear the first part at least.

And I still think DE addressing this topic is essential.  But, while doing it through the modding system would be a vast improvement, it's very short-sighted compared to just bucking down and doing it through configuration options. Health issues (and tendons) are not grist for game balance. 

 

Anyway, [bump]

 

 

 

[Salenstormwing]

8 hours ago, Tiltskillet said:

Glad to hear the first part at least.

And I still think DE addressing this topic is essential.  But, while doing it through the modding system would be a vast improvement, it's very short-sighted compared to just bucking down and doing it through configuration options. Health issues (and tendons) are not grist for game balance. 

Thank you. I'll admit it's a bit annoying I can't bend my fingers back almost 90 degrees anymore on my right hand, but in the end, I have to live with it because it's still considered normal for everyone else. But overall, I'll be fine for now.

But I agree, I'd prefer an option to just change the weapon trigger outside the mod system, but I figure if you make the mods free to everyone, you eliminate most of the issue so no "I must farm a mod so my personage at the keyboard doesn't suffer".

Hmm.

Perhaps you could have both. You either introduce an unlocked Trigger mod slot for every weapon, and give 0-Cost Trigger mods to everyone and make Trigger mods that are actually better. "Want a Trigger mod that'll cost you actual mod points but give you bonuses? Here you go." If anything, it might help bring ranged weapon performance up a bit since Melee is honestly disgustingly OP right now.

Auto-Charge might also be fun, for stuff like Bows and some Launchers, where you just hold the trigger down, and your character would just Charge-Fire-Charge-Fire-Charge-Fire-ect till you let off the trigger. And if you're saying "Oooooooo! You can't do that as an archer with a bow & arrow!", why is it okay for archers to do that in real life then? I'm a space ninja! Let me be space ninja cool! I'm Legolas the Jellyfish Frog in Space!

 

Uh, heh. Good morning btw. I'm gunna go wake up more fully now.

[Tyreaus]

10 hours ago, Salenstormwing said:

Perhaps you could have both. You either introduce an unlocked Trigger mod slot for every weapon, and give 0-Cost Trigger mods to everyone and make Trigger mods that are actually better.

I agree with Tiltskillet and say that accessibility options, let alone general quality of player life improvements, should be divorced from gameplay aspects.

First, the "no mashing is better" line of reasoning doesn't really fly very far when we have macros that DE turns a blind eye toward. If there is a major advantage to not having to button mash, the ship's sailed ages ago. It's really just about integrating that fact into the game itself, especially so that it's platform agnostic - kind of hard to use macros on an Xbox from what I know.

Second, if you had 0-cost trigger mods, assumed to be acquired for free (because you don't want new players to have to suffer with a Lato and tendonitis, right?), with open slots that are also completely free, why wouldn't you make it an accessibility option? There are likely more hoops to jump through for implementing it as a mod than for just telling the game "if this option is enabled, then treat semi-auto weapons as auto".

Third, if you were to have particular "trigger" mods that came with bonuses, then you're likely to have one that turns auto weapons to semi-auto. And then either A: tendonitis players can't use those mods or B: you make duplicate versions that don't actually change auto weapon trigger functions but still impart the bonus. Or you get around the problem by implementing a gameplay-agnostic option. (Mind: that is to say you can totally have trigger mods, and I like the concept. Using them as a QoL function, however...)

Not to mention various bugs and mistakes, like mods getting reset on weapons on occasion or the player just forgetting to slot the mod onto that brand new pistol they just acquired. It'd save a lot of trouble to be able to flick the switch and not think about it, no?

[Salenstormwing]

On 2021-05-15 at 7:15 PM, Tyreaus said:

First, the "no mashing is better" line of reasoning doesn't really fly very far when we have macros that DE turns a blind eye toward. If there is a major advantage to not having to button mash, the ship's sailed ages ago. It's really just about integrating that fact into the game itself, especially so that it's platform agnostic - kind of hard to use macros on an Xbox from what I know.

Honestly, that's half the reason I bring this up, because I am a player on PC, I don't use macros, I used to use controller, and I understand that there are plenty of console Tenno out there. I used to call myself a "Controller Game Tester" back when Warframe would release stuff before it would go to PC, and I will say... having no option to select the 5-Key for powers (aka Transference) was rather interesting when trying to play "The War Within".

But yes, as much as Macros are available, the solution, whatever it is, should be universal to the game, and not platform dependent.

And I do like Tiltskillet's suggestions as well. I also like to offer potential alternatives too. Maybe one of them will be good enough for DE to consider implementing.

[Salenstormwing]

Pandero Prime: exists in my inventory finally

My Hand: are you ready for a sacrifice pain?

Hi. I'm still here. Still want a trigger mod. Please.

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

On 2021-07-13 at 5:48 PM, Salenstormwing said:

Pandero Prime: exists in my inventory finally

My Hand: are you ready for a sacrifice pain?

Hi. I'm still here. Still want a trigger mod. Please.

I'm a PS4 Controller user

and as a mechanic by day, I do need to take care of my hands

as wonderful as it would be for DE to take this issue seriously and introduce some IN-game support for it

I will say that a solution that works for me in the meantime is to use a "TitanOne" Controller Mod. Lets me program whatever I need as far as macros go, and remap controls beyond the very limited in-game control config options.

 

You might look into that, if DE won't help, then help yourself.

[Salenstormwing]

On 2021-07-14 at 10:04 PM, (PSN)haphazardlynamed said:

I'm a PS4 Controller user

and as a mechanic by day, I do need to take care of my hands

as wonderful as it would be for DE to take this issue seriously and introduce some IN-game support for it

I will say that a solution that works for me in the meantime is to use a "TitanOne" Controller Mod. Lets me program whatever I need as far as macros go, and remap controls beyond the very limited in-game control config options.

 

You might look into that, if DE won't help, then help yourself.

I looked into it. Not sure it'd help me, but for folks using controllers, it's an option for sure. Here's a link to an article about it: https://www.consoletuner.com/products/titan-one/

The fact it costs 75 bucks is a bit annoying. But hey, if there are folks here who want to try something out while we wait for DE to make a choice for giving players options....

Honestly, I should look into macros at this point...

[Divinehero]

yea.. i'd adore bein able ot just hold down the fire button and keep shooting on my burst fire weapons

[Divinehero]

oops accidental double post

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

4 hours ago, Salenstormwing said:

I looked into it. Not sure it'd help me, but for folks using controllers, it's an option for sure. Here's a link to an article about it: https://www.consoletuner.com/products/titan-one/

The fact it costs 75 bucks is a bit annoying. But hey, if there are folks here who want to try something out while we wait for DE to make a choice for giving players options....

Honestly, I should look into macros at this point...

75$ wasn't that bad considering I use it for All my PS4 games, not just Warframe.

Its all about gaming personalization for me, not just a WF bandaid.

[Salenstormwing]

16 hours ago, (PSN)haphazardlynamed said:

75$ wasn't that bad considering I use it for All my PS4 games, not just Warframe.

Its all about gaming personalization for me, not just a WF bandaid.

Oh, completely. It's just I game pretty exclusive to PC, where the options are more mod-based. It's nice to see a Console version available in some form for others though.

I'd hope DE would offer a universal option, especially since I can imagine how bad it would be to use something like an AkVasto on a Mobile Device, trying to fire at someone like a mad man. I hope you like tapping at that screen like a crazy person.

[Salenstormwing]

Anyways, I'm thinking of making a list of things that can help out folks having similar issues. Not sure if I should add it here, or not, but hey, why not here?

A video on Steam Controller Turbo Fire set-up:

For folks looking for an Ergo Mouse: The Logitech MX Vertical Ergonomic Mouse: $99 (maybe less depending on sales)

https://www.logitech.com/en-us/products/mice/mx-vertical-ergonomic-mouse.910-005447.html

ConsoleTuner's Titan One Controller Converter for Consoles: $75

https://www.consoletuner.com/products/titan-one/

And if you're looking for something to help with wrist compression (if you're experiencing wrist pain, these are what I wear while working or gaming): 1 Pair of Wrist Wraps for Wrist Support: $14.99 for 2

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07TT6X9F9/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

This is just a few things you can try in the meantime if you're looking for a solution and DE isn't saying anything about a future update with this invovled.