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Bonewidow 2.0 Ability Changes


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quoting a post I made on the subreddit:r/Warframe - Virgin fully modded Ironbride VS Chad unmodded Arquebex

With the base 50% crit chance and 3x multiplier the Arquebex outdoes a 2 forma Hybrid build on the Ironbride per click not even including Firerate or blast radius or usage range or base heat for armor stripping.

 

Iron bride needs something to keep up with arquebex as it is not worth using over an archgun.

Suggestions:

Massive base damage boost: at least x 5 - 10 to compensate for its slow swing

Glaive mechanics: Given how good the glaive rework is making this thing wolf sledge 2.0 with a decent explosion radius would make it feel really good alternative to arquebex. Bonewidows throw and move over voidrigs sit and carpet bomb

Garunteed slash proc: slow swing speed means we get very few status procs when compared to an Arquebex barrage given its one of the best status right now itll be a very good compliment to the glaive throw

 

The buffs to other abilities are a welcome sight but until this is a damage dealer like voidrig this is just a slow inaros with a archgun

Edited by Klokw3rk
missed out would proc
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2 hours ago, A7roboBOT said:

This will definitely make Bonewidow more effective, but will we see a buff to Ironbride? It's damage is still rather anemic, and people are saying Bonewidow is trash because it can't deal the ludicrous amount of damage that Voidrig does. I understand that Bonewidow is designed more around survivability, but when compared to Voidrig, Bonewidow's extra survivability is currently still not worth the tradeoff in damage output. I'd like to see a rebalance to both of the mechs to bring them to roughly the same level of utility. (Yes, that means nerfing the Arquebex.)

okay that means voidrig is going to lose half health

storm shroud now costs 100 energy

gravemines removed

 

and bonewidow gets 50+ base armor added 

 

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Whilst I appreciate the taking of feedback and these initial changes they simply do not go far enough. Both necramechs feel clunky and cumbersome to use and Bonewidow will still be far outclassed by Voidrig even after these changes.

Exalted Ironbride for example is an absolute mess and far too slow. I don't expect it to play like a normal melee weapon with 2 or 3 attack speed mods added but our only option being "Furor" with +10% Attack speed is abysmal. Increase its base speed to account for the sheer lack of attack speed mods and increase its range for starters.

Generally though I would suggest that instead of slightly tweaking Bonewidow's abilities or adding little bits to them here and there I would like to see massive sweeping changes and outright replacements. Many good suggestions have already been made by countless players. I hope when time permits you will take these onboard.  

Edited by -Alleluia-
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IronBride while having decent damage, doesn´t feel powerfull enough. Voidrigs Ultimate can deal 223k dmg, why don´t you Buff Ironbrides damage x20 or at least make it able to orange crit with the critical chance archwing mod (with its current 45% critical chance we can barely see orange crits, with a 70% critical chance it would feel better reaching a 175% modded), Its a melee after all! we have to get closer in order to use it and its range while being generous still feels lackluster for a huge melee swinged by a mecha... 

Edited by xXMadneXDXx
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These are good and all but there has to be some more synergy here. I feel like the 3 needs a tad less energy (20 rather than 25) and maybe just make ironblade a 5 energy drain rather than 25 cost and 2.5 energy drain. The other issue is it's still too slow and that's an issue with the archwing mods. Those need to be fixed 100%

12 minutes ago, (XBOX)Emo Priest TSR said:

Copy and Paste Arquebex Stats to Ironbride problem solved. Seriously this is ridiculous Bonewidow is Mastery fodder...buff this mech before this comes to consoles.

Ohhhhh no no no. If we suffer with bonewidow then so do you lol

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2 hours ago, A7roboBOT said:

I'd like to see a rebalance to both of the mechs to bring them to roughly the same level of utility. (Yes, that means nerfing the Arquebex.)

I agree with your general sentiment here, but to put it bluntly, if they nerf the Arquebex in any kind of significant way, I will simply just stop using Necramechs altogether, and I suspect a lot of other people will too. 

 

This isn't out of spite or anything - Necramechs just aren't that useful outside of the Arquebex's ability to deal sustained AoE damage. Voidrig is already just the Arquebex on wheels with an ironskin. Remove the main draw of the mech and it's dead content. 

They have no real purpose in the game outside of being a kinda fun toy to play with, and if the toy isn't fun to play with anymore, I just won't play with it. Simple as that. 

 

Furthermore, they're already barely worth the trouble it is to get them up to speed - the multi-forma rank-increasing thing is a whole lotta bullS#&$ that I'm definitely not gonna bother with even if Bonewidow gets buffed, so why should I bother with this whole system at all if they aren't fun to play with either?

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2 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Meathook

Do you know that you cannot cast this ability if you are holding a shield out? Interesting eh?

The shield is placed in front of Bonewidow but she needs to hold it out for it to (unreliably) block (only frontal) damage. 

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well, it would be nice if the necra bonewidow's first skill applied for the two necras, then the shield skill is a passive and you can push with it. I think that will be my contribution, sorry if you don't understand what it is, use google translator to write this.
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3 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Held enemies will lose Health over time, the Health lost will be transferred into Bonewidow

i love when you actually listen to the community, really good change

 

3 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Improved Meathook grab to feel sharper and more consistent. 

i don't know if you touched the animation, but please change  that, change the animation because that's the real problem, remove that  forward movement that starts everytime you use the ability, btw, good QoL changes.

 

3 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

SHIELD MAIDEN: 

i like the changes, but please, consider to increasing the shield size model(just a bit), and also consider to increase the health, because it doesn't feel like a shield at all.

 

3 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

FIRING LINE:

again, good changes, just improve the "grab" of the ability because most of the times, enemies don't get dragged even when they are in front of you.

 

3 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

EXALTED IRONBRIDE: 

i'm just asking one simple thing that will surely 100% improve ironbride, please, give it a stance, not just a standard and bland combo.

Edited by TheKurtiStryke
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Melee in Warframe is fun because it grants a unique and varied playstyle that's accessible at the press of a button. Through the simple act of mashing E, your frame can turn into a whirlwind, launching through enemies at high speed whilst delivering powerful, fast blows. You can combine the multitude of weapon combos at your disposable with slide attacks, air-dashing and slams, giving you a sense of fluidity and speed that mere gunplay simply can't deliver. The melee weapons are balanced by their speed and damage; you have fast weapons that have low damage but can apply status many times, vs weapons that hit like a truck with crits but are slow and precise. The best melee weapons, in my opinion, are ones like Wukong's iron staff, which provides combos that are instantly distinct from each other whilst also being incredibly powerful; a perfect balance between fun and strength.

Bonewidow is not the same. Without unique combos and slide attacks, it totally lacks the mobility of standard melee weapons. Only having access to archwing melee mods puts it at an instant disadvantage in terms of strength, as it misses out on the many fantastic mods that are the bread and butter of melee combat. Naturally, you have to wonder why anyone would want to use Bonewidow's melee over regular melee. It's slower, less fun, and less powerful. Voidrig does suffer the same problem of "Why should I use this over a Warframe?" to a degree, but at least has the Arquebex, which provide value through their absolutely bonkers damage, balanced by the limitation of energy drain and immobility. 

Ironbride in its current state simply has no reason to exist. You could get into Bonewidow and drain your energy for a slow and relatively weak melee combo, or you could simply press E to access four fleshed-out combos on your powerfully-modded melee weapon. I don't think Ironbride could be fixed by making it more powerful, nor by just giving it stances. It suffers greatly from the inherent immobility of a Necramech, which disables your ability to efficiently close gaps.

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Ok, but Ironbride is still slow, still clunky, and still doesn't hit enemies more than a few meters away. It still has the world's longest recovery time on a slam attack.

It's an exalted weapon, it's meant to feel superior to just mashing e without it on, not like more of a limitation.

Edited by anarchy753
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Just straight up buff Ironbride damage by at least 20 times. It's slow, and clunky, cost energy, and the only way to justify pulling it out (or even using the Bonewidow mech at all) is if it can deal immense damage to anything it manage to  hit. Right now, it can't even do that.  

Screw it, Buff it by 100 times. It should be doing 6-7 digits of damage. I'm serious. Because that's the only way im seeing myself using it, barring any additional mechanics.   

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These changes were very VERY good for bonewidow. The recovery time from doing a slam by accident REALLY helped a lot. Cant begin to say how many times I was stuck in the slam animation with it. Also the dmg buffer from firing line and the healing from meathook is very good as well.

 

Just a few issues to tweak and itd be a decent mech:

1. For firing line add the lifted duration to the UI. 

2. When activating ironbride right now either 1 of two things happens; you get stuck in using shield bash and shield bash only and thats with e not left click like it should be, or when activated you can only swing once and cant do the full combo attack without having to reactivate it and thats with both bugs the reactivation part. And reactivating it doesnt guarantee the bug goes away, similar to when we couldnt get the sword to come out at all in a way.

3. This is more of a benefit to both Widow and Void; fix whatevers causing the corn on the cob mech from spawning Its funny as heck to see but still kinda annoying

Edited by rawr1254
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These changes will help bonewidow become more survival orientated, which isn't what she was supposed to be, she was meant to be a melee necramech, but the archmelee (ironbride) still sucks in damage and speed, that is what needs to be buffed more than anything, these changes were needed but ironbride needs buffs too, please don't forget them. Also please add arch melee to be equippable as a normal melee for necramechs you said you were, even showed a veritux with a necramech in the tennocon showcase, but when asked about y'all said you were talking about, but you just forgot it again. I know I'm not the only one who wants this, thank you for reading this and taking this into account if you do.

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6 hours ago, saghzs said:

Too bad we're still stuck with doing a few thousand damage within a very limited range, with Ironbide.

When Voidrig can do 100k-1mil 5-10 times a second, and has much much much higher range.

The obvious solution to this is to nerf Voidrig into the ground to make Bonewidow the only choice. /ˢ

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Have to admit, that these changes look very nice. And while people surely see the meathook changes as a qol change, I'm asking myself : why not use vazarin school ?!

People change school for eidolons, energy replenish and some sweet cheesy tactics with various modsets in their companions ( those mod-set mechanics are beyond broken in my opinion, but that's something else I guess xD )

I'm glad, that you didn't make the mechs deployable in regular missions yet, as planed for the future.. and yet one has to ask himself : WHY at all ?

If one compares the mechs with archwing.. the mechs are not even 1 year in game. Archwings have been for how long ?! How can you say, that mechs are more "core-game" than archwings and make it, so they will soon to be deployable in every single mission? That's just a mayor slap in the face in my opinion for everyone, that likes the "space" aspect of the game..

If I remember correctly, you've even taken regular mission nodes for archwings away like the defense that happened to be on pluto or uranus.. can't remember exactly. But if you plan to make the mechs useable in regular missions in the future, which will cause so many problems in terms of clunkiness and even more cheese for EVERY SINGLE MISSION.. I'm just wondering: what's the point anyway ? To make it easier to lvl them ? To enable people to stay even more hours in one mission and punish them for doing so ? It just doesn't make any sense whatsoever. But hey.. we're ninjas.. right ?! xD

To be able to deploy archwing in every single mission wouldn't make sense at all, that's for sure.. but on the other hand one has to ask: why do mechs get this treatment ??

What happened to modular archwings ?!

Edited by kulow
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Good change to the hook, but i'll just repeat what i said (and still applies) in the feedback thread:

The hook is still too unreliable, the shield breaking plain sucks, having an anti-synergy in the kit is absolute heresy (her 1 and 2 should get merged), her 3 is just useless and should be straight up replaced and most importantly, Ironbride needs more speed (be it trough the necramesh melee speed mod, a buff to the arch melee speed mod, or a buff to its base stats) and A FULL MOVESET. Seriously, with Bonewidow you can actually dedicate all the attack buttons to melee combos, MAKE USE OF THAT OPPORTUNITY.

 also i still think "stealing" the eximus aura if you grab one would be a wonderful addition.

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