Lavos Build + 6,000,000 damage Combo showcase

[Nash]

 

[uberfu]

This video is set to PRIVATE

[Nash]

4 hours ago, uberfu said:

This video is set to PRIVATE

Had to reupload due to sheer amount of mistakes I made, making this was pretty tired when I made this should've rested instead of trying to pump out another video

[uberfu]

No worries, wasn't sure if you knew.  Thanks for all the great videos.

[Sylonus]

Not gonna lie, every time he sets up a combo I'm sitting here wondering what's taking him so long, frankly just using melee with literally any frame, including Lavos will come out ahead on kill times rather than these memey setups.

Don't get me wrong, I like Lavos but I feel like he's more a midgame frame, he's tanky enough to survive steel path just fine for those just getting there, and his status application lets your weapon kill things quickly it might have a harder time with without the statuses, but for people who are properly built for the situation, all the setup is just not needed, and you'll blender things faster just hitting the melee button.

[Nash]

12 hours ago, Sylonus said:

Not gonna lie, every time he sets up a combo I'm sitting here wondering what's taking him so long, frankly just using melee with literally any frame, including Lavos will come out ahead on kill times rather than these memey setups.

Don't get me wrong, I like Lavos but I feel like he's more a midgame frame, he's tanky enough to survive steel path just fine for those just getting there, and his status application lets your weapon kill things quickly it might have a harder time with without the statuses, but for people who are properly built for the situation, all the setup is just not needed, and you'll blender things faster just hitting the melee button.

You're right I don't have do all this I could easily just use a kuva nukor and smack them silly, but I didn't because that type of gameplay is just resident SLEEPER everyone and their mother can do that and has been done for 5 years straight, I can literally do what you said with any of my frames but you know variety is the spice of life, sometimes I just don't wanna mash. I like the idea of casting, of setting up abilities for a stronger hit. It reminds me of my days on Dragon Nest, when there was a process to doing damage. Instead of a flat out one-BAP you're dead. Theres pacing to it. Its a showcase showing what he is capable of doing, not what is already known. Ahhh yes, yes... attack speed, status secondary or perhaps the Cedo that's new right? It can boost condition overload! Nami skyla prime and a touch of swirling tiger... a HIT of winding claws. Finito.

It's the difference of gameplay, that's why you're wondering why. It's no different from you using Chroma or Saryn to fight Profit-Taker while I take my Excalibur in to do the same thing, it takes longer but its about the gameplay, the foreplay. No cap. 

[Sylonus]

On 2020-12-25 at 6:41 PM, Nash said:

You're right I don't have do all this I could easily just use a kuva nukor and smack them silly, but I didn't because that type of gameplay is just resident SLEEPER everyone and their mother can do that and has been done for 5 years straight, I can literally do what you said with any of my frames but you know variety is the spice of life, sometimes I just don't wanna mash. I like the idea of casting, of setting up abilities for a stronger hit. It reminds me of my days on Dragon Nest, when there was a process to doing damage. Instead of a flat out one-BAP you're dead. Theres pacing to it. Its a showcase showing what he is capable of doing, not what is already known. Ahhh yes, yes... attack speed, status secondary or perhaps the Cedo that's new right? It can boost condition overload! Nami skyla prime and a touch of swirling tiger... a HIT of winding claws. Finito.

It's the difference of gameplay, that's why you're wondering why. It's no different from you using Chroma or Saryn to fight Profit-Taker while I take my Excalibur in to do the same thing, it takes longer but its about the gameplay, the foreplay. No cap. 

Sure, I certainly have no issue with anyone advocating alternate setups, I certainly use off-meta setups plenty, for exactly the reasons you laid out, variety is the spice of life, as they say, and they can be very fun.

The problem I have is in the presentation, hyping this up with the clickbait damage numbers and epic music, etc, and presenting it like it's the best option since sliced bread is just a way to get something that's not truly "OP" in any way nerfed, it's how we lost the Xoris, and so many other things in recent history, not that the real fault in those cases lie with the content creators, obviously it's the ones actually doing the balancing who are mostly at fault, but still, things being presented like this feels misleading and unhealthy for the game due to the outcome, even if ultimately the blame should mostly be on the balance team's shoulders.

[Nash]

On 2020-12-27 at 1:31 PM, Sylonus said:

Sure, I certainly have no issue with anyone advocating alternate setups, I certainly use off-meta setups plenty, for exactly the reasons you laid out, variety is the spice of life, as they say, and they can be very fun.

The problem I have is in the presentation, hyping this up with the clickbait damage numbers and epic music, etc, and presenting it like it's the best option since sliced bread is just a way to get something that's not truly "OP" in any way nerfed, it's how we lost the Xoris, and so many other things in recent history, not that the real fault in those cases lie with the content creators, obviously it's the ones actually doing the balancing who are mostly at fault, but still, things being presented like this feels misleading and unhealthy for the game due to the outcome, even if ultimately the blame should mostly be on the balance team's shoulders.

Using kuva nukor + Melee is no different from using the Kuva Nukor + his 4 to dish out damage only difference is that it has a cooldown and its slower, His ability take setting up to do, the Xoris deserved to be nerfed because it removes you from actually working. The power it gave came far too easily even if there was alternatives, like how Brozime gave his thoughts on it not being all that broken because whip claw can use rivens. Its foolish to use that as the only example, when frames like Excalibur, Baruuk, Wukong, and Valkyr, perhaps any future melee warframe would only use the Xoris because of the fact it gives you infinite combo duration + Gladiator mod set bonus, especially on Baruuk, Valkyr, and Wukong. There would be no variety. As fun as certain things may be, there has to be a semblance of balance. Plus I don't even see smashing basic enemies as endgame content, thats midgame stuff, its in the realm of gathering and collecting material to gear up. So as far as I know the Xoris nerf is inconsequential atleast to me and is a horrible example.

As for hyping up, thats what my channel is, although what I show is generally true. I present it as such because that is how I play. If it comes out to be OP or not as OP, it is, what it is. 

[Sylonus]

I agree with the statement that it's no different except slower and with a cooldown downside, which is exactly why the presentation of it is pretty ridiculous in your video.

As for Xoris deserving to be nerf, I categorically disagree, preserving combo  "removed you from working?" What, it's not like it killed anything for you, all it did was preserve your combo, just like Naramon, so using Xoris allowed you to use another school if you so chose, as opposed to using Naramon and a Riven, which plenty of people would do instead even if it existed, it granted you no more maximum power, only flexibility, it was an option which enhanced player choice and made for more variety rather than everyone running Naramon with a riven always with their best dispo weapon but not actually using, the situation is quite the opposite of what you describe.

As to a semblance of balance, the Xoris nerf, and most of the nerfs in recent history have done little if anything to affect general balance in any real way. The Catchmoon and Steel Essence nerfs admittedly did generate more diversity, (The Khora nerf hurt her, but honestly the Steel essence nerf did more in the way of killing her off, removing the place where she was useful assuredly hurt her more than making her 1 inconsistent and annoying.) but I'd argue that while these were valid targets for change, they handled the changes badly. Many of the nerfs, including the Xoris were uncalled for and do not feel inconsequential to me, though that's subjective, the way to turn a subjective opinion into an objective metric is consensus, though it would only be a guess, my guess is that general opinion would be against the nerf, but I'd love to see polling done, it's unlikely that would ever be a question DE would ask, even if they did one of their extremely infrequent polls.

Who mentioned anything about smashing basic enemies or endgame content? I'm not sure how that statement relates to anything we've been discussing. As for your channel, I applaud the Hydroid Prime video, you played well and mentioned that while it's doable, it's by no means close to optimal. Again, the Lavos video comes off as making it seem like he's extremely OP and will rule the meta due to the tone and title etc, you can look at your comments and see multiple people using your video as justification for how "OP" he is, for example.