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Looking for suggestions, on non-toxic creators.


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The Warframe Youtubers I watch: 

Rahetalius, Grind Hard Squad, Sabucchi, Tactical Potato, Relentless Zen, LeyzarGamingViews, Quite Shallow, Brozime, OriginalWickedFun, KnightmareFrame, Triburos and MCGamerCZ. 

Out of that list, most of my attention goes to Rahetalius and Sabuuchi. The others I go to for mostly for build videos and laughs. 

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12 minutes ago, Yakhul said:

Change and improvement also come from very well written and positive feedback. It doesn't really mean that because is positive, you should leave it like that. It also means that you are doing a good job, and people like it, and there is room for improvement.

I am sorry but that is gibberish, I am sure you would agree?

You accept something, they then exactly have no reason or motivation to change it.

Not sure you were trying to actually type out what you actually typed here or meant something else?

 

 

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6 hours ago, JackHargreav said:

Quiet Shy? She's pretty funny and informative imo.

Maybe DkDiamantes tho he's not very entertaining. But still he usually doesn't talk about drama.

There's OriginalWickedFun? or something like that. 

These are the ones I can mention from the top of my head.

Shy also is Rebecca 🤷 

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1 hour ago, Kaggelos said:

"(DE)Scott: Im just a dude making videogames. And some of the criticism we get is delivered in a very harsh and hurtful manner.
Brozime: But am I wrong?"

For me, THIS is the problem (imo at least). Personally I dont care if you're right, if you're being a $&*^ about it. Like in the movie The Big Lebowski; "You're not wrong, you're just an A******"

Yeah I can't stand that attitude either. If you are righteous and correct you can find a more professional way to put it. 

Too many people seem to forget that the devs really are just normal people working a job and trying to do their best, and it really is just a game. Despite the memes, Scott is not a comic book villain who wants to hurt people. 

I'm not going to sit here and say they are a perfect company, but they invite way more feedback from players than most live service games do, and some people take that as a license to just go straight on the attack. Like, they asked you to give feedback, not try to make them feel bad about their career choice. 

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28 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Yeah I can't stand that attitude either. If you are righteous and correct you can find a more professional way to put it. 

Too many people seem to forget that the devs really are just normal people working a job and trying to do their best, and it really is just a game. Despite the memes, Scott is not a comic book villain who wants to hurt people. 

I'm not going to sit here and say they are a perfect company, but they invite way more feedback from players than most live service games do, and some people take that as a license to just go straight on the attack. Like, they asked you to give feedback, not try to make them feel bad about their career choice. 

THANK YOU!

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1 hour ago, Surbusken said:

I am sorry but that is gibberish, I am sure you would agree?

You accept something, they then exactly have no reason or motivation to change it.

Not sure you were trying to actually type out what you actually typed here or meant something else?

 

 

I very much mean what i said. Perhaps i should word it differently for you?

You give negative feedback to developers > developers learn from it and take whats wrong, turn it into good.
 

You give Positive feedback > Good job, you did something people liked, and that pops the question: How can i make this good feature, even better? It is clear people liked it, so changing it too much wont do, but adding to it maybe?
All sorts of questions pop the moment you receive good positive feedback, it becomes a chain: How do i make this even better? how to improve on it? the players gave me some nice ideas, how do i implement them to the good feedback without changing too much? and more questions, unlike with negative feedback, which pops one initial question of "how do i fix this? will people like the fix?"

Negative feedback, when done wrong, causes fear, and as humans we are, we are afraid of failure. But positive feedback, can improve on another human thing: self esteem, pushing you to want to do better, build on your already good job, to make it better.

Perhaps i know of this because i experience this kind of scenarios daily, at my work. Negative feedback bring you down, while positive push you up to become better, is a human thing, and DE are not machines, they are humans, and they need not just the negative, but the positive too, like @Kaggelossaid about the interview on Shy channel with DE sctott and Brozime.

I agree with him on Brozime attitude. He can come very harsh and elitist, as if his words are final, and anything that is not as he said, is completely wrong and wont work. Definitely some good arguments, but he can be a bit more professional or at least a bit more "human"

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1 hour ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Yeah I can't stand that attitude either. If you are righteous and correct you can find a more professional way to put it. 

Too many people seem to forget that the devs really are just normal people working a job and trying to do their best, and it really is just a game. Despite the memes, Scott is not a comic book villain who wants to hurt people. 

I'm not going to sit here and say they are a perfect company, but they invite way more feedback from players than most live service games do, and some people take that as a license to just go straight on the attack. Like, they asked you to give feedback, not try to make them feel bad about their career choice. 

Spot on. 

If someone is criticizing me in a non professional or mannered way I'll just shut them off. It's like you verbally attack a a boss for something wrong directly at them. They won't listen to some uncivilized person, instead they will call security to kick you out.

Negative attitude only demoralizes the person you are giving it to most of the time and start fights. If Scott isn't a chill dude, he would be angry at him on video and that will escalate pretty quick.

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1 hour ago, Yakhul said:

...

 

OP is being toxic, with personal attacks, and, he is complaining, that complaining shouldn't be allowed.

"I have zero tolerance for intolerance".

That's the intellectual capacity of generation skinny jeans, well, enough of that.

We gave them all the chances in the world patiently, knowing they came up under the worst educational system we've had but at some point you have to grow up.

 

 

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, exturkconner said:

I don't see that as toxic. He didn't tell them to call the company. He didn't say to flood peoples work or private emails. He told them to take it to the forum. I mean it's the equivalent of peaceful protesting. How else are you supposed to let them know you are unhappy with things? The forums seem like the way to me. The fact that they lock so many threads and delete so many posts makes it all but irrelevant anyhow but at least someone has to read it to delete it. Calling it toxic seems pretty thin skinned to me. 

Well, for one thing, he COULD do it himself, hes a content creator, he has a big voice, so why ask his audience to do it for him? It was also pretty thin skinned of him to treat the nerf to khora as if the world is gonna end, as if steel essence farming was going to be completely killed and sunk into the ground, when it is actually easier than before, and you do not need a specific frame to do it.

Coincidence that he also uses a few keywords that sound eerily similar to politics:

- Calls his audience to promote HIS ideology of the situation at hand, kind of like some rallies across the USA?
- "Lets take back the game from the developers" Sound familiar? like the words chanted by a specific group of people saying "lets take back the country from the doctors"? First of all, game is not yours or ours to "take back"
- As you said, maybe is not different from peaceful protests, but guess what, those protests can often turn violent, and is often started by the people who started to protest, who treat everyone else who disagree with em with harmful behavior.

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4 minutes ago, Surbusken said:

 

OP is being toxic, with personal attacks, and, he is complaining, that complaining shouldn't be allowed.

"I have zero tolerance for intolerance".

That's the intellectual capacity of generation skinny jeans, well, enough of that.

We gave them all the chances in the world patiently, knowing they came up under the worst educational system we've had but at some point you have to grow up.

 

 

 

 

 

Perfect. You are a perfect example of what being toxic is.

You are being passive aggressive, and throwing attacks at a group of people, calling them, to put it in a more simple to understand word "idiots" and assuming that their education level is lower than yours.

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4 minutes ago, Yakhul said:

Well, for one thing, he COULD do it himself, hes a content creator, he has a big voice, so why ask his audience to do it for him? It was also pretty thin skinned of him to treat the nerf to khora as if the world is gonna end, as if steel essence farming was going to be completely killed and sunk into the ground, when it is actually easier than before, and you do not need a specific frame to do it.

Coincidence that he also uses a few keywords that sound eerily similar to politics:

- Calls his audience to promote HIS ideology of the situation at hand, kind of like some rallies across the USA?
- "Lets take back the game from the developers" Sound familiar? like the words chanted by a specific group of people saying "lets take back the country from the doctors"? First of all, game is not yours or ours to "take back"
- As you said, maybe is not different from peaceful protests, but guess what, those protests can often turn violent, and is often started by the people who started to protest, who treat everyone else who disagree with em with harmful behavior.

He is a small content creator. And he wasn't in the older partner program nor in the new creator program. His voice doesn't matter. The voice of hundred or thousands of players matter more. 

He called for the players to speak up if they saw a problem. He didn't demand they post what he said. He didn't provide a post for them to cut and paste. Those things would have been easy to do if he was trying to further his own agenda. He wants the players to have a voice. As we should all want.

A protest turning violent isn't on the person who arranged it. It's on the person or persons who turned violent we are responcible for our own actions. As far as it's often started by the people who started the protest. No virtually never. The people who start peaceful protest are registered names are known. They aren't the random people in the crowd who tend to get things going. But I digress you are clearly going to put any spin you can on something to make your argument glitter even if it requires inflamatory nonsense and intentionally being missleading about one of the most important parts of freedom.

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3 minutes ago, Yakhul said:

Perfect. You are a perfect example of what being toxic is.

You are being passive aggressive, and throwing attacks at a group of people, calling them, to put it in a more simple to understand word "idiots" and assuming that their education level is lower than yours.

....

And what are you doing right now

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I wouldn't classify any WF creators as toxic. Rio is just boring, cant make a point and rambles incoherently. AGGP is a hostile weirdo from the little ive seen, w/e.

The creators I follow right now would be Aweblade4, Gaz_TTV and Brozime when he bothers to leave Gensin for a little bit and do some WF stuff.

While all of them have very good mechanical knowledge of the game, they all represent different aspects and I appreciate that.

Brozime's perspective on warframe power in the game is very focused on regular content, keeping within the star-chart level-ranges. He also dislikes convolution in damage-setups, having as direct as possible damage and he'll like it. I do find his perspective useful in general, but I keep his scope in mind when hes critiquing some aspect of the game. In general I think hes one of the few creators that DE should be listening to more closely for feedback, especially on topics like training new players and making their experience simpler, as he as spent a significant amount of time looking at the games early progression for new players over the years with his "free-to-playthroughs" were he restarts to get an understanding of those aspects.

Gaz_TTV has a perspective more focused on deeper mechanics, I would say his game knowledge goes deeper than Brozime just because hes more engaged with the extreme cases for warframe performance, going into a lot of endurance content where the details start to matter a whole lot more for things like status or w/e. Also in huge contrast Gaz focuses a lot on Rivens and I do find that interesting, even if I dont always mess with the riven system.

Being part of his community has been great fun, a lot of oddball meta stuff is discussed there. Quite a bit of criticism of DE too, but its not like they don't warrant it form time to time. It would be valid to say that the gaz community is more geared towards people who've maybe played for too long and I wound not disagree with that. One of the best depending on your perspective and general sensitivity I guess.

Aweblade4 has a great yt channel, deep mechanical knowledge that I would attribute to his willingness to apply convoluted setups from time to time. Personally that's not my thing in practice, but as a way to understand mechanical interactions in the game is good fun to hear about all that. big time Garuda fan. To me hes got the best WF youtube channel right now and you are missing out by not subscribing to him.

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Tactical Potato is great.   Just non-pretentious review of new stuff, mostly.  Honest, critical, but he doesn't beat you over the head with his opinions.

Relentless Zen has a crazy mix of offbeat gamebreaking builds and on-beat gamebreaking fashion.  I wish he had time to put out more content, but what he does is quality.

Quite Shy is  ironically toxic and toxically awesome.  Iroxically Tawxome.  I don't go to her channel for information, but she is funny as hell if you enjoy bitter, bitter humor and don't need to hold Warframe up on a pedestal.  I can't think of any creator for any game that makes me laugh out loud so much.

 

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7 hours ago, Oorel said:

I wouldn't classify any WF creators as toxic. Rio is just boring, cant make a point and rambles incoherently. AGGP is a hostile weirdo from the little ive seen, w/e.

The creators I follow right now would be Aweblade4, Gaz_TTV and Brozime when he bothers to leave Gensin for a little bit and do some WF stuff.

While all of them have very good mechanical knowledge of the game, they all represent different aspects and I appreciate that.

Brozime's perspective on warframe power in the game is very focused on regular content, keeping within the star-chart level-ranges. He also dislikes convolution in damage-setups, having as direct as possible damage and he'll like it. I do find his perspective useful in general, but I keep his scope in mind when hes critiquing some aspect of the game. In general I think hes one of the few creators that DE should be listening to more closely for feedback, especially on topics like training new players and making their experience simpler, as he as spent a significant amount of time looking at the games early progression for new players over the years with his "free-to-playthroughs" were he restarts to get an understanding of those aspects.

Gaz_TTV has a perspective more focused on deeper mechanics, I would say his game knowledge goes deeper than Brozime just because hes more engaged with the extreme cases for warframe performance, going into a lot of endurance content where the details start to matter a whole lot more for things like status or w/e. Also in huge contrast Gaz focuses a lot on Rivens and I do find that interesting, even if I dont always mess with the riven system.

Being part of his community has been great fun, a lot of oddball meta stuff is discussed there. Quite a bit of criticism of DE too, but its not like they don't warrant it form time to time. It would be valid to say that the gaz community is more geared towards people who've maybe played for too long and I wound not disagree with that. One of the best depending on your perspective and general sensitivity I guess.

Aweblade4 has a great yt channel, deep mechanical knowledge that I would attribute to his willingness to apply convoluted setups from time to time. Personally that's not my thing in practice, but as a way to understand mechanical interactions in the game is good fun to hear about all that. big time Garuda fan. To me hes got the best WF youtube channel right now and you are missing out by not subscribing to him.

Lol aweblade can’t mod for S#&$. 

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17 hours ago, (XBOX)Hyperion Rexx said:

What you have to remember is, these guys are just normal folks, nothing special at all except they make a few videos.  Its all just opinion at the end of the day, and you can agree or disagree.

But the thing is, they are special since they make those videos. Not special in the way that they are superior to other gamers, but in the way that some people see it as if that is the case, making their word the law or truth among the meek herd of the neon-gods. It is harmless when it comes to in-game content, a poor guide doesnt matter, but when they open their mouths regarding real world things related to the games they play, and lack enough info while doing so, it can lead to the game getting harmed.

This isnt some WF exclusive thing I'm talking about, it is a widespread issue within gaming and in general when it comes to influencers. Which is practically what each and every content creator is that tries to/feels the need to voice an opinion about something. And at that point they should make sure to have their facts straight and enough knowledge about whatever subject it is they try to voice.

And this year, each and every internet voice that raises a concern regarding releases in any game and blames the devs in the process I write off as cluless drama seekers since they dont grasp the nature of the state the world is currently in. There are very few exceptions to this.

If this was any other year I might have looked at the 2020 releases in WF as a bit too little, but with all things going on which puts pins in the wheels for development it has been a quite remarkable year regarding releases. But we can see some people not being satisfied, we've even had complaints regarding how DE failed to release Wraith this year as "planned", even though they've never released 4 frames a year, not even during a normal year. But yet somehow some people expect more from this very restrictive year? Logic goes to cry in a corner when those people pop out from their caves.

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19 hours ago, GrazeZeroLow said:

Good afternoon.

Now that the well-know warframe creators/steamers are becoming toxic towards both DE and those viewers who disagree with them, I'm looking for new and small channels to sub to.

Any and all suggestions are welcome.

PS - Please don't ask me who the toxic ones are. They're well known and their brain-dead fans will go after anyone. 

Quiet shy 

originalwockedfun

tactical potato
MCgamerZ

LeyzarGamingreveiws

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Don't mistake toxic with constructive. 
I'll suggest only KnightmareFrame, because he really plays this game and OriginalWickedFun because he is rarely giving an opinion for pros or cons, only on the game itself.
They are almost polar opposites but both of their content is good.

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4 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

But the thing is, they are special since they make those videos. Not special in the way that they are superior to other gamers, but in the way that some people see it as if that is the case, making their word the law or truth among the meek herd of the neon-gods. It is harmless when it comes to in-game content, a poor guide doesnt matter, but when they open their mouths regarding real world things related to the games they play, and lack enough info while doing so, it can lead to the game getting harmed.

This isnt some WF exclusive thing I'm talking about, it is a widespread issue within gaming and in general when it comes to influencers. Which is practically what each and every content creator is that tries to/feels the need to voice an opinion about something. And at that point they should make sure to have their facts straight and enough knowledge about whatever subject it is they try to voice.

And this year, each and every internet voice that raises a concern regarding releases in any game and blames the devs in the process I write off as cluless drama seekers since they dont grasp the nature of the state the world is currently in. There are very few exceptions to this.

If this was any other year I might have looked at the 2020 releases in WF as a bit too little, but with all things going on which puts pins in the wheels for development it has been a quite remarkable year regarding releases. But we can see some people not being satisfied, we've even had complaints regarding how DE failed to release Wraith this year as "planned", even though they've never released 4 frames a year, not even during a normal year. But yet somehow some people expect more from this very restrictive year? Logic goes to cry in a corner when those people pop out from their caves.

100% spot on and this is why I get frustrated when people defend these content creators. This year has seen people accept irresponsible rhetoric with horrifying results. In gaming, youtubers have gone so far as to judge games without even playing them! Heck, Warframe youtubers openly state they haven't played in years but feel express their "freedom" to speak on the game as representatives. 

That is not a freedom and should not be defended. They should be subjected to slander laws honestly because it can unjustifiably cost devs their jobs based on nothing but false but widely publicized lies...disguised as "content". Rio is the worst of the worst at this because he openly calls for devs to be fired. He doesn't play the game nor even understands what the direction of the game is but feels absolutely compelled to dream up his own version and demand it be made true, or else. All because raids and an endgame (he accepts) are not in the game. Outta here with that child stupidity.

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