(NSW)BalticBarbarian Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 24 minutes ago, Serafim_94 said: "Feed the Helminth" needs to go. It's on the same level of stupid as "gild a modular weapon" and "apply a forma". Both force vets to go out of their way for absolutely no benefit. Might as well add "reroll a riven" challenge while we're at it. Completely agree. I am in no way defending this specific challenge - it's only slightly better than the "gild a weapon" one (which I consider to be the worst one in NW). I am purely arguing against the "I randomly chose to stay at low MR, but everything in-game must still be available to me" mentality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(NSW)BalticBarbarian Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, Radu10 said: Idk, maybe I really need people upvote and keep this topic alive? That also counts as making it viral... That's a stretch and you know it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radu10 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 18 minutes ago, Volcombrot said: OK, then a similar wall: I once had an alarm I couldn't complete, because my mods were to low. I did not deal enough damage, because the enemies had a level way to high. I missed out on a potato. I also missed that potato, because I refused to play with randoms, because I hate being carried by others. I missed it, because of how I decided to play the game in the beginning. And I also missed out on some Vauban parts, because I hadn't unlocked the Star Chart yet. So, because I "refused" to progress in the game far enough, I was locked out of some content, until I got to that point in the game. The only thing the author missed out on was 1.5k Nightwave Standing. He did not miss "THE WHOLE NIGHTWAVE". The missed 1.5k. That is a daily mission. Yes, maybe it is bugged and will reward 4.5k in the future. You can farm 2*7k=14k from the two "Elite Weekly". You can farm 5*4.5k=22.5k from the weekly challenges. And you can farm 7k from the daily challenges. (Estimated. Yes, sometimes dailys give 1.5k). That makes 14k+22.5k+7k = 43.5k per Week in Nightwave. That means he missed out on ~3.5% of the weekly Nightwave Standing. Or ~10%, if it really will be worth 4.5k. And he can STILL just progress in the game to get MR 8, get the Helminth System and recover that mission to get the Standing for it. So he does not even loose it "forever". He only does so, if he chooses to "stand his ground" and not level up, even though he looses exactly nothing by doing so. Yeah I am kinda neutral to what the OP reported here, like I said I just took the chance to say my opinion about current MR and NW system and suggested some tweaks, that would not hurt any player, only makes the sad minorities happier. A win-win situation. OP has the time to do it ofc, but doesn't mean having that act in the NW is cool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radu10 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 Just now, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said: That's a stretch and you know it! No, seriously that's the first thing I associate when I see the word "viral" in a public media. And having that guy that suggested him to redo the post in a better fitting area of the forum (he even confirmed on the 2nd one it happened 'cause of him). But don't worry, I am not really into OP story anyway so I will pass on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroX4 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 29 minutes ago, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said: "staying at a low MR" is not a "gameplay style". It is a refusal to engage with one of the game's core progression systems. And refusing to engage with the game's core progression system is something that gets penalised in any video game! If you want to do it as a self-imposed challenge - do it! But any self-imposed challenge will end up limiting you in one way or another - expect that to happen and don't come crying on the forums when it does! Ok, so you refuse to engage with the conservation system in Warframe. That is your choice and you absolutely do have the right. Are you saying that you should still be given the rewards for it? Because that's what the OP is saying. All you are saying is that the alerts worked better with the set of arbitrary restrictions you've set yourself. Well, times have changed, the game has evolved, and so should your restriction have! Adapt or you'll get left behind! Ok the hell with OP the hell with NW and Alerts all together Just tell me this Do you understand players that some players like me and many others even if they do progress with core game mechanism which is MR still refuse to do some content And no reward behind it will change it? Your whole argument fall flat when you realize that being able to do something does not mean you will do it Imagine if we had only NEO relics on defection are you me or any1 else not in the right to ask for it to revert it back to where there were different mission types? You are so lost in your imaginary world you fail to see NO ONE HERE ASK FOR FREE REWARDS? IF alerts were so bad and NW is so good why we have so many ppl asking for alerts to come back eh? Did u even think about it from other players standpoint and not ur own? You can say well things change evolve into better things i do agree with that But do you see any posts here bring back channeling system back for melee and remove heavy attack system? Well no and you know why? Maybe because it was move from something that worked fine to something that works better And if players do cry about alerts being replaced in favor of NW what could possibly that tell you? NOT every one in this game want to play it like you or me and we should not force them to I can teach you how to do profit taker under 4 mins solo to swim in credits but if you dont like it no matter how many rivens you would have you just wont do it Is it so hard to understand that major acts on NW dont require from you anything else to just play the game so why we should have any acts that require some MR if we dont meet that MR? Would it harm any1 to have specific acts for ppl who did not reach that MR to do that act? I dont say remove MR required acts i say only when your for example MR4 you should not see do tricap while you could have like do LUA spy mission which is plain stupid if u abuse limbo You are literally here to refuse someone something he could get earlier but cant get it now Your whole argument circles around NO because NO so GTFO You are not here to help any1 idk if its even possible to be more shallow I literally start to believe when they guy who asked for forma crafting time to be reduced by 1H so we can overlap crafting time in 24H time frame you would just come to his topic and say NAH game is designed to have forma craft 24H so GTFO Sorry no serious or valid arguments i can have with you if that is your approach to the problem so until you start to look from other ppl perspective and not your own feel free to keep ur words of wisdom for uself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(NSW)BalticBarbarian Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 17 minutes ago, Radu10 said: No, seriously that's the first thing I associate when I see the word "viral" in a public media. Not sure I would agree with you in the current context, but that doesn't really matter - two reasonable people can have different reasonable interpretations of the same words. 20 minutes ago, Radu10 said: Yeah I am kinda neutral to what the OP reported here, like I said I just took the chance to say my opinion about current MR and NW system and suggested some tweaks, that would not hurt any player, only makes the sad minorities happier. A win-win situation. OP has the time to do it ofc, but doesn't mean having that act in the NW is cool I get what you are saying - the current MR system is somewhat outdated, NW has its problems, and this specific act is pretty bad too (but for the opposite reason to what the OP is complaining about). But I'm afraid this is not the right thread for that any more - the silliness of the OP's original complaint has completely poisoned this thread for any productive discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psianide73 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 Op is wrong. ZeroX4 is wrong. No, I won't get into a discussion why, as they will both argue til they're blue in the face. End of line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malaki_7 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 On 2021-02-08 at 8:15 AM, ZeroX4 said: But in a moment tons of ppl will come here explaining to you why NW is better than alerts While its not Because it is way better. 1. It's not based on randomness and FOMO. 2. It provides a clear and attainable progression path, even for very low MR players. 3. Unlike alerts it allows new players to get slots. 4. Much more consistent way to get nitain, alt-helmets, and catalysts and reactors. 5. Provides permeant story, worldbuilding, and new content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Bounty-Hunter Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 You don't need to complete every act in order to reach rank 30 in Nightwave. Knowing how long the past few seasons have run, you'll be able to skip a few acts each week and still have enough to get those two umbral formas and a handful of Orokin Potatoes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(NSW)BalticBarbarian Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 58 minutes ago, ZeroX4 said: Do you understand players that some players like me and many others even if they do progress with core game mechanism which is MR still refuse to do some content And no reward behind it will change it? They are free to not do the content they don't like. As long as they don't expect to get rewards (including in-game progression) locked behind the content they are refusing to do. And yes, it is ok to lock in-game progression behind specific pieces of content, even if some players choose to avoid doing it. It is their choice and they are free to change their mind (or not) if the potential reward turns out to be great enough. 1 hour ago, ZeroX4 said: IF alerts were so bad and NW is so good why we have so many ppl asking for alerts to come back eh? I don't care if alerts were good or bad. The simple fact is that alerts are no more! They are gone and are not coming back. A new system has replaced it - and that system is called "Nightwave". With all its advantages and flaws. You crying about it won't change that! If you had a playstyle you liked that relied on alerts and is incompatible with Nightwave - then tough! Go play that way 3 years ago! If you want to play today - adapt or suffer the consequences! But don't expect any sympathy for failing to adapt! 1 hour ago, ZeroX4 said: Is it so hard to understand that major acts on NW dont require from you anything else to just play the game so why we should have any acts that require some MR if we dont meet that MR? Is it so hard to understand that there is a very simple, straightforward and permament solution to "not meeting that MR"? The solution is called "go farm some mastery and raise the MR"! Had any of the examples you've given required MR29-30 - then you might have had some point. But when it requires something as trivial as MR8, your arguments don't have a leg to stand on! 1 hour ago, ZeroX4 said: I dont say remove MR required acts i say only when your for example MR4 you should not see do tricap while you could have like do LUA spy mission which is plain stupid if u abuse limbo Or how about just leave the tricap there and give the MR4 something to work towards? So that the player would see something he can't do yet and strive to improve to the point where he is able to succeed where he previously failed? When you are a new player, it's ok to not be able to do harder content - that's what makes you try to improve! 1 hour ago, ZeroX4 said: You are literally here to refuse someone something he could get earlier but cant get it now Your whole argument circles around NO because NO so GTFO You are not here to help any1 idk if its even possible to be more shallow I literally start to believe when they guy who asked for forma crafting time to be reduced by 1H so we can overlap crafting time in 24H time frame you would just come to his topic and say NAH game is designed to have forma craft 24H so GTFO Sorry no serious or valid arguments i can have with you if that is your approach to the problem so until you start to look from other ppl perspective and not your own feel free to keep ur words of wisdom for uself Silly attempted insults aside, what are you even on about? Times change, the game changes, systems evolve - whether you like it or not. You either change with it or get left behind! The change happened 2 years ago, so you've had plenty of time to get used to it. And at the end of the day, "I want things just like they were before" is not a "perspective" - it's just a tantrum! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroX4 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 3 hours ago, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said: ......... As i said we will talk when you learn to think beyond urself until then bye and have fun <( '.'< ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(NSW)BalticBarbarian Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, ZeroX4 said: As i said we will talk when you learn to think beyond urself until then bye and have fun <( '.'< ) I am. I am thinking of other people who want to develop and improve. As for those who want to live in the past and just cry and complain when something is not going their way - I'm not sure anyone should ever take them or their opinions into consideration. For their own good and for the good of the community in general! If you choose to coddle these people - you are just hurting them in the long run! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)The Neko Otaku Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 On 2/8/2021 at 8:15 AM, ZeroX4 said: But in a moment tons of ppl will come here explaining to you why NW is better than alerts While its not So have fun ;) And yet people never have reasons ready for why alerts are better than nightwave besides rose tinted nostalgia and false facts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radu10 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 5 hours ago, ZeroX4 said: Ok the hell with OP the hell with NW and Alerts all together Just tell me this Do you understand players that some players like me and many others even if they do progress with core game mechanism which is MR still refuse to do some content And no reward behind it will change it? Your whole argument fall flat when you realize that being able to do something does not mean you will do it Imagine if we had only NEO relics on defection are you me or any1 else not in the right to ask for it to revert it back to where there were different mission types? You are so lost in your imaginary world you fail to see NO ONE HERE ASK FOR FREE REWARDS? IF alerts were so bad and NW is so good why we have so many ppl asking for alerts to come back eh? Did u even think about it from other players standpoint and not ur own? You can say well things change evolve into better things i do agree with that But do you see any posts here bring back channeling system back for melee and remove heavy attack system? Well no and you know why? Maybe because it was move from something that worked fine to something that works better And if players do cry about alerts being replaced in favor of NW what could possibly that tell you? NOT every one in this game want to play it like you or me and we should not force them to I can teach you how to do profit taker under 4 mins solo to swim in credits but if you dont like it no matter how many rivens you would have you just wont do it Is it so hard to understand that major acts on NW dont require from you anything else to just play the game so why we should have any acts that require some MR if we dont meet that MR? Would it harm any1 to have specific acts for ppl who did not reach that MR to do that act? I dont say remove MR required acts i say only when your for example MR4 you should not see do tricap while you could have like do LUA spy mission which is plain stupid if u abuse limbo You are literally here to refuse someone something he could get earlier but cant get it now Your whole argument circles around NO because NO so GTFO You are not here to help any1 idk if its even possible to be more shallow I literally start to believe when they guy who asked for forma crafting time to be reduced by 1H so we can overlap crafting time in 24H time frame you would just come to his topic and say NAH game is designed to have forma craft 24H so GTFO Sorry no serious or valid arguments i can have with you if that is your approach to the problem so until you start to look from other ppl perspective and not your own feel free to keep ur words of wisdom for uself Well even if alerts were better for some players, me included for "some" points, having them back isn't reasonable ofc. But having DE improve nightwave really is something I hope will happen. almost each season I reported, and will keep doing it, some bugs and design flaws I will find on them, 'cause I really like the idea and want it to never disappoint some player minorities. The thing with this act it's not really that MR cap that ofc seems is annoying someone, but rather the idea to put it in the nightwave itself, when idk a speedrun one like the capture, go kill another challenging and rewarding boss, do something with a necramech would have all been ideal replacement for this, same fate for gild item and use forma ones. Even lich after u got all ephemeras and weapons (still forcing players generate a lich when the act is on and not when they need it is kinda meh) starts being an useless and boring nw act. And we all here moved away from what the OP said anyway, and after this time he could have farmed some frame/weapon to rank up. I would understood his point if nw would end this week. I also want to say I am really curious if we will be able hit the nightwave cap this time by just doing all acts, considering there are no other ways to get standing; if yes I have to dig out that topic I made about NW S3 cap management Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radu10 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 5 hours ago, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said: Not sure I would agree with you in the current context, but that doesn't really matter - two reasonable people can have different reasonable interpretations of the same words. I get what you are saying - the current MR system is somewhat outdated, NW has its problems, and this specific act is pretty bad too (but for the opposite reason to what the OP is complaining about). But I'm afraid this is not the right thread for that any more - the silliness of the OP's original complaint has completely poisoned this thread for any productive discussion. Yeah we started moving in the opposite direction OP was going anyway. I will keep partecipate in nighwave related discussions and open new ones myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(NSW)BalticBarbarian Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 2 hours ago, Radu10 said: I am really curious if we will be able hit the nightwave cap this time by just doing all acts I sure hope we won't! DE don't seem to ever lower the cap, and the S3 cap was at least 30+180 (I hit 30+150 and I still had more ranks available). To hit that with acts alone, this intermission would have to last for almost a year (49 weeks)! I would really like to have the next season available sooner than that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radu10 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 1 hour ago, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said: I sure hope we won't! DE don't seem to ever lower the cap, and the S3 cap was at least 30+180 (I hit 30+150 and I still had more ranks available). To hit that with acts alone, this intermission would have to last for almost a year (49 weeks)! I would really like to have the next season available sooner than that! I mean this time cap could be 60 hopefully (let's stretch to 90), i also not wanna be locked in an intermission forever lol Do you think that cap putted on previous series affects next ones? Usually they were all separated I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackHargreav Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 Well this was a joy to read. Thank god I didn't stick around to argue because, wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(NSW)BalticBarbarian Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 6 hours ago, Radu10 said: I mean this time cap could be 60 hopefully (let's stretch to 90), i also not wanna be locked in an intermission forever lol Do you think that cap putted on previous series affects next ones? Usually they were all separated I think The Nightwave ranks cap was never there as a goal - just a safeguard against exploits. If you look at it from that perspective, you'll see that there is no point for DE to ever lower it once it's set to a certain amount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radu10 Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 2 hours ago, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said: The Nightwave ranks cap was never there as a goal - just a safeguard against exploits. If you look at it from that perspective, you'll see that there is no point for DE to ever lower it once it's set to a certain amount. So in series 3 after you maybe reached rank 180 on the nw progress bar you could see rank 181?? (151 excluding the 30 normal ranks) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(NSW)BalticBarbarian Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 Just now, Radu10 said: So in series 3 after you maybe reached rank 180 on the nw progress bar you could see rank 181?? (151 excluding the 30 normal ranks) yes. I did not reach 30+151 (not enough standing), but I could see it. Since DE seem to raise ranks in multiples of 30, it's safe to assume that the ranks were going up to at least 30+180. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radu10 Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 8 minutes ago, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said: yes. I did not reach 30+151 (not enough standing), but I could see it. Since DE seem to raise ranks in multiples of 30, it's safe to assume that the ranks were going up to at least 30+180. Well knowing that was gonna be the cap and farming glass from the start maybe would have been possible but players might die before it happened playing 8/9 hours each day i think:O Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkelheit Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 vor 17 Stunden schrieb ZeroX4: As i said we will talk when you learn to think beyond urself until then bye and have fun <( '.'< ) Are you aware that his postings get a couple of likes each time and you get nothing? Maybe it is time for some self reflection? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkelheit Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 vor 23 Stunden schrieb ZeroX4: Can we experience the game as we want and not as u wish us for? Pretty please? Sure go ahead, as long as you don't complain on every corner and try to change the game to the worse. If you think, alarms were that great (like keeping an app running and logging in when the game needs me to, which is no big deal though, because the rewards were trash tier anywhere... some MR fodder + Vauban is all that ever was), more power to you, because you can play invasions, which are a slight derivation form alerts and very close to the original thing. Then you can think of NW as something new and we all have our peace, ok? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkelheit Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 vor 22 Stunden schrieb hix3r: Warframe has an "median hours played" of 6 and a half hours on Steam. (https://steamdb.info/app/230410/graphs/) This means that 50% of all the accounts that ever played this game on Steam played for less than 7 hours ever. I would estimate that 80-90% of all the accounts ever created play this game for less than 150-200 hours. The average total playtime is around 140 hours. If you play this game for 3k hours you are an outlier, not an average player. All those progression systems that are meant to keep you "engaged" for 3k hours are not even played by most. Why? My opinion: because the progression systems in this game get repetitive and boring fast. It's fun to meme about calling the game "Grindframe", and "you better love grinding, lol" etc. but the play stats indicate most players just quit this game around the time they played all the quests and tried a couple WFs. Progression by itself never solves engagement, players need to have fun first. If it's not fun playing anymore, progression systems do nothing. Your assumption might be right, but you are drawing the wong conclusions. Especially an F2P game will draw in people who do not know about the game at all, they just try it out, even if they like only jump&run, do not like it and stop playing. My assumption is that this game has a big, big community who plays it for a long time now. People come back to it all the time. So DE might have done something right, even though a lot of people fail to acknowledge that. Honestly, the progression in this game does not even matter. Warframe is a Marathon and not a Sprint. If you play it like you want to, the game will open all the right doors for you. The only thing you need to do to progress is look in your foundry once in a while and build everything that is ready to build. No need to grind, just play the game. Levelling a weapon takes 3 minutes tops in ESO, so that is not really a grind as well. Yes, there are some hoops to jump through, but they only feel like a grind if you grind them. Does that make sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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