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New Player Crafting Experiment


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46 minutes ago, Sdarts said:

All great suggestions. Really. That's one of - if not - the biggest issues I've heard from years as well, they see the market and they only see Platinum this and Platinum that. The same happened with me the first time I played Warframe back in November of 2013.

I played one mission, didn't understand anything, left and went to the market, saw all these cool and great characters and weapons, then I saw the Platinum cost and immediately closed the game. Fully not intending to go back.

I was modding Mass Effect 3 at the time and it was a very tedious and long process - you had to unpack the textures one by one, mod and repack them again, which the repacking process took many hours. It was because of that, that in December of that year I decided to give Warframe another chance, as there wasn't much else to do while waiting for the repacking to finish.

When I learned about the fact that most stuff in the market that wasn't cosmetic was buildable, and that the cosmetics were acquirable through trading, that's when Warframe clicked and over 7 years later, I'm still here.

For anyone wondering why I'm telling this story, it's for the fact that in these over 7 years, the game still doesn't explain the most essential systems to new players. A game that has grow and evolved so much, but the new player experience is still a very bad experience. It's insane, really.

Like many people have said over the years, there should be quests - just like the story quests - that introduce and show each of the systems to new players. I know it would take a lot of effort, resources and time, but there's no "easy way out", that commitment does need to happen.

Otherwise, all of these well intentioned, but misguided small attempts will never be as successful as the developers intend them to be. You can't use shortcuts on this one, there needs to be a lot of effort put into it. And it would be worth it, because the number one obstacle to new players I hear and read is that Warframe is very complex to get into.

When new players need to read or watch many guides, or have a veteran sponsor readily available most of the time to show them the ropes and answer their hundreds of questions, that's how you know the game is very unfriendly to new players. I don't have all the answers, but I know that this issue isn't something that easy fixes will resolve.

I would like to further reinforce this point.  I started Warframe less than a year ago and had the same experience.  A group of myself and three other friends played video games once a week as a way of keeping in touch, and we decided to try out Warframe.  We opened the market, saw only platinum prices, managed to figure out that platinum was a premium currency, and decided the game was not for us.  The only reason we stuck around is that we had three weeks until another game we had been playing released an update, and what we though was the only free content in Warframe was still fun enough to last us until then.  If one of my friends hadn't pressed the purchase button to see if it would give him a better view of some of the art we would have been gone.

Instead, I'm now past 1500 hours played, we've recruited two additional friends, and once it became clear that the currency model was actually pretty good and not the complete ripoff we were first presented with, I've spent about 60 dollars on the game.

Warframe has a lot of barriers to entry, but that first impression of the market is the worst.

 

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Let me propose another alternative.  A mini-quest to acquire ANY weapon blueprint and then build that weapon.  It would be a bit more open ended, whereas giving a specific blueprint might make players think that particular weapon is particularly important, which isn't the case or the goal.

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Making it clearer to new players that they can get the blueprints for weapons from the market is also a good idea. We also need ways for new players to find out how and where to get each resource to craft a new item. Modding needs to be explained more clearly, this could be done with a screen that pops up when they first open the modding menu explaining the basics of modding and the importance of it if they wish to become more powerful.

These simple things could make a whole difference between a new player staying and enjoying the game and a new player leaving the game with confusion.

This experiment is a good step forward as it will help many new players get the basics of the need to resource gather in Warframe for different items and weapons.

Edited by EgmoPrime
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  • 1 month later...

If there are errors sorry for my english I'm playing from turkey.

Information messages can be sent to new players.. 

Most players get bored and erase the game after leveling 0 to 1 level after doing the initial task because they cannot see the initial help of the game.

high levels don't care about them...

 

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On 2021-02-13 at 5:34 AM, jinxeverything said:

Option #5 - Player completes Vor's Prize and a random node on Planet Earth will have an alert for Burston BP and all the resources needed to craft it is from Planet Earth itself!

(baby steps and its less overwhelming this way since less jumping around from planet to planet will allow to player to focus, would be nice if the starting gears AKA MR0-2 also requires resources from Planet Earth then its time to branch out) 

When the player select the node to start the mission, a popup will show up with the first line reflecting that this alert is a tutorial alert and that other BP are obtained from missions / NPC or a vendor! (this item on the house to help the player start :))

The same popup will show up when the player is about to claim the item from Foundry which explains that in order to craft, you need credits and different resources which comes from different plants/ locations! (most players are too excited to craft new gear they double checking its cost, credits and resources, been there done that)

These popups are unskippable and you need to confirm exit with another popup! (sometimes you need to force feed the players some info regarding something)

As for Inbox message, have a standalone invasion vs Infested that have random reward, this is a good use for Inbox and good introduction to Invasion missions!(Invasions have random reward most of the times, its a good thing to include a line that states Invasion missions have random rewards when the player select them though)

My pieces, sorry if this is not what you wanted as a feedback.

This is what needs to happen or something similar to it. I remember my new game experience was only made tolerable due to the 3rd party wiki and people in the clan I joined. Having recently played Final Fantasy 14 what impressed me was the sheer volume of tutorial quests and useful popups with pictures that clearly instruct you on how to play the game. It also has a in game link to their new player website as well as information that can be accessed at any time through the menu. Square Enix have put in a massive amount of effort to say "Hey we really want you to play this game and not be confused while playing it" and that speaks volumes.

So I have some questions and suggestions:

Why is codex not available at anytime via the ESC menu?

Why is the codex not full of straight forward "This is how you do it" guides with clear illustrations to show how to complete a task?

Why do you have to mouseover the extractor button to see the resources for each planet and why is it not made clear what is rare and what is common? Why not have a button next to each planet that if you click will show you everything you need (resources and their rarity, enemy types,  and drop down menu options to launch extractors or display common/uncommon/rare mod drops that can be expected from the enemies present on the world).

Why is the UI so bad at communicating important information? For example, why don't items in the market have incredibly clear buttons, with text in them that say "Purchase with Credits" and "Purchase with Platinum" making it absolutely clear the market is not just a cash shop? 

Why is there no starter quest chain through nodes on Earth that specifically crafted for new players? These nodes can have scripted events with pop ups and in game video that clearly demonstrate how to do everything in the game, this includes modding. This would happen before you even get near getting access to an orbiter and the segments for the orbiter. Vor's Prize could then be the final part of this quest line. Since the player would now be familiar with all of the games systems you could do what you like as a reward.

TL:DR How about you craft a new game experience with tutorial quests, in game pop ups and video to fully explain everything from the UI to modding before the player even gets near the actual game itself. Make some changes to the UI to make it intuitive and not an exercise in "Guess what the dev was thinking when they made this" and please prioritise function over form (at least for new players). Yes, it is a massive amount of work but if you want new players then why not make the barrier to entry as low as possible. Warframe is fun and it is a shame people would miss out on it because it is about as new player friendly as being stuck in a small room with a rabid porcupine .

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On 2021-02-12 at 11:26 AM, Duality52 said:

It would also be wise to inform new players about Extractors and where resources are located. The Codex should be more effective in conveying information to the player as well, which requires cleaning it up.

What's also important is to make the game less dependent on the Wiki, allowing players a fair share of their own exploration and tutorials to ensure they don't get overwhelmed nor lost in the process.

I’ve been playing for 2 months and still don’t know anything about extractors and where to get them other then I need to complete a planet for them, so yea them telling me earlier on would be great, maybe like a forced tutorial when you complete ur first planet, or a quest where ur goal is to complete earth and then use an extractor for it? 

Edit- After reading these comments I’ve realized there’s actually a lot I had issues with when I started. I never knew how to mod/completely forgot about it for like 3-4 planets after earth, only reason I realized I had to mod was after a friend realized I did no damage and sat down for a half and hour and taught me how to mod. I woulda stayed doing no damage thinking it was just a difficulty spike. 

Same with the market, for a chunk of the star map all I used were the starter weapons and some quest weapons I got before being told that the market actually had blueprints I could get with credits. Also, it would be nice if the clans also had some sort of guidance because I didn’t even know the point or the value of them until my friend told me to “join one because they’ve got blueprints”

Same with certain enemies, like why is there a boss that you have to hit the back tubes on to knock down 4x and then kill? cuz I spent 1hr trying to fight him not knowing what I had to do, why isn’t ordis giving me tips on how to fight these unique bosses like “Operator, those tubes seem to be powering his suit, try attacking them” “Oh operator it worked attack him while he’s down”. Not to mention after unlocking operator I didn’t realize I could go into operator mode on command anywhere. If I hadn’t learnt eidolons using hours of wiki and youtube I never woulda learnt how to do them or kill the night sentients in the plains, let alone do rapocist or whatever that eidolon node is. Ordis right now is a plot point, why not make him a being that assists in nodes and boss fights by giving tips and essentially guiding the tenno. 

Also, the mastery tests look like they are built towards testing players on their skills, but at the first 10 or so MR’s the first few seem more like they were meant to lowkey teach you but you’re forced to do this stuff long before.

Someone in this thread mentioned making Earth a tutorial planet and frankly that woulda been amazing, have every node act as an in-depth tutorial of how to do that mission type, I personally can say that hacking was not fun to learn at first, let alone stuff like disruption and how life support dropping is a solid form of surviving in survival instead of actually triggering the support that lotus yells at me to trigger. 

Kuva Liches were another really confusing feature to be honest. Knowing that I had to massacre the enemy after a small flash during a mission was something I never woulda figured out if it weren’t for my friend spoon feeding me this info, it would also have been nice if the weapon shows up on top of the enemy without me having to get close right onto them before hand, because this is how I got locked into my first lich, I walked up and attacked because I didn’t realize they told me what the weapon was, I saw an ignis looking weapon on the ground next to them, figured it was that and slaughtered them.

This thread has made a lot of amazing points that I would have loved a month or two ago. I would really have loved the game teach me some of this stuff instead of having to look everything up or bother my friend for every little detail the game failed to provide me with. I understand that learning yourself in itself can be part of the journey, but at the very least set aside tutorial quests because giving someone a fork and telling them to go slay a dragon is not the way you make a hero, that’s how you make a corpse.

In conclusion, it’s 3 am and I’m typing this on my phone with 1 eye open so if I sound whiny or angry just know that isn’t it, I’m saying this all in a neutralish tone in the best way my brain can rn  

Edited by MomentoHeleo
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On 2021-02-12 at 6:50 PM, kyori said:

May I ask what is the point if there is nothing for new tenno to gain?

If really want to let new players experience the crafting system, then may I suggest a small quest (that reward the Burston Blueprint) in which ordis guide the player to go about acquiring the needed resources and teach them how to use all the segments in the orbiter

You need to guide and teach new players what n what in the game does. Not just throw things at them and let them find out.

Bad in-game communication is quite known in this game. 1 good example is the Limbo Theroem. After getting the Proof Fragments, nothing was told to the player that they need to craft it in the foundry. 

Isn't that what Vor's Prize is though? You have to gather resources for the Ascaris removal tool. By default players don't advance Vor's Prize if they don't craft. An ingame mail telling one that they can either purchase prebuilt weapons or the blueprints and then gather the materials and build them would be useful, but even then not all players read anything. Similarly with popups everywhere in the game players who have played games before will probably disable them. It's hard to make a new player experience that handles every type of new player.

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On 2021-02-12 at 8:50 AM, kyori said:

May I ask what is the point if there is nothing for new tenno to gain?

If really want to let new players experience the crafting system, then may I suggest a small quest (that reward the Burston Blueprint) in which ordis guide the player to go about acquiring the needed resources and teach them how to use all the segments in the orbiter

You need to guide and teach new players what n what in the game does. Not just throw things at them and let them find out.

Bad in-game communication is quite known in this game. 1 good example is the Limbo Theroem. After getting the Proof Fragments, nothing was told to the player that they need to craft it in the foundry. 

if the point of this is to run an experiment. Than this is what's called the control group. This is an option to give DE something to compare the results of the other groups with.

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the best new player experience would be to just give them a tutorial on how the market works. I spent the first few weeks of the game thinking I could only get new weapon blueprints from drops, or earning them through quests, junctions, exct. granted that was the old market UI which was horrendously bad because it outright hid buying blueprints with credits. but also I didn't even know the drop down menu with categorys was there until I got so frustrated not understanding how to progress in the game that some rando eventually explained to me how the market works.

If your game's new player experience hinges almost entirely on other players teaching new players how the most basic parts of the game work. there's something horrendously wrong with it that needs some more serious looking into than just "nudge them vaguely in that direction with a low effort inbox message" or the tutorial button hardly anyone knows exists and never gives any actually useful information on the few things it's available on.

I know you guys really dont want to put blatant tutorials in your game. but you pretty badly need them in some cases. at the very least have some long time players re-write the tutorials, and ones for some areas of the game that don't have one but need it, like the market, and put a little arrow and message indicating to new players that the tutorial button exists.

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On 2021-02-12 at 4:26 PM, Askell91 said:

Warframe became overloaded with stuff to learn troughout the years.

Popups and tip windows could help a lot to new players (should have on/off button in options and on by default)

Maybe make Ordis usefull and make him give tips them dunno.

A lot of new player met had no idea they can mod theyr weapons.....

tenor.gif

This.

I think having Ordis Interject when certain milestones are done, like:
Player hits Rank 30 on his first weapon:
"Operator, you've Mastered your first weapon, Congratulations!! Maybe you should build new weapons and master those to improve your Mastery Level. Have you checked the Market? I hear there's a few more MK1 weapons you can get."
Similar dialogue for Rank 30 on first frame.
Mods are already covered, but maybe pop-up a tutorial on modding since its a bit more complicated. Or you can go for steps.
Player equips a mod:
"Operator, you installed your first mod! You can rank it up to get greater benefits!"
Player Ranks a mod:
"Operator, good job improving your Mod! You can make more mods fit your warframe and weapons by improving your Mastery or by Equipping a Orokin Reactor or Catalyst"
Player Equips a Potato:
"Operator you've doubled your Mod capacity! Good job! If you still need more space, you can use forma to change the polarity of your mod slots. If you match the polarity of the slot and the mod, it halves the cost of the mods installed in that slot!"

Etc.

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I think that displaying the credit prices initially instead of platinum prices in the market would go a long way.
It's been proven time and time again that people immediatly get turned off seeing that.

Especially since games have moved into the direction of being infested with microtransactions.

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Well... Atleast you're making use of the Inbox Messaging.... I can't tell you how depressing it is when a whole week goes by and there's nothing new in my Inbox.... 

As for the issue of Transparency... For the purpose of experiments such as these I think developers should reserve the Right to keep things hidden to ensure the results are 100% Accurate... Ultimately this does help everyone in the end...

Now... For the actual Topic at hand... While the issue of Crafting is a new player hurdle I think the issue of Resource Acquisition is just a General Problem for everyone.... No amount of experience in this game has made the process of finding Resources Locations any easier for me...

Especially for things like Argon Crystals.... It's not that I have an issue collecting them (there was this one week I had ove 30 Crystals at any given time).... The issue is when I need an Argon Crystal for whatever reason.... My go to Response every single time... Is to Go to Marduk (Void) and find all three Caches.... Not once... Not ever do I actually look for any Crystals.... I just look for the Cache's  and by Happenstance the Argon Crystal will find me instead....

I think the main issue here is that there's no way to formulate an actual plan about how to actually find something.... You just go somewhere... Do a thing and hope that it finds you...

And that's why I love Cryotic .... Because it works the exact Opposite way.... If I need Cryotic for whatever reason I can formulate a plan and then execute knowing what the Outcome is going to be....it's my Favourite Resource.... Sure Polymer Bundles and Oxium is nice but they don't have Cryotic's Poise and Elegance 😝 !!!

In any case hope the experiment is Fruitful.... BTW I've never used the Burston or Its Prime.... Sure my Profile says I mastered it but that's Affinity I got from my Team Mates.... I never generated any using the weapon itself 😝

On 2021-02-12 at 6:26 PM, Askell91 said:

Maybe make Ordis usefull and make him give tips them dunno.

A great Idea... But then you then have to call up the Voice Actor (or their Agent) and hope they're not to be busy to give a Recording....

Atleast that's how I assume this stuff works.... 

I always thought getting new updates into any game with Voice Over work included required the stars to align just right 🤔....

On 2021-02-12 at 6:26 PM, Askell91 said:

A lot of new player met had no idea they can mod theyr weapons.....

My first week of Warframe I just never Bothered.... Mostly because at MR 1 no mods would fit....

On 2021-02-12 at 6:26 PM, Duality52 said:

It would also be wise to inform new players about Extractors and where resources are located. 

But you have to craft those things... And even though they work independently I've never found this to be an effective way of gathering Resources...

On 2021-02-12 at 6:26 PM, Duality52 said:

The Codex should be more effective in conveying information to the player as well, which requires cleaning it up.

Il do you one better.... The game should actually direct you towards the Codex in the first place....

I mean some people don't even know that the Codex isn't all that informative because the game rarely tells you to go there....

It was months before a friend told me: "Oh... You can find that information in the Codex".... I was like "😱" !!!!

On 2021-02-12 at 6:26 PM, Duality52 said:

What's also important is to make the game less dependent on the Wiki, allowing players a fair share of their own exploration and tutorials to ensure they don't get overwhelmed nor lost in the process.

This !!!

On 2021-02-12 at 6:34 PM, LillyRaccune said:

That is light years ahead of new players that are just completing Vor's Prize. The nature of the experiment is to see if they will craft anything. Let alone building an extractor and clearing all the nodes from a planet to deploy one.

I didn't even know that was a Requirement 😳 !!!

On 2021-02-12 at 6:50 PM, kyori said:

May I ask what is the point if there is nothing for new tenno to gain?

They are covering all bases... 

In the Process of all Scientific Experiments there's always going to be Anomalies and Unexpected Surprises....

Such things can still occur even if there's nothing new to gain.... And that data can prove useful in some way.

On 2021-02-12 at 6:50 PM, kyori said:

 

If really want to let new players experience the crafting system, then may I suggest a small quest (that reward the Burston Blueprint) in which ordis guide the player to go about acquiring the needed resources and teach them how to use all the segments in the orbiter

If I remember correctly... When doing the Quests for the Segments... I didn't actually know what Resources I was picking up.... I mean I'm sure the game told me but none of that meant anything to me....

Perhaps the purpose of this experiment is to determine if players know what a Resource actually is....

And another thing... Using Quests might actually not be the best way to do this.... I'm sure we all remember what it was like when we completed Vor's Prize and then we were like:"Cool... Now what do I do..."

I don't know if it's possible to teach players how to take the initiative but that's what the new player experience is lacking...

On 2021-02-12 at 7:02 PM, bad4youLT said:

Some of the key materials are locked away behind planet progression like neural sensors or argon crystals , I think early obtainable weapons and warframes should have their material requirments changed to early planets resource .

 

There was this one Key item that had this issue....

Ah yes I believe it was Rhino !!!

The Blueprints are Obtained on Venus but Resources needed to build him couldn't be reached for I think 2 or 3 more Planets later...

I think The Derelict was one of them.... At which point I discovered that there's a shortcut into the Void and Derelict Through Maroo's Treasure Hunts....

Ah yes and then Ofcourse there the issue of New players Selling their Chroma Blueprints early on because they needed credits and couldn't craft Chroma right away because you don't get all the Parts until WAAAAAÀAAAAAY later !!!

I mean Simaris saves you from having to buy him with platinum but it's still something I think needs to be fixed.

On 2021-02-12 at 7:06 PM, FSK41 said:

The people are the problem,not the game. DE doesnt force or provide as many oppertunities (events) to give players a reason to ;quote on quote; git  gud.

"Gitting Gud" is overrated 😐... It's also abit of a myth... 90% of our Performance Results are due to our Equipment... Not our Skill.

On 2021-02-12 at 7:07 PM, FSK41 said:

If you think this isnt true then tell me why Ignis wraith % usage is the highest BY FAR in 2020 and why people  Use Inaros (without actually using ANY ability except the 4 maybe?)

Where are these Usage Results ? 🤔

On 2021-02-12 at 7:21 PM, -JT-_-R3W1ND said:

LOL. How about have Market with more oblivious BPs?

Do you really have many plat from a "wow, market! I should buy everything, there is my wallet"?

I'm not sure, but IMHO this only leads to "this game is rediculos, i will delete it right now!".

The negative steam Reviews would indicate that is actually what happens....

I honestly don't know.... That's a UI thing and UI is not something I paid that much attention to...

On 2021-02-12 at 7:30 PM, UNG_God said:

if going that direction, should have more tutoring quests , not journeys , after completing the vor prize players should visit the relay and there each important npc, the sindicates , silmaris, tenshi should have a little quest teaching those little things like modding your arsenal and frames, how to use consumables , about resource location extractors , and on and on .

That's abit too on the nose.... Remember we also want new players to be abit more Self Sufficient. 

We can add as many quests and tutorials as we like but whenever the game let's go those players can become crippled with Indecision and Seperation Anxiety.

I think a better option would be to use the game's Inbox to invite players to the Relay.... You can have it setup so that this invite doesn't Auto Open when it first arrives and can not be deleted or marked as Read until the player actually Speaks to one of the Syndicate Representatives.

Hopefully players will get the impression that they are making these choices on their own without realising they are really being lead by the invisible Guiding hand.

On 2021-02-12 at 7:33 PM, Tiltskillet said:

That sounds like a great motto for a successful developer.

LoL Right !!! 😁

Actually the sad reality is designers actually do blame their users for not Understanding their Products... Atleast that was the case in 2013.... Donald Norman (The Design of Everyday Things) described his interactions with numerous Designers expressing their Frustration about why people don't just Read the Instructions or why they don't use all the Features....

Soooo yeah.... It's both a funny and disturbing Revelation.

On 2021-02-12 at 7:34 PM, Surbusken said:

Honestly, I would go with 3.

But change it, so the resource is gated on the last planet, having to grind out the entire star chart for just one resource.

Then once they get to the last planet, they find out the need a level 2 fishing pole for the blueprint, first.

Though they have to grind another grind for the level 1 mining laser which requires you play bounties.

Now unfortunately they can't play through those now, because they are locked on daily standing from low MR. Also, it's not the right day cycle.

Then they spend 5 days randomly searching for a faction standing level up item, only to learn it only spawns in certain areas.

This is where they find out having to watch youtube videos and read wiki on everything before you play anything.

If the aim is introducing the player to the game and full transparency, might aswell just come out of the bush about it right off the bat.

Damn... You don't pull any punches 😳 !!!

That being said... That is Warframe in a Nutshell...

On 2021-02-12 at 8:41 PM, Gentleman_Bird said:

I think we're missing the main issue entirely. The issue for new players is finding the weapon blueprints in the first place. When a new player installs the Market segment for the first time, they see all the new featured items that all cost platinum, and they assume that the Market is just full of microtransactions. Then, they completely ignore the Market until someone else informs them that the Market is where you get weapon blueprints. That's what I thought when I was new, and I've seen DE's sponsored content creators come to the same conclusion. Sending newbies a Burston blueprint through the mail does not solve this issue. It might even make the system more confusing since they may think that the main source of blueprints is through the in-game mail system.

We'll have to get the UI people to work on that Specific Problem...

If I remember correctly... The interface puts the Platinum Alternative in an Easy to See spot mean while the Credit Alternative is shoved to the Bottom....

Which is better than how it used to be when the Credit Alternative was all the way in a Seperate Tab.

Still though... Those two Options need to be Laid out... And I say this with no I'll intent... They need to be Laid Out in a less "Predatory" Manner...

On 2021-02-12 at 8:41 PM, Gentleman_Bird said:

Also, the market could use a sorting option that shows players the blueprints they can buy with their current mastery level. If a MR2 player wants to find a new weapon, they need to sort through the entire market weapon by weapon until they find one that they can actually use. A market filter that filters out weapons that are MR locked at the player's current level can be helpful.

Why didn't I think of this before ? 🤔

I guess I got so caught up window shopping that I never considered this would be a nice Feature.

On 2021-02-12 at 8:46 PM, arkadikos213 said:

For options with no full resource you should include info where this resources can be find or where this info is.

Or better yet.... They could do both... It would help contextualize the results...

On 2021-02-12 at 9:03 PM, Krilexis said:

Sounds like a good idea Id say lets wait how it goes. Materials except ferrite is weird but why not, players may have some ferrite already and notice that they earned it while doing Earth missions.

I don't think that would help the experiment... It would be better if those players didn't have Ferrite hence they can now observe how those players handle that situation.

On 2021-02-12 at 10:26 PM, far_wanderer said:

Warframe has a lot of barriers to entry, but that first impression of the market is the worst.

Another one that bugs me is the Default Colour Pallet being Partially locked... Specifically not having access the the colours Black and White.... What kind of game denies you Black and White 😐 ?

On 2021-03-14 at 2:09 AM, SemiNoodle said:

Why is codex not available at anytime via the ESC menu?

That is a good Question 🤔 !!!

 

On 2021-03-14 at 2:09 AM, SemiNoodle said:

Why is the codex not full of straight forward "This is how you do it" guides with clear illustrations to show how to complete a task?

That's the Funny thing about the Codex... In one section there's actually a full on Interactive Tutorial showcasing Mobility but then other sections are bare bones and not Helpful....

On 2021-03-17 at 8:16 AM, MomentoHeleo said:

let alone do rapocist or whatever that eidolon node is.

Ropalolyst 😉...

I mean you could call it the Rapist if you want... Nobody likes that big Chicken anyway 😝...

On 2021-03-17 at 8:16 AM, MomentoHeleo said:

Also, the mastery tests look like they are built towards testing players on their skills, but at the first 10 or so MR’s the first few seem more like they were meant to lowkey teach you but you’re forced to do this stuff long before.

I always assumed those Tests were just Gear Checks because each one has a specific loadout that Allows you to Cheese the Crap out of it.... Nioh Style....

The Mobile Interception Test can be Cheesed with Limbo... The Stealth Tests can be Cheesed by Banshee... The Rathuum Arena Test can be Cheesed by Inaros....

And so on and so forth....  That's why I went and got every Warframe.... To cheese all the tests...

On 2021-03-17 at 8:16 AM, MomentoHeleo said:

I understand that learning yourself in itself can be part of the journey, but at the very least set aside tutorial quests because giving someone a fork and telling them to go slay a dragon is not the way you make a hero, that’s how you make a corpse.

The Jordans Golem and The Sacrifice are two Examples where this Happens.... And most Recently The Deadlock Protocol aswell...

 

Although I hear they adjusted the Boss Fight on that one in the last updated.

On 2021-03-17 at 5:08 PM, ReaverKane said:

Player equips a mod:
"Operator, you installed your first mod! You can rank it up to get greater benefits!"
Player Ranks a mod:
"Operator, good job improving your Mod! You can make more mods fit your warframe and weapons by improving your Mastery or by Equipping a Orokin Reactor or Catalyst"

I'd rather Ordis tell me where I can get Endo in the first place....

On 2021-03-22 at 7:34 PM, Doom_Gaming said:

I think that displaying the credit prices initially instead of platinum prices in the market would go a long way.
It's been proven time and time again that people immediatly get turned off seeing that.

Especially since games have moved into the direction of being infested with microtransactions.

While this would be nice for Free Loaders such as myself I don't think it's fair to leave those who want to actually spend money out in the Cold....

Hence why both those options should be Equal in the UI's Layout.

 

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On 2021-02-13 at 5:50 AM, kyori said:

If really want to let new players experience the crafting system, then may I suggest a small quest (that reward the Burston Blueprint) in which ordis guide the player to go about acquiring the needed resources and teach them how to use all the segments in the orbiter

You need to guide and teach new players what n what in the game does. Not just throw things at them and let them find out.

This is a Great suggestion .. !! 

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Although it's not the focus of these tests, I think some consideration should be put towards making nanospores available earlier(say, making them a universally available drop in dark sector missions).  There are a number of lower-MR things that need them(low enough that it's understandable that you wouldn't have access to Saturn or Deimos yet), and every other week I see a newbie lamenting over how the hell to find them.  

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16 minutes ago, garbenzine said:

Although it's not the focus of these tests, I think some consideration should be put towards making nanospores available earlier(say, making them a universally available drop in dark sector missions).  There are a number of lower-MR things that need them(low enough that it's understandable that you wouldn't have access to Saturn or Deimos yet), and every other week I see a newbie lamenting over how the hell to find them.  

It could help with Survivability since Health Restores need Nanospores...

That being said I don't like how Health Restores or Any Restores Work....you're a bad ass awesome Ninja and you need to patch yourself on the go... So you drop a health Restore that pulse once and that's it... Since you're on the go you only get 1/5 of the Value from your Pizzas... If you want more... You have to be Glued to it for 12 Seconds 😱 !!! 

It's every Ninja's worst nightmare !!!

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5 hours ago, Lutesque said:

Where are these Usage Results ? 🤔

https://www.warframe.com/2020stats

5 hours ago, Lutesque said:
On 2021-03-13 at 7:09 PM, SemiNoodle said:

Why is codex not available at anytime via the ESC menu?

That is a good Question 🤔 !!!

But it is :crylaugh: StartMenu> Profile> Codex.

Or maybe Noodle means "while in a mission"?

Edited by LillyRaccune
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1 hour ago, LillyRaccune said:

Oh wow this is Awesome.... 

Can you teach how to Decipher the "Heat map per Mastery Rank%" Graphs....

I kinda sorta think I understand IT but can't be sure... TEACH ME !!! 🙃

 

Edit:

Assuming I'm Reading this thing Right....

Wukong Prime was the 2nd most used Warframe last year... 

However the Heat Map only shows usage Clustering towards the lower and Middle MR side rather than the Top...

Combine this Detail with the Fact that Excalibur was the most used Warframe tells us Roughly what MR the most Active player base of Warframe is....

Neat !!!

These Charts.... It's almost like they're Telling a Story 😮 !!!

Edited by Lutesque
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vor 20 Stunden schrieb Lutesque:

Well... Atleast you're making use of the Inbox Messaging.... I can't tell you how depressing it is when a whole week goes by and there's nothing new in my Inbox.... 

As for the issue of Transparency... For the purpose of experiments such as these I think developers should reserve the Right to keep things hidden to ensure the results are 100% Accurate... Ultimately this does help everyone in the end...

Now... For the actual Topic at hand... While the issue of Crafting is a new player hurdle I think the issue of Resource Acquisition is just a General Problem for everyone.... No amount of experience in this game has made the process of finding Resources Locations any easier for me...

Especially for things like Argon Crystals.... It's not that I have an issue collecting them (there was this one week I had ove 30 Crystals at any given time).... The issue is when I need an Argon Crystal for whatever reason.... My go to Response every single time... Is to Go to Marduk (Void) and find all three Caches.... Not once... Not ever do I actually look for any Crystals.... I just look for the Cache's  and by Happenstance the Argon Crystal will find me instead....

I think the main issue here is that there's no way to formulate an actual plan about how to actually find something.... You just go somewhere... Do a thing and hope that it finds you...

And that's why I love Cryotic .... Because it works the exact Opposite way.... If I need Cryotic for whatever reason I can formulate a plan and then execute knowing what the Outcome is going to be....it's my Favourite Resource.... Sure Polymer Bundles and Oxium is nice but they don't have Cryotic's Poise and Elegance 😝 !!!

In any case hope the experiment is Fruitful.... BTW I've never used the Burston or Its Prime.... Sure my Profile says I mastered it but that's Affinity I got from my Team Mates.... I never generated any using the weapon itself 😝

A great Idea... But then you then have to call up the Voice Actor (or their Agent) and hope they're not to be busy to give a Recording....

Atleast that's how I assume this stuff works.... 

I always thought getting new updates into any game with Voice Over work included required the stars to align just right 🤔....

My first week of Warframe I just never Bothered.... Mostly because at MR 1 no mods would fit....

But you have to craft those things... And even though they work independently I've never found this to be an effective way of gathering Resources...

Il do you one better.... The game should actually direct you towards the Codex in the first place....

I mean some people don't even know that the Codex isn't all that informative because the game rarely tells you to go there....

It was months before a friend told me: "Oh... You can find that information in the Codex".... I was like "😱" !!!!

This !!!

I didn't even know that was a Requirement 😳 !!!

They are covering all bases... 

In the Process of all Scientific Experiments there's always going to be Anomalies and Unexpected Surprises....

Such things can still occur even if there's nothing new to gain.... And that data can prove useful in some way.

If I remember correctly... When doing the Quests for the Segments... I didn't actually know what Resources I was picking up.... I mean I'm sure the game told me but none of that meant anything to me....

Perhaps the purpose of this experiment is to determine if players know what a Resource actually is....

And another thing... Using Quests might actually not be the best way to do this.... I'm sure we all remember what it was like when we completed Vor's Prize and then we were like:"Cool... Now what do I do..."

I don't know if it's possible to teach players how to take the initiative but that's what the new player experience is lacking...

There was this one Key item that had this issue....

Ah yes I believe it was Rhino !!!

The Blueprints are Obtained on Venus but Resources needed to build him couldn't be reached for I think 2 or 3 more Planets later...

I think The Derelict was one of them.... At which point I discovered that there's a shortcut into the Void and Derelict Through Maroo's Treasure Hunts....

Ah yes and then Ofcourse there the issue of New players Selling their Chroma Blueprints early on because they needed credits and couldn't craft Chroma right away because you don't get all the Parts until WAAAAAÀAAAAAY later !!!

I mean Simaris saves you from having to buy him with platinum but it's still something I think needs to be fixed.

"Gitting Gud" is overrated 😐... It's also abit of a myth... 90% of our Performance Results are due to our Equipment... Not our Skill.

Where are these Usage Results ? 🤔

The negative steam Reviews would indicate that is actually what happens....

I honestly don't know.... That's a UI thing and UI is not something I paid that much attention to...

That's abit too on the nose.... Remember we also want new players to be abit more Self Sufficient. 

We can add as many quests and tutorials as we like but whenever the game let's go those players can become crippled with Indecision and Seperation Anxiety.

I think a better option would be to use the game's Inbox to invite players to the Relay.... You can have it setup so that this invite doesn't Auto Open when it first arrives and can not be deleted or marked as Read until the player actually Speaks to one of the Syndicate Representatives.

Hopefully players will get the impression that they are making these choices on their own without realising they are really being lead by the invisible Guiding hand.

LoL Right !!! 😁

Actually the sad reality is designers actually do blame their users for not Understanding their Products... Atleast that was the case in 2013.... Donald Norman (The Design of Everyday Things) described his interactions with numerous Designers expressing their Frustration about why people don't just Read the Instructions or why they don't use all the Features....

Soooo yeah.... It's both a funny and disturbing Revelation.

Damn... You don't pull any punches 😳 !!!

That being said... That is Warframe in a Nutshell...

We'll have to get the UI people to work on that Specific Problem...

If I remember correctly... The interface puts the Platinum Alternative in an Easy to See spot mean while the Credit Alternative is shoved to the Bottom....

Which is better than how it used to be when the Credit Alternative was all the way in a Seperate Tab.

Still though... Those two Options need to be Laid out... And I say this with no I'll intent... They need to be Laid Out in a less "Predatory" Manner...

Why didn't I think of this before ? 🤔

I guess I got so caught up window shopping that I never considered this would be a nice Feature.

Or better yet.... They could do both... It would help contextualize the results...

I don't think that would help the experiment... It would be better if those players didn't have Ferrite hence they can now observe how those players handle that situation.

Another one that bugs me is the Default Colour Pallet being Partially locked... Specifically not having access the the colours Black and White.... What kind of game denies you Black and White 😐 ?

That is a good Question 🤔 !!!

 

That's the Funny thing about the Codex... In one section there's actually a full on Interactive Tutorial showcasing Mobility but then other sections are bare bones and not Helpful....

Ropalolyst 😉...

I mean you could call it the Rapist if you want... Nobody likes that big Chicken anyway 😝...

I always assumed those Tests were just Gear Checks because each one has a specific loadout that Allows you to Cheese the Crap out of it.... Nioh Style....

The Mobile Interception Test can be Cheesed with Limbo... The Stealth Tests can be Cheesed by Banshee... The Rathuum Arena Test can be Cheesed by Inaros....

And so on and so forth....  That's why I went and got every Warframe.... To cheese all the tests...

The Jordans Golem and The Sacrifice are two Examples where this Happens.... And most Recently The Deadlock Protocol aswell...

 

Although I hear they adjusted the Boss Fight on that one in the last updated.

I'd rather Ordis tell me where I can get Endo in the first place....

While this would be nice for Free Loaders such as myself I don't think it's fair to leave those who want to actually spend money out in the Cold....

Hence why both those options should be Equal in the UI's Layout.

 

https://www.warframe.com/2020stats 

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Hey Tenno! Great seeing all the new chatter on this thread. Just a quick message to let you know that we haven't forgotten about this and that we're analyzing how this experiment went now! We'll be sure to follow up with you via a "how'd it go" post once the dust has settled. Talk soon!  

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I don't think this will solve anything. The issue is that you can gain access to things in WF way faster than you can process on how to deal with them. Also the game litterally explains nothing on anything. I mean I just found out I could MERGE Railjack parts!! Am I supposed to find this out by just checking every pixel on the screen and understand what it does?

 

If you have no experienced player to guide you, the content in WF is just too rediculous in the sheer amount, it's poorly explained and there's a serious lack of pacing. 

Once you get to know the systems and understand what is what it's not that big of a deal. I'm not saying it should be dumbed down. Like At All. But introducing pacing and adding missions/quests to actually deal with newly unlocked content would be a good place to start.

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On 2021-02-12 at 5:26 PM, Askell91 said:

Warframe became overloaded with stuff to learn troughout the years.

Popups and tip windows could help a lot to new players (should have on/off button in options and on by default)

Maybe make Ordis usefull and make him give tips them dunno.

A lot of new player met had no idea they can mod theyr weapons.....

Overloaded with information that is completely accessible in one place: official wiki.

The AAA gaming has become extremly hand-holding already. You get map waypoints, icons, pop-ups, tooltips and much more UI clutter. This kinda made the playerbase ignore/skip most of them including voiceover during begining of missions that tells you what to do. In those games they can still manage, but in WF you wont. 

Learning gameplay mechanics trough pop-ups is bad design. Look at Souls series and how it teaches you mechanics through gameplay.

Thats not the game fault, thats their own fault for ignoring what game tells them.

I for example knew I can mod my weapons right away but had no idea I can put any mod in any slot, thought it must be polarity match.

I didint know I can sell weapons and buy new ones for credits (still have my starting MK-1 weapons in top 10 used on MR30), which is much more accesible for neww player than crafting them. 

However after I discovered wiki all my problems went poof. 

If someone hates reading wiki wont help him. If someone got used to the new AAA system, the popups, tooltips and voiceovers wont help him either. If someone is lazy this is clearly not the game for them.

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1 hour ago, RazerXPrime said:

I mean I just found out I could MERGE Railjack parts!! Am I supposed to find this out by just checking every pixel on the screen and understand what it does?

Wiki/patchnotes.

And yes, one can hoover mouse over every icon available on UI and read tooltips and then maybe click and see what it does.

If one does not actively look for new information (curiousity) there is no point in forcefeeding it to someone.

Edited by Zakkhar
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Hello DE, 

I believe that one of the hardest thing for a new player in this game is to make sense of the plethora of resources that gets collected and shown at the mission end screen. Sure the inventory reveals the lore and locations of the resource, but it doesnt show its rarity/dropRate, nor what it builds into. 

I believe teasing the weapons that the resources can build into alone can teach players to collect the said resource and find the blue print thats needed to make the teased weapon. Again , only show the weapon that is easily acquirable from the player's explorable regions in short time, and not to show the player the weapons that would require more time investment. 

Remember, less is more (reveal less of future, but show more of current), that logic is lacking in warframe. Try the game Subnautica, a survival game that uses resources to build stuff to progress the game, that game uses player instinct and natural level/system design to guide them into discovering new resources and blueprints through self exploration. It does all that, by just teasing it here and there and demanding the player to think for themselves. Do not overwhelm the players, let the players chose that path for themselves. 

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