Arcane Helmets in Nightwave?

[Voltage]

Is this intentional? I feel like it's not considering their retirement years ago and their lack of integration into Arcane Slots when that change was made.

Having them in the Nightwave shop doesn't seem like "untouched" which has me confused. I also never saw mention of this in the patch notes.

Reading over the Hotfix 13.2.3 patch notes, it seems to me like this is a mistake and Arcane Helmets are supposed to remain retired as per:

Quote

• Helmets with stat modifications have now been removed from the Market/Alert Cycle. Previously crafted or purchased Helmets with stats have been grandfathered in and will not be affected by this change. Additional Stat-to-Stateless Helmet recipes have been added to the Market for individuals wishing to change their current stat modifying helmets to purely cosmetic versions. To coincide with this change, the ability to trade Helmets has been added into the game as well. While the possible options to execute on this change were many, we do not feel comfortable removing the stats outright from gear players have spent hours and hours waiting for via alerts or spent Platinum on. The agency is in the players hand to remove the stats, and we will monitor to decide if further steps need to be taken.

[JackHargreav]

Probably a bug.

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

DE messing with the exclusive trading price of old Arcane Helmets?

didn't they do similar with Primed Chamber a while ago?

be funny to see an Artax Riven show up next

[PublikDomain]

Shh!

[Voltage]

4 minutes ago, (PSN)haphazardlynamed said:

DE messing with the exclusive trading price of old Arcane Helmets?

didn't they do similar with Primed Chamber a while ago?

be funny to see an Artax Riven show up next

Primed Chamber wasn't a retired item, and Artax rivens were re-added to the game when Sentinel Weapon Riven Mods were added to Simaris Offerings as far as I know.

Arcane Helmets are the equivalent of slipping Ancient Fusion Cores or Corpus Void Keys into circulation. If these items are to be reintroduced, an official statement would be appreciated as this sort of pulls a bag over players head with misinformation on these items. I am assuming this is a simple oversight, but we won't know for sure until something is said about them.

Just now, PublikDomain said:

Shh!

Respecting item information and acquisition isn't something I will be silent about.

[Drachnyn]

Back when they still existed as an acquireable thing, was it a blueprint or the fully built helmet? It seems like a mistake at first glance but it is not in the same patch as the other alternative helmets.

[Krankbert]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb Voltage:

Primed Chamber wasn't a retired item, and Artax rivens were re-added to the game when Sentinel Weapon Riven Mods were added to Simaris Offerings as far as I know.

Arcane Helmets are the equivalent of slipping Ancient Fusion Cores or Corpus Void Keys into circulation.

That's not the same thing. Ancient Fusion Cores have no use anymore except for dissolving them. Void Keys don't even exist anymore, along with the entire game system they belonged to.

Arcane Helmets merely can't be obtained except through trading for an existing one, but the ones that exist still work normally. They were merely unobtainable, like Primed Chamber was.

[Tesseract7777]

15 minutes ago, Voltage said:

Is this intentional? I feel like it's not considering their retirement years ago and their lack of integration into Arcane Slots when that change was made.

Having them in the Nightwave shop doesn't seem like "untouched" which has me confused. I also never saw mention of this in the patch notes.

What the what. 

Seriously? 

I am really not sure what to think of this. I am flabbergasted. Is this a visual bug, or truly for really available in the Nightwave Shop? 

 

[Drachnyn]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Tesseract7777:

What the what. 

Seriously? 

I am really not sure what to think of this. I am flabbergasted. Is this a visual bug, or truly for really available in the Nightwave Shop? 

 

It really is in there with correct description and all.

[Voltage]

2 minutes ago, Krankbert said:

That's not the same thing. Ancient Fusion Cores have no use anymore except for dissolving them. Void Keys don't even exist anymore, along with the entire game system they belonged to.

Arcane Helmets merely can't be obtained except through trading for an existing one, but the ones that exist still work normally. They were merely unobtainable, like Primed Chamber was.

Arcane Helmets were specifically retired in Update 13.2.3 as per:

Quote

• Helmets with stat modifications have now been removed from the Market/Alert Cycle. Previously crafted or purchased Helmets with stats have been grandfathered in and will not be affected by this change. Additional Stat-to-Stateless Helmet recipes have been added to the Market for individuals wishing to change their current stat modifying helmets to purely cosmetic versions. To coincide with this change, the ability to trade Helmets has been added into the game as well. While the possible options to execute on this change were many, we do not feel comfortable removing the stats outright from gear players have spent hours and hours waiting for via alerts or spent Platinum on. The agency is in the players hand to remove the stats, and we will monitor to decide if further steps need to be taken.

I understand where you are coming from, but Arcane Helmets are fundamentally the same as Ancient Fusion Cores or Corpus Void Keys. These are retired collector items that can be traded. Likewise, there was no information on Arcane Helmets being added to Nightwave, so this does seem like an oversight and a mistake. These items are not supposed to exist in rotation. That is the entire reason Arcane Slots exist and why Arcanes are not tied to Syandanas and Helmets anymore.

1 minute ago, Tesseract7777 said:

I am really not sure what to think of this. I am flabbergasted. Is this a visual bug, or truly for really available in the Nightwave Shop? 

As far as I know, they function and you can buy/craft them. I am guessing crafted Arcane Scorpion Helmets from Nightwave are tradeable. I am not buying this because I already own one of every Arcane helmet.

[Tesseract7777]

Just now, Drachnyn said:

It really is in there with correct description and all.

Wow that is wild. 

There definitely has to be some kind of oversight here. 

Either: 

1) They completely forgot to put this in the patch notes or: 

2) This was a mistake, but it seems like it wouldn't be an easy mistake to make? 

If they are adding them back they should not just be putting them in the patch notes either, they should be fully explaining why they are bringing them back, and maybe with a little more fanfair. 

I'm kind of torn here, because I feel like if an item is going to remain in game at all and have stats, people should be able to acquire more than a finite amount of them, but releasing a couple random ones here and there in the Nightwave Shop, without giving any respect to those players who do have them stockpiled (not me for the record), and no announcement at all, is definitely a strange choice to say the least. 

[Krankbert]

Gerade eben schrieb Voltage:

Arcane Helmets were specifically retired in Update 13.2.3 as per:

I understand where you are coming from, but Arcane Helmets are fundamentally the same as Ancient Fusion Cores or Corpus Void Keys.

You say you understand, but I really don't think you do.

Fusion Cores have no function and the game system they belong to doesn't exist anymore.
Void Keys have no function and the game system they belong to doesn't exist anymore.
Arcane Helmets still continue to work unchanged like they did before 13.2.3.

It's not the same thing. It just isn't.

[Drachnyn]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb Tesseract7777:

Wow that is wild. 

There definitely has to be some kind of oversight here. 

Either: 

1) They completely forgot to put this in the patch notes or: 

2) This was a mistake, but it seems like it wouldn't be an easy mistake to make? 

If they are adding them back they should not just be putting them in the patch notes either, they should be fully explaining why they are bringing them back, and maybe with a little more fanfair. 

I'm kind of torn here, because I feel like if an item is going to remain in game at all and have stats, people should be able to acquire more than a finite amount of them, but releasing a couple random ones here and there in the Nightwave Shop, without giving any respect to those players who do have them stockpiled (not me for the record), and no announcement at all, is definitely a strange choice to say the least. 

Well they also didnt tell us about primed chamber returning to baro in any patchnote. I am not quite sure if there is something worth respecting here however. As far as I understand they are all just either from helmet alerts or from the market.

[Krankbert]

vor 9 Minuten schrieb Tesseract7777:

Wow that is wild. 

There definitely has to be some kind of oversight here. 

Either: 

1) They completely forgot to put this in the patch notes or: 

2) This was a mistake, but it seems like it wouldn't be an easy mistake to make? 

At this point, we can't say. Just compare it with Baro.

1) Stuff like that doesn't necessarily appear in the patch notes. New Baro offerings are never announced either, not even Primed Chamber. It's entirely plausible that this an unannounced surprise change, just like Primed Chamber was.

2) While I personally would implement such a store by generating it from a list of possible items just so I don't have to keep touching the damn thing constantly, we know from past mistakes that Baro's inventory is apparently hand-curated. Recently, his inventory on consoles was accidentially a repeat from a previous week, items have been  missing and then added later, and at one point they straight-up forgot putting a weapon in for an entire cycle and accidentially made it unavailable for an entire year. I find it equally plausible that someone meant to add the regular Scorpion helmet and put in the Arcane variant by accident.

[Tesseract7777]

5 minutes ago, Drachnyn said:

Well they also didnt tell us about primed chamber returning to baro in any patchnote. I am not quite sure if there is something worth respecting here however. As far as I understand they are all just either from helmet alerts or from the market.

 

4 minutes ago, Krankbert said:

At this point, we can't say. Just compare it with Baro.

1) Stuff like that doesn't necessarily appear in the patch notes. New Baro offerings are never announced either, not even Primed Chamber.

2) While I personally would implement such a store by generating it from a list of possible items just so I don't have to keep touching the damn thing constantly, we know from past mistakes that Baro's inventory is apparently hand-curated. Recently, console inventory was accidentially repeated, items were missing and then added later, and at one point they straight-up forgot putting a weapon in for an entire cycle and accidentially made it unavailable for an entire year. I find it equally plausible that someone meant to add the regular Scorpion helmet and put in the Arcane variant by accident.

I guess for now we will just have to wait and see. 

Either way, anyone who wants to take advantage of it better do it fast before DE has a chance to patch, just in case. 

Last time, I believe all blueprints were converted to regular blueprints of the helmet, but if you had already crafted or were crafting the arcane variety, you got to keep it. If it was a mistake to put it in there, but it is the real arcane helmet blueprint and not just a naming error, they will probably hotfix it the same way here. So stockpiling blueprints probably isn't wise, but buying one if you can craft it right away might be worth it if you don't have it yet. 

I mean, it's not like it would be the first time they accidentally released this very arcane helmet blueprint. 

• The arcane variant of this helmet was accidentally released in an alert (in the guise of a Harlequin Mirage Helmet) on October 4, 2014 due to an oversight in coding. Update 14.10 converted any remaining blueprints to non-arcane variants, but did not convert any fully-constructed helmets, which remained arcane as a result.

[Miser_able]

18 minutes ago, Krankbert said:

That's not the same thing. Ancient Fusion Cores have no use anymore except for dissolving them. Void Keys don't even exist anymore, along with the entire game system they belonged to.

Arcane Helmets merely can't be obtained except through trading for an existing one, but the ones that exist still work normally. They were merely unobtainable, like Primed Chamber was.

corpus void key =/= void key. corpus void keys were from the first event.

[Wind_Blade]

I still have my collection i used in raid build back in the day to min max, don't care if they come back meh.

[Drachnyn]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb Tesseract7777:

 

I guess for now we will just have to wait and see. 

Either way, anyone who wants to take advantage of it better do it fast before DE has a chance to patch, just in case. 

Last time, I believe all blueprints were converted to regular blueprints of the helmet, but if you had already crafted or were crafting the arcane variety, you got to keep it. If it was a mistake to put it in there, but it is the real arcane helmet blueprint and not just a naming error, they will probably hotfix it the same way here. So stockpiling blueprints probably isn't wise, but buying one if you can craft it right away might be worth it if you don't have it yet. 

Well I got one but I assume it would be very easy for DE to just revert that and refund the build costs for everyone who chose to get one now.

[Krankbert]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Miser_able:

corpus void key =/= void key. corpus void keys were from the first event.

Those also have no function and the game system they belong to also doesn't exist anymore. What's your point?

[PublikDomain]

5 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

If it was a mistake to put it in there, but it is the real arcane helmet blueprint and not just a naming error, they will probably hotfix it the same way here. So stockpiling blueprints probably isn't wise, but buying one if you can craft it right away might be worth it if you don't have it yet. 

1. It is an actual Arcane Scorpion Ash Helmet Blueprint
2. It costs 35 Creds
3. You can't buy a blueprint if you already own one*
4. You can't craft the blueprint if you already own the helmet

So the impact of this is pretty minimal. If it's an oversight DE should embrace it and return Legacy Arcane Helmets to the game. Or better yet, rework them and split them into Warframe-specific Arcanes, then run a new series of them for all of the newer frames.

[Tesseract7777]

Just now, Drachnyn said:

Well I got one but I assume it would be very easy for DE to just revert that and refund the build costs for everyone who chose to get one now.

DE has accidentally released that very same arcane helmet before, I checked the wiki page, it was once released accidentally under an alert for a regular mirage harlequin helmet blueprint. 

DE allowed anyone who had already constructed them to keep the arcane version. 

Remaining blueprints were converted to regular. So if they follow past precedent you'll get to keep it. 

[Voltage]

Just now, Drachnyn said:

Well they also didnt tell us about primed chamber returning to baro in any patchnote. I am not quite sure if there is something worth respecting here however. As far as I understand they are all just either from helmet alerts or from the market.

I don't want to re-open the Primed Chamber discussion, but you can read up on it here:

As for this topic on Arcane Helmets, I really want to give DE the benefit of the doubt and say it's a mistake. If it is not a mistake, then this would be very disrespectful to the value of the item and the original statement on their retirement. It would also open DE to criticism of incorporating Arcane Helmet stats into the Arcane Slot system as that is what happened in Shrine of the Eidolon: Update 22.14.0 as per:

Quote

Upon logging in, all Arcanes installed on Cosmetics/Helmets will be Distilled because Arcanes can no longer be installed on Cosmetics/Helmets.

• Old Legacy Arcane Helmets will keep their Arcane installed but you can not equip the Legacy Arcane Helmet on a Warframe with 2 Arcanes already installed.

Likewise, given these items are referred to as "Legacy" seems that DE did not intend on ever releasing these in the future. That is just my interpretation of DE's actions over the years regarding these items and I am going out on a limb and saying that most players who got into Arcane Helmets can agree that these are retired items.

1 minute ago, PublikDomain said:

If it's an oversight DE should embrace it and return Legacy Arcane Helmets to the game. Or better yet, rework them and split them into Warframe-specific Arcanes, then run a new series of them for all of the newer frames.

I would like to see that myself. I made a concept for that a long time ago, and I feel like it would be a great system to add for min-max players. I mean, we have Helminth now, so 15% power strength on your Chroma or Mirage won't break the game.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

see, DE, this is what happens when you drink so much while you work: you end up giving away arcane helmets!

I guess it's a good incentive to get people running the intermission, though I can't say as I'm really that bothered about the Arcane helms: like so many things, they aren't essential, plus it means changing your fashionframe. 

[Miser_able]

3 minutes ago, Krankbert said:

Those also have no function and the game system they belong to also doesn't exist anymore. What's your point?

my point was just that they arent the same thing.

[(XBOX)C11H22O11]

If it pisses off some people then by all means let it stay