Thanks for Watching Home Devstream #12/ Devstream #152

[Liu_K]

Do I contact support for the Umbra Forma? I even got a pop-up during the stream about it. Clicked "claim" and then...nothing. I don't have it in the inventory.

[(PSN)XtraveNation]

Good day,

I was unsure as to where to post this.

With this stream last night , I got the prompt for claiming the umbra forma blueprint. However , I logged in my game and it was not in there.

I had done the steps to unlink and link my account and everything at the start of the week, I even go that sexy octavia noggle...

Please help :(

 

I literally got it after posting this! 

Thank you , DE support always ontop of it!

[fabi-fly]

36 minutes ago, (PSN)XtraveNation said:

Good day,

I was unsure as to where to post this.

With this stream last night , I got the prompt for claiming the umbra forma blueprint. However , I logged in my game and it was not in there.

I had done the steps to unlink and link my account and everything at the start of the week, I even go that sexy octavia noggle...

Please help :(

 

I literally got it after posting this! 

Thank you , DE support always ontop of it!

Sometimes, you just have to do a mission to get the drops, it's a little weird

[KVenom]

47:00 - *Sigh*

Dear DE, I will be honest with you: your Balancing Gamedevs do not have a history of responsible nerfs.
Covert Lethality, Sonicor, Helminth - List goes on. I will not ask you not to nerf Melee, because if you announced it as planned, it will happen.
I will ask just one thing:
 

PLEASE NERF RESPONSIBLY. DO NOT MAKE MELEE UNVIABLE OR TOO WEAK.

Sure, I am might be just one guy having this much concern over that little announcement. Sure, Steve merely said it as a joke. But, the thing is - you guys tend to make this kind of jokes into reality.

So, let's be real: speed is not the problem. It never was, since more speed mods just translates into lacking of other things a weapon could've had.
Damage calcualtion, however is a huge problem. On both Melee and Firearms. If you guys really wanna fix melee, ya need to rework the damage calculated from explosions on throwable melee, as wel as slightly amplify damage calculation on AoE and non-Aoe guns. Besides, there are things like Bramma, Stahlta, Nukor Kuva that deal AOE and clear maps faster than any melee. You surely don't mean that some fast-smacking  statstick with no other merrits can outdo those?

So if you really want to break the "melee meta", please buff guns. Do not nerf melee too much.
Thanks in advance.

[TastyTaro]

Harness. The reason to continue to play RJ solo. RJ is supposed to be my own ship, not a communal one. Just fail to understand why you wanna change things which are not broken.

[(PSN)lykos88]

Q&A stream not that good. Talking about things we are already known or need improvent why?

Railjack harnes thingy why?

I liked the railjack modding for being difrent unique cool looking but still accessible.

But no  you want to made into the same than every otherd moddaple thing in the game.

I dont need the same thing over and over another forma dump come on. 

Can you ad Clem and other npc as a crewmembers and even having some event ones ive been farming some liches to use in railjack this is feature im most hyped.

Adding more things ad to your railjack both inside and out we only have 2 skins currently maybe ad some visual skins like gun skins room deco etc.

The point having avionicks etc. Is have your ship the way you want i dont need people coming using flux for some abilities i dont want need or use.

This coming uptade will pring more people in to railjack thats a good thing but dont dum it down for them too much let us have something difrent than other modes.

And i know we are having hard times thanks you know what im still proud you keep making this game and overall communicating with the players...

[Svenarx]

Just increase guns... Don t touch melee... It s Warframe or Nerframe !?

[(PSN)AbBaNdOn_]

Guns needs: 

Bullet Time = bullet combo duration (way longer than melee)

Blood Shot = crit chance +% based on bullet combo duration

Oozing(uzi-ing) Wounds = stat chance +% based on bullet combo duration

Condition Overheat = Base damage + % based on # of status on target.   

----------------

Realistically they need that all in one mod because guns require ALOT of midding lol.   It should be STANCE MODS for guns that boost mod cap.....    3 stances.....  Pure Crit,,   Pure status,  Hybrid....   

• Pure Crit = Combo+major crit bonus's+homing  
• Pure Status = Combo+Major status bonus's + homing   
• Hybrid = combo+ moderate bonus to both cc/sc + homing

(NOT for AoE weapons)

[KVenom]

В 27.02.2021 в 23:21, (PSN)AbBaNdOn_ сказал:

Guns needs: 

Bullet Time = bullet combo duration (way longer than melee)

Blood Shot = crit chance +% based on bullet combo duration

Oozing(uzi-ing) Wounds = stat chance +% based on bullet combo duration

Condition Overheat = Base damage + % based on # of status on target.   

----------------

Realistically they need that all in one mod because guns require ALOT of midding lol.   It should be STANCE MODS for guns that boost mod cap.....    3 stances.....  Pure Crit,,   Pure status,  Hybrid....   

• Pure Crit = Combo+major crit bonus's+homing  
• Pure Status = Combo+Major status bonus's + homing   
• Hybrid = combo+ moderate bonus to both cc/sc + homing

(NOT for AoE weapons)

Guns need Gun-kata stances. Just so we can go full Matrix with Akimbo Guns. 😁

On the serious note tho, some primaries/secondaries, other than Sniper rifles(which already have it), need that Combo Mechanic. And it should be based of the old Melee Combo system(The more you have on your Multiplier, the more damage you do, top Multiplier is 10, duration is around 3-5 seconds, after which combo gets completely RESET).
Examples of guns that would benefit from Combo Mechanic without getting too OP:

• Slow-shooting Revolvers(Akvasto, Aklex)
• Machine Guns/UZI  with low damage, with combo multiplier capped at 3 (Soma, Afurris)
• Throwable Secondaries and Bows, with only Direct Hits counting to combos (Kunai, Hikou, Dread, Paris Prime), while those specific instances should not gain combo at all, for obvious reasons: Probosk Cernos, Bramma, Lenz.

And yes, adding Homing Bullets/Projectiles, but only as a Exilus mods, would fix certain Primaries/Secondaries and their problems.

Other things you presented would make guns Kinda OP, considering that UZIs fire faster than any melee, and the existense of AOE guns like Bramma, which already have crazy Damage. (Clear the Map on Steel Path kind of damage)

[KVenom]

Actually, if are talking melee-related changes, please consider following:

PARAZON IS STILL USELESS.

You know what would be awesome: the return of Covert Lethality. Please make some sort of Parazon or Dagger/Dual Daggers Mod that makes all the Finishing Blows from Daggers/ Dual Daggers activate the Mercy status on the enemy, assuming they are still alive, and make Mercy overall a faster or skippable animation.

Because really, Daggers kinda suck now. Not counting Karyst and Fang primes. And this little tweak would make both Daggers AND Parazon finishers more usefull.

[Joezone619]

i did not recieve an umbral forma or umbral forma blueprint like was promised.

[(PSN)Calibrijade65]

Good Evening,

I didn't catch the Devstream livestream but I have my opinion upon what is about to take place and mind you I do understand that nothing has been set as of yet but still I need to stress my opinion on it.

1. The nerfing of melee weapon vs guns and there strengths- From what is being told by a lot of different people is that there is a plan in effect to take away the strengths of melee weapons and give strengths to guns. Personally I find it a very bad idea, First and foremost most of your guns are not even strong enough to take down bosses at lvl 108 - 130! you are putting people in a position to use a gun that might not be effective enough for the gamer who is playing. Many people including myself uses melee weapons! I find using melee weapons way more effective in taking down bunches of enemies versus a gun even though its there in my loadout.  Why don't you just add more mods to add to the guns power or something and add better rivens as well also nerfing melee weapons is no need however an adjustment to melee speeds to the weapons would also be good. Unless you are going to compensate all those people who has spent time and money in making or buying melee style weapons I believe many will indeed leave this game because its not very fair to those who actually play on a regular basis or work there tails off just to get what they have going right now.

2. Not listening to your player base- Currently what I have noticed that many weapons, skills and etc in the year I have been playing has been changed and then giving us substitutes to these changes with other things that are not even worth having. Personally you  are not listening to your hard core players enough but rather listening to those whinning and complaints because things are too hard for them or what not. The people who you really needs to focus on is those who has been here from the beginning who knows the game who knows the builds and how things are suppose to react. Those who spend the most time on this game is the ones who you needs to be talking to not those who hasn't invested no time at all.

3. Complacency vs Laziness- Let me stress one thing and make it clear, I play this game 90% of my time meaning I play this game religiously I have seen very good players and I have seen those that don't cut the mustard far as player skill, those who have submitted there concerns and complaints to me shouldn't be listen to period, 90% of those who play in the game are the very ones who wants everything easy to them. They don't want to work and they beg and whine about every single thing in the game. Basically they don't want to work, by nerfing and changing content to suit them is the wrong idea and if that is how you choose to go by this just to suit them be prepared to lose a large number of  your current player base because trust me no one is going to keep spending money to play a game that has no clear interest in it and turn it boring to play.

Now I do understand that I haven't played very long but I have been honored to play with some very good players in this game and if I have to pick between the whiners and those good players I would support the good players hands down. Those players are brilliant and know the game way better than half of your devs period (not intending on insulting just bringing facts to light!) and I do think that you need to reach out to these players because they could give you way better ideas about this game and I do believe they would be willing to talk to you than those who don't know anything at all about it.

Its obvious that others are taking notice of this and many things that you are trying to do and you are not being mentioned in most of your gaming magazines that are out  anytime a magazine mentions other games including Destiny 2 over your game and your game has been around for quite some time its clearly obvious there is a problem! If you look at the the amount of players that has been playing from say 3-5 years these players are leaving in vast numbers because of your constant changes and slowing the game down and I guess you are ok with this fact because you choose to come up with this concept . If you want to change anything how about going after all those toxic players that you have in this game? How about extending bonuses to clans who have active players in there clans? How about making clan challenges that make clan members willing to actually play for there respective clans? If you are going to do anything consider what you already have going and build up on those things instead of tearing up the game just to suit others who may or may not want to be willing to stay and play this game.

What I really want to say is  stop listening to the lazy whinners and start listening to your player base who really know how to play  don't change content just to suit those who don't want to work at it like all the ones who has played for years we don't need weapons that don't work we need for it to stay the same or else you will lose it all!

[Chroia]

Last I heard, Scott and Steve are proponents of MaRo's 20 Lessons, 20 years (which is awesome, and worth reading and adopting), and specifically of Lesson 19.
So I'm not going to offer solutions, just point out a couple of issues.

 

Since as far back as I've been playing, Warframe's always had a problem with balance.
- Part of this stemmed from weapon stats being (apparently) assigned arbitrarily, without someone plotting out the expected damage output. This was addressed with the huge weapon balance pass of U22.12, and more-or-less adhered to since, I think.

- Part of this stems from Warframe not being consistent.
(On this note:
Scott:
I've recently picked up a couple of old accounts (for 'reasons'), MR 12 and MR 3.
Do another undercover boss run (or watch someone else do so.) - and you're more than welcome to plat to skip the resource farming (that's Sheldon's bailiwick afaik). Hell, I'll gift you the necessities, inasmuch as I can afford, if that'll make the difference. The point is that you get an idea of how Warframe plays.
Warframe is a very very different game for a new vs. mid vs. high/end-tier geared player.)

- And I can't help but think that at least some of it, as well as the above, stems from -as far as I can tell- no one having a clear idea of 'What kind of game is warframe?'
I've been asking this question for years, (and it was asked on Devstream 78 back in Aug 5th, 2016, sadly I didn't phrase it explicitly enough - I'll have another go at it, below.) with no concrete answer beyond 'power fantasy'... and even that isn't actually a clear answer:
Musou (Dynasty Warriors et al) is a power fantasy - the omnipotent player, scything through hundreds upon hundreds of nameless mooks. (And is the direction Warframe's been going in for years).
In contrast, the MR3 account has Loki, no pizzas and next to no relevant mods beyond an Energy Siphon (so no living in perma-invis).
Sure, the AI isn't genius. But when it outstats you enough - and you can't 'turn it off', going into missions that are way past my power level, missions that I have no business legitimately being in (grandfathered taxi nodes, RIP), with nothing but my parkour, 175% eff, r2 damaged Serration, (no crit/multi) and +45% or so Blast damage on my guns, and completing them because I outplayed the computer? That is also a power fantasy (and the one that got me playing Warframe in the first place, and one it hasn't really catered to in years).
Hell, half the reason I play Warframe now is the mobility. When you're in the zone, the smooth, controlled fluidity of traversing a space with a speed and surety I lack in real life? That's a power fantasy. (Which is part of why I miss coptering.)

To be clear - make whatever game you choose to make, no pressure from me. Just pick your audience/appeal, and be sure you're catering to them.

 

Pupsker recently posted his opinion on what Warframe is.
So did Ashisogi, see 8:50 to ~12:00.
And I'm pretty sure I came across a third such last week (might've been on reddit?), but can neither find nor recall it atm.

 

Which brings us back to the question: 'what kind of game is warframe?'
Some examples, to clarify:

Concept -
* What about the game is supposed to make the player want to play?
The combat (gunplay, melee, caster) ^{This isn't actually a straightforward question - see next segment}? The graphics/pretties/aesthetics? Fashion? Progression, a.k.a. 'watching numbers go up' (see: Cookie Clicker ^{note: not cookie clicker} or more broadly incremental games)? Completionism? Optimization/minmaxing? Sunk costs? Facerolling hordes of mooks? Winning against statistically-superior-but-(sadly-)stupid enemies? Other?
Combat -
* How technical vs. statistical is combat supposed to be? for melee and for ranged, separately, as they play differently offering/suffering different capabilities and vulnerabilities.
* How demanding vs. casual - how much attention and effort is it supposed to take?
* What pace do you intend for the game? (Different game modes targetting different paces is a fair answer, but then they need to incentivize and reward playing at that pace.)
*How long should a player survive under level-appropriate unmitigated fire? How long should (each class of) enemy?
* How are players supposed to survive a combat engagement? This has implication for skillset design.
(The usual answers, for example, are 'cover', possibly paired with 'replenishing shields' (but this requires downtime, which Warframe doesn't necessarily offer/allow, subject to the specific game mode), 'healing (instant or over time)/vampiric healing', '#DR (doesn't exist in Warframe), %DR (Adaptation, armor, buffs) and/or ablative armor' (Iron Skin), %dodge, "don't stand where the bullets are" (loses hard to hitscan enemies).)
Design -
* What is the role of nuker frames, given the huge delta in eHP between faction defenses, compounded by the delta between level 1 and 105 (sortie 3 eximus) and Steel Path 105-165 (max non-endless)?
* What is the purpose of the elemental bonus/penalty -damage system, and how effective it is supposed to be? Are you supposed to be able to 'solve' a faction? ^{and are all factions roughly equally impacted by their elemental solution?}
* What's the intended maximum player power, what is the maximum intended enemy power level, and are they supposed to be equivalent?

I could go on (for instance, I haven't even touched on CC yet), and I'm sure you could too, so I'll stop there, hoping I clarified the question - I don't care what label you slap on the game, I care what game you're making.

 

* So, Devstream had talk about damage, vis-a-vis guns vs. melee, but the entire conversation revolved around Steel Path.

* And - correct me if I'm mistaken here - the entire conversation on melee dominating Steel Path revolves around slash procs.
To me, this says there's an imbalance between the effectiveness of armor vs. shields vs. pure HP as a passive defensive mechanic, with regards to Damage 2.0 and elemental 'solutions'.
Which would make weapon stats a secondary (possible) issue, and Damage 2.0 the main problem.
If so, what impact is (only) changing weapon stats going to have on 'normal' Star chart, where SP modifiers aren't in play? re: next.

* Scott emphasied that the point is to buff guns, not nerf melees.
What does this do to non-weapon nukers? Companions (snort)? Sentinel weapons (lol)?
Let me point out: Chop all melee damage by 50%, then chop all enemy eHP by 50% = melee power hasn't changed relative to enemy survivability, guns massively more effective, and no number bloat.
Let me further point out: Do the above, instead of buffing gun damage, and now non-weapon nukers are more effective, sentinel guns are more effective and companions are more effective. (Though they have too few mod slots to support survivability, utility and damage all at once, on top of their lacking most of a player's survivability options in the first place.)
On the other hand, buff (just) guns, and the gap widens.

 

I think that was everything, but it's too bleeping late/early, and this things already too far past tl;dr territory for me to expect anyone will actually read any of it.
But hey, catharsis. I "did my part", and I got this off my chest, at least.

 

Edit:

Ah yes, reducing melee speed.
* Brozime's got a point here - there are very few cases where you want to equip more than one '+%attack speed' mod.
The problem, as often is the case in Warframe, is stacking. Parenting attack speed mods does nothing to someone stacking Berserker + Warcry + Redline/Speed/Haste Mote + Arcane whatever it was. Fury?

* Attack speed serves as a costless, unconditional, universal 'attacks per second' increase, without changing the gameplay (but making it less pretty).
So does multishot.
So does unconditional crit (read: Point Strike vs. Target Acquired (and how many of you reading this know the mod without looking it up?))
They don't make the game look less pretty - so they're less likely to get touched, but I still believe they need to be reworked or removed.

[Nekromast]

Am 28.2.2021 um 10:23 schrieb (PSN)Calibrijade0206:

Why don't you just add more mods to add to the guns power or something and add better rivens as well also nerfing melee weapons is no need however an adjustment to melee speeds to the weapons would also be good.

They are exactly doing what you suggested! Adding new mods as well as buffing current ones for guns and the 10% nerf portion is an adjustment to melee speed as well as removing some stagger from combos which doesn't rly affect us since killing is the best cc

[(XBOX)Big Roy 324]

On 2021-02-27 at 7:22 PM, KVenom said:

Guns need Gun-kata stances. Just so we can go full Matrix with Akimbo Guns. 😁

On the serious note tho, some primaries/secondaries, other than Sniper rifles(which already have it), need that Combo Mechanic. And it should be based of the old Melee Combo system(The more you have on your Multiplier, the more damage you do, top Multiplier is 10, duration is around 3-5 seconds).
Examples of guns that would benefit from Combo Mechanic without getting too OP:

• Slow-shooting Revolvers(Akvasto, Aklex)
• Machine Guns/UZI  with low damage, with combo multiplier capped at 3 (Soma, Afurris)
• Throwable Secondaries and Bows, with only Direct Hits counting to combos (Kunai, Hikou, Dread, Paris Prime), and those specific instances should not gain combo at all, for obvious reasons: Probosk Cernos, Bramma, Lenz.

And yes, adding Homing Bullets/Projectiles, but only as a Exilus mods, would fix certain Primaries/Secondaries and their problems.

Other things you presented would make guns Kinda OP, considering that UZIs fire faster than any melee, and the existense of AOE guns like Bramma, which already have crazy Damage. (Clear the Map on Steel Path kind of damage)

I would very much like a homing option on thrown secondaries.  Also a potentially counts as a melee when one is not equipped (dual daggers- however, not benefitting from melee mods)  Which then combo count applies to the thrown projectile. This could be a largely unnecessary but fun mechanic especially if the melee functions are usable (1+ attack speed/ 3 standard range, 12x finisher damage)

[KVenom]

В 02.03.2021 в 23:07, (XBOX)Big Roy 324 сказал:

I would very much like a homing option on thrown secondaries.  Also a potentially counts as a melee when one is not equipped (dual daggers- however, not benefitting from melee mods)  Which then combo count applies to the thrown projectile. This could be a largely unnecessary but fun mechanic especially if the melee functions are usable (1+ attack speed/ 3 standard range, 12x finisher damage)

I'll be honest, bruddha:

Transforming weapons are an ARSE to programm. I mean, you've seen Dark Split-Sword?

It was meant to use stances for both Heavy Blades and Dual Blades. But even making it to change swiftly within it's own Melee Category was, as shown on one of a few Devstreams, "a very unpleasant and hard task, so it was ultimately scrapped". And it merely was supposed to switch Stance mods.

Now imagine a Cross-Category Switch. Even more BS to programm. I mean, the easiest way would be to create a Melee Weapon for each of those Thrown Secondary instances, and only activate it like Garuda's Claws. But that alone would make like tons of unnecessary and broken code, especially considering it's interaction with Garuda.

And I am not even talking on integration of using Secondary mods as Stat Modifiers for a Melee Weapon. It's hell incarnate to implement.

[(XBOX)Big Roy 324]

On 2021-03-07 at 12:47 AM, KVenom said:

I'll be honest, bruddha:

Transforming weapons are an ARSE to programm. I mean, you've seen Dark Split-Sword?

It was meant to use stances for both Heavy Blades and Dual Blades. But even making it to change swiftly within it's own Melee Category was, as shown on one of a few Devstreams, "a very unpleasant and hard task, so it was ultimately scrapped". And it merely was supposed to switch Stance mods.

Now imagine a Cross-Category Switch. Even more BS to programm. I mean, the easiest way would be to create a Melee Weapon for each of those Thrown Secondary instances, and only activate it like Garuda's Claws. But that alone would make like tons of unnecessary and broken code, especially considering it's interaction with Garuda.

And I am not even talking on integration of using Secondary mods as Stat Modifiers for a Melee Weapon. It's hell incarnate to implement.

Ya that makes sense.  I was thinking that they could have made it easier as an unmoddable melee.  Only transferring the fully modded damage stats to place holder melee values.  Which on their own would be decent enough to not make you feel like you were missing to much not having a full melee build.

I have said before that DE should be honest about the games limitations. We could provide suggestions of change that stays within the frame work and not expect too much. They have been so successful at convincing us they can do anything. So even I forget we're talking about a nearly 10 yo game and all that comes with it. 😅

[KVenom]

16 часов назад, (XBOX)Big Roy 324 сказал:

Ya that makes sense.  I was thinking that they could have made it easier as an unmoddable melee.  Only transferring the fully modded damage stats to place holder melee values.  Which on their own would be decent enough to not make you feel like you were missing to much not having a full melee build.

I have said before that DE should be honest about the games limitations. We could provide suggestions of change that stays within the frame work and not expect too much. They have been so successful at convincing us they can do anything. So even I forget we're talking about a nearly 10 yo game and all that comes with it. 😅

The whole problem is with switch of a mode. I mean, they could just add a "Pistol Whip" Mechanic to all the FireArms trees(if you remember that LabView-esque programming trees they shown us a few times), but it would take a CRAP TON OF WORK to make it work properly, from both triggering and animation points.

Because it:

1. Should be activated when player has no Melee Equipped,
2. Must be disabled for Garuda(her claws are activated when no melee),
3. Should be different for each type of firearm, since Throwables get a full Dual Dagger-esque built-in combos, while Primaries will be just bashing people with their Sweet Spot or Stock.

[uberfu]

Not sure if anyone bothers with Page 3 but ... when you showed off the udpated UI changes coming for Update 30 (the orange interface stuff) Reb was mentioning the added imagery and so on ... This needs an OPTION TO DISABLE ... where the fucntions of the menu items are the primary feature of the menu. Too many graphcis "just because" might look "cool" but disrupts the ability to actually use the menus.

ALSO - The current menus when going into the NAVIGATION are glitchy and do not always function as intended. Specifically when dealing with the INVASIONS menu -- after opening it -- when there are multiple locations listed for invasions (Neptune/ Mars/ Pluto ... and so on) the dropdown menu where each location set expands to show the missions might end up getting stuck. Open Invasions > Move the mouse over the first planet -- it expands as expected.  Continue to move the mouse down to the next Planet lsited and it gets SKIPPED where the 3rd Planet missions then expands instead of the 2nd.  Sometimes this fault sits at the 3rd Planet missions and not the 2nd. The workaround is to move the mouse back tot he top menu items > close the Invasions List > Then reopen the Invasions and the they fucntion as expected.  There should not be a need for a workaround.  This broken functionality has been around for at least the time I've been playing over the past 4+ years. 

QUESTION:
Are the upcoming changes simply UI tweaks or is the menu structure and functionality getting a pass as well in ordre to stabilize the menus ?