Jump to content
Temporary sub-forum for Update 30: Call of the Tempestarii ×

About upcoming melee "nerf" and suggested tweak


Recommended Posts

they're not nerfing melee, they're boosting primaries and secondaries whilst making tweeks to melee to bring it down from being a flurry of death

i'm actually excited for this, hopefully a lot of the guns benefit from this and everyone will stop crying when melee rivens change cus they rely too heavily on a meta

Link to post
Share on other sites
vor 3 Minuten schrieb ShogunGunshow:

Man I'd love a 'Heavy Pendulum' mod that reduced attack speed but caused increased damage an an inverse relationship. And if you killed an enemy with it it would ragdoll them like old Blast used to, knocking them against walls with lots of squishy sound effects.

It exists, is called Spoiled Strike and you don't know about it because it's currently terrible.

vor 1 Minute schrieb EdinaMonsoon:

whilst making tweeks to melee to bring it down from being a flurry of death

They're changing it to be worse. That's what a nerf is.

Edited by Krankbert
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, Drachnyn said:

alright what are you dropping for two attack speed mods, show me one of those builds. I know that berserker works differently than normal attack speed mods.

Normally range, it just isn't needed on a fast melee. Or you use Naramon and drop something like drifting contact.

Edited by -CdG-Zilchy
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Krankbert said:

It exists, is called Spoiled Strike and you don't know about it because it's currently terrible.

I'm aware of it. In my head I'm thinking about a mod that goes farther than that, where the damage bonus on the mod dynamically scales with the weapon's attack speed. 

But that's probably too complex for players. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Krankbert said:

 

They're changing it to be worse. That's what a nerf is.

you're not listening to the devs. it's much needed tweaks whilst "90% of the focus" is bringing the guns up to par with the power of melee

that's the majority of every player's arsenal getting a buff

Link to post
Share on other sites

there is a lot that isn't confirmed, all DE shared on stream is their ideas on what they MAY do, not their progress on what they WILL do. Simply put we will have to watch and wait.

 

I don't think they'd be dumb enough to lower the base speed on all melee weapons, they're far more likely to just reduce the speed mods if they go for that approach, less work. Though personally i think they should look at tweaking melee speeds per weapon, that way they can have more control, and the test cluster (that we haven't heard about since deimos arcana and haven't been taken seriously by DE since steel path)  could test things more thoroughly.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
vor 2 Minuten schrieb EdinaMonsoon:

you're not listening to the devs. it's much needed tweaks whilst "90% of the focus" is bringing the guns up to par with the power of melee

You're arguing semantics because you think the word "nerf" means more than it does. They're making changes that will see melee being worse than it is now. That is a nerf.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, nelu_Y3K said:

Will you still play Warframe after the upcomming nerf?

Will melee be worse thwn mellee 1.0?

What do you think?

I think all anyone can do really is wait and see what changes. if they can make the melee weapons seem like they have a bit more weight to them (particularly in the case of Heavy Blades and Hammers), then that will make up for a loss in speed and, for me at least, make the weapons feel a bit more enjoyable. still waiting on Pistol & one-handed blade dual wield too..

but there's every chance DE could screw it up. I hope not.

Edited by (PSN)robotwars7
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Krankbert said:

You're arguing semantics because you think the word "nerf" means more than it does. They're making changes that will see melee being worse than it is now. That is a nerf.

nerf makes it sound like they're ONLY bringing down the power of melee. melee being tweaked is a small side effect with the majority of weapons being a more viable choice

Link to post
Share on other sites
vor 3 Minuten schrieb EdinaMonsoon:

nerf makes it sound like

They're making changes that will see melee being worse than it is now. It won't be a side effect, because melee won't just be relatively worse because other weapon types improve, but because they will directly change aspects of melee that will make melee worse than it is now. That is a nerf, because that's what that word means.

It only makes it sound like they're only bringing down the power of melee to you because you think the word means more than it does. Changing something so that it's worse is a nerf, even if you buff something else at the same time.

I'm not going to have a discussion about the meaning of common terms.

Edited by Krankbert
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, FallenDisc said:

I don't see how's that a nail in the coffin.

You dont see how ALWAYS press button X then button Z then LMB to do decent damage or else enemies are bullet sponges is nail in the coffin?
Then nothing i wrote will explain it to you since seems you like that kind of gameplay

Its not a bad thing if you like it its just not all of us like it

And dont tell me worry about tossing some warframes being tossed into trash i dont see you asking for rework for warframes that already are trash (compared to what other warframes can do)

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

The biggest problem with warframe, and this has been ongoing, is that its very very difficult to distinguish between, buffs/nerfs, tweaks, and bug fixes. Melee being changed to be more slower paced is tweaking it doesn't affect a handful of weapons, its going to affect all of them, the entire system.

But DE has to do this carefully, they can't just tweak melee, they need to tweak melee, guns, and enemy scaling. Its like a triangle, if one side doesn't work, it all doesn't.

Link to post
Share on other sites
vor 18 Minuten schrieb -CdG-Zilchy:

Normally range, it just isn't needed on a fast melee. Or you use Naramon and drop something like drifting contact.

Personally I would never drop range but sure. It still feels like an out of touch and pointless thing to say by scott. He brought up the attack speed you get by stacking all attack speed mods. I did that a few times for the riven unlock with 3x combo for 30 seconds (or whatever that unlock was) but that really doesnt seem relevant in the current discussion.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, FallenDisc said:

Currently the gameplay of warframe is barely engaging to the point where gameplay can be easily replaced with macros.

Weapon swap spamming=/=engaging. More button presses=/=more engagement.

The whole weapon swap playstyle also doesn't even take into account actually using melee as a weapon. Priming a melee is just utilizing quick melee, and this is where the complaints about melee is trash at mobility comes from. Some stances provide mobility on alternate combos that are locked to fully equipping melee, and swapping back and forth out of full melee is highly tedious. You have to press and hold to enable melee mode, and if you want to swap back to primary, you have to swap weapons twice as it often defaults to the secondary, and no idea if it does the other way around if you initially had the secondary out when you enabled melee; it's why I don't even equip a secondary on this account other than when forced to.

If weapon swapping was an enforced playstyle, I would just drop the game. We already have Warframe abilities that support weapons, and with Helminth existing, there is literally no excuse now. Anytime there's an armored unit that doesn't die as quickly as the rest, I just delete its armor instantly, and not this non-sense prime with a secondary, and switch to melee. It either gets deleted by an ability, a gun, or a melee with the support of the ability that deleted its armor.

Just because people opt into macroing, doesn't mean it needs to be ruined for others, and your suggestions does nothing to solve the macro issue anyways. A lot of it just comes down to the popular game modes incentivizing sitting in a single spot and only slightly moving to not be considered afk. Why do you think Wukong is popular? He both rushes missions, and stationary missions you can equip a good ranged weapon and semi-afk while the twin kills everything.

1 hour ago, ShogunGunshow said:

They could nerf melee damage by 50% and they would still be top tier.

Frankly, making it so you can't stack attack speed mods helps you, because it's not something you should be doing anyway. You want to be stacking different multipliers to your damage, not doubling up on the same. 

Outside of sitting in a mission for several hours, why wouldn't you "give up" damage for attack speed? I can use 2x attackspeed mods even multiple hours into a mission and it still be enough damage. I have a Kuva Shildeg with attackspeed on the Riven, Primed Fury, and Berserker equipped, used it against all factions multiple hours in, and still didn't lack damage. I've also been using Karyst-P using Berserker and Primed Fury, again, even multiple hours in and during SP, still no issues with damage. I also don't use guns to prime them.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sadly the approach is wrong. Use a none slash weapon against Graineer/corrupted and see how terribly it works. 

Before touching anything on the melee/range damage side, armor scaling and status procs need to be addressed first. Anything else is beating around the bush.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I am apprehensive about these changes .... the melee 3.0 caused the zaw weapons to lose relevance. They were the best melee weapons and now with this possible update we will be able to see the most relevant weapons become unusable such as paracesis, vitrica, kuva shildeg, stropha and redemmer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm also somewhat scared, they said "Nerf Melee" but didn't say "Buff Guns" which doesn't make sense 
because some content pretty much REQUIRES the DPS Output Melees have 
Could you mind taking a look at my post? I went into detail about this issue. 

 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Drachnyn said:

Personally I would never drop range but sure. It still feels like an out of touch and pointless thing to say by scott. He brought up the attack speed you get by stacking all attack speed mods. I did that a few times for the riven unlock with 3x combo for 30 seconds (or whatever that unlock was) but that really doesnt seem relevant in the current discussion.

For example on a Kronen, range is simply not necessary, it comes down to the weapon type. Would I drop range on a polearm or hammer? Probably not. But something that turns you into a frantically slashing whirlwind and kills in 1 shot, yeh sure, no need for it. Even better if you can just get a Range stat on a riven that also has say an elemental, freeing up even more mod space.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, this also exists not only in the form of kuva nukor + any condition overload weapon, but it has been added recently to a singular primary weapon (cedo) with in-built condition overload (and due to that it's quite a powerful primary weapon, one of the best atm)

Link to post
Share on other sites
vor einer Stunde schrieb Roble_Viejo:

I'm also somewhat scared, they said "Nerf Melee" but didn't say "Buff Guns"

Did you watch the stream everyone else did? They absolutely said 90% of the changes was "buff guns".

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Yamazuki said:

The whole weapon swap playstyle also doesn't even take into account actually using melee as a weapon. Priming a melee is just utilizing quick melee, and this is where the complaints about melee is trash at mobility comes from. Some stances provide mobility on alternate combos that are locked to fully equipping melee, and swapping back and forth out of full melee is highly tedious.

Can you provide a practical example of the quoted part?

Sorry but, by reading it without a proper context, it feels like you are playing with a version of the game that is stuck at melee 2.0.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...