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Reguarding railjack 3.0 after devstream 152


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I think not having the host railjack contribute things like weapons and avionics is a bad deal. Pretty much destroys the community. By that I mean i solo everything so I like being called on to help i bring my railjack and then I pilot while they use my weapons and intrinsics. I'm not saying you shouldnt have the option to bring your own stuff but for me at least and players like me I can't see myself playing afterwards.

This is almost like fasion frame in a way but its more like look what I can do and what I worked hard to get and you get to share that and this just seems to destroy it. maybe you pick a loadout from squad before mission and you choose which persons you want to use but as for just hearing how this plays out it doesnt seem good.

time will tell with all things but ill be honest i was hoping for some reverted changes the railjack speed going up and more hazzards playing solo and coming back to see the ship completly on fire ect. it skill checks you that way because if you dont have enough revolite your teleporting everywhere killing enemies and repairing as fast as you can it was a rush!

after a mission the arsenal needs to open thats for sure. different parts of the railjack need function i was honestly hoping we will eventually get the model we first saw at tennocon a few years back so it could work as both an orbiter and a warship

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56 minutes ago, (XBOX)Huggs93 said:

I think not having the host railjack contribute things like weapons and avionics is a bad deal. Pretty much destroys the community. By that I mean i solo everything so I like being called on to help i bring my railjack and then I pilot while they use my weapons and intrinsics. I'm not saying you shouldnt have the option to bring your own stuff but for me at least and players like me I can't see myself playing afterwards.

This is almost like fasion frame in a way but its more like look what I can do and what I worked hard to get and you get to share that and this just seems to destroy it. maybe you pick a loadout from squad before mission and you choose which persons you want to use but as for just hearing how this plays out it doesnt seem good.

time will tell with all things but ill be honest i was hoping for some reverted changes the railjack speed going up and more hazzards playing solo and coming back to see the ship completly on fire ect. it skill checks you that way because if you dont have enough revolite your teleporting everywhere killing enemies and repairing as fast as you can it was a rush!

after a mission the arsenal needs to open thats for sure. different parts of the railjack need function i was honestly hoping we will eventually get the model we first saw at tennocon a few years back so it could work as both an orbiter and a warship

I 100% understand your point of view
But i 100% dont understand whats the problem here?
We are ok with going into ARCH WING mission not giving 2 F###$ about what others have if we are prepared for the mission
But we gonna start to care what other players bring to RJ?

Just look at current RJ If ur prepared armed up the A## you dont care who joins ur RJ since you can solo that stuff
So in the end business as usual

And i dont believe de will do any miracles for us with RJ but i also dont believe they want to ruin it for us by being depended so much on other players

I can believe to some degree it will happen but not to a point we will need to give a F###

For now lets wait for some more info and rage when it will be stupid just like we did with kuva weapons RNG ;)

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I don't get this complaint?

Didn't watch the stream, but from what I heard you still bring your avionics? Your RJ will be exactly the same if you bring your current load-out? It's just that others can bring a loadout specifically for a certain role.

This can only make your RJ stronger, not weaker. Am I missing something?

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24 minutes ago, Angwah said:

I don't get this complaint?

Didn't watch the stream, but from what I heard you still bring your avionics? Your RJ will be exactly the same if you bring your current load-out? It's just that others can bring a loadout specifically for a certain role.

This can only make your RJ stronger, not weaker. Am I missing something?

Now we swim in speculations
But most popular idea is that whatever you bring it will affect RJ part you are doing
So if u got maxed out all avio but ur not a pilot and pilot have crap avio RJ will be destroyed in seconds (more or less that the general idea)

But i doubt it will work like that and we wont be so depended on other players
Players just freak out because they assume worst case scenario will happen

Where i see it more as some avio will be per player and some will be per RJ
So like HP avio will be pr RJ but shield recharge will be per player (pilot in this case)
Same with weapon overheat avio should be per player

So gunners can shove up their butts all avio that benefit only turrets not minding other avios and that would be a good thing
But again ppl like to think of the worst things that can come with that change

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The problem with these changes is that they affect a lot who invested in railjjack like me and other players. I dedicated myself a lot playing alone and it was a very good challenge! The problem is that the majority of warframe players are lazy or casual people .... reducing railjack to that public profile will completely destroy this mode which, in my view, is the most interesting, challenging and I love collecting things for me build my way. Railjack mode demonstrated over time that it should be more focused on solo mode. I only play solo because I like to have control over everything and do it the way I think. When I played in public I saw people without mods, without resources asking for help and doing nothing ... they wanted me to just do everything for them. I want to beg the DE not to make these changes to remove avionics and weapon customizations and etc. The way to popularize railjack is another offering more customization and automation and not removing or removing our options to serve a casual audience that one day plays and the other day forgets ...! Please! Do not make these proposed changes! It will completely ruin this game mode that I love so much!

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16 hours ago, Vaml77 said:

The problem with these changes is that they affect a lot who invested in railjjack like me and other players. I dedicated myself a lot playing alone and it was a very good challenge! The problem is that the majority of warframe players are lazy or casual people .... reducing railjack to that public profile will completely destroy this mode which, in my view, is the most interesting, challenging and I love collecting things for me build my way. Railjack mode demonstrated over time that it should be more focused on solo mode. I only play solo because I like to have control over everything and do it the way I think. When I played in public I saw people without mods, without resources asking for help and doing nothing ... they wanted me to just do everything for them. I want to beg the DE not to make these changes to remove avionics and weapon customizations and etc. The way to popularize railjack is another offering more customization and automation and not removing or removing our options to serve a casual audience that one day plays and the other day forgets ...! Please! Do not make these proposed changes! It will completely ruin this game mode that I love so much!

 

20 hours ago, ZeroX4 said:

Now we swim in speculations
But most popular idea is that whatever you bring it will affect RJ part you are doing
So if u got maxed out all avio but ur not a pilot and pilot have crap avio RJ will be destroyed in seconds (more or less that the general idea)

But i doubt it will work like that and we wont be so depended on other players
Players just freak out because they assume worst case scenario will happen

Where i see it more as some avio will be per player and some will be per RJ
So like HP avio will be pr RJ but shield recharge will be per player (pilot in this case)
Same with weapon overheat avio should be per player

So gunners can shove up their butts all avio that benefit only turrets not minding other avios and that would be a good thing
But again ppl like to think of the worst things that can come with that change

thing is you have to assume the worst to avoid it.

and yes they have completly ruined this game mode for me personally witht he proposed changes i loved that it was a game mode that challenged you i still love the first version of railjack the best as it was a challenge only thing that needed tuning was the weapons.

Now I hear they want to make the interior even smaller than what we have now!
they ruin the whole poijnt of being captain of the ship.
I personally asked rebb if it was going to turn into a glorofied orbiter and from gameplay we saw yeah its a glorified orbiter no one has to stay on the ship you could launch orphix venom straight from the regular map.
I honestly do not see what about it needed to be integrated into railjack.

Hell I  would love different models and the original system where we could change what was active in the railjack while in space on the terminal.
tbh navigation shouldnt be where it is and that device is supposed to fold into the floor instead its always open why isnt nav by the arsenal and guns that table serves no other purpose.
At this point i wouldnt care if they delayed it just so we could get the system we were first introduced to dynamic missions where we have to change our active systems.the problem is people likeyou and me know how to fix it and we dont work at DE and its getting to the point we wish it was ripped out and we didnt anticipate it so much.

In a way it being. different orbiter would be cool but only if it had unique stuff go through my other posts and ask yourself if anything i have propsed is bad.

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21 hours ago, Angwah said:

I don't get this complaint?

Didn't watch the stream, but from what I heard you still bring your avionics? Your RJ will be exactly the same if you bring your current load-out? It's just that others can bring a loadout specifically for a certain role.

Based one what they said in the stream sort of, they made it sound like the only avionics that will contribute to the role in play (I will use pilot) as an example will be the person who has their a$$ in the seat, meaning it does not matter how good you're loadout is if someone still has poor pilot avionics and they are the pilot its the still same boat just different mod location

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16 hours ago, Vaml77 said:

reducing railjack to that public profile will completely destroy this mode which, in my view, is the most interesting, challenging and I love collecting things for me build my way

Are you sure you play warframe for warframe ? bcs i don't understand your point here, Railjack an alien concept to the game itself, in its current state its just an Island of nothing but grind that literally means nothing, I'm personally excited about being able to crack relics in this game mode, also earning arcanes with orphix venom game mode, I think DE did the right thing with this one, people have been asking for rewards for years, I don't think this will end up being en empty Island, bcs a lot of veterans will keep playing the game longers after finishing the story, this also will ease the radical meta surrounding eidolon hunt, Integrating Railjack with the rest of the game is the right step in my Opinion, having your own resources, not worrying that some troll wastes your ammo, I think its good experience for Solo player, it just works for this game 

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3 hours ago, (XBOX)Huggs93 said:

 

thing is you have to assume the worst to avoid it.

and yes they have completly ruined this game mode for me personally witht he proposed changes i loved that it was a game mode that challenged you i still love the first version of railjack the best as it was a challenge only thing that needed tuning was the weapons.

There is nothing challenging in RJ you only can be unprepared for it

RJ soon would become another PVP where few love it and other beg to remove it from the game
Same as archwing was before rework

Thats why any change to RJ that would make it more playable is welcome in my eyes

I prefer to wait and se what we get than cry and not before

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I would assume DE won't just make it only be the person using x thing gives it 100% of all its stats. What I would assume is that DE would make it "use the best of x" but that is assuming the current RJ stats remain the same.

In my opinion DE have 2 real options if they want it to be an overall improvement. One is to use the best stats out of everyone in the squad and to just have tactical/battle avionics and resources be "personal."

Two is to completely remove HP/Damage mods and integrate them in to a basic RJ, that way its only utility avionics (like speed) that will take effect when the person with them does x thing.

I'd prefer option 1, but DE could have something better or worse in mind and that means feedback should be saved for when the Dev workshop is posted so you actually know their plans.

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4 hours ago, MouadSaqui said:

Are you sure you play warframe for warframe ? bcs i don't understand your point here, Railjack an alien concept to the game itself, in its current state its just an Island of nothing but grind that literally means nothing, I'm personally excited about being able to crack relics in this game mode, also earning arcanes with orphix venom game mode, I think DE did the right thing with this one, people have been asking for rewards for years, I don't think this will end up being en empty Island, bcs a lot of veterans will keep playing the game longers after finishing the story, this also will ease the radical meta surrounding eidolon hunt, Integrating Railjack with the rest of the game is the right step in my Opinion, having your own resources, not worrying that some troll wastes your ammo, I think its good experience for Solo player, it just works for this game 

read some of my other posts i solve a lot of these issues

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4 hours ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

meh, most of the changes are OK, and the negatives only affect you if you insist on playing with squads. Command Intrinsic is the way to go IMO.

The funny/sad thing is for a game that has multiplayer DE seems like they want to make sure that people have little incentive to use it, when it comes to railjack at least with the potential changes. I am right there with you crew my ship with my semi loyal lich's and call it a day.

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I can't accept the idea of equipping avionics on my warframe .... unacceptable. I like to change the configuration of the railjack because I find it beautiful, interesting and stimulating. I hope you change your mind because what was proposed is just terrible.

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I dont really like how they design the railjack content as a whole.
From the beggining they should make few class of ships:  railjack as the big, slow and powerfull ship with command intristic in mind, some small 1-person infiltrator ship that would be fastest ship used to for objectives/infiltrate bases or ships, and maybe some 2-person medium craft best for dogfighting in space. This way you could give everybody a small quest an infiltrator ship that can be accessed  from everywhere (not just dojo or relay). Clans could use railjacks and small party of premade friends would go with the medium class.

I dont like the second star chart, its basicaly same as the base game, copy-paste mechanic that brings nothing new or fun. I would totally invest in randomly generated nodes that you get as a host, but the whole party could vote which node you pick as next (voting) mission. Those nodes would contain bosses, galleon ships, bases, variety of missions overally with different kind of rewards. I would also put load of rewards in there - some rare blueprings for railjack gear and warframe gear, possibly even super rare cosmetics.

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To be honest, I'm just worried about the whole refund/reset of all of my avionics. It's going to take at least a few days to respec everything without sabotaging myself. That and some of the functions that are necessary for proper gameplay are locked behind grind (OMNI teleportation, decent piloting skills, forge efficiency, etc). 

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Am 27.2.2021 um 08:24 schrieb (XBOX)Huggs93:

I think not having the host railjack contribute things like weapons and avionics is a bad deal. Pretty much destroys the community. By that I mean i solo everything so I like being called on to help i bring my railjack and then I pilot while they use my weapons and intrinsics. I'm not saying you shouldnt have the option to bring your own stuff but for me at least and players like me I can't see myself playing afterwards.

This is almost like fasion frame in a way but its more like look what I can do and what I worked hard to get and you get to share that and this just seems to destroy it. maybe you pick a loadout from squad before mission and you choose which persons you want to use but as for just hearing how this plays out it doesnt seem good.

time will tell with all things but ill be honest i was hoping for some reverted changes the railjack speed going up and more hazzards playing solo and coming back to see the ship completly on fire ect. it skill checks you that way because if you dont have enough revolite your teleporting everywhere killing enemies and repairing as fast as you can it was a rush!

after a mission the arsenal needs to open thats for sure. different parts of the railjack need function i was honestly hoping we will eventually get the model we first saw at tennocon a few years back so it could work as both an orbiter and a warship

then just don't play it. if you don't like it, then there's no reason!

i have ignored eidolons or whatever for years. because why should i play this random? a few months camp in trade chat while watching movies and i had 20k plat. I just bought arcane energize. ez.
the same with railjack. I just don't like it. i know many other games with spaceships in space that offer extremely interesting story and lot of action.

devs from warframe are TOP! but there is very strong competition in this area. and improving all of the points also takes a lot of resources and time. I just don't think it's worth it. because there is enough action with warframes.
railjack for me is just a mini game and will continue to be in the future.

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30 minutes ago, Battle.Mage said:

then just don't play it. if you don't like it, then there's no reason!

i have ignored eidolons or whatever for years. because why should i play this random? a few months camp in trade chat while watching movies and i had 20k plat. I just bought arcane energize. ez.
the same with railjack. I just don't like it. i know many other games with spaceships in space that offer extremely interesting story and lot of action.

devs from warframe are TOP! but there is very strong competition in this area. and improving all of the points also takes a lot of resources and time. I just don't think it's worth it. because there is enough action with warframes.
railjack for me is just a mini game and will continue to be in the future.

You have no idea what are you talking about. Railjack can be the future of warframe....but now with the last devstream looks like they want to sabotage who invested a lot like me and others....

I hope im wrong but what i see was a true nightmare and unacceptable.

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Gerade eben schrieb Vaml77:

You have no idea what are you talking about. Railjack can be the future of warframe....but now with the last devstream looks like they want to sabotage who invested a lot like and others....

I hope im wring but what i see was a true nightmare.

of course I have. But if you start provoking so childishly, then there is no need to discuss it any further.

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On 2021-02-27 at 1:29 AM, ZeroX4 said:

I 100% understand your point of view
But i 100% dont understand whats the problem here?
We are ok with going into ARCH WING mission not giving 2 F###$ about what others have if we are prepared for the mission
But we gonna start to care what other players bring to RJ?

Just look at current RJ If ur prepared armed up the A## you dont care who joins ur RJ since you can solo that stuff
So in the end business as usual

And i dont believe de will do any miracles for us with RJ but i also dont believe they want to ruin it for us by being depended so much on other players

I can believe to some degree it will happen but not to a point we will need to give a F###

For now lets wait for some more info and rage when it will be stupid just like we did with kuva weapons RNG ;)

I'm all for waiting for the workshop for more info, I certainly intend to before being overly critical of what might be. That being said, I think there's at least some cause for concern based on what was said in the stream and shown with the wip mockup for the harness. Simply going by the mockup there's already substantially less space for integrated avionics which would be a nerf of things as it stands, especially for solo play. There's other things that tie into this as well like not having the upraded grid anymore or how the grid removal will affect reactors and the purpose of such (primarily Vidar since avi capacity is their whole shtick). Obvs nothing at this point is certain or final but it's still worrisome, to me at least.

 

As for your AW comparison I find it a bit of a false equivalency. There's so much dependent on exactly how these changes are implemented that can affect the thing as a whole and how far the pendulum swings to either side, good or bad. I just can't simply equate the 2. One literally only has an effect on the person (loadout choices) while the other "could" have a far greater impact on the squad and ease of mission success or even be an indirect gimping of solo capabilities.

 

Ultimately though it's all neither here nor there at this point as we do have very little concrete info to go on. Just hypothetical what ifs and supposition based on a few words and a mock UI pic. I look forward to the workshop in a week or so but until then I think I'll maintain my worry. Hopefully it'll be unfounded in the end :)

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This may just be me...

I would have rather seen them create a sliding scale scenario where you had up to 3 or 4 railjacks with their individual loadouts in the same mission and scaled enemy count and difficulty slid up to suit.

That'd be a scenario where you'd actually need an engineer and side gunners with enough people to deploy away team(s) for different objectives.

In essence, Switch the extermination/sabotage nature of RailJack into a hardcore Survival mission with objectives that you have to manage to complete while your ship doesn't get blown up because enemies may never stop coming.

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5 minutes ago, (PSN)VKPButcher said:

I'm all for waiting for the workshop for more info, I certainly intend to before being overly critical of what might be. That being said, I think there's at least some cause for concern based on what was said in the stream and shown with the wip mockup for the harness. Simply going by the mockup there's already substantially less space for integrated avionics which would be a nerf of things as it stands, especially for solo play. There's other things that tie into this as well like not having the upraded grid anymore or how the grid removal will affect reactors and the purpose of such (primarily Vidar since avi capacity is their whole shtick). Obvs nothing at this point is certain or final but it's still worrisome, to me at least.

 

As for your AW comparison I find it a bit of a false equivalency. There's so much dependent on exactly how these changes are implemented that can affect the thing as a whole and how far the pendulum swings to either side, good or bad. I just can't simply equate the 2. One literally only has an effect on the person (loadout choices) while the other "could" have a far greater impact on the squad and ease of mission success or even be an indirect gimping of solo capabilities.

 

Ultimately though it's all neither here nor there at this point as we do have very little concrete info to go on. Just hypothetical what ifs and supposition based on a few words and a mock UI pic. I look forward to the workshop in a week or so but until then I think I'll maintain my worry. Hopefully it'll be unfounded in the end :)

IDK how far u r up with the RJ so just in case you dont know let me explain 1 simple thing
ONLY thing in RJ you need your RJ is to destroy yellow barier around crew ships other than than EVERYTHING in RJ can be done with just archwing
So whatever will be done to RJ we have plan B called AW

Other thing is that current RJ situation is like riven someone have ours melee riven mod with +100%CC +100%SC -200%AS and someone is about to roll it
And ppl cry just about the fact someone gonna roll it even before new stats are revealed while most likely we will have influence with our eventual rage to have that riven re-rolled into something better

On top of that who do really believes that de care to do so much harm to RJ or leave it at state players refuse to even play it when they plan to add so much content to it?
Content which takes time and resources to make so um?

But whatever the hell with that
If ppl care to freak out about something why not
- where is our RJ taking us off from orb vallis?
- where is that kind of deck bring and windshield?
- where are this kind of command menu? (most likely command intrinsics was for that)
- where is that kind of astro ruins we could fly trough
- where is our ability to control what happens in base with our RJ?

And i can go on and on
Lets face it we get bare minimum to what we were promised and now when actual changes can happen we prefer to complain rather than wait and see (and then complain)?
You know we got very different stuff with RJ from what was shown and somehow its still enjoyable even so its so different
So how about maybe just maybe lets believe changes proposed for now will also be enjoyable?

Video for reference (English is not my native language but it sound so strange not to say banana for reference)

 

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43 minutes ago, ZeroX4 said:

IDK how far u r up with the RJ so just in case you dont know let me explain 1 simple thing
ONLY thing in RJ you need your RJ is to destroy yellow barier around crew ships other than than EVERYTHING in RJ can be done with just archwing
So whatever will be done to RJ we have plan B called AW

Other thing is that current RJ situation is like riven someone have ours melee riven mod with +100%CC +100%SC -200%AS and someone is about to roll it
And ppl cry just about the fact someone gonna roll it even before new stats are revealed while most likely we will have influence with our eventual rage to have that riven re-rolled into something better

On top of that who do really believes that de care to do so much harm to RJ or leave it at state players refuse to even play it when they plan to add so much content to it?
Content which takes time and resources to make so um?

But whatever the hell with that
If ppl care to freak out about something why not
- where is our RJ taking us off from orb vallis?
- where is that kind of deck bring and windshield?
- where are this kind of command menu? (most likely command intrinsics was for that)
- where is that kind of astro ruins we could fly trough
- where is our ability to control what happens in base with our RJ?

And i can go on and on
Lets face it we get bare minimum to what we were promised and now when actual changes can happen we prefer to complain rather than wait and see (and then complain)?
You know we got very different stuff with RJ from what was shown and somehow its still enjoyable even so its so different
So how about maybe just maybe lets believe changes proposed for now will also be enjoyable?

Video for reference (English is not my native language but it sound so strange not to say banana for reference)

 

THIS

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50 minutes ago, ZeroX4 said:

IDK how far u r up with the RJ so just in case you dont know let me explain 1 simple thing
ONLY thing in RJ you need your RJ is to destroy yellow barier around crew ships other than than EVERYTHING in RJ can be done with just archwing
So whatever will be done to RJ we have plan B called AW

Other thing is that current RJ situation is like riven someone have ours melee riven mod with +100%CC +100%SC -200%AS and someone is about to roll it
And ppl cry just about the fact someone gonna roll it even before new stats are revealed while most likely we will have influence with our eventual rage to have that riven re-rolled into something better

On top of that who do really believes that de care to do so much harm to RJ or leave it at state players refuse to even play it when they plan to add so much content to it?
Content which takes time and resources to make so um?

But whatever the hell with that
If ppl care to freak out about something why not
- where is our RJ taking us off from orb vallis?
- where is that kind of deck bring and windshield?
- where are this kind of command menu? (most likely command intrinsics was for that)
- where is that kind of astro ruins we could fly trough
- where is our ability to control what happens in base with our RJ?

And i can go on and on
Lets face it we get bare minimum to what we were promised and now when actual changes can happen we prefer to complain rather than wait and see (and then complain)?
You know we got very different stuff with RJ from what was shown and somehow its still enjoyable even so its so different
So how about maybe just maybe lets believe changes proposed for now will also be enjoyable?

Video for reference (English is not my native language but it sound so strange not to say banana for reference)

 

Not that it's really relevant to the discussion how much of RJ I've personally done (all nodes btw, soloed all of the Veil, 8/8/8/8 intrinsics) but sure, imply I'm clueless about Veil crewships. You don't even need RJ for the shieled ones or the healing bubbles, AW works too. That being said, I spent a lot of time early on in RJ in my AW getting things done so I could get my ship to the point where I could do everything with that (or close to it, depending on objectives) and not have to use AW for everything. Is it an option? Sure. Do I want to do that all the time? Hell no. My ship is in a great spot now and I'd like to have it stay that way.

 

As for DE intentionally making things worse not making sense, there are always unintentional side effects. I don't think the bulk of what they've proposed are bad ideas per se but there is the possibility of those changes being implemented in a bad way and thus having an unintentionally adverse effect on the experience for some people. It certainly wouldn't be a first for them. As for your last little rant? You do you. I'm not going to cry over the spilt milk of could've beens and wouldn't it be nices. I won't fault them for, at least for the time being, scaling things back because their reach exceeded their grasp. If those things are added, in time, then cool...great. Until that time comes though, if ever, my concern is on what's currently present in game and tangible and how that may or may not be affected by proposed changes. 

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