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Railjack needs its own game designer. Nothing here is good


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I already maxed out everything I need on my railjack and I just severely dislike joining a random squad whos guns don't kill and hull is non-existent. Thanks DE btw for removing all our hulls and then not giving us a proper hull equivalent when you changed the system in your effective reset. Now I can go solo, but some of the missions are "cancer" to do alone just because (deserving of its own thread) DE doesn't know how to make engaging content, so they throw a bunch of trash at us.

The bad:

  • Matchmaking randomly into bad Railjacks where you've reset everyone's hulls to trash and gave no hull equivalent
    • Turrets should just use our own turrets and not the host's turrets, or an option to choose should be available, (ie and override button in our plexus or something to force use our own guns)
    • We should have 2 options for joining missions:
      • Make your own instance
      • Join someone else's game
  • Jamming drones sparsely spawned 2 galactic radii apart?
    • This is the most annoying and least satisfying mission in the game.
    • The floor is lava, but if anyone 1/4 players gets hit by random lightning, hack goes to 0%
    • 1 drone gives multiplies the progress by 0.4! That's absurd considering you spawn 4 waves with 1-4 drones each
    • You cannot sustain 100% for more than 5 seconds, might as well keep 1 drone alive for 40% efficiency the entire time
  • Auto targeting electrical lasers to keep us moving? (DE did NOT learn from limbo scarlet spear, and instead made their mode too exhaustive on the user to enjoy)
    • This is how you make your players hate your game
    • Don't put exhaustive work on humans
    • This isn't fun, its literally intended to be annoying
    • Remove this
  • Random hazards, quite literally there used to be a limit 1, now they can have multiple, and immediately return once fixed!
    • This combined with the forge capacity reset (bug?)
      • its almost impossible to fix the 3rd hazard once it happens for new players
      • veterans cannot find the resources to produce enough revolite by the 5th hazard if they occur back-to-back
  • No recall!
    • Lazy writing
    • Enemy "jammed recall" conveniently during the only place we would need it, and immediately works when we reach the door
  • Needing all players at airlock is bad game design too.
    • The previous RJ implementation of Nodes of Interest where you can parallelize work was better.
    • It's a buggy mess to force teleport players into a room (assuming they're not dead, in a turret, in a slingshot, entering another place, etc)
    • Mission stopper when 1 player fails to teleport into the room
  • Players replacing AI
    • I can have 2 gunners and 1 engineer AI keeping my ship alive, but then 3 people joined and they left my ship to die
    • Host AI should still be active even if players joined, otherwise "Command" is literally useless!
  • Mechs
    • Voidrig still can't heal.
      • you removed too many methods of healing (doesn't this speak to you on what the players want?)
      • Its the only thing that can kill orthrix and they practically get 1 shotted at level 100
    • Still cant spawn them in normal missions?
      • You could have just launched THIS and everyone will be 100% happy even if it's bugged
        • This is because you added something and did not take away anything, so anything is a bonus, but RJ took away our legacy stuff and gave us bugs
  • Corpus Crewships
    • Those things are tiny!
      • Hard to hit and harder to kill with forward artillery
    • The shield projectors that only face the railjack
      • Impossible to break (bug?)
      • requires a player to archwing behind it and shoot it out (bad game design)
  • Tile sets
    • Too small
    • Too cluttered
    • Pathing issues, ie, I have to walk around huge glassed off rooms just to reach an area that would otherwise be 5 meters away had that pane of glass not been there
  • New enemies
    • Similar to fortuna's launch the new enemies are able to perma stun you
    • Too difficult for new players
    • Too annoying for veteran players
  • Plexus polarities
    • Everything mandatory in this game is practically all Madurai
      • I saw the Vazarin and Naramon as: players need to spend forma, and indirectly: spend player: spend money
  • You've earned 5 whole asterite
    • Thanks
      • but no thanks

So that I'm not totally pessimistic, here are the goods:

  • Dirac being removed! YAY!
  • Everything is mods so it's one coherent system, (good game design! Whoever suggested this needs to take control!)
  • No stamina for pilots makes so much sense. The ships are slow canoes without it.
  • Adding reliable game modes into your unreliable game mode is an excellent strategy
  • New rewards! That's literally why we play your game
  • Bonuses are very nice and they're marked for us too
  • New relay dry docks are cool
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Gotta say, even though I do really like Railjack (conceptually) I agree with nearly every point made in your post. 

Aside from all of the things you've mentioned the amount of new bugs I've experienced in one day rivals the OG launch of Railjack. I've been softlocked twice and had multiple objectives flip out and either disappear or fail to register as complete even though all objectives were completed (IE: You're done here tenno, return to railjack. Then the mission list has the objective still listed incomplete. This has happened on (optional) objectives multiple times so not game breaking but still annoying).

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2 hours ago, -Damocles- said:

Corpus Crewships

  • Those things are tiny!

 

bigger on the inside!

 

how about ... you need to level up to use railjack recall and necramechs except when you don't need to do that and necramechs just work sometimes on railjack orphix ? but not other times ?

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I played through and maxed out Railjack back when, and I had good fun with it. However, it's so absolutely unlike the rest of the game that I always believed it really should have been a separate IP entirely; I just don't think DE has the wherewithal or personnel to do that.

 

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End of Mission {Loading Screen}

=> Back to Dry Dock {Loading Screen}

=> Everyone from [Dojo Name] left! Time for you to leave too! {Loading Screen + End of Mission window} 

=> Now in Orbiter, but have too any scraps to get rid of before going back to RJ ? No problem !

=>  Go back to Dry Dock {Loading Screen}

=> Scrap your S#&$, select mission {Loading Screen}

Yeah man this S#&$ is totally enjoyable /s

Not mentioning the various bugs here and there, infinite loading, CPU tanked after leaving RJ mission forcing me to kill the process every now and then, and the fact most ground-content in RJ missions are boring slugfest (including Volatile where one guy is more than enough)...

Did I mention that I've tried a few missions with no-Primed-Flow-Warframes and consequently had a pitiful experience piloting the ship ? Great design 10/10

I dunno, all you had to do was adding a "Survival !" node with only RJ content and half of complainers would be more than happy to fly around with their ship. The whole Part 1 of every Railjack Mission nowadays looks like a playable loading screen, where you fight 4 enemy ships at any time. Better add Railjack to Ludoplex, then replace the Landing Crafts in the loading screen by a Railjack that you can move up and down during infinite loadings, and you'll have a more complete game mode than what we have now.

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Quote

Everything is mods so it's one coherent system, (good game design! Whoever suggested this needs to take control!)

i don't see why that's something to get excited about - it's purely a cosmetic change, shrug.

the way that you upgraded ""Avionics"" was even less tedious due to the nature of the UI. the Mod Station is pretty tedious to upgrade Mods with. so we get a cosmetic change with some functionality regressions.

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Am 20.3.2021 um 17:19 schrieb -Damocles-:

I already maxed out everything I need on my railjack and I just severely dislike joining a random squad whos guns don't kill and hull is non-existent. Thanks DE btw for removing all our hulls and then not giving us a proper hull equivalent when you changed the system in your effective reset. Now I can go solo, but some of the missions are "cancer" to do alone just because (deserving of its own thread) DE doesn't know how to make engaging content, so they throw a bunch of trash at us.

The bad:

  • Matchmaking randomly into bad Railjacks where you've reset everyone's hulls to trash and gave no hull equivalent
    • Turrets should just use our own turrets and not the host's turrets, or an option to choose should be available, (ie and override button in our plexus or something to force use our own guns)
    • We should have 2 options for joining missions:
      • Make your own instance
      • Join someone else's game
  • Jamming drones sparsely spawned 2 galactic radii apart?
    • This is the most annoying and least satisfying mission in the game.
    • The floor is lava, but if anyone 1/4 players gets hit by random lightning, hack goes to 0%
    • 1 drone gives multiplies the progress by 0.4! That's absurd considering you spawn 4 waves with 1-4 drones each
    • You cannot sustain 100% for more than 5 seconds, might as well keep 1 drone alive for 40% efficiency the entire time
  • Auto targeting electrical lasers to keep us moving? (DE did NOT learn from limbo scarlet spear, and instead made their mode too exhaustive on the user to enjoy)
    • This is how you make your players hate your game
    • Don't put exhaustive work on humans
    • This isn't fun, its literally intended to be annoying
    • Remove this
  • Random hazards, quite literally there used to be a limit 1, now they can have multiple, and immediately return once fixed!
    • This combined with the forge capacity reset (bug?)
      • its almost impossible to fix the 3rd hazard once it happens for new players
      • veterans cannot find the resources to produce enough revolite by the 5th hazard if they occur back-to-back
  • No recall!
    • Lazy writing
    • Enemy "jammed recall" conveniently during the only place we would need it, and immediately works when we reach the door
  • Needing all players at airlock is bad game design too.
    • The previous RJ implementation of Nodes of Interest where you can parallelize work was better.
    • It's a buggy mess to force teleport players into a room (assuming they're not dead, in a turret, in a slingshot, entering another place, etc)
    • Mission stopper when 1 player fails to teleport into the room
  • Players replacing AI
    • I can have 2 gunners and 1 engineer AI keeping my ship alive, but then 3 people joined and they left my ship to die
    • Host AI should still be active even if players joined, otherwise "Command" is literally useless!
  • Mechs
    • Voidrig still can't heal.
      • you removed too many methods of healing (doesn't this speak to you on what the players want?)
      • Its the only thing that can kill orthrix and they practically get 1 shotted at level 100
    • Still cant spawn them in normal missions?
      • You could have just launched THIS and everyone will be 100% happy even if it's bugged
        • This is because you added something and did not take away anything, so anything is a bonus, but RJ took away our legacy stuff and gave us bugs
  • Corpus Crewships
    • Those things are tiny!
      • Hard to hit and harder to kill with forward artillery
    • The shield projectors that only face the railjack
      • Impossible to break (bug?)
      • requires a player to archwing behind it and shoot it out (bad game design)
  • Tile sets
    • Too small
    • Too cluttered
    • Pathing issues, ie, I have to walk around huge glassed off rooms just to reach an area that would otherwise be 5 meters away had that pane of glass not been there
  • New enemies
    • Similar to fortuna's launch the new enemies are able to perma stun you
    • Too difficult for new players
    • Too annoying for veteran players
  • Plexus polarities
    • Everything mandatory in this game is practically all Madurai
      • I saw the Vazarin and Naramon as: players need to spend forma, and indirectly: spend player: spend money
  • You've earned 5 whole asterite
    • Thanks
      • but no thanks

So that I'm not totally pessimistic, here are the goods:

  • Dirac being removed! YAY!
  • Everything is mods so it's one coherent system, (good game design! Whoever suggested this needs to take control!)
  • No stamina for pilots makes so much sense. The ships are slow canoes without it.
  • Adding reliable game modes into your unreliable game mode is an excellent strategy
  • New rewards! That's literally why we play your game
  • Bonuses are very nice and they're marked for us too
  • New relay dry docks are cool

there is too good competition for space battles. DE can't keep up here that fast. Warframe's strength is ground battles and not railjack.
In addition, DE has top people in my opinion. if you think they should listen to you -> how about applying to them?

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Agreed with your points. Given the thread title, I was ready to say there's enough that's been improved in RJ for me to, now, at least care enough to want to see the rough patches smoothed out, but you beat me to it.

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On 2021-03-20 at 3:54 PM, Ham_Grenabe said:

I played through and maxed out Railjack back when, and I had good fun with it. However, it's so absolutely unlike the rest of the game that I always believed it really should have been a separate IP entirely; I just don't think DE has the wherewithal or personnel to do that.

 

I've been starting to visualize Warframe as it's own game storefront (since I don't think DE has outputted anything new). The outright oddity of the Planes of Duviri teaser has been strengthening that thought.

DE has the potential to spin off a team, since they did try with The Amazing Eternals, though that fizzled out early on, so eh.

--- 


But yeah, related to the topic's title: Railjack being its own game, space battles in the Warframe Universe, rather than a game mode, might make the implementation of the core idea better and more fleshed out. I don't think a minimum-viable-product for game modes work anymore, when the rest of Warframe is so complete.

 

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On 2021-03-20 at 7:49 PM, -Damocles- said:

Needing all players at airlock is bad game design too.

I loved the old railjack for one specific reason, it would fix the issue of "making 4 incredible overpowered players compete with each other on an increadible simple thing instead of co-operating with each other" Basically only one of you (the most minmaxed player) is gonna do something, the rest of you? Utterly useless! so only one of you is gonna enjoy playing a GAME which has up to 4 people in a mission! 
and that goes out the window with the new RailJack literally doing what it was fixing before.
Like idk what sort of space gymnastic someones brain must do to think this was a good idea! 

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On 2021-03-20 at 12:19 PM, -Damocles- said:
  • Needing all players at airlock is bad game design too.
    • The previous RJ implementation of Nodes of Interest where you can parallelize work was better.
    • It's a buggy mess to force teleport players into a room (assuming they're not dead, in a turret, in a slingshot, entering another place, etc)
    • Mission stopper when 1 player fails to teleport into the room
  • Players replacing AI
    • I can have 2 gunners and 1 engineer AI keeping my ship alive, but then 3 people joined and they left my ship to die
    • Host AI should still be active even if players joined, otherwise "Command" is literally useless!

these 2 points i dont agree with. 

point 1: this creates more work for solo. im not against DE adding more coop objectives but first they need to bring command up so that the crew does secondary objectives. its the one thing i hate about grineer skirmish. the back and forth because crew dont target radiators.

point 2: its not the commands fault people are lazy. you want railjack to be coop yet you want to also bypass what makes it coop? doesnt make sense.

Edited by EinheriarJudith
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On 2021-03-20 at 9:19 AM, -Damocles- said:
  • Tile sets
    • Too small
    • Too cluttered
    • Pathing issues, ie, I have to walk around huge glassed off rooms just to reach an area that would otherwise be 5 meters away had that pane of glass not been there

 

I always wondered with the open sky maps on Mars (desert canyon tileset) and Venus (ice world excavation), why those tilesets weren't used for Necramechs.

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