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TAXIJACK: an irreversible mistake.


Soy77

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anyone remember Top Gear? that stupid show about cars featuring 3 silly british guys?
on series 17 episode 1, richard hammond was reviewing the Marauder, and Jeremy Clarkson opened with these lines:

"many people say that last year they stop making the Hummer because it's too big, and too silly.
however, richard hammond said the reason it has gone west is because it wasn't big or silly enough."

then it shows a vehicle far bigger and more outrageous than the Hummer: the Marauder.

in my most honest opinion, rj had potential. it have the graphics, it have the physics, it's already better than half of star wars copycats out there. all it need was slightly better enemy a.i, and more engaging mission types. it could be a really decent space combat game. the fact that it's actually just a little game mode inside warframe, only makes it even more impressive.

and just like that marauder, i always preached that rj wasn't bad because it doesn't have enough warframe in it. it's bad because it doesn't have the balls to ditch warframes and just go all the way into the space combat territory.

==============

a little backstory about me. i'm relatively a new player, i just played warframe for almost a year. my first huge event was Orphix Venom, and boy it was a game changer for me.
i managed to get my first arcane there, energize was the energy solution that i've been looking in my entire noob career. i maxed out a couple more arcanes, even managed to sold quite a few to turn my fortune around. i was a poor noob no more. i bought a couple of vaulted warframes and weapons, which granted me access to higher level of contents inside warframe. nowadays i fear very few things inside this game. i still have long way to go, but i know i can work for whatever build i need to make. i have the ability to do that, thanks to OV.

of course when OV actually started, i was still a poor noob with bad builds. but i learned that to kick tushies in OV, all i need was one good mech. so i built one: a voidrig with like 5 formas iirc, put around 3 or 4 formas on my fluctus as well, poor boy gambled and put everything i had left on the arquebex.
the gamble pays off. that voidrig is heavily pimped with neat bruntspar skin now. that's if i ever need it. with my vast collection of frames, weapons, and mods, i rarely got my back against the ropes that i need to call my trusty old voidrig.

why are you bragging now you little... ok i'm sorry. my point is: i turned my whole fortune around inside this game, with just one decent voidrig.

 

won't it be novel and romantic if some other rookies can turn his or her whole fortune in this game, just by being a good pilot and having a good ship...?

you know... like han solo and his millennium falcon. the first reason why he joined luke's crew is because he's a darn good pilot with a darn good ship. wouldn't it be cool if you can be a han solo in warframe?

==============

i built the heck out of my railjack.

most people don't like the game mode so they barely played it. but me and plenty others sucked it up and actually hunted for the best mkiii parts. we valanced the heck out of them and ended up with ship among ships. something that made us proud every time we step foot on our dry docks.
ironically, even after having such powerful ship, the missions that i keep coming back to whenever i want to play rj are the first three on earth. because they're truly railjack missions: you fly your ship around, you shoot some bad guys, then pull out the big cannon to finish up the biggest baddies.

call me crazy, but i often pretend that it's just an awesome space combat game while playing it. which wasn't that hard to do, actually.

i often dreamed that DE would put some more mission types for rj.
missions where i don't have to step out of the ship, and get back in again, and step out again, and get back in again.
rj capture where you dogfight with an actually good grineer crewship that'll challenge your piloting skills. or even just simple rj racing through some space rings, so people who have build their ships can put their speed to the test. i never claimed to be a better game developer than DE, so i'm not forcing those ideas. but you know, should DE ever need any ideas, they could always just play some space combat games out there. ace combat have been doing it for decades, there are gotta be a mission type or two that DE can "borrow". warframe has been borrowing ideas from countless other games after all. *CoughHardNemesisSystemCough

==============

of course, building your railjack nowadays simply means that you only completed "half" of the mission.
you still gotta have good frames and builds, so when your taxi ride ends, you can actually do the actual mission.

but the milk has been spilled. there's no use for me crying or getting riled up in the forums over it.
from the moment i downloaded the update and saw that most of the early nodes that i liked are deleted, i immediately realize what has happened.
this is what DE meant by "incorporating more railjack into the main game modes". it means forcing regular warframe missions into poor old railjack.

what could've been a totally kickas space combat game, now is just usual warframe with extra steps.
and to be honest, i just can't see DE owing another mistake for the second time. it was already pretty embarrassing the first time they did it, and it took YEARS for them to try fixing it. DE are nice, but they're not cdpr.
i imagine they'll just stick to their guns this time, they have plenty of supporters. back when i preached that rj should go the space combat route, a lot of people insisted that it's a bad idea, rj should embrace warframe core gameplay instead. they've won.

"why are we riding mech in a game called warframe??", "why are we flying spaceships in a game called warframe??", "why are we mining??", "why are we fishing??"
i guess we won't. we'll just continue to play warframe from now on, with extra steps here and there, but this game will be nothing but warframes. you guys have won.

==============

some of you might wonder then what is the point of this gruelingly long post?

i'm very sorry to inform you that i'm not trying to convince anyone about anything. i just have to let this out of my system.

turns out, this long post is simply my goodbye.
it's me saying goodbye to my hopes and dreams that rj could be a good mode that i can enjoy someday. to the little boy inside my heart that hoped he can have a little bit of that star wars fantasy he grew up with, in his favorite game, warframe.

i finally can let go of that dream now. so long...

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7 minutes ago, Zimzala said:

Some people are simply determined to blame their own internal moods on external entities like game companies who do not make their dreams come true.

Some people are simply determined to excuse anything that external entities like game companies do even if the things they do are detrimental to the people in question.

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Railjack is under a microscope with DE right now, they're not even done with updating it. We still have Call of the Tempestarii. You are not the only person that feels this way obviously, and people who feel similar have been informing DE on a specific forum they made just for Railjack feedback about this. We are all currently beta testing Railjack 3.0. I'd say wait for Call of the Temp to drop the drama bomb if they blatantly ignore all the feedback.

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1 minute ago, Alucard291 said:

Some people are simply determined to excuse anything that external entities like game companies do even if the things they do are detrimental to the people in question.

Sure, I imagine there are a number of people that do that. I think gamers call them 'white knights' in the Internet.

Now, if you can show me something DE has done with WF in this last round of updates that is 'detrimental to the people', I am all ears.

All that occurred was that the game code/rules changed. Nothing added to cause seizures, etc., just game changes some people do not agree with, nothing more.

No one lost money in a Ponzi scheme, the code is not actively hacking our personal data, etc.

So, while these changes may be detrimental to the mood of some players, it remains a Video Game for entertainment, with no more 'detrimental' power over any individual beyond what that individual gives it.

So you don't like a game as much today as you did yesterday...so what? if you think this is some real life 'detriment' to your well-being, I think you have a large battle ahead than just some game mode changes impacting your outlook.

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3 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

Railjack is under a microscope with DE right now, they're not even done with updating it. We still have Call of the Tempestarii. You are not the only person that feels this way obviously, and people who feel similar have been informing DE on a specific forum they made just for Railjack feedback about this. We are all currently beta testing Railjack 3.0. I'd say wait for Call of the Temp to drop the drama bomb if they blatantly ignore all the feedback.

They just attached defense and exterminate missions to railjack. I fear that this architecture cannot just get hotfixed in 1-2 weeks.

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17 minutes ago, sorcer3r said:

They just attached defense and exterminate missions to railjack. I fear that this architecture cannot just get hotfixed in 1-2 weeks.

They added ways to get bonus rewards that aren't just hide n seek, they added  sub-missions and a new mission that encourages constant movement and speed. They brought in crewships with vertical level designs. We have crew members that can keep our railjack safe while taking care of business.  They actually unvaulted some primes warframes and weapons that don't require a lot of grind. We can use mechs in more areas now. If you wanna focus on the two weakest points of the update then go ahead. But its obvious there's a lot more promise here than people are willing to admit.

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31 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

There's already threads on it.

There's still "oldschool" RJ missions.

there are threads about me saying goodbye?

oh my, sir... i'm afraid you have probably mistaken this thread as another type of thread...

30 minutes ago, Zimzala said:

Some people are simply determined to blame their own internal moods on external entities like game companies who do not make their dreams come true.

nah, i don't and won't blame anyone for anything.

i just have accepted what the "game companies" you mentioned most likely are doing, and making my peace with that fact by pouring my final feelings i have into some words.

i do feel little jealous with the guys who wants "more warframe" because they're getting what they want. but that's it, just little harmless jealousy.

21 minutes ago, (PSN)Wil_Shatner_face said:

As someone who didn’t really like RJ before, I think it looks way better now and I can’t wait until it’s on console. Irreversible mistake sounds like a huge stretch.

I know it’s impossible to please everyone though, so I do sympathize that the changes are not to your liking.

thanks for your kind words, my friend. you posted the coolest response ever.

may you have a blast with the new rj!

22 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

Railjack is under a microscope with DE right now, they're not even done with updating it. We still have Call of the Tempestarii. You are not the only person that feels this way obviously, and people who feel similar have been informing DE on a specific forum they made just for Railjack feedback about this. We are all currently beta testing Railjack 3.0. I'd say wait for Call of the Temp to drop the drama bomb if they blatantly ignore all the feedback.

yeah i'm not as strong as those who are still fighting. judging from how things are heading, i decided to take the cowardly route and do the easiest thing in life: giving up.

i guess this little thread is some sort of my own way to express my feelings about the update? i don't think my poor heart is strong enough to join the fight in that specific subforum -and even more, facing possible defeat for the second time.
this pathetic little drama is the most drama i can pull off. as of now, i'm at peace. if by then we lose, i won't mourn. but if by some miracle we win, i'll quietly celebrate in my corner.

thank you for your kind consideration, though. that's really cool of you.

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1 minute ago, Soy77 said:

 

yeah i'm not as strong as those who are still fighting. judging from how things are heading, i decided to take the cowardly route and do the easiest thing in life: giving up.

 

I really, really hope you can find a way out of this line of thinking as it's just not healthy, IME.

By realizing you cannot control the actions of DE and by proxy what occurs in WF, you have given up exactly nothing other than a POV which would hurt you, IMO.

This is just a Video Game for Entertainment, not a Social Justice War for the rights of your fellow humans to be fought to the last breath.

To place the changes that occur in a video game in some emotional bucket that makes you think you are 'giving up' by accepting reality is not a healthy outlook, IMO.

This game company did not hit your happy button with this update, which I get is sad for you. Good games are hard to find.

But to post prose like this over changes in a video game is a huge flashing red light, IMO. Please, just remember it's a game.

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7 minutes ago, Soy77 said:

yeah i'm not as strong as those who are still fighting. judging from how things are heading, i decided to take the cowardly route and do the easiest thing in life: giving up.

i guess this little thread is some sort of my own way to express my feelings about the update? i don't think my poor heart is strong enough to join the fight in that specific subforum -and even more, facing possible defeat for the second time.
this pathetic little drama is the most drama i can pull off. as of now, i'm at peace. if by then we lose, i won't mourn. but if by some miracle we win, i'll quietly celebrate in my corner.

thank you for your kind consideration, though. that's really cool of you.

As someone who has played this game on different consoles and pcs off and on since 2015. Let me tell you, this game does not stop changing. Every time I managed to be able to play this again its this weird mixture of familiarity and freshness. You kinda have to learn some things in this game will never be permanent.

The developers can only put so much passion into certain aspects of the game until they get burnt out or get told the new content is complete failure. Then they stay away from it for a good while. Learn new things. And then comeback to either completely abandon an old aspect or dig deep and put a new spin on it. It isn't normally perfect tbh.

I hope you can find the entertainment in the blossoming and fading moments this game has, because this is hands down one of my favorite games for that reason.

Also Im glad to see someone else who found enjoyment in OV. I thought that event was a blast.

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A user with soy in his name is posting about giving up. The joke writes itself.

Ultimately there is very little anyone can really do. Either DE makes a good game or they don't.
If you don't think warframe is a good game then the best thing you can do is dump it and find something
you enjoy. You don't owe anyone anything and you don't have to justify anything to anyone.

 

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vor einer Stunde schrieb Soy77:

and just like that marauder, i always preached that rj wasn't bad because it doesn't have enough warframe in it. it's bad because it doesn't have the balls to ditch warframes and just go all the way into the space combat territory.

(...)

"why are we playing [insert mech/ship/mining/conservation or whatever here] in a game called warframe??"
i guess we won't. we'll just continue to play warframe from now on, with extra steps here and there, but this game will be nothing but warframes. you guys have won.

==============

some of you might wonder then what is the point of this gruelingly long post?

i'm very sorry to inform you that i'm not trying to convince anyone about anything. i just have to let this out of my system.

turns out, this long post is simply my goodbye.
it's me saying goodbye to my hopes and dreams that rj could be a good mode that i can enjoy someday. to the little boy inside my heart that hoped he can have a little bit of that star wars fantasy he grew up with, in his favorite game, warframe.

i finally can let go of that dream now. so long...

You know space combat games exist, right? How about you just go and play those. I think this community would be far better off if the people who got bored with Warframe would just admit it and just play something else instead of clinging to the game like addicts and trying to turn it into a whole other genre of game.

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1 hour ago, Soy77 said:

 

and just like that marauder, i always preached that rj wasn't bad because it doesn't have enough warframe in it. it's bad because it doesn't have the balls to ditch warframes and just go all the way into the space combat territory.

I see your point, but I don't think this is a case of the devs not having the balls. I think this is a case of the engine failing to hold il their vision

I've seen this happen before, in a little game called Madness: Project Nexus. The devs made episode 1, they made a prequel called episode 1.5, and they planned an episode 2. But halfway through 1.5 they realized they were already hitting the upper limit on what the Adobe Flash "engine" could handle. They ended up ditching the Flash game plans after 1.5 was released (thankfully 1.5 was good) and just moving the plans for episode 2 into its own game on the Unity engine, with a Kickstarter and everything. 

Warframe reminds me of that story in many ways. They made base Warframe and it was good. Then they made open worlds, and started seeing the limits of their engine. Then they started making Railjack and saw those limits even more. I mean compare what they wished to do with Railjack Squad Link in 2018, and what Scarlet Spear in 2019 actually was

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41 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

They added ways to get bonus rewards that aren't just hide n seek, they added  sub-missions and a new mission that encourages constant movement and speed. They brought in crewships with vertical level designs. We have crew members that can keep our railjack safe while taking care of business.  They actually unvaulted some primes warframes and weapons that don't require a lot of grind. We can use mechs in more areas now. If you wanna focus on the two weakest points of the update then go ahead. But its obvious there's a lot more promise here than people are willing to admit.

That's imo nice to have stuff. But not a step in the direction of what tennocon demo has shown.

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1 hour ago, Soy77 said:

most people don't like the game mode so they barely played it.

seems you have identified the primary issue with the old rj system.

new railjack is magnitudes better than it was before. its not even a debate as far as im concerned. i, along with most players, completely ignored railjack since it came out...now, well now ill play it all the time.

mission accomplished.

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6 minutes ago, (XBOX)TyeGoo said:

I'll never understand why people can't grasp the fact that Warframe doesn't have to be every game, and that it's allowed to play other games and all that comes with it. 

Yup, agree here, totally.

Personally, I think it's a combination of Peer Pressure, Sunk Cost Fallacy, and Stockholm Syndrome, mixed into a heady cocktail of perceived FOMO, that prevents players from realizing it's just time to find another game, for an hour, a day, a week, or 'forever'.

Add in the idea so very many players have the idea that if they are not playing the 'most popular' game, then they are 'doing it wrong' and we have our modern WF gamer at scale.

It continues to be bizarre to me that some people allow a video game for entertainment to control so much of their personal agency.

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1 minute ago, sorcer3r said:

That's imo nice to have stuff. But not a step in the direction of what tennocon demo has shown.

I think people are gonna be severly disappointed if they are gonna hold on to that demo. I think that direction has been abandoned somewhat due to DE biting off more than they can chew and showed something that was definitely not ready.

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Well, I'm sorry to hear that you are *this* disappointed in the new Railjack, but to be honest, I rather enjoy it myself.  I did not even get past Earth Proxima in the old Railjack because for a solo player back then, it was basically "hide your ship and play Archwing", which I didn't really get.  With an NPC crew now, I'm almost done with Veil Proxima with mostly mkIII components and weapons.  It seems like half of the missions (the Grineer ones) are still old Railjack, whereas the other half (the Corpus ones) are more integrated?

I'm sure DE is collecting play data right now, and will steer future development towards whichever type is more popular with the players.  Sorry to see you go, but I'm sure Warframe will be here when you need a familiar game to turn back to.  And who knows, maybe by then some new modes will get added and you will have a blast with those!

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5 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

I think people are gonna be severly disappointed if they are gonna hold on to that demo. I think that direction has been abandoned somewhat due to DE biting off more than they can chew and showed something that was definitely not ready.

Some people really cannot let go of something they see/learn/envision as the 'first' thing. They compare everything back to that initial perception/interpretation.

Just look at the bickering over if WF is a 'co-op looter-shooter' OR an 'MMO' OR an 'MMORPG', etc., for an easy example.

It's all just pedantic people trying to put everything they see and hear into little boxes to make them feel better about claiming someone lied, IMO.

"You showed me a red gun, that gun is blood-red, not fire-engine red, you lied."

Some people think they are acting like some kind of Corporate Board Oversight with the way they think they hold game companies to the fire over the details over which they like to bicker.

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8 minutes ago, Zimzala said:

Some people really cannot let go of something they see/learn/envision as the 'first' thing. They compare everything back to that initial perception/interpretation.

It's is a rough lesson to learn with game companies, the Fable series taught me to never trust hyped up trailers lol. I had a great disdain for Peter Molyneux for a long time.

Cripes even Dark Souls has done that.

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1 minute ago, TomCruisesSon said:

It's is a rough lesson to learn with game companies, the Fable series taught me that one lol. I had a great disdain for Peter Molyneux for a long time.

Cripes even Dark Souls has done that.

Cognitive Dissonance is the super power of the human brain.

I have been a gamer and around gamers for over 40 years and nothing has changed.

Much like the meme where someone says the only difference in the way someone looks (creepy or not), is if you are attracted to them, all of this perceived drama is on the person, not the games.

Sure, companies outright lie and take money, but IME, this is just not what is happening with WF, even if some people are so full of FUD it's all they can think.

Games and virtual worlds are where many people have the only place they can 'control'. When from their POV they can no longer control the narrative, it really impacts them. I get that. But that's ALL in the brain chemistry of the individual, not the 'fault' of a game company.

The more humans treat these virtual worlds as if they are real life, the more we will see this.

We are, IMO, deep into the beginning of society trying to treat these online worlds in a very dangerous way, as if they are real life, when it's just pixels in a fantasy.

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17 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

I think people are gonna be severly disappointed if they are gonna hold on to that demo. I think that direction has been abandoned somewhat due to DE biting off more than they can chew and showed something that was definitely not ready.

Well but then it is better to remove Railjack before it ends as archwing 2.0  which everyone tries to avoid as much as possible.

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