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Please remove the forge, or at least rework it


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Forge is the least interesting part of RJ. It rather boring and tedious like a chore. I get DE want us to manage resource, this could lead to opening up another aspect of ship management. But the current implementation is just another way to hinder players.

I have never see anyone actually enjoy stay on forge full time. Maybe only new players who are really humble, so they listen to veteran and stuck in S#&$ty job. AI crew doesn't do forge either.

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Tbh i've seen quite a lot of dedicated forge crew pre-retrofit (shout out to all the octavias crafting resources and playing music in forge). But nowadays forge feels like it indeed doesn't match the rest of the railjack. Let me list some issues:

  • You can't see the resources of your teammates, you have no idea who needs what.
  • Energy replenishment is useless, people rather use zenurik dash or energy pads, or they skip the whole energy mechanic with lavos or hildryn
  • You need only one use of the forge to restock all of the wanted resource + you increase the capacity (no idea if this is a bug cause it feels like it). Previously you had to think 'what do we need the most now, ship is burning and we're running low on repairs, i'll prioritize survival so i'm using all the resources to fix the ship'. Nowadays it's 'hurr durr i cruft everythink and make more so i don't come back again'
  • Giving everyone separate resources makes forge even more useless, you get over 30 rockets with mk3 seeker. The biggest amount of crewships you need to destroy is 6, mk3 seeker tends to shut down yellow shields in 1 hit, but lets make it 2 to be safe. Not every crewship spawns with shields but again, let's make it safe and guess all 6 crewships have shields. Thats 2 * 6 = 12 rockets required in most dire situation. That's not even half of the amount of what pilot has. 
  • Hull repair, i just don't see any use of that. You get quite a long invulnerability after repairing critical breach, hull repairs itself.
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I used to stay on forge a good while back when Railjack on consoles had the sort of population that allowed squad-play, I find support roles fun if they give you a variety of things to manage, and launch Railjack had that- frequent need of repairs, constant demand for dome charges/flux, repelling boarders. Now you can bypass most of that through avionics (Artillery cheap shot was a mistake, it should work only on missed strikes), repairs were made scarce and largely inconsequential with the first railjack revisited, and while I haven't experienced it firsthand, resource pools were made individual and get replenished individually, on top of flux being gone in favor of protea/pad spam, removing the support nature of the forge. All of that killed the engineering role for good.

And that's a bummer, because it could have represented a nice change of pace if implemented properly, with active roles that included temporary buffs to ship structures (turrets, engines, shields, artillery, etc), and the need to solve more harmful hazards. Seriously, your ship being "on fire" is represented by a small little campfire on the floor with a DoT on the ship. Same for the electrical hazard. Bigger, ship wide threats with accompanying set pieces (sections of the ship on fire, a reddish glow in the atmosphere, waning life support for the fire hazard; complete blackout, except core systems, with an electrical hazard) with more complex/multiple resolution routes would elevate the engineer's role to something truly fun. 

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nowaway i would say that forge is used for Energy, Hull, and Dome charge increase/refill

 

( craft to increase? what the #*!% kinda stupid logic is that? give me back my 5/5 from pre-retrofit ) 

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On 2021-03-26 at 4:39 AM, Godmode_Ash said:

have never see anyone actually enjoy stay on forge full time

You never played much RJ then. I happily acted as engineer, and one game we all stood around until the host piped up "host is enginerr, someone else get piloting" 😀

Its a change, and change from the usual is a good thing. Support roles are few and far between in WF, so when one does appear, some people who like support roles jump into them.

The old forge was superior - the new one is broken anyway (starting with 0/5 dome charges, forge +1 gave me 6/6 dome charges. I still don't understand that but assume its a bug). The old forge encouraged teamwork, and I know DE wants to stomp all over that in favour of solo play so gave us crew to do the forging... but still removed the shared forge that the crew would use for you anyway. That just doesn't make sense.

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On 2021-03-27 at 6:05 AM, gbjbaanb said:

You never played much RJ then. I happily acted as engineer,

Weird that I rarely run into player like you in my PUG game, and I have play WF too much that I usually complete the new content in the first few days.

I usually start RJ as a pilot, and people who joined mid mission would immediate rush out on AW, or stay on side turrets. I usually have to do pilot/repair/defend/forge all together.

I have tried to tell the other players to help on tasks. Very few occasions they would listen, but once mission ends I have to instruct the same to the new groups. Sometimes other players would argue with me, and I have seem too many ego players online.

If I only have to do FA/repair/defend while piloting, that is fine for. FA is a quick switch, repair doesn't happen that often if I fly smart, and invader won't be   board if I shoot them down. Those are the things I can reduce from happening. But the new forge compare to the old one is alot more ammo/power hunger. I constantly have to switch back and forth from front to end of ship it gets rather annoying.

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Am 26.3.2021 um 05:39 schrieb Godmode_Ash:

Forge is the least interesting part of RJ. It rather boring and tedious like a chore. I get DE want us to manage resource, this could lead to opening up another aspect of ship management. But the current implementation is just another way to hinder players.

I have never see anyone actually enjoy stay on forge full time. Maybe only new players who are really humble, so they listen to veteran and stuck in S#&$ty job. AI crew doesn't do forge either.

that was always pointless. also, you can't see how much ammo Forward Artillery has. or should you ask there every time or check yourself ?? ... really now.

and even in ancient games like return to castle wolfenstein, you can easily tell that you need ammo or healing ...
the same thing has to go into the railjack!

in addition, railjack is extremely lacking in content. it's really like a taxi now and the ships are dead too quickly.

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